Funny 'cuz the first person to mention 'anti-cri sentiment' was critical.
Anyway, yes, people who know how to bhop hold an advantage over people who cannot. I was glad the ability to bhop as a marine was taken out in 2.0 because it looked stupid to see humans bouncing along like that when everything else was trying to go for the sci-fi movie realism feeling. I think bhop fits well with the theme of aliens as fast creatures who can spread across the map much faster than marines.
Scripts or mousewheel, I don't care. Whatever floats your boat.
Here's a tip for people who get dominated regularly by a bhopping skulk: don't stand like a moron around a sharp turn. It gives you no chance to shoot a skulk who whips around the corner. Position yourself in a spot where it gives you the maximum amount of time possible to empty your clip. Excellent bhoppers like in envy aren't invincible and are easy to control by NOT sitting around a corner. To give him decent speed, he needs to move in a more or less straight path. Makes it alot easier to keep your crosshair on them.
<!--QuoteBegin--Delphi+Dec 20 2003, 03:45 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Delphi @ Dec 20 2003, 03:45 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> As stated by Flayra MANY MANY times.. Anything where you have to use the console or modify userconfig.cfg is deemed an exploit. So the +3jumps script is NOT fair game.
Some of us kill the old fashioned way; You know, aiming at our targets, having patience, and not turning our gamma up via third party programs to insane levels to see skulks, or jumping around like a friggin idiot to avoid a skulk. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> <span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'><b>C-R-Y</b></span>
To the people who think bhopping could be disabled:
Sure, while the 300% air speed cap is there, you can only get to 170%, correct?
So you think that you could just lower the bhop air capped speed to something like 110% or 100% (no speed incrase), and leave the other 300% air capped speed alone.
This isn't true. For some reason, these two values are somehow releated, but I don't know how.
If you lower the bhop speed cap to 100%, when you fall you will not be hurt. One speed cap (the 300% one) is for special abilities to reach, while the 170% speed increase is what you reach by falling/jumping.
Furthermore, the way you kill bhopping with marines is not by lowering the airspeed cap... it's by making their speed decrease after each jump landed. Doing the same process for aliens would be pure sh!t in my oppinion.
There is no way to kill alien bhop without killing leap/fall damage/everything else for aliens it seems.
I guess the only solution would be to give an entirely different recode for each alien WEAPON, so they are not linked in anyway by global varibles, and so that you could make it so there's no bhop and each weapon behaves differently. I don't even know if this is possible.
<!--QuoteBegin--Toshax+Dec 25 2003, 07:13 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Toshax @ Dec 25 2003, 07:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Delphi+Dec 20 2003, 03:45 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Delphi @ Dec 20 2003, 03:45 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> As stated by Flayra MANY MANY times.. Anything where you have to use the console or modify userconfig.cfg is deemed an exploit. So the +3jumps script is NOT fair game.
Some of us kill the old fashioned way; You know, aiming at our targets, having patience, and not turning our gamma up via third party programs to insane levels to see skulks, or jumping around like a friggin idiot to avoid a skulk. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> <span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'><b>C-R-Y</b></span> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Congrats buddy you just became the classic example in whats wrong with the community. I hope you feel good now. Drama queen.
Look if you can't do it manually, it isn't skill, so don't go around flexing a script. Someone lock this, the idiocy from the vet forums as penetrated General discussion
btw. cri sux <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Im beginning to think clans in general suck, my god its like listening to a bunch of 17 year olds on the rag
<!--QuoteBegin--CommunistWithAGun+Dec 25 2003, 08:32 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CommunistWithAGun @ Dec 25 2003, 08:32 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Im beginning to think clans in general suck, my god its like listening to a bunch of 17 year olds on the rag <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I've always thought they suck, because they're a huge hoard of elitists, and they suck the good players away from pubs.
<!--QuoteBegin--Delphi+Dec 20 2003, 03:45 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Delphi @ Dec 20 2003, 03:45 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> ... or jumping around like a friggin idiot to avoid a skulk. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> so I suppose the good players should just stand there and allow the skulk to kill him in order to level the playing field for those that don't know how?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->To the people who think bhopping could be disabled:
Sure, while the 300% air speed cap is there, you can only get to 170%, correct?
So you think that you could just lower the bhop air capped speed to something like 110% or 100% (no speed incrase), and leave the other 300% air capped speed alone.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There isn't a bhop airspeed cap at all. You can reach any speed while in the air, it is the instant you jump(IE the +jump command is processed). You do get slightly over 170% while bunnyhopping, but the instant you jump again you are put at 170%.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->This isn't true. For some reason, these two values are somehow releated, but I don't know how.
If you lower the bhop speed cap to 100%, when you fall you will not be hurt. One speed cap (the 300% one) is for special abilities to reach, while the 170% speed increase is what you reach by falling/jumping.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
some errors, the airspeed cap refers only to horisontal speed not vertical, you can reach far over 300% of your max speed by falling. I don't see how it might cause bugs with falldamage and I have no clue if the maximum airspeed relates to the horisontal speed cap after a jump or how, but if you say so.
Skulks don't take falldamage(they only growl) so not having them growl when falling to far might be a small price to pay if your adamant to prevent skulks from bhoping(they are the most common creature to bhop with).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Furthermore, the way you kill bhopping with marines is not by lowering the airspeed cap... it's by making their speed decrease after each jump landed. Doing the same process for aliens would be pure sh!t in my oppinion.
There is no way to kill alien bhop without killing leap/fall damage/everything else for aliens it seems.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not so sure about that, it seems so easy... but then again, I'm not a MOD coder so I don't know where setting the bhoping speed limit to something lower would produce unwanted results <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo-->.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->some errors, the airspeed cap refers only to horisontal speed not vertical, you can reach far over 300% of your max speed by falling. I don't see how it might cause bugs with falldamage and I have no clue if the maximum airspeed relates to the horisontal speed cap after a jump or how, but if you say so. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The reason I know you can't simply adjust the air capped values is because Flay tried it already once for 3.0...
It wasn't pretty, leap looked like a marine jump, lerks were slow POS, fades were sad, and marines couldn't take fall damage...
If it's so easy Green, why hasn't Flay taken it out?
Bickering, fighting, squabbling over such a petty argument such as bunny hopping. I can bunny hop. Below is my .cfg, which has not even a single script. Do I take pride in that? No. Do I get up in my high horse and think I own you because I play it naturally? No. Is it more challenging to learn to bunnyhop, and some other movement and weapon skills without scripts? Yes. Was it worth it? Yes.
I do not have +4 years of HL experience, I am not cal-i, although #cri is going cal-o next season. I never learned to bunnyhop in the old days. I have been learning it by myself. It is quite simple. Just grab some speed, probably jump off a ledge or inclination, hold crouch, jump the instant I hit the floor again, look left, jump again, jump instant I get back down, look right, etc etc. I don´t have +3 years of playing with the same setup, I have settled in one just since a month ago, and I don´t aim too bad, we can say. I will probably have 70% accuracy in 3 months or so, and progressively increase.
Some people in my clan do script. Does it make them better players than me? I don´t think so. If they are more skilled, inherently, through practice, or just raw talent, I admire that. If they use scripts to help their game a little, do I belittle them? No. Personally, Charlie can do whatever he wants with bhopping.
I don´t use powerstrip, any other gamma programs, not an autoexec.cfg file, or binds. I only use my 3 mouse buttons, although my mouse has 5, because my hand is quite small for it.
I´m not better than maven, tex, cole, meb, or whoever else that bhops naturally or by script. You have to know this.
You adapt, or you die.
Don´t want to get mauled by bunnyhopping skulks? Why not spend a little less time in the forums and more time practicing your aim and some smarts so you won´t get mauled as much.
Seriously, people. Most of this things you speak of can be easily countered. God, some of you want everything on a golden plate nowadays. About my clan, #cri, You could take my word for it that we don´t hack, but its the internet, after all, and why believe me? Another arrogant veteran who feels way too proud of his golden icon that he shares with last-minute clans and the such? Why believe me?
James, I have known him for a long time. Since my OSS days when I was, lets say, a below-average player. I snatched him from OSS, instated him in #cri, and after some time, god damn he may have gotten some skill for playing so much as I do. James Heath is Yumosis (Oh noes Hackers have NAMES!!). He´s a nice guy, kind of slow sometimes, but I believe in him. It is your call whether you do. #cri.tical, you should ease up on the comments a little, we didnt do too good against BM, did we? Neither could I play in the cpl due to my distance and age, so why bash ir? Bashing another clan is like bashing yourself. You downgrade yourself and them. Why fight when we could all be brothers? Except you Delphi, you are too leetsauce for us <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->. Or are you?
As stated, below is my cfg file, enjoy! As always, idling in #fa1lure in gamesnet is always charming <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
// This file is overwritten whenever you change your user settings in the game. // Add custom configurations to the file "userconfig.cfg".
Btw does bunny hopping still get u to fast speeds? I know that just jumping doesn't but is there another way? i seen people looking from side to side as they jump heaps, which i am assuming is beneficial.
Personally I'm against scripting not a against binding. I think that bhoping scripts take a way from the skill required to achieve desired results. I have binds like: CODE <!--c1--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->alias health "say_team commander I need health"bind h "impluse (I dont remember number but its med pack command); health"<!--c2--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--ec2--> But I bhop almost as good as the ones with scripts and I just use almost the default binds.I don’t like binds that help in combat... I use hud_fastswitch 1 and don’t need binds to swipe when blinking. I think that its taking away the required skill, knowing where every key that does everything in the game is with out looking is something that script kiddies shouldn’t be allowed to download and use to match the skill of those that practice.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The reason I know you can't simply adjust the air capped values is because Flay tried it already once for 3.0...
It wasn't pretty, leap looked like a marine jump, lerks were slow POS, fades were sad, and marines couldn't take fall damage...
If it's so easy Green, why hasn't Flay taken it out? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He might not have given it much thought because he considers other aspects of the game more important or he might have given it some thought and found that he does not disslike bunnyhopping.
Furthermore I have not suggested that he should adjust the airspeed cap value, I suggested that it might(<-- notice might) work if the bunnyhopping cap alone was set to something near 1. (which was put there by valve to try and fix bhoping, I don't know if it is even possible to change(which I have allready said a page or 2 back) but you can switch it on and off. EG it is turned off in AGHL, it is turned on in NS. Also You can punish people when they are going faster than 170% and jump by setting their speed back to 100%(this is done in HLDM), this does not reduce the mobillity of the player only gives people a "speeding ticket" when they do extreme stuff <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->)
This should(notice should, I am not or have ever been a HL MOD coder) only have the effect of lowering the top speed of bunnyhopping. The current value is 1.7 and you can still leap, blink and fly at 3 times the normal speed without any special coding as well as fall really really fast, way above the 3x speed cap beacause falling is vertical movement and is not affected by the speed cap. If you set this value lower the only noticable effect I think you should be seeing during normal play is when strafe turning on the ground to pick up more speed than normal before jumping(most people don't do this anyway and I see no reason why this should be allowed more than bunnyhopping since they are very similar).
Unless Flayra has stated that he tried changing this limit to something lower, and this limit alone(not the horisontal airspeed cap which I don't think is related) and either found it was not possible to change it or it caused weird side-effects I still believe it would be rather easy.
If this limit is not changeable, is it possible for Flayra to code it himself instead of making changes to the given code?(IE everytime the jump command is succesfully executed then check to see if the horisontal speed of the player is above some value slightly above 1 or 1 then set the players horisontal speed to 1 or slightly above in the direction of movement).
Is there anyone who has any more concrete information on why this isn't possible or what you can do in coding for HL(more specifically, does the above idea of coding it yourself work or does it backfire somehow/isn't possible)?
edit: Found some relevant information in the HL SDK documentation(yes I DLed the SDK just to have a look at player physics documentation and such <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> )
In this version of the Half-Life engine SDK, the MOD authors now have control over all player movement physics behavior. This allows interesting physics tweaks for MODs as well as allowing the creation of new physics types ( e.g., allowing various spectator modes ) which can be shared between the game server and client code.
The source files for the player physics code may be found in the pm_shared/ directory. Note that the files in the shared folder are shared between both the client and game .dll. You should also note that some of the headers are referenced in the engine, so care should be taken not to alter important data structures in those files. To alter player physics, one simply changes the appropriate code in the pm_shared/ directory ( most likely in pm_shared.c ) and recompiles the client .dll and the game .dll. Both of those projects reference the same source file so prediction errors are unlikely to occur ? so long as you remember to compile both projects if you make physics changes.
All player movements ( either predicted on the client or actual on the server ) occur by the engine invoking PM_PlayerMove ( found in pm_shared.c ) called via PM_Move().
This function evaluates the move as follows ( generally ):
Parameters such as maximum speed, punch angle adjustment, and dead player view angle tweaks are checked in PM_CheckParameters().
Any timers associated with player physics ( e.g., time before playing another step sound, etc. ) are decremented in PM_ReduceTimers().
The player's position is checked to see if the player is stuck in the world or another entity. If not, the player's position is categorized in PM_CatagorizePosition(), which checks whether the player is standing on an entity/the ground or is in the air and also, if the player is under water, this checks how far under water ( feet, torso, eyes ).
If the player is holding the crouch/duck key, PM_Duck deals with that action.
Finally, depending on the player's movetype, one of various movetype specific code paths is followed. The MOVETYPE_WALK code path is the most relevant, as this handles the player in the normal state ( walking, swimming ). This is where gravity, friction, water or ground movement, jumping, velocity capping, and falling are taken into account.
The main data structure for player movement is the pmove structure. This structure contains the relevant data elements as input / output for the move. I.e., the engine fills in most of the data before calling this function and the results of movement on the relevant variables is recorded by setting them in the pmove structure before returning control to the engine.
In addition, various API callbacks are provided to help the physics system perform the move. Such things as retrieving physics key/value pairs for the player, testing the player position, printing to the console, getting the current clock, determining the contents value for a point, tracing rays, generating random numbers, getting model data from a model pointer, playing sounds, tracing to determine a texture name, and playing back events are supported. The pmove structure ( playermove_t ) is defined in pm_defs.h.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Didn't help much but anyway, somewhat interesting read <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> ...
[spazzout] omg omgo mgom ogomgo gogm leetl leet lett lleet!!11111[/spazzout]... I uh, fixed bunnyhopping for HLDM using only my rudimentary knowledge of c programming and without any prior knowledge at all(zilch) of programming HL MODs. I have seen no ill effects of the fix and it is not a total fix but nearly enough.
What I did was examine the air acceleration code, calculate the new x y and z components of the velocity as usual, then renormalize the horisontal speed to it's previous value. IE you can strafe turn in the air just as well as before, you won't pick up any speed or lose any speed if there's no trigger_push's or other outside disturbances.
Still, if you somehow manage to get up to speed(such as jumping when landing in a steep slope, using the gauss gun or straferunning prior to jumping) you will retain the speed if you try to bunnyhop. However this is much better than the previous sitiuation because without scripts you will not be able to retain the speed for long at all(you loose more than you think through friction when you can't gain it right back by strafejumping).
If still have the WON installation of HL you might wish to try it out. You can get my compile of the client.dll and hl.dll file <a href='http://hem.bredband.net/congal/temp/hl_tehbunnynerf.zip' target='_blank'>here</a>. Rename and replace the hl.dll in valve\dlls and rename and replace the client.dll. Try it out by starting a LAN game and playing a nice open map such as crossfire. You might wish to use a speedometer tool, such as the one found in sparky utils v1(non-cheat client-side hook that is just as easy to install and use as cheating-death is, the console command for displaying the speedometer is bspeedo).
I also beefed up the long jump module quite a bit(catapulting you damn near half-way across the map in one jump).
When you are done playing around/testing my fix you just remove my .dll's and restore the old renamed ones. IF YOU FIND ANY I'LL EFFECTS, QUIRKY BEHAVIOUR THAT ISN'T THERE WITH THE OLD ONES PLEASE PLEASE TELL ME!!!!111... have fun
I also found this <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->// Only allow bunny jumping up to 1.7x server / player maxspeed setting #define BUNNYJUMP_MAX_SPEED_FACTOR 1.7f
//----------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Purpose: Corrects bunny jumping ( where player initiates a bunny jump before other // movement logic runs, thus making onground == -1 thus making PM_Friction get skipped and // running PM_AirMove, which doesn't crop velocity to maxspeed like the ground / other // movement logic does. //----------------------------------------------------------------------------- void PM_PreventMegaBunnyJumping( void ) { // Current player speed float spd; // If we have to crop, apply this cropping fraction to velocity float fraction; // Speed at which bunny jumping is limited float maxscaledspeed;
// Don't divide by zero if ( maxscaledspeed <= 0.0f ) return;
spd = Length( pmove->velocity );
if ( spd <= maxscaledspeed ) return;
fraction = ( maxscaledspeed / spd ) * 0.65; //Returns the modifier for the velocity
VectorScale( pmove->velocity, fraction, pmove->velocity ); //Crop it down!. }<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I haven't played with it yet but I'm damn well going to <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->.
if (pmove->dead) return; if (pmove->waterjumptime) return;
// Cap speed //wishspd = VectorNormalize (pmove->wishveloc);
if (wishspd > 30) wishspd = 30; //Determine veer amount currentspeed = DotProduct (pmove->velocity, wishdir); // See how much to add addspeed = wishspd - currentspeed; // If not adding any, done. if (addspeed <= 0) return; // Determine acceleration speed after acceleration
accelspeed = accel * wishspeed * pmove->frametime * pmove->friction; // Cap it if (accelspeed > addspeed) accelspeed = addspeed;
if (pmove->dead) return; if (pmove->waterjumptime) return;
// Cap speed //wishspd = VectorNormalize (pmove->wishveloc);
if (wishspd > 30) wishspd = 30; // Determine veer amount currentspeed = DotProduct (pmove->velocity, wishdir); // See how much to add addspeed = wishspd - currentspeed; // If not adding any, done. if (addspeed <= 0) return; // Determine acceleration speed after acceleration
accelspeed = accel * wishspeed * pmove->frametime * pmove->friction; // Cap it if (accelspeed > addspeed) accelspeed = addspeed;
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
Nice code. I don't script, and I don't really bhop. I get by as skulk. You can usually find me on linuxmonster now-a-days if you want to test that. Please I welcome the challenge <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> I'v enever played in a clan so I don't know how it ould affect tournys but removing bhop wouldn't affect me or the pubs I play very much. As a result I don't care.
One thing I'm a little confused on is why people are up in arms about the removal of wait. Maybe I'm ignorant, but the scripts that I would defend(like music scripts, or binding it so you change configs when you switch to commander mode or gorge mode) wouldn't be affected by the removal of wait. And weapon switch scripts... are just dumb. I love last_inv, maybe I'd like ot whip out my knife a little faster after using my pistol and lmg, but that's something I just have to get better at.
I noticed someone was going to post Valve's take on bhopping and I find that completely irrelevent to the topic unless Valve decides to eradicate Bhopping from the source code entirely. It's there and it's not going away in NS, unless it is removed by a developer of NS therefore Valve really has nothing to do with it.
I'm glad the clan war seems to have subsided, I was waiting for cri. to get accused of hoarding WMD's though.
Green, what I was also was trying to imply was that in NS, removing Bhop will affect other classes and their abilities as well.
Instead of modifying HLDM, try doing it to NS (err... I guess you'd have to decompile it...)... see what the effects are with the same code. I doubt it would be pretty.
I know there's a good reason if Flay didn't remove bhop when he's trying to kill all of these scripts for it...!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Nice code. I don't script, and I don't really bhop. I get by as skulk. You can usually find me on linuxmonster now-a-days if you want to test that.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Test what? The server must run the same version of the .dll's as the clients. And isn't lunixmonster an NS server?, this can't be compiled for NS without the complete source code of NS and NS isn't open source(i.e. I don't get to have it).
The only thing this is supposed to show is one possible way to almost remove bunnyhopping from NS.
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Test what? The server must run the same version of the .dll's as the clients. And isn't lunixmonster an NS server?, this can't be compiled for NS without the complete source code of NS and NS isn't open source(i.e. I don't get to have it).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Green, what I was also was trying to imply was that in NS, removing Bhop will affect other classes and their abilities as well.
Instead of modifying HLDM, try doing it to NS (err... I guess you'd have to decompile it...)... see what the effects are with the same code. I doubt it would be pretty.
I know there's a good reason if Flay didn't remove bhop when he's trying to kill all of these scripts for it...! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I barely get by with the source code in hand. Given that I don't have the NS source code all I get is 2 .dll files. That's like... machine language, it's completely unintelligible, you could easily spend several freaking years trying to make heads or tales of it much worse modifying it <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo-->.
But the code is not class specific, granted, it would only have to be specially tailored for lerks, as they can't bunnyhop as it is, I guess you just make lerks use their normal movement code and use this code for all other aliens, the marines are fine the way they are.
I still don't see what could go wrong, it does not affect fall speed, it does not feel different strafe turning in the air(allthough you can now turn a little sharper since you don't get a speed bost from strafe turning), you can still jump like mad up an down.
Given the very generic nature of the fix, it involves no set speeds or caps, it should give similar results for the skulk, gorge, fade and onos as it does for HLDM...
I'm not sure Flayra want's bunnyhopping gone, he might just want to put some more skill in it(I.E. remove scripting abillities).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Erm, I meant my skill(or lack thereof) not your code. Sorry for the confusion. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But... why me, I'm.. nobody...? I don't even think I've played NS in 2-3 weeks now <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> (I like to cycle through a fair bunch of MODs...)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Erm, I meant my skill<b>(or lack thereof)</b> not your code. Sorry for the confusion. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah locallyunscene, your really bashing the wrong person methinks...
EDIT: w00t! 11(th) page! This is the last topic I would think to hit 11 pages.
Comments
Anyway, yes, people who know how to bhop hold an advantage over people who cannot. I was glad the ability to bhop as a marine was taken out in 2.0 because it looked stupid to see humans bouncing along like that when everything else was trying to go for the sci-fi movie realism feeling. I think bhop fits well with the theme of aliens as fast creatures who can spread across the map much faster than marines.
Scripts or mousewheel, I don't care. Whatever floats your boat.
Here's a tip for people who get dominated regularly by a bhopping skulk: don't stand like a moron around a sharp turn. It gives you no chance to shoot a skulk who whips around the corner. Position yourself in a spot where it gives you the maximum amount of time possible to empty your clip. Excellent bhoppers like in envy aren't invincible and are easy to control by NOT sitting around a corner. To give him decent speed, he needs to move in a more or less straight path. Makes it alot easier to keep your crosshair on them.
btw. cri sux
Toggle scripts rule.
If scripts are cheating then why wasn't the scripting language disabled in the HLDM? (You know the multiplayer that came with HL)
Can any of you geniuses answer that?
alias +blinkswipe "slot2; wait; +attack"
alias -blinkswipe "-attack; wait; slot1"
bind "MOUSE2" "+blinkswipe"
Enjoy.
In conclusion, #cri rules.
Some of us kill the old fashioned way; You know, aiming at our targets, having patience, and not turning our gamma up via third party programs to insane levels to see skulks, or jumping around like a friggin idiot to avoid a skulk. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
<span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'><b>C-R-Y</b></span>
Sure, while the 300% air speed cap is there, you can only get to 170%, correct?
So you think that you could just lower the bhop air capped speed to something like 110% or 100% (no speed incrase), and leave the other 300% air capped speed alone.
This isn't true. For some reason, these two values are somehow releated, but I don't know how.
If you lower the bhop speed cap to 100%, when you fall you will not be hurt. One speed cap (the 300% one) is for special abilities to reach, while the 170% speed increase is what you reach by falling/jumping.
Furthermore, the way you kill bhopping with marines is not by lowering the airspeed cap... it's by making their speed decrease after each jump landed. Doing the same process for aliens would be pure sh!t in my oppinion.
There is no way to kill alien bhop without killing leap/fall damage/everything else for aliens it seems.
I guess the only solution would be to give an entirely different recode for each alien WEAPON, so they are not linked in anyway by global varibles, and so that you could make it so there's no bhop and each weapon behaves differently. I don't even know if this is possible.
Some of us kill the old fashioned way; You know, aiming at our targets, having patience, and not turning our gamma up via third party programs to insane levels to see skulks, or jumping around like a friggin idiot to avoid a skulk. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'><b>C-R-Y</b></span> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Congrats buddy you just became the classic example in whats wrong with the community. I hope you feel good now. Drama queen.
Look if you can't do it manually, it isn't skill, so don't go around flexing a script. Someone lock this, the idiocy from the vet forums as penetrated General discussion
btw. cri sux <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Im beginning to think clans in general suck, my god its like listening to a bunch of 17 year olds on the rag
I've always thought they suck, because they're a huge hoard of elitists, and they suck the good players away from pubs.
Why, thank you. How did you ever know?
so I suppose the good players should just stand there and allow the skulk to kill him in order to level the playing field for those that don't know how?
Sure, while the 300% air speed cap is there, you can only get to 170%, correct?
So you think that you could just lower the bhop air capped speed to something like 110% or 100% (no speed incrase), and leave the other 300% air capped speed alone.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There isn't a bhop airspeed cap at all. You can reach any speed while in the air, it is the instant you jump(IE the +jump command is processed). You do get slightly over 170% while bunnyhopping, but the instant you jump again you are put at 170%.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->This isn't true. For some reason, these two values are somehow releated, but I don't know how.
If you lower the bhop speed cap to 100%, when you fall you will not be hurt. One speed cap (the 300% one) is for special abilities to reach, while the 170% speed increase is what you reach by falling/jumping.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
some errors, the airspeed cap refers only to horisontal speed not vertical, you can reach far over 300% of your max speed by falling. I don't see how it might cause bugs with falldamage and I have no clue if the maximum airspeed relates to the horisontal speed cap after a jump or how, but if you say so.
Skulks don't take falldamage(they only growl) so not having them growl when falling to far might be a small price to pay if your adamant to prevent skulks from bhoping(they are the most common creature to bhop with).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Furthermore, the way you kill bhopping with marines is not by lowering the airspeed cap... it's by making their speed decrease after each jump landed. Doing the same process for aliens would be pure sh!t in my oppinion.
There is no way to kill alien bhop without killing leap/fall damage/everything else for aliens it seems.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not so sure about that, it seems so easy... but then again, I'm not a MOD coder so I don't know where setting the bhoping speed limit to something lower would produce unwanted results <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo-->.
anyways your bunny hoppy scripts are gone they aren't coming back so just deal with it
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The reason I know you can't simply adjust the air capped values is because Flay tried it already once for 3.0...
It wasn't pretty, leap looked like a marine jump, lerks were slow POS, fades were sad, and marines couldn't take fall damage...
If it's so easy Green, why hasn't Flay taken it out?
Bickering, fighting, squabbling over such a petty argument such as bunny hopping.
I can bunny hop. Below is my .cfg, which has not even a single script.
Do I take pride in that? No.
Do I get up in my high horse and think I own you because I play it naturally? No.
Is it more challenging to learn to bunnyhop, and some other movement and weapon skills without scripts? Yes.
Was it worth it? Yes.
I do not have +4 years of HL experience, I am not cal-i, although #cri is going cal-o next season.
I never learned to bunnyhop in the old days. I have been learning it by myself.
It is quite simple. Just grab some speed, probably jump off a ledge or inclination, hold crouch, jump the instant I hit the floor again, look left, jump again, jump instant I get back down, look right, etc etc.
I don´t have +3 years of playing with the same setup, I have settled in one just since a month ago,
and I don´t aim too bad, we can say. I will probably have 70% accuracy in 3 months or so, and progressively increase.
Some people in my clan do script. Does it make them better players than me? I don´t think so. If they are more skilled, inherently, through practice, or just raw talent, I admire that. If they use scripts to help their game a little, do I belittle them? No.
Personally, Charlie can do whatever he wants with bhopping.
I don´t use powerstrip, any other gamma programs, not an autoexec.cfg file, or binds.
I only use my 3 mouse buttons, although my mouse has 5, because my hand is quite small for it.
I´m not better than maven, tex, cole, meb, or whoever else that bhops naturally or by script.
You have to know this.
You adapt,
or you die.
Don´t want to get mauled by bunnyhopping skulks? Why not spend a little less time in the forums and more time practicing your aim and some smarts so you won´t get mauled as much.
Seriously, people. Most of this things you speak of can be easily countered. God, some of you want everything on a golden plate nowadays.
About my clan, #cri, You could take my word for it that we don´t hack, but its the internet, after all, and why believe me? Another arrogant veteran who feels way too proud of his golden icon that he shares with last-minute clans and the such? Why believe me?
James, I have known him for a long time. Since my OSS days when I was, lets say, a below-average player. I snatched him from OSS, instated him in #cri, and after some time, god damn he may have gotten some skill for playing so much as I do. James Heath is Yumosis (Oh noes Hackers have NAMES!!). He´s a nice guy, kind of slow sometimes, but I believe in him. It is your call whether you do. #cri.tical, you should ease up on the comments a little, we didnt do too good against BM, did we? Neither could I play in the cpl due to my distance and age, so why bash ir?
Bashing another clan is like bashing yourself. You downgrade yourself and them. Why fight when we could all be brothers? Except you Delphi, you are too leetsauce for us <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->. Or are you?
As stated, below is my cfg file, enjoy!
As always, idling in #fa1lure in gamesnet is always charming <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->.
// This file is overwritten whenever you change your user settings in the game.
// Add custom configurations to the file "userconfig.cfg".
unbindall
bind "TAB" "+showscores"
bind "ESCAPE" "cancelselect"
bind "SPACE" "+duck"
bind "'" "+moveup"
bind "+" "sizeup"
bind "," "impulse 123"
bind "-" "sizedown"
bind "." "impulse 124"
bind "/" "impulse 125"
bind "0" "slot10"
bind "1" "slot1"
bind "2" "slot2"
bind "3" "slot3"
bind "4" "slot4"
bind "5" "slot5"
bind ";" "+mlook"
bind "=" "sizeup"
bind "]" "invnext"
bind "`" "toggleconsole"
bind "a" "+moveleft"
bind "c" "impulse 3"
bind "d" "+moveright"
bind "e" "+use"
bind "f" "impulse 100"
bind "g" "+voicerecord"
bind "h" "impulse 10"
bind "k" "+showmap"
bind "l" "impulse 105"
bind "m" "impulse 11"
bind "o" "impulse 80"
bind "q" "+popupmenu"
bind "r" "+reload"
bind "s" "+back"
bind "t" "messagemode2"
bind "w" "+forward"
bind "y" "messagemode"
bind "~" "toggleconsole"
bind "UPARROW" "+scrollup"
bind "DOWNARROW" "+scrolldown"
bind "LEFTARROW" "+scrollleft"
bind "RIGHTARROW" "+scrollright"
bind "ALT" "+voicerecord"
bind "CTRL" "+jump"
bind "SHIFT" "+speed"
bind "F1" "jointeamone"
bind "F2" "jointeamtwo"
bind "F4" "readyroom"
bind "F5" "snapshot"
bind "INS" "+klook"
bind "DEL" "kill"
bind "PGDN" "+lookdown"
bind "PGUP" "+lookup"
bind "END" "centerview"
bind "MWHEELDOWN" "invnext"
bind "MOUSE1" "+attack"
bind "MOUSE3" "lastinv"
bind "PAUSE" "pause"
_snd_mixahead "0.1"
ati_npatch "1.0"
ati_subdiv "2.0"
bgmvolume "1.000000"
bottomcolor "0"
brightness "3"
cl_allowdownload "1"
cl_allowupload "'1"
cl_autohelp "0"
cl_backspeed "1000"
cl_buildmessages "1"
cl_centerentityid "0.0"
cl_cmdbackup "2"
cl_cmdrate "100"
cl_cmhotkeys "qwerasdfzxcv"
cl_dlmax "128"
cl_download_ingame "0"
cl_dynamiclights "1"
cl_forcedefaultfov "0"
cl_forwardspeed "1000"
cl_highdetail "1"
cl_himodels "0"
cl_idealpitchscale "0.8"
cl_lc "1"
cl_logocolor "#Valve_Orange"
cl_logofile "smiley"
cl_lw "1"
cl_musicdelay "0.000000"
cl_musicdirectory "C:\My Music"
cl_musicenabled "1"
cl_musicvolume "35.000000"
cl_particleinfo "0"
cl_quickselecttime "0.000000"
cl_timeout "60"
cl_updaterate "101"
cl_vsmoothing "0.05"
con_color "255 255 50"
console "1.0"
crosshair "1.000000"
fps_max "100"
fps_modem "100"
gamma "3"
gl_dither "1"
gl_flipmatrix "0"
gl_monolights "0"
gl_overbright "1"
gl_polyoffset "0.1"
hisound "1"
hpk_maxsize "0"
hud_capturemouse "1"
hud_centerid "1"
hud_classautokill "1"
hud_draw "1"
hud_fastswitch "1"
hud_takesshots "0"
joystick "0"
lookspring "0.000000"
lookstrafe "0.000000"
m_filter "0"
m_forward "1"
m_pitch "0.022000"
m_side "0.8"
m_yaw "0.022"
model "gordon"
MP3FadeTime "2.0"
MP3Volume "0.120000"
mp_decals "300.000000"
name "#fa1lure"
net_graph "0"
net_graphpos "1"
net_scale "5"
r_bmodelhighfrac "5.0"
s_a3d "0"
s_automax_distance "30.0"
s_automin_distance "2.0"
s_bloat "2.0"
s_distance "60"
s_doppler "0.0"
s_eax "1"
s_leafnum "0"
s_max_distance "1000.0"
s_min_distance "8.0"
s_numpolys "200"
s_polykeep "1000000000"
s_polysize "10000000"
s_refdelay "4"
s_refgain "0.4"
s_rolloff "1.0"
s_verbwet "0.25"
sensitivity "2.5"
skin ""
suitvolume "0.250000"
sv_aim "0"
sv_voiceenable "1"
team ""
topcolor "30"
viewsize "120.000000"
voice_enable "1"
voice_forcemicrecord "1.000000"
voice_modenable "1"
voice_scale "1"
volume ".5"
setinfo "friends" "0"
+mlook
exec userconfig.cfg
<!--c1--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->alias health "say_team commander I need health"bind h "impluse (I dont remember number but its med pack command); health"<!--c2--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
But I bhop almost as good as the ones with scripts and I just use almost the default binds.I don’t like binds that help in combat... I use hud_fastswitch 1 and don’t need binds to swipe when blinking. I think that its taking away the required skill, knowing where every key that does everything in the game is with out looking is something that script kiddies shouldn’t be allowed to download and use to match the skill of those that practice.
It wasn't pretty, leap looked like a marine jump, lerks were slow POS, fades were sad, and marines couldn't take fall damage...
If it's so easy Green, why hasn't Flay taken it out? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He might not have given it much thought because he considers other aspects of the game more important or he might have given it some thought and found that he does not disslike bunnyhopping.
Furthermore I have not suggested that he should adjust the airspeed cap value, I suggested that it might(<-- notice might) work if the bunnyhopping cap alone was set to something near 1. (which was put there by valve to try and fix bhoping, I don't know if it is even possible to change(which I have allready said a page or 2 back) but you can switch it on and off. EG it is turned off in AGHL, it is turned on in NS. Also You can punish people when they are going faster than 170% and jump by setting their speed back to 100%(this is done in HLDM), this does not reduce the mobillity of the player only gives people a "speeding ticket" when they do extreme stuff <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->)
This should(notice should, I am not or have ever been a HL MOD coder) only have the effect of lowering the top speed of bunnyhopping. The current value is 1.7 and you can still leap, blink and fly at 3 times the normal speed without any special coding as well as fall really really fast, way above the 3x speed cap beacause falling is vertical movement and is not affected by the speed cap. If you set this value lower the only noticable effect I think you should be seeing during normal play is when strafe turning on the ground to pick up more speed than normal before jumping(most people don't do this anyway and I see no reason why this should be allowed more than bunnyhopping since they are very similar).
Unless Flayra has stated that he tried changing this limit to something lower, and this limit alone(not the horisontal airspeed cap which I don't think is related) and either found it was not possible to change it or it caused weird side-effects I still believe it would be rather easy.
If this limit is not changeable, is it possible for Flayra to code it himself instead of making changes to the given code?(IE everytime the jump command is succesfully executed then check to see if the horisontal speed of the player is above some value slightly above 1 or 1 then set the players horisontal speed to 1 or slightly above in the direction of movement).
Is there anyone who has any more concrete information on why this isn't possible or what you can do in coding for HL(more specifically, does the above idea of coding it yourself work or does it backfire somehow/isn't possible)?
edit: Found some relevant information in the HL SDK documentation(yes I DLed the SDK just to have a look at player physics documentation and such <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> )
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->HL SDK 2.3
Player Physics System
In this version of the Half-Life engine SDK, the MOD authors now have control over all player movement physics behavior. This allows interesting physics tweaks for MODs as well as allowing the creation of new physics types ( e.g., allowing various spectator modes ) which can be shared between the game server and client code.
The source files for the player physics code may be found in the pm_shared/ directory. Note that the files in the shared folder are shared between both the client and game .dll. You should also note that some of the headers are referenced in the engine, so care should be taken not to alter important data structures in those files. To alter player physics, one simply changes the appropriate code in the pm_shared/ directory ( most likely in pm_shared.c ) and recompiles the client .dll and the game .dll. Both of those projects reference the same source file so prediction errors are unlikely to occur ? so long as you remember to compile both projects if you make physics changes.
All player movements ( either predicted on the client or actual on the server ) occur by the engine invoking PM_PlayerMove ( found in pm_shared.c ) called via PM_Move().
This function evaluates the move as follows ( generally ):
Parameters such as maximum speed, punch angle adjustment, and dead player view angle tweaks are checked in PM_CheckParameters().
Any timers associated with player physics ( e.g., time before playing another step sound, etc. ) are decremented in PM_ReduceTimers().
The player's position is checked to see if the player is stuck in the world or another entity. If not, the player's position is categorized in PM_CatagorizePosition(), which checks whether the player is standing on an entity/the ground or is in the air and also, if the player is under water, this checks how far under water ( feet, torso, eyes ).
If the player is holding the crouch/duck key, PM_Duck deals with that action.
Finally, depending on the player's movetype, one of various movetype specific code paths is followed. The MOVETYPE_WALK code path is the most relevant, as this handles the player in the normal state ( walking, swimming ). This is where gravity, friction, water or ground movement, jumping, velocity capping, and falling are taken into account.
The main data structure for player movement is the pmove structure. This structure contains the relevant data elements as input / output for the move. I.e., the engine fills in most of the data before calling this function and the results of movement on the relevant variables is recorded by setting them in the pmove structure before returning control to the engine.
In addition, various API callbacks are provided to help the physics system perform the move. Such things as retrieving physics key/value pairs for the player, testing the player position, printing to the console, getting the current clock, determining the contents value for a point, tracing rays, generating random numbers, getting model data from a model pointer, playing sounds, tracing to determine a texture name, and playing back events are supported. The pmove structure ( playermove_t ) is defined in pm_defs.h.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Didn't help much but anyway, somewhat interesting read <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> ...
=;[
I uh, fixed bunnyhopping for HLDM using only my rudimentary knowledge of c programming and without any prior knowledge at all(zilch) of programming HL MODs. I have seen no ill effects of the fix and it is not a total fix but nearly enough.
What I did was examine the air acceleration code, calculate the new x y and z components of the velocity as usual, then renormalize the horisontal speed to it's previous value. IE you can strafe turn in the air just as well as before, you won't pick up any speed or lose any speed if there's no trigger_push's or other outside disturbances.
Still, if you somehow manage to get up to speed(such as jumping when landing in a steep slope, using the gauss gun or straferunning prior to jumping) you will retain the speed if you try to bunnyhop. However this is much better than the previous sitiuation because without scripts you will not be able to retain the speed for long at all(you loose more than you think through friction when you can't gain it right back by strafejumping).
If still have the WON installation of HL you might wish to try it out. You can get my compile of the client.dll and hl.dll file <a href='http://hem.bredband.net/congal/temp/hl_tehbunnynerf.zip' target='_blank'>here</a>. Rename and replace the hl.dll in valve\dlls and rename and replace the client.dll. Try it out by starting a LAN game and playing a nice open map such as crossfire. You might wish to use a speedometer tool, such as the one found in sparky utils v1(non-cheat client-side hook that is just as easy to install and use as cheating-death is, the console command for displaying the speedometer is bspeedo).
I also beefed up the long jump module quite a bit(catapulting you damn near half-way across the map in one jump).
When you are done playing around/testing my fix you just remove my .dll's and restore the old renamed ones. IF YOU FIND ANY I'LL EFFECTS, QUIRKY BEHAVIOUR THAT ISN'T THERE WITH THE OLD ONES PLEASE PLEASE TELL ME!!!!111... have fun
I also found this <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->// Only allow bunny jumping up to 1.7x server / player maxspeed setting
#define BUNNYJUMP_MAX_SPEED_FACTOR 1.7f
//-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
// Purpose: Corrects bunny jumping ( where player initiates a bunny jump before other
// movement logic runs, thus making onground == -1 thus making PM_Friction get skipped and
// running PM_AirMove, which doesn't crop velocity to maxspeed like the ground / other
// movement logic does.
//-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
void PM_PreventMegaBunnyJumping( void )
{
// Current player speed
float spd;
// If we have to crop, apply this cropping fraction to velocity
float fraction;
// Speed at which bunny jumping is limited
float maxscaledspeed;
maxscaledspeed = BUNNYJUMP_MAX_SPEED_FACTOR * pmove->maxspeed;
// Don't divide by zero
if ( maxscaledspeed <= 0.0f )
return;
spd = Length( pmove->velocity );
if ( spd <= maxscaledspeed )
return;
fraction = ( maxscaledspeed / spd ) * 0.65; //Returns the modifier for the velocity
VectorScale( pmove->velocity, fraction, pmove->velocity ); //Crop it down!.
}<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I haven't played with it yet but I'm damn well going to <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->.
The code change I made:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->void PM_AirAccelerate (vec3_t wishdir, float wishspeed, float accel)
{
int i;
float addspeed, accelspeed, currentspeed, wishspd = wishspeed, temp[3], velfixed[3];
if (pmove->dead)
return;
if (pmove->waterjumptime)
return;
// Cap speed
//wishspd = VectorNormalize (pmove->wishveloc);
if (wishspd > 30)
wishspd = 30;
//Determine veer amount
currentspeed = DotProduct (pmove->velocity, wishdir);
// See how much to add
addspeed = wishspd - currentspeed;
// If not adding any, done.
if (addspeed <= 0)
return;
// Determine acceleration speed after acceleration
accelspeed = accel * wishspeed * pmove->frametime * pmove->friction;
// Cap it
if (accelspeed > addspeed)
accelspeed = addspeed;
//possible bunnyfix
temp[0]=sqrt(pmove->velocity[0]*pmove->velocity[0]+pmove->velocity[1]*pmove->velocity[1]);
temp[1]=pmove->velocity[0]+accelspeed*wishdir[0];
temp[2]=pmove->velocity[1]+accelspeed*wishdir[1];
temp[0]/=sqrt(temp[1]*temp[1]+temp[2]*temp[2]);
velfixed[0]=temp[1]*temp[0];
velfixed[1]=temp[2]*temp[0];
velfixed[2]=pmove->velocity[2]+accelspeed*wishdir[2];
//Adjust pmove vel.
for (i=0 ; i<3 ; i++)
{
pmove->velocity[i] = velfixed[i];
}
}<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The original code:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->void PM_AirAccelerate (vec3_t wishdir, float wishspeed, float accel)
{
int i;
float addspeed, accelspeed, currentspeed, wishspd = wishspeed;
if (pmove->dead)
return;
if (pmove->waterjumptime)
return;
// Cap speed
//wishspd = VectorNormalize (pmove->wishveloc);
if (wishspd > 30)
wishspd = 30;
// Determine veer amount
currentspeed = DotProduct (pmove->velocity, wishdir);
// See how much to add
addspeed = wishspd - currentspeed;
// If not adding any, done.
if (addspeed <= 0)
return;
// Determine acceleration speed after acceleration
accelspeed = accel * wishspeed * pmove->frametime * pmove->friction;
// Cap it
if (accelspeed > addspeed)
accelspeed = addspeed;
// Adjust pmove vel.
for (i=0 ; i<3 ; i++)
{
pmove->velocity[i] += accelspeed*wishdir[i];
}
}<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As you can see the change is pretty minor.
One thing I'm a little confused on is why people are up in arms about the removal of wait. Maybe I'm ignorant, but the scripts that I would defend(like music scripts, or binding it so you change configs when you switch to commander mode or gorge mode) wouldn't be affected by the removal of wait. And weapon switch scripts... are just dumb. I love last_inv, maybe I'd like ot whip out my knife a little faster after using my pistol and lmg, but that's something I just have to get better at.
I noticed someone was going to post Valve's take on bhopping and I find that completely irrelevent to the topic unless Valve decides to eradicate Bhopping from the source code entirely. It's there and it's not going away in NS, unless it is removed by a developer of NS therefore Valve really has nothing to do with it.
I'm glad the clan war seems to have subsided, I was waiting for cri. to get accused of hoarding WMD's though.
Instead of modifying HLDM, try doing it to NS (err... I guess you'd have to decompile it...)... see what the effects are with the same code. I doubt it would be pretty.
I know there's a good reason if Flay didn't remove bhop when he's trying to kill all of these scripts for it...!
Test what? The server must run the same version of the .dll's as the clients. And isn't lunixmonster an NS server?, this can't be compiled for NS without the complete source code of NS and NS isn't open source(i.e. I don't get to have it).
The only thing this is supposed to show is one possible way to almost remove bunnyhopping from NS.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Erm, I meant my skill(or lack thereof) not your code. Sorry for the confusion.
Instead of modifying HLDM, try doing it to NS (err... I guess you'd have to decompile it...)... see what the effects are with the same code. I doubt it would be pretty.
I know there's a good reason if Flay didn't remove bhop when he's trying to kill all of these scripts for it...!
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I barely get by with the source code in hand. Given that I don't have the NS source code all I get is 2 .dll files. That's like... machine language, it's completely unintelligible, you could easily spend several freaking years trying to make heads or tales of it much worse modifying it <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo-->.
But the code is not class specific, granted, it would only have to be specially tailored for lerks, as they can't bunnyhop as it is, I guess you just make lerks use their normal movement code and use this code for all other aliens, the marines are fine the way they are.
I still don't see what could go wrong, it does not affect fall speed, it does not feel different strafe turning in the air(allthough you can now turn a little sharper since you don't get a speed bost from strafe turning), you can still jump like mad up an down.
Given the very generic nature of the fix, it involves no set speeds or caps, it should give similar results for the skulk, gorge, fade and onos as it does for HLDM...
I'm not sure Flayra want's bunnyhopping gone, he might just want to put some more skill in it(I.E. remove scripting abillities).
But... why me, I'm.. nobody...? I don't even think I've played NS in 2-3 weeks now <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> (I like to cycle through a fair bunch of MODs...)
Yeah locallyunscene, your really bashing the wrong person methinks...
EDIT: w00t! 11(th) page! This is the last topic I would think to hit 11 pages.