ns2_fusion

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  • FlaterectomyFlaterectomy Netherlandistan Join Date: 2005-02-03 Member: 39643Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts Posts: 938 Advanced user
    Yeah, pretty much. It can make lane blocking a little more complicated. In the image below, I'd say the magenta routes from Lower Passage to Slice aren't really an issue (I merely added it to illustrate two almost same length routes between the two rooms), and others might be fine with you, but my personal preference is to reduce these lanes.

    7KmDcmz.jpg
    MouseGhoulofGSG9[=Alex=]
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,546 mod
    edited October 2013
    Thanks for that pic. I've dealt with the Lower Passage, Vista -> Server and Approach -> Storage routes. Not entirely sure what to do with the other two. I don't want to turn Upper Passage into a massive choke point and the trick with Server -> Approach will be to do something without making Fortress even more difficult for aliens to assault & defend (it's already rather difficult to break a siege on Fortress from Slice).

    AurOn2 wrote: »
    Anyway maus you have 5 weeks to get this textured and balanced in order to get it league worthy? Up to the task?

    @AuroN2 ;)

    Post edited by Mouse on
    -/AUS/- PS_Mouse
  • HowserHowser UK Join Date: 2010-02-08 Member: 70488Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer Posts: 654 Advanced user
    ABOUT TIME! cant wait to play it this weekend!
  • KalopsiaKalopsia Join Date: 2003-05-15 Member: 16331Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 502 Advanced user
    Nice job Mouse.
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  • PostawaPostawa Join Date: 2007-02-08 Member: 59912Members Posts: 17
  • TurbineTurbine Join Date: 2012-09-13 Member: 159160Members Posts: 172 Fully active user
    Very nice map! Can't wait till servers use this.
  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,817 admin
    edited January 2014
    Added it to my server as i like the overall structure.
    Great work so far but i think the map will need some more polish work. Like some corners are a bit to dark and some texture crossovers look a bit odd.
    Developer, Modder and Server Admin of Survival of the Fattest - Ingame Nick: Ghoul
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,546 mod
    Added it to my server as i like the overall structure.
    Great work so far but i think the map will need some more polish work. Like some corners are a bit to dark and some texture crossovers look a bit odd.

    Awesome that its running on your server :D

    Could you provide some screenshots or location names of the places that you think need some more work?
    -/AUS/- PS_Mouse
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver Posts: 3,442 Advanced user
    I don't know... While this map has really, really, really, really awesome geometry, it's still so ... empty. Alien Start is too narrow and the textures are a bit monotone.

    Don't get me wrong; it's not like I don't appreciate your work. I just wouldn't call it "finished" ;)
    formerly known as F0rdPrefect

    I am good Onos
    GhoulofGSG9
  • doesephdoeseph Join Date: 2009-11-22 Member: 69467Members, NS2 Playtester, Subnautica Playtester Posts: 148 Fully active user
    I don't know... While this map has really, really, really, really awesome geometry, it's still so ... empty. Alien Start is too narrow and the textures are a bit monotone.

    Don't get me wrong; it's not like I don't appreciate your work. I just wouldn't call it "finished" ;)

    I agree, the geometry looks wonderful but the map itself seems very empty and lifeless. Maybe add a few pieces of detail here and there to spruce things up a bit?
    ← →
    Rudy.cz
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,546 mod
    doeseph wrote: »
    I don't know... While this map has really, really, really, really awesome geometry, it's still so ... empty. Alien Start is too narrow and the textures are a bit monotone.

    Don't get me wrong; it's not like I don't appreciate your work. I just wouldn't call it "finished" ;)

    I agree, the geometry looks wonderful but the map itself seems very empty and lifeless. Maybe add a few pieces of detail here and there to spruce things up a bit?

    @F0rdPrefect @doeseph Which locations are the main culprits?
    -/AUS/- PS_Mouse
  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Posts: 4,268 Advanced user
    edited January 2014
    Mouse, having fun running around this map, I have to say it is very nice looking geometrically, but in-line with previous comments, it is very empty. It is almost like an NS1 map, flat walls, textures, very few models. The texturing is good, but the lighting and the lack of models really make the map feel empty and bare.

    For an idea of what I mean, look at Glass Hallway in Summit. Look how much detailing has gone into the area, then compare that directly with Corner in your map. They are similar types of area. Glass Hallway feels like a real place, Corner feels like a level in an old school shooter.

    I really love what you have done with the layout of the map, if you could detail it, it would be an amazing map.

    Edit- I made this quick slideshow to illustrate my point..

    http://smg.photobucket.com/user/Soulrefuge/slideshow/NS2 Map Ideas/fusion
    Post edited by Soul_Rider on
    Games:Subnautica Fan Game Mods: GorgeCraft & CTF & Proving Grounds Website: andysoulrider.uk
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    Capitalisation is the difference between helping your Uncle Jack off a horse and helping your uncle jack off a horse.
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    Mouse
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,546 mod
    Soul_Rider wrote: »
    It is almost like an NS1 map, flat walls, textures, very few models. The texturing is good, but the lighting and the lack of models really make the map feel empty and bare.
    Can you tell I started with CS and NS1? :p

    Hmm. One thing that'll make detailing interesting is that I'm specifically trying to make the place look abandoned. It's certainly not there yet, but I don't want go leave it with the atmosphere of descent or biodome
    -/AUS/- PS_Mouse
  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Posts: 4,268 Advanced user
    I ninja'd with a quick slideshow link ;)

    Abandoned is fine, but they wouldn't have taken the wall supports, beams, rails, etc. Which leads me onto my biggest problem with your map, marine movement.

    Marines move around in NS2 by chaining jumps from one surface to another. It is the only way to get speed as a marine player. As your map does not have railings, etc, I have to walk everywhere as a marine. Wall Jumping is a treat, but marine movement is a pig :P
    Games:Subnautica Fan Game Mods: GorgeCraft & CTF & Proving Grounds Website: andysoulrider.uk
    Twitter: @AndySoulRider Twitch: Twitch.tv/SoulRider YouTube: Youtube.com/user/IamSoulRider/videos

    Capitalisation is the difference between helping your Uncle Jack off a horse and helping your uncle jack off a horse.
    Knowledge is gained through listening, Understanding is gained through discussion.
    Mouse
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,546 mod
    Awesome feedback Soul_Rider. I hadn't even considered marine hopping as a factor.

    (the slideshow did an unexpectedly good job of illustrating your point)
    -/AUS/- PS_Mouse
  • SamusDroidSamusDroid Colorado Join Date: 2013-05-13 Member: 185219Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Playtester, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,154 mod
    edited January 2014
    Just from glancing at the pictures, it needs more props, and colors, a little bit too plain and bland, other than that, I really like the curves.
    My mods --- Watermod collaboration with Feha
    For some reason, the instant you ask players to behave differently to be successful, they associate that with bad mapping. - KungFuDiscoMonkey
    Z5UIr2s.png
    AurOn2
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver Posts: 3,442 Advanced user
    Mouse wrote: »
    doeseph wrote: »
    I don't know... While this map has really, really, really, really awesome geometry, it's still so ... empty. Alien Start is too narrow and the textures are a bit monotone.

    Don't get me wrong; it's not like I don't appreciate your work. I just wouldn't call it "finished" ;)

    I agree, the geometry looks wonderful but the map itself seems very empty and lifeless. Maybe add a few pieces of detail here and there to spruce things up a bit?

    @F0rdPrefect @doeseph Which locations are the main culprits?

    Well, what SoulRider said. There is an overall lack of detail. Take a look at kodiak, for example. Really nice details, everywhere.

    Of course, that doesn't mean your map is bad, it just doesn't look finished to me ;)
    formerly known as F0rdPrefect

    I am good Onos
  • UncleCrunchUncleCrunch Mayonnaise land Join Date: 2005-02-16 Member: 41365Members, Reinforced - Onos Posts: 1,542 Advanced user
    maybe you can try to play with spots for marine start. The windows seem to face the sunset. Shadows alway bring a little something.
    ChubbChubbs ???

    Reach me on NS2 forums in :
    Map: Outer Rim Ark and Outer Rim Ark Edge
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,546 mod
    Facing the sunset is bad?
    -/AUS/- PS_Mouse
  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Posts: 4,268 Advanced user
    edited January 2014
    I think he means use a few spot lights shining in through the windows to cast a few shadows in marine start.

    Sunset is good, but sunset has shadows :)
    Games:Subnautica Fan Game Mods: GorgeCraft & CTF & Proving Grounds Website: andysoulrider.uk
    Twitter: @AndySoulRider Twitch: Twitch.tv/SoulRider YouTube: Youtube.com/user/IamSoulRider/videos

    Capitalisation is the difference between helping your Uncle Jack off a horse and helping your uncle jack off a horse.
    Knowledge is gained through listening, Understanding is gained through discussion.
  • UncleCrunchUncleCrunch Mayonnaise land Join Date: 2005-02-16 Member: 41365Members, Reinforced - Onos Posts: 1,542 Advanced user
    Exactly
    ChubbChubbs ???

    Reach me on NS2 forums in :
    Map: Outer Rim Ark and Outer Rim Ark Edge
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,546 mod
    edited January 2014
    For the hell of it I've made a combat version of fusion.
    It's comprised of the top left half of the map, including the length of the crevice through the map. Marines start in Fortress and Aliens start in Observation.

    9ewl.jpg

    [EDIT] Oh and I've put some more effort into the look of fusion. Which parts of the map stand out as needing more work?
    -/AUS/- PS_Mouse
    Soul_Rider
  • cariocacarioca Join Date: 2003-09-02 Member: 20511Members Posts: 921
  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue Posts: 4,268 Advanced user
    Hey Mouse, it's an improvement, but still a way to go...

    As an example, take a look at this screenshot:

    2014-01-19_00001_zps7659a98a.jpg

    I am not a mapper, at least, not like you are, but with 5 minutes work, I made this:

    2014-01-19_00002_zps36be904d.jpg

    The other thing is, in todays game engines, models are cheaper than geometry. To this extent, in the screenshot above, that Geometric vent should not be there, it should be models instead. I did start to change it, but I got distracted, loaded up NS2 and the editor crashed, and I couldn't be bothered to continue....

    Models are very important in modern maps, they are almost free engine-wise, so make the most of them. Use more models than geometry. I notice all your trims are textures too, again, these should be models..

    You made some great maps in NS1, and fusion can be a great map, but ti feels like it is made for GoldSrc, rather than Spark/Source or any modern engine :)

    I hope this helps..
    Games:Subnautica Fan Game Mods: GorgeCraft & CTF & Proving Grounds Website: andysoulrider.uk
    Twitter: @AndySoulRider Twitch: Twitch.tv/SoulRider YouTube: Youtube.com/user/IamSoulRider/videos

    Capitalisation is the difference between helping your Uncle Jack off a horse and helping your uncle jack off a horse.
    Knowledge is gained through listening, Understanding is gained through discussion.
  • deathshrouddeathshroud Join Date: 2010-04-10 Member: 71291Members Posts: 1,187 Advanced user
    1 of the biggest things i have noticed with using geometric shapes is the lack of textures to use on them, ns2 levels are model heavy and because of that there are very few textures to work eith mhen making things with geometry
    AQ-Brainfood
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver Posts: 3,442 Advanced user
    I suggest using more varied textures, wallmods and pillars for a start. You should be able to slap most of them to random places and get some nice results if you do it properly :)
    formerly known as F0rdPrefect

    I am good Onos
  • MauvaisVitrierMauvaisVitrier France Join Date: 2014-04-10 Member: 195291Members, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond Posts: 450 Advanced user
    I must agree with Soul Rider here. I love the map, it took me some getting used to, but it's awesome, layout is good although you might have created too 'powerful' shortcuts for the aliens (like the one that goes under the map, accross three rooms in the centre of the map).

    But it is true that the map feels empty. The textures are there sure, but there is no relief. The walls are straight. Take for example the screenshots that Soul Rider took. It feels already way better. and I'm not saying that you are bad, you've done an awesome work. But I think that by putting more details into it, the map could really have a particular and specific mood.The lower right (south east) side of the map feels desperatly empty.

    We'll try it more often during French gathers, but I think we might have already adopted it. :)

    Keep up the good work
  • PelargirPelargir Join Date: 2013-07-02 Member: 185857Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, WC 2013 - Supporter, Forum staff Posts: 1,183 mod
    Australians & especially Mr.@Mouse always make an excellent work. I'm still waiting for the next updates by the way.
    "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"

    "It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to."


  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,546 mod
    Thanks for the news and the feedback @MauvaisVitrier! It's sometimes hard to keep track of whether your map is actually getting played.

    @Pelargir‌ I'm actually half way through building a more compressed version of the map. I'm not sure whether it's a good idea just yet.
    Current changelog:
    - Marine start moved north
    - Storage moved south
    - Storage to Fortress vent removed
    - Shortcut to Lower Passage hallway removed
    - Fortress to Shortcut hallway + Shortcut redesigned
    - Lower Passage node redesigned
    - Slice to Upper Passage hallway redesigned
    + probably one or two more changes

    Because I'm making so many changes I should probably ask both of you (and whoever else winds up reading this post) some questions about the map:
    1) Which parts of the map shouldn't change?
    2) Which parts of the map need to change?
    -/AUS/- PS_Mouse
    PelargirMauvaisVitrier
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