I’ve been playing NS since it came out completely script less as my coding skills are nil, and it doesn’t seem right to have complicated sequences of actions bound to single keys.
I use last inv for quick switching weapons, and have just learnt how to bunny hop using the mouse wheel as jump. I really don’t see what justification there can be for keeping special and wait commands in.
As for bunny hopping I don’t mind if it’s in or out, but maybe it should be included in the NS manual as a documented tactic so people don’t feel cheated by other people learning it, when they’ve never heard of it. It really isn’t that difficult to learn with a bit of practice.
<!--QuoteBegin--blanket+Dec 20 2003, 07:25 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (blanket @ Dec 20 2003, 07:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Is bunnyhopping going to be eradicated in ns 3.0? my clan mate told me flayra will eradicate bunnyhop for good.. i mean hey, marine bunnyhoping wif a gun is strange.. which human can do that.. but alien sure can hop what? i am not against or for bunnyhop, just wanna make sure wad will happen to its future. moderator, can don't delete my post? i believe this question will also be lots of people questions also <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You can't use bhop SCRIPTS...Aliens can still bhop just fine if they know how to do it manually. I can sometimes, but I like playing skulks as...skulks. Hopping like a fool headlong into marines and killing them all because your going faster than the game meant is a bit lame...but...to each his own I suppose. Personally I'd like to see it gone but thats just flamebait for the fanboys I suppose.
hmm... If removing bhop will make the game better, so be it. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> The game shouldnt require people to start scripting just to get little advantage over other players or to get even with the other script users (as the jump script probably does, not sure thou, never done such scripting...) If others dont use "+3jump" or whatever you call it, then neither should you (the jump script users...).
A 5-button mouse is the best thing in my arsenal. I can see the attraction in scripts, but why not just press jump as you land? I've never scripted, ever. Sure, I sometimes get stuck on walls or jump too high and hit the ceiling, but it's much more fun. The timing isn't that hard, anyway. If I went round to someone's house and I saw them using scripts I'd just call them a retard.
eh, i tried to use a b-hop script once, failed miseably, but imho b-h should not be removed for aliens, just remove the ability to script it and do it without any real effort. I try to b-hop and can do it half way decently, but im not anywhere near the level that any scripters can do it. And in some sense, that angers me.
While i try to improve my skill and get better little by little, most smart **** teenage elitists bypass the hard and rewarding path of using work, trial and error etc. to gain a valuable skill and instead feel the need to script, cheat and otherwise exploit faults in an outdated engine. so i cheer the work of the dev team to do their best to create the greatest game/mod for half-life and if they feel the need to remove an aspect to add to the greatness of this game, so be it, all this bantoring is pointless.
Right now bhopping is the best skill of most of these CAL-champ wannabe clans, like ir, evil, etc. If we take that away from them they won't have any skill left <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
I'm all for removing bhop. Its a relic of an old engine and there isn't any real point in it besides the whining and insistence of a few clanners. Flayra needs to wake up and see the light.
<!--QuoteBegin--cri.tical+Dec 24 2003, 11:21 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (cri.tical @ Dec 24 2003, 11:21 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Right now bhopping is the best skill of most of these CAL-champ wannabe clans, like ir, evil, etc. If we take that away from them they won't have any skill left <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
I'm all for removing bhop. Its a relic of an old engine and there isn't any real point in it besides the whining and insistence of a few clanners. Flayra needs to wake up and see the light. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You forgot #cri.
<!--QuoteBegin--Last.+Dec 24 2003, 02:23 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Last. @ Dec 24 2003, 02:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--cri.tical+Dec 24 2003, 11:21 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (cri.tical @ Dec 24 2003, 11:21 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Right now bhopping is the best skill of most of these CAL-champ wannabe clans, like ir, evil, etc. If we take that away from them they won't have any skill left <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
I'm all for removing bhop. Its a relic of an old engine and there isn't any real point in it besides the whining and insistence of a few clanners. Flayra needs to wake up and see the light. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> You forgot #cri. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, I wasn't counting <i>cheaters</i>.
allready this discussion has gone astray. many people here have no idea of the difference between a cheat, a hack, a script, a bind or an alias.
<!--QuoteBegin--Delphi+Dec 20 2003, 01:45 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Delphi @ Dec 20 2003, 01:45 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->As stated by Flayra MANY MANY times.. Anything where you have to use the console or modify userconfig.cfg is deemed an exploit.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yes, flayra can have an opinion of what is an exploit but flayra dosnt run leauges. Blocking wait and special will not stop bunny hopping, or bhop scripting.
In my experince with eR, clans that can bhop are much better then clans that cant.
<!--QuoteBegin--Lux+Dec 24 2003, 02:40 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Lux @ Dec 24 2003, 02:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> In my experince with eR, clans that can bhop are much better then clans that cant. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yep, I'd agree. Thats why they'll fight Flayra to the death to keep it that way. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Aaronvroom vroom der party startahJoin Date: 2002-11-05Member: 7020Members
<!--QuoteBegin--Delphi+Dec 22 2003, 12:52 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Delphi @ Dec 22 2003, 12:52 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Vektuz+Dec 21 2003, 11:31 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Vektuz @ Dec 21 2003, 11:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Yeh, the point of what I'm saying is, the only reasonable reason I've seen for not removing the 'wait' command is that some other binds (weapon change scripts) also need it. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Since when?
If you need a weapon change script, you need to rethink your time in NS. I get by just fine with lastinv. Even as a blink/swipe/blink fade. Sure, I have to keep a running memory of what my last weapon was (If it was acid rocket, blink, or swipe or whatever), but if I do the same as a weapon switch scripter without the scripts, that says a whole helluva lot about me, doesn't it?
If you can point out a LEGITIMATE use of wait, I'd be glad to hear it. Otherwise.. well.. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, you have to admit, mouse-scroll-wheel weapon change is sort of convenient, if only from the "i'm -too-lazy-to-move-my-other-hand" perspective. There are too many buttons and things to memorize already, being able to use a scroll button for something that is obviously "cyclical" is useful. I'm not using this in an exploitive manner (I don't think it even can)...I just find it useful to use a finger to scroll the mouse button (no I am not flipping like crazy and h4xxing somehow).
On the other hand, I can probably live without it.
What are the advantages of bunny hopping? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You move faster. Thus you are harder to hit and you can close to your target or goal faster.
What are the advantages of bunny hopping? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> You move faster. Thus you are harder to hit and you can close to your target or goal faster. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yes but how much faster?
If it's 200% faster, I'd agree with the anti-bunnies. If it's just a tad more, I'd say it's a bonus for those who are actually pro's.
<!--QuoteBegin--cri.tical+Dec 24 2003, 02:21 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (cri.tical @ Dec 24 2003, 02:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Right now bhopping is the best skill of most of these CAL-champ wannabe clans, like ir, evil, etc. If we take that away from them they won't have any skill left <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> How do you explain the consistent ownage of clans such as cri by ir during ir's marine round? Marines can't bhop as far as I know...
<!--QuoteBegin--Rennex+Dec 24 2003, 06:24 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Rennex @ Dec 24 2003, 06:24 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--cri.tical+Dec 24 2003, 02:21 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (cri.tical @ Dec 24 2003, 02:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Right now bhopping is the best skill of most of these CAL-champ wannabe clans, like ir, evil, etc. If we take that away from them they won't have any skill left <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> How do you explain the consistent ownage of clans such as cri by ir during ir's marine round? Marines can't bhop as far as I know... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->ignorant
\Ig"no*rant\, a. [F., fr. L. ignorans, -antis, p. pr. of ignorare to be ignorant. See Ignore.] 1. Destitute of knowledge; uninstructed or uninformed; untaught; unenlightened.
Ye ignorant in thine skill o' bhopping, shalt not take thine aggression upon yonder innocents.
Translation: Bias. You can't bhop, I can(as a member of the no-skill would-be champions ir). Just because you don't implement bunny hopping into your own playstyle does not mean you should deny the rest of the world so its an "equal opportunity skulking" game. The <b>majority</b> of those who wish bunny hopping to be removed are those who can not do it, or those who don't even know what it is.
Taking out bunny hopping for marines was a great call, both for balance and for whatever believability Flayra is shooting for. Removing the mobility for aliens, however, would simply destroy them. As for scripts, I say ditch 'em..despite being labeled by other "ignorant" people as a scripter/mwheeler/whatever so I only have one thing to say.
If you remove bhopping you'd have to change so many factors in NS...
Feasible... yes, worth it? No...
Not only that but by the only way to stop skulk bhopping (capping the damn air speeds) would kill the fade and lerk and the leap attack.
Personally I like bhop, because it seperates skilled players from less skilled players.
Removing the _special command was a big step, but people can find ways to repete an action through other means.
I think the best solution is to make the jumping process easier:
- Every time you hit the jump key, you will automatically jump upon hitting the ground. Timing your jumps will never be an issue, you will only need to control your movement.
or
- Make a way to put a capped limit to how fast you can spam ANY command (this would stop all attempts at _special scripts, or jump scripts, hardware doing the jumps for you, using macro's, it would stop ALL scripted commands).
Removing bhop, IMO, is a step too far. NS needs things that seperate the nubs from the decent players.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Not only that but by the only way to stop skulk bhopping (capping the damn air speeds) would kill the fade and lerk and the leap attack.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think that's the problem.
The airspeed cap is set at 300%. This speed is irrelevant for bunnyhopping and you only approach it through leap, blink, lerk flight, trigger_push entities and such.
The "speed limit" relevant to bunnyhopping is the maximum speed after a jump. If you are going faster than 170% of the normal forward running speed you will be slowed to exactly 170% when you jump again. (edit: got a bit confused, the speed is set down to 170% when you jump again, not when you touch the ground after a jump).
If this "speed limit" is set to close to 100%(if it is possible to set it, I can't see why you wouldn't be able too but I'm not a half-life MOD coder) it will still allow you to go at 300% base speed in the air or on the ground(through sliding on a slope after leaping for example, though you slow quite quickly through friction). It will still allow you to strafe jump and approach speeds of 120%-130% of normal until your next jump. It should not decrease air mobillity or the feel of jumping while in the air. It would not effect strafe turning on the ground until you actually jump, I don't think that would feel bad.
I frankly fail to see why removing the speed gain of bunnyhopping would restrict mobillity of the aliens(mind you, you can still bounce around like mad, IE bhop, just you wouldn't go more than negligibly faster than running in a straight line).
I would like to see flayra essentially give everyone the the triple jump script(IE make the +jump function work like the triple jump script).Then lock down further scripting(IE _special(which will be done in the next version) and wait, which is pretty useless) and possibly even disable binding +jump to mwheelup/down to minimize the problem with scripting(as noted, people can still use special functions of their mouse drivers to do this). I could care less if he changes the "speed limit" of bhoping as that's not it's most usefull feature IMHO(the pure evasiveness of jumping like a luney going every which way is <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->). I would also like to see bunnyhoping added as an official feature in the NS manual if it is going to stay in the game and be officially accepted.
Negative. The whole point of bhopping is you can preserve the speed you gain after a jump, that is, good bhoppers will reach the 300% speed cap. I know I do.
My point was that removal of script commands such as 'wait' will not prevent machine-automated bunny hopping.
I mean, go ahead, remove them... I dont use any scripts anyway.
But it won't prevent in any way, auto bunny hopping at all. There are macro programs, tweaked mouse drivers, auto-mouse buttons, mouse wheels, joystick 'autofire' buttons DESIGNED To spam a command every frame at 100 fps or more.
So please do not remove 'wait' AND BELIEVE YOU'VE PREVENTED MACHINE AUTOMATED BUNNY HOPPING.
Those auto-retrigger mouse drivers, macro programs, etc, are A LOT BETTER at it than a 3jump script is, anyway. They can do it perfectly, all the time, and all the person does have to do is hold the button down.
There is no way to prevent automated bunny hopping save to remove bunnyhopping ITSELF from the game. Messing with scripts wont do ANYTHING.
That's like saying that we should get rid of all anti-cheat programs because they don't detect 100% of cheats (at least some of the time). Mousewheel isn't the most effective way to bhop, as you can't reach for the wheel while biting. As for the joystick, all I can say is, if someone out there actually does that, "..."
007Bistromath: if you're referring to my sig then... stop posting one lined attention grabbing posts <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
ok they made it so you can't bunny hop with a script good for them so now all you people that had an unfair advantage have to play normally now. and to that guy who wanted them to make it easyer to bunny hop manually, do you really think the devs will do that? They are trying to stop bunny hopping not make it easyer
“now I can’t use my script and I’m going to have to learn to do it manually, darnit that’s not fair”
<!--QuoteBegin--Last.+Dec 24 2003, 10:51 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Last. @ Dec 24 2003, 10:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> 007Bistromath: if you're referring to my sig then... stop posting one lined attention grabbing posts <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> 1. Nowhere in your sig is n00b spelled at all, much less with a 4. I'm talking about -Lurker-'s post where he says "n44b question."
2. I'm not. That's the only one I've posted all night, IIRC.
<!--QuoteBegin--Cole+Dec 24 2003, 06:27 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cole @ Dec 24 2003, 06:27 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> You can't bhop, I can(as a member of the no-skill would-be champions ir). Just because you don't implement bunny hopping into your own playstyle does not mean you should deny the rest of the world so its an "equal opportunity skulking" game. The <b>majority</b> of those who wish bunny hopping to be removed are those who can not do it, or those who don't even know what it is. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I know how to bunny hop. But I will agree with you that most of those who are "whining" to remove it can't.
I just don't see the point in it, really. I've flip flopped on the whole idea, I used to be a huge supporter of bhop. Just because a team can bhop doesn't mean they'll hold up in a high pressure situation on a LAN, either.
I hope to see ir at the CPL this year. Mosis especially hopes you guys come down there. I've heard word of an unofficial tourney in the works.
Of course, half of your team won't be able to participate due to age limitations. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
EDIT: I forgot to mention all those ir victories you are claiming. We all know when it was in a competitive environment, ir nearly lost to cri in CAL. You barely scraped by with a 1-1. Just because you guys like to drum up anti-cri sentiment within the community doesn't mean you can beat us in a real game.
Comments
I use last inv for quick switching weapons, and have just learnt how to bunny hop using the mouse wheel as jump. I really don’t see what justification there can be for keeping special and wait commands in.
As for bunny hopping I don’t mind if it’s in or out, but maybe it should be included in the NS manual as a documented tactic so people don’t feel cheated by other people learning it, when they’ve never heard of it. It really isn’t that difficult to learn with a bit of practice.
i am not against or for bunnyhop, just wanna make sure wad will happen to its future. moderator, can don't delete my post? i believe this question will also be lots of people questions also <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
You can't use bhop SCRIPTS...Aliens can still bhop just fine if they know how to do it manually. I can sometimes, but I like playing skulks as...skulks. Hopping like a fool headlong into marines and killing them all because your going faster than the game meant is a bit lame...but...to each his own I suppose. Personally I'd like to see it gone but thats just flamebait for the fanboys I suppose.
If removing bhop will make the game better, so be it. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
The game shouldnt require people to start scripting just to get little advantage over other players or to get even with the other script users (as the jump script probably does, not sure thou, never done such scripting...) If others dont use "+3jump" or whatever you call it, then neither should you (the jump script users...).
IMO
Cheers...
While i try to improve my skill and get better little by little, most smart **** teenage elitists bypass the hard and rewarding path of using work, trial and error etc. to gain a valuable skill and instead feel the need to script, cheat and otherwise exploit faults in an outdated engine. so i cheer the work of the dev team to do their best to create the greatest game/mod for half-life and if they feel the need to remove an aspect to add to the greatness of this game, so be it, all this bantoring is pointless.
I'm all for removing bhop. Its a relic of an old engine and there isn't any real point in it besides the whining and insistence of a few clanners. Flayra needs to wake up and see the light.
I'm all for removing bhop. Its a relic of an old engine and there isn't any real point in it besides the whining and insistence of a few clanners. Flayra needs to wake up and see the light. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
You forgot #cri.
I'm all for removing bhop. Its a relic of an old engine and there isn't any real point in it besides the whining and insistence of a few clanners. Flayra needs to wake up and see the light. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You forgot #cri. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, I wasn't counting <i>cheaters</i>.
<!--QuoteBegin--Delphi+Dec 20 2003, 01:45 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Delphi @ Dec 20 2003, 01:45 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->As stated by Flayra MANY MANY times.. Anything where you have to use the console or modify userconfig.cfg is deemed an exploit.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, flayra can have an opinion of what is an exploit but flayra dosnt run leauges. Blocking wait and special will not stop bunny hopping, or bhop scripting.
In my experince with eR, clans that can bhop are much better then clans that cant.
Yep, I'd agree. Thats why they'll fight Flayra to the death to keep it that way. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Since when?
If you need a weapon change script, you need to rethink your time in NS. I get by just fine with lastinv. Even as a blink/swipe/blink fade. Sure, I have to keep a running memory of what my last weapon was (If it was acid rocket, blink, or swipe or whatever), but if I do the same as a weapon switch scripter without the scripts, that says a whole helluva lot about me, doesn't it?
If you can point out a LEGITIMATE use of wait, I'd be glad to hear it. Otherwise.. well.. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, you have to admit, mouse-scroll-wheel weapon change is sort of convenient, if only from the "i'm -too-lazy-to-move-my-other-hand" perspective. There are too many buttons and things to memorize already, being able to use a scroll button for something that is obviously "cyclical" is useful. I'm not using this in an exploitive manner (I don't think it even can)...I just find it useful to use a finger to scroll the mouse button (no I am not flipping like crazy and h4xxing somehow).
On the other hand, I can probably live without it.
What are the advantages of bunny hopping?
What are the advantages of bunny hopping? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
You move faster. Thus you are harder to hit and you can close to your target or goal faster.
What are the advantages of bunny hopping? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You move faster. Thus you are harder to hit and you can close to your target or goal faster. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes but how much faster?
If it's 200% faster, I'd agree with the anti-bunnies.
If it's just a tad more, I'd say it's a bonus for those who are actually pro's.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
How do you explain the consistent ownage of clans such as cri by ir during ir's marine round? Marines can't bhop as far as I know...
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
How do you explain the consistent ownage of clans such as cri by ir during ir's marine round? Marines can't bhop as far as I know... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->ignorant
\Ig"no*rant\, a. [F., fr. L. ignorans, -antis, p. pr. of ignorare to be ignorant. See Ignore.] 1. Destitute of knowledge; uninstructed or uninformed; untaught; unenlightened.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ye ignorant in thine skill o' bhopping, shalt not take thine aggression upon yonder innocents.
Translation: Bias. You can't bhop, I can(as a member of the no-skill would-be champions ir). Just because you don't implement bunny hopping into your own playstyle does not mean you should deny the rest of the world so its an "equal opportunity skulking" game. The <b>majority</b> of those who wish bunny hopping to be removed are those who can not do it, or those who don't even know what it is.
Taking out bunny hopping for marines was a great call, both for balance and for whatever believability Flayra is shooting for. Removing the mobility for aliens, however, would simply destroy them. As for scripts, I say ditch 'em..despite being labeled by other "ignorant" people as a scripter/mwheeler/whatever so I only have one thing to say.
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bind "SPACE" "+jump"
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Feasible... yes, worth it? No...
Not only that but by the only way to stop skulk bhopping (capping the damn air speeds) would kill the fade and lerk and the leap attack.
Personally I like bhop, because it seperates skilled players from less skilled players.
Removing the _special command was a big step, but people can find ways to repete an action through other means.
I think the best solution is to make the jumping process easier:
- Every time you hit the jump key, you will automatically jump upon hitting the ground. Timing your jumps will never be an issue, you will only need to control your movement.
or
- Make a way to put a capped limit to how fast you can spam ANY command (this would stop all attempts at _special scripts, or jump scripts, hardware doing the jumps for you, using macro's, it would stop ALL scripted commands).
Removing bhop, IMO, is a step too far. NS needs things that seperate the nubs from the decent players.
I don't think that's the problem.
The airspeed cap is set at 300%. This speed is irrelevant for bunnyhopping and you only approach it through leap, blink, lerk flight, trigger_push entities and such.
The "speed limit" relevant to bunnyhopping is the maximum speed after a jump. If you are going faster than 170% of the normal forward running speed you will be slowed to exactly 170% when you jump again. (edit: got a bit confused, the speed is set down to 170% when you jump again, not when you touch the ground after a jump).
If this "speed limit" is set to close to 100%(if it is possible to set it, I can't see why you wouldn't be able too but I'm not a half-life MOD coder) it will still allow you to go at 300% base speed in the air or on the ground(through sliding on a slope after leaping for example, though you slow quite quickly through friction). It will still allow you to strafe jump and approach speeds of 120%-130% of normal until your next jump. It should not decrease air mobillity or the feel of jumping while in the air. It would not effect strafe turning on the ground until you actually jump, I don't think that would feel bad.
I frankly fail to see why removing the speed gain of bunnyhopping would restrict mobillity of the aliens(mind you, you can still bounce around like mad, IE bhop, just you wouldn't go more than negligibly faster than running in a straight line).
I would like to see flayra essentially give everyone the the triple jump script(IE make the +jump function work like the triple jump script).Then lock down further scripting(IE _special(which will be done in the next version) and wait, which is pretty useless) and possibly even disable binding +jump to mwheelup/down to minimize the problem with scripting(as noted, people can still use special functions of their mouse drivers to do this). I could care less if he changes the "speed limit" of bhoping as that's not it's most usefull feature IMHO(the pure evasiveness of jumping like a luney going every which way is <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->). I would also like to see bunnyhoping added as an official feature in the NS manual if it is going to stay in the game and be officially accepted.
I mean, go ahead, remove them... I dont use any scripts anyway.
But it won't prevent in any way, auto bunny hopping at all. There are macro programs, tweaked mouse drivers, auto-mouse buttons, mouse wheels, joystick 'autofire' buttons DESIGNED To spam a command every frame at 100 fps or more.
So please do not remove 'wait' AND BELIEVE YOU'VE PREVENTED MACHINE AUTOMATED BUNNY HOPPING.
Those auto-retrigger mouse drivers, macro programs, etc, are A LOT BETTER at it than a 3jump script is, anyway. They can do it perfectly, all the time, and all the person does have to do is hold the button down.
There is no way to prevent automated bunny hopping save to remove bunnyhopping ITSELF from the game. Messing with scripts wont do ANYTHING.
007Bistromath: if you're referring to my sig then... stop posting one lined attention grabbing posts <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
and to that guy who wanted them to make it easyer to bunny hop manually, do you really think the devs will do that? They are trying to stop bunny hopping not make it easyer
“now I can’t use my script and I’m going to have to learn to do it manually, darnit that’s not fair”
1. Nowhere in your sig is n00b spelled at all, much less with a 4. I'm talking about -Lurker-'s post where he says "n44b question."
2. I'm not. That's the only one I've posted all night, IIRC.
I know how to bunny hop. But I will agree with you that most of those who are "whining" to remove it can't.
I just don't see the point in it, really. I've flip flopped on the whole idea, I used to be a huge supporter of bhop. Just because a team can bhop doesn't mean they'll hold up in a high pressure situation on a LAN, either.
I hope to see ir at the CPL this year. Mosis especially hopes you guys come down there. I've heard word of an unofficial tourney in the works.
Of course, half of your team won't be able to participate due to age limitations. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
EDIT: I forgot to mention all those ir victories you are claiming. We all know when it was in a competitive environment, ir nearly lost to cri in CAL. You barely scraped by with a 1-1. Just because you guys like to drum up anti-cri sentiment within the community doesn't mean you can beat us in a real game.