Now, I was a little slow on the whole Steam thing... you left, to create a new Engine, right? Then why are you going back to Steam?
Honestly, I used to think Steam was a great company. And while they have great prices and tons of games to choose from, I've been fortunate enough to follow them through thick and thin. I've been around since the original Natural Selection days and so far, up until this update, I was excited. But this changed to Steam? It's been in my honest opinion, that people only sign up with Steam when it's all about the money. And because of personal reasons, I'm a little pissed off that you went back to them.
I can just see it now. Playing with a load of morons, only playing to get their ridiculous achievements. Of which I'm sure you'll fill it with a bunch of half-witty crappy achievements that are only going to make me wish I wasn't playing it on Steam. Then again, I can certainly see how important it'll be for marketing purposes for me to show all my friends, that I'm playing NS2. Very smart. ######.
This is the first time I've been disappointed and as long as you work with Steam, I'm sure I can expect more.
Now, I was a little slow on the whole Steam thing... you left, to create a new Engine, right? Then why are you going back to Steam?
Honestly, I used to think Steam was a great company. And while they have great prices and tons of games to choose from, I've been fortunate enough to follow them through thick and thin. I've been around since the original Natural Selection days and so far, up until this update, I was excited. But this changed to Steam? It's been in my honest opinion, that people only sign up with Steam when it's all about the money. And because of personal reasons, I'm a little pissed off that you went back to them.
I can just see it now. Playing with a load of morons, only playing to get their ridiculous achievements. Of which I'm sure you'll fill it with a bunch of half-witty crappy achievements that are only going to make me wish I wasn't playing it on Steam. Then again, I can certainly see how important it'll be for marketing purposes for me to show all my friends, that I'm playing NS2. Very smart. ######.
This is the first time I've been disappointed and as long as you work with Steam, I'm sure I can expect more.
Thanks a lot.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
1. Steam is not an game engine.
2. Steam is not an company
3. Steam is a digital distribution service by Valve
4. The original Natural Selection has been on steam like every half life mod had been since 2004 when WON got shutdown by Valve.
5. Having a game on steam has nothing to do with having achievements in your game.
6. The steam community is the very same community that NS1 had back than.
How about you google what steam actually is before ranting on about how bad it is? You know it certainly helps knowing what you are talking about when you talk about something...
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->1. Steam is not an game engine.
2. Steam is not an company
3. Steam is a digital distribution service by Valve
4. The original Natural Selection has been on steam like every half life mod had been since 2004 when WON got shutdown by Valve.
5. Having a game on steam has nothing to do with having achievements in your game.
6. The steam community is the very same community that NS1 had back than.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Or you can be a whiny about it.
Why do you insist on numbering things when it's not even consistent. Technically, 1, 2, and 3, should all be in the same sentence. Steam is not a game engine or company, rather a distribution service by valve. (which by the way I know. I've been using them for years. But when your old like me, you just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.)
And NS, is still a running mod. On the "Steam" or not. It's called adding a program to your list which is what I did.
Having a game on steam has EVERYTHING to do with achievements. You really musta just crawled out of a cave. About 80% of ALL games supported by the Steam client have achievements. I think the only one I do have, that doesn't is RCT3.
And the Steam community is NOT the same community that NS1 had back then. Are you dumb? Have you been asleep for the last 7 years? There was no Steam Community when NS1 launched and wasn't one for a while, afterwards. XFire was the thing to use, back when NS1 launched, because it was the Friendslist program at the time, that held its game. After a while of XFire growing, finally Steam fixed their ######. And still they can't hold up to live broadcasting, taking video, and screenshot abilities.
It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.
I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.
Steam has its ups and downs... Some aspects are extremely convenient, others seem to be wtf where is common sense issues- like not being able to play games I payed for because of storms in the north west.
Anyway not like what I've said hasn't been said 1,000 times- Looking forward to running around NS2 with my awesome black armor! My way of paying for ns-1.
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 14 2010, 12:56 PM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 14 2010, 12:56 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Or you can be a whiny about it.
Why do you insist on numbering things when it's not even consistent. Technically, 1, 2, and 3, should all be in the same sentence. Steam is not a game engine or company, rather a distribution service by valve. (which by the way I know. I've been using them for years. But when your old like me, you just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.)
And NS, is still a running mod. On the "Steam" or not. It's called adding a program to your list which is what I did.
Having a game on steam has EVERYTHING to do with achievements. You really musta just crawled out of a cave. About 80% of ALL games supported by the Steam client have achievements. I think the only one I do have, that doesn't is RCT3.
And the Steam community is NOT the same community that NS1 had back then. Are you dumb? Have you been asleep for the last 7 years? There was no Steam Community when NS1 launched and wasn't one for a while, afterwards. XFire was the thing to use, back when NS1 launched, because it was the Friendslist program at the time, that held its game. After a while of XFire growing, finally Steam fixed their ######. And still they can't hold up to live broadcasting, taking video, and screenshot abilities.
It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.
I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
your arguement is empty.
you don't mention anything that is actually wrong with steam... just ###### about how you don't like achievments and how there's no video recording or ss ability integrated (i lol'd at you a bit when I read that btw). FYI achievements are nothing more then bragging rights added to a game... they have little to no effect on any gameplay elements... and video recording and SS can be done with third party programs... the same thrid party programs you would be using if you wernt using steam...
If you can't see the value of steam for an indie company such as UWE I'll explain. Steam offers exposure to an audience that is most likely going to be interested in the products in question... i.e. NS2. A gamer such as your self logs into steam... an advertisement pops up for NS2 (imagine you have never heard of it). Theres a pretty picture of a fade or onos or marine that catches your eye... you click the link to see more and get intrigued by the style of the game... you decide to do some research on it and find out it's a good game... you purcase it and voila... UWE made $40 minus whatever steam commissons...
CURSE THE MAN WHO INVENTED MARKETING STRATEGIES!!!!!!!
there's absolutly no reason to question why UWE decide to use steam to distribute thier product.
P.S. if you are implying that UWE turned to steam beacuse they are "all about the money" you should look back at the history of NS2's development. UWE could have easily released a half finished product with the money they made from pre-orders but instead they are useing that money to complete their vision of what NS2 is supposed to be.
Why you pissed that NS2 is on Steam? Steam is just a content distribution service, like EA link or Impulse. It has nothing to do with the game engine. The NS2 game engine is completly new and original to NS2 and has nothing to do with valve or steam. NS2 will not be affected in any way shape or form by it's move to steam.
Furthermore, i'm willing to bet dollars to doughnuts that 99% of NS1 players have steam still installed. This move will only help NS2 to generate more sales, more publicity, easier distribution of patches, and improved quality of service for us, the customers.
A note to the devs: Have the NS2 forums open when you right click on the game in steam and select "Visit forum".
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 14 2010, 11:56 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 14 2010, 11:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wow, that just kinda sounds self-entitled and dìckhole-ish to me, but okay.
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 14 2010, 11:56 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 14 2010, 11:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->you just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, I would presume you're a moron because saying "Steam" when you are referring to a game engine is pretty stupid. Achievements don't have to affect your game and if you get butthurt over the inclusion of them in a game, get over yourself. The fact that a game is on Steam has ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING on whether there are achievements or not. I guess I missed the part where achievements exist on XBox Live, etc.
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 14 2010, 11:56 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 14 2010, 11:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
QQ, go get a refund. Honestly, if you care that much about whether you have to have Steam installed to automatically update your game and work your server browser for you and track achievements that may or may not be in the game, then you should get a refund now. If you didn't think that NS2 would be on Steam from the very beginning (regardless of whether or not the devs said it would be), then you're a bit naïve.
<!--quoteo(post=1771207:date=May 14 2010, 01:13 PM:name=todd1Ok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (todd1Ok @ May 14 2010, 01:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771207"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Furthermore, i'm willing to bet dollars to doughnuts that 99% of NS1 players have steam still installed. This move will only help NS2 to generate more sales, more publicity, easier distribution of patches, and improved quality of service for us, the customers.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is basically what it boils down to. Not everyone has to love Steam but for most people it's a very good service, and I think having NS2 on Steam is absolutely and unequivocally the right move.
<!--quoteo(post=1771207:date=May 14 2010, 09:13 PM:name=todd1Ok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (todd1Ok @ May 14 2010, 09:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771207"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A note to the devs: Have the NS2 forums open when you right click on the game in steam and select "Visit forum".<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I believe Max (or it may have been Flayra), explained in another thread that this would start working (although probably pointing to an NS2 forum on the steam forums rather than here), when NS2 gets added to the Steam Store and things like the product news start showing release notes.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Wow, that just kinda sounds self-entitled and dìckhole-ish to me, but okay.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lets not mix anything up... it was ######hole-ish and probably over-confident...
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well, I would presume you're a moron because saying "Steam" when you are referring to a game engine is pretty stupid. Achievements don't have to affect your game and if you get butthurt over the inclusion of them in a game, get over yourself. The fact that a game is on Steam has ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING on whether there are achievements or not. I guess I missed the part where achievements exist on XBox Live, etc.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I refer to it in that manner, because before Steam was this "distribution and store with a buddylist"... it was just for Half-Life, HL:S and other Source games that only had the Source Engine. As I said before, I was in a rush. I wasn't expecting people to dissect my words, but perhaps shed more light on maybe something I don't see. Even now, I'm not getting any credible answers. Just rants to my rants.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->QQ, go get a refund. Honestly, if you care that much about whether you have to have Steam installed to automatically update your game and work your server browser for you and track achievements that may or may not be in the game, then you should get a refund now. If you didn't think that NS2 would be on Steam from the very beginning (regardless of whether or not the devs said it would be), then you're a bit naive.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't want a refund. I didn't ask for a refund and I'm not commenting anything based on gameplay or anything on that nature, that I feel would merit taking my money back.... what I think I said, is that I've earn my right to express my opinion. I said their result dealings with Steam upset me. Perhaps using the wrong words or a context you can't understand... but it's been in my opinion that sell-outs goto Steam. Rockstar, EA and lots of others have jumped on the Steam Bandwagon, to make sales... I'm asking why NS2 decided to do so aswell, when I feel they can do much better than falling back onto the (somewhat) roots they spouted out from. It was my understanding that they did not wish to be supported by Steam/Valve or anyone else associated.
I thought I read that I few years ago, when Natural Selection 2 was considered for launch on the "Source Engine". But later they decided to go standalone and create something new. I can't remember, considering all the hoopla about over the last year and awaiting for the Alpha to released. I just didn't expect this, and already issues are spouting up. Not unlike the Steam-Client either...
Steams automatic updates aren't spot on either. A few times they've updated material that could break a game. (A.K.A. Day of Defeat : Source) and I've got nothing to say on achievements system. I just feel that game developers should be spending more time concentrating on OTHER gaming features, rather than some achievement perks and awards that mean diddly. Developers loose track of what's important. It's about money and ###### over the consumer... I just don't ever want to feel like this pure water, has been tainted with Valve piss. While I love their games, NS2 is better than them. I'm just hoping they don't sucked into the bull###### and forget what's important.
And hopefully I don't have to remind anyone what <b>that</b> is. I'm still waiting to see a working "creep" in action. Still waiting to see how they've taken what was BEST about NS1 and putting it into NS2, without surcoming to the gaming industries set of moralities. I don't want hogwash. I want the dream I was sold into... that's all.
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 15 2010, 02:56 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 15 2010, 02:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Or you can be a whiny about it.
Why do you insist on numbering things when it's not even consistent. Technically, 1, 2, and 3, should all be in the same sentence. Steam is not a game engine or company, rather a distribution service by valve. (which by the way I know. I've been using them for years. But when your old like me, you just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.)
And NS, is still a running mod. On the "Steam" or not. It's called adding a program to your list which is what I did.
Having a game on steam has EVERYTHING to do with achievements. You really musta just crawled out of a cave. About 80% of ALL games supported by the Steam client have achievements. I think the only one I do have, that doesn't is RCT3.
And the Steam community is NOT the same community that NS1 had back then. Are you dumb? Have you been asleep for the last 7 years? There was no Steam Community when NS1 launched and wasn't one for a while, afterwards. XFire was the thing to use, back when NS1 launched, because it was the Friendslist program at the time, that held its game. After a while of XFire growing, finally Steam fixed their ######. And still they can't hold up to live broadcasting, taking video, and screenshot abilities.
It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.
I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah not to start a flame war but you are wrong about "Steam". Valve own Steam "Valve" being a company and "Steam" obviously being one of their products which is used as a game hub and distribution service through the "Steam Network".
So your comment about "Steam" being the "Orange Box Engine" is wrong, Steam is just a program not an engine. the "Orange Box Engine" is the engine that TF2, DoD:S and a number of newer "Mods" use. That has no relevance for Natural Selection moving to Steam. Natural Selection 1 is on Steam but it does not use the Orange Box Engine it uses the old Half-Life Engine still.
Look at games like EA's Bad Company 2. It's on Steam as far as integration and distribution is concerned but it does not contain any "Achievements" through Valve's Achievement system. EA use Steam for added exposure and ease of use for people to purchase and track their gameand communicate with other gamers. Hell EA's in-game friends list is really really bad.
So it seems logical to me that Natural Selection is moving to Steam. It gives them marketing opportunities and targets a large established gaming market. It allows them to also if they want add their game to the Steam Store so people can purchase it through there (Extra Revenue which is important to them) and allows them to easily have things like Update Notices etc. They may even be able to integrate properly with Steam as far as game information is concerned to show what server a player is in hopefully. I am not sure if this is possible without using Valve's game engine.
Overall Steam seems like a wise choice and I myself hated Steam when it was first released as it was a piece of ######, however these days it does the job and has turned out to be a decent program.
So in the end NS2 moving to Steam does not mean they are using the "Orange Box Engine" they are still using their own engine as far as I know, they are just utilizing the Steam services. For Achievements it will be up to the devs whether they add any, I am not even sure if by adding NS to Steam they could use Achievements, I don't know if they are somehow integrated or built into the Engine. I would say they are part of the Orange Box Engine as a number of games that were on the older "Source Engine" didn't have Achievements but once moving to Orange box they added some.
So if NS has achievements they would probably be independent like EA's.
Hopefully that clarifies some of the things for you.
In regards to the "community" well that is always a problem. Of course if we kept a close-nit community of die hard NS players Unknown Worlds would probably not make enough money to cover development. So they need to target a large audience. There will always be idiots who make their way into a gaming community from advertising exposure but it'll come down to server admins and game communities to keep things in order to make for a good playing experience.
<!--quoteo(post=1771217:date=May 15 2010, 06:29 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 15 2010, 06:29 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771217"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't want a refund. I didn't ask for a refund and I'm not commenting anything based on gameplay or anything on that nature, that I feel would merit taking my money back.... what I think I said, is that I've earn my right to express my opinion. I said their result dealings with Steam upset me. Perhaps using the wrong words or a context you can't understand... but it's been in my opinion that sell-outs goto Steam. Rockstar, EA and lots of others have jumped on the Steam Bandwagon, to make sales... I'm asking why NS2 decided to do so aswell, when I feel they can do much better than falling back onto the (somewhat) roots they spouted out from. It was my understanding that they did not wish to be supported by Steam/Valve or anyone else associated.
I thought I read that I few years ago, when Natural Selection 2 was considered for launch on the "Source Engine". But later they decided to go standalone and create something new. I can't remember, considering all the hoopla about over the last year and awaiting for the Alpha to released. I just didn't expect this, and already issues are spouting up. Not unlike the Steam-Client either...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah the reasoning behind Unknown Worlds not using the Orange Box Engine I believe don't quote me on this was because of limitations. They believed it would require too much customization to do what they wanted and would be easier to create their own engine rather than heavily modify the Valve one. So that is why it didn't start on Steam.
<!--quoteo(post=1771217:date=May 15 2010, 06:29 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 15 2010, 06:29 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771217"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Steams automatic updates aren't spot on either. A few times they've updated material that could break a game. (A.K.A. Day of Defeat : Source) and I've got nothing to say on achievements system. I just feel that game developers should be spending more time concentrating on OTHER gaming features, rather than some achievement perks and awards that mean diddly. Developers loose track of what's important. It's about money and ###### over the consumer... I just don't ever want to feel like this pure water, has been tainted with Valve piss. While I love their games, NS2 is better than them. I'm just hoping they don't sucked into the bull###### and forget what's important.
And hopefully I don't have to remind anyone what <b>that</b> is. I'm still waiting to see a working "creep" in action. Still waiting to see how they've taken what was BEST about NS1 and putting it into NS2, without surcoming to the gaming industries set of moralities. I don't want hogwash. I want the dream I was sold into... that's all.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah that is not a Steam issue, that is just Valve ###### around and doing willy-nilly updates without proper testing. That will not affect Natural Selection as long as they retain their own engine. That only affects anyone using their "Orange Box Engine" as a core.
Maybe you should look at a few bits of information on Valve's website about what they state Steam is:
lol even the more reading I do I can see why a lot of people move to Steam for distribution. There are no licensing fees and Valve pay for all the bandwidth sounds like a win-win right there and again they get exposure to a well established gaming market.
I wasn't trying to start a flame war. I felt insulted being led on by numbers and "definitions" as if I'm a naive 13 year old, so of course I took on the next post with more natural aggression. As I stated, I was in a rush to explain myself. I assumed everyone knew what I was talking about, even if I wasn't using the right words.
I find it to be a waste of time when people stray off from topic, in hopes of making someone sound like an idiot. I'm sure I did... but, I'm pretty sure he succeeded further by responding only to that, with no other personal thoughts on my comment.
As far as EA, I used them in my last post. EA is a huge company, which houses and controls many smaller developing teams. Most dedicated to its own project, in which some have been perfecting for literally, almost 15 years for some titles. But don't give them too much credit. They do suck. Most of their games fail... and with their recent money sucking device, I've just about had all I can take with EA. Modern Warfare 2 downright pissed me off. While many of the game is actually good, there's a few things that EA forget and fudged up. Things I'm sure you've all seen and been just as mad about, if you play MW2. And they're only accomplishing exactly what I thought they would. I'm referring to their abilities to turn PC into Console, by making all servers, owned and run by MW2. Taking away modding possibilities, player created maps and extra alternative game modes, all for what? Control. Now you can't get any new maps for MW2, unless you pay 15 dollars for them. And 2 out of those 5 maps, are recycled. Which means, they didn't even create a NEW map, but just reskinned an old map.
They did it in those first few titles, which was cool... but now that they're charging, it's a little ridiculous and redundant to expect people to not take this bending over. It's only going to get worse, as they start flooding map-packs until their new COD comes out. Then, there will be no more maps for MW2 and slowly the world will change again.
As I said... Don't give EA too much credit. They don't have the stuff to be experimental. They don't have the balls to throw the idea of money out the window and just make a game because they want to or because they have a revolutionary idea. They make game for one reason and one reason only.
To be honest, I am glad they went with Steam because it's so convenient. I have yet to see a good argument to the fact that Steam auto-updates your games, has a giant userbase and is great (now-a-days) for keeping track of other people, and NS1 was on Steam so wouldn't the sequel be? I would really rather not have to sign up for "UWE online" to keep track of the small group of people I would keep track of in NS2, that would be such a hassle. UWE isn't a company that's just going to sell out or make things harder for their customers for the sake of perpetuating their brand or keeping everything in-house (See: EA Online, Rockstar Social Club, Games for Windows Live, ETC ETC ETC).
Calling a company a sell-out for trying to spread their game to a larger audience is really _____. You can fill in the blank with whatever you want. That's like calling a band who gets on the radio or packs a stadium full of fans a sell-out because they're trying to spread their name and become more popular (just like UWE would love to do). Just because something/someone is popular doesn't mean that they're sell-outs. Kind of a silly thing to say if you ask me.
As a disclaimer: I'm trying really hard not to come off as jumping all over UWE's dìck by coming to their defense but this whole "OMG wtf Steam is lame!" stuff is so, so stupid. I'm the last guy that will unilaterally defend UWE on pretty much any issue but going with Steam is a no-brainer. Not that there are NO drawbacks to using Steam, just that the positives obviously outweigh the negatives.
IeptBarakatThe most difficult name to speak ingame.Join Date: 2009-07-10Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
Also about autopatching.
Things get patched for a reason.
And auto patching helps not having the userbase split. It wasn't fun on non steam games seeing which patch version had the most users. "Oh. I have 1.3 but everyone seems to be playing on 1.23."
aeroripperJoin Date: 2005-02-25Member: 42471NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
edited May 2010
Everyone needs to relax a bit in this thread. It's been stated for some time (years?) that Steam is the likely distribution method for NS2, barring some temporary uncertainty involving the issue of pre-orders. You're all free to express your civil opinion on the matter, just learn to do it without the personal attacks or you'll be hearing from the mods. Thanks.
<!--quoteo(post=1771197:date=May 14 2010, 06:48 PM:name=spellman23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (spellman23 @ May 14 2010, 06:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771197"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->rebirth is trying to sound pretentious. Ignore pretentious people.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah sorry for pointing out the obvious, it's just that too many people don't know what steam is or does. Seen it too often that people confuse steam with some kind of "game" or that having a game on steam requires you to stay online to play and all kinds of other BS.
Just like the BS about "the evil steam community" when NS has been running trough steam since WON got shutdown so the NS community had been part of the Steam/WON community for as long as it existed.
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 14 2010, 05:56 PM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 14 2010, 05:56 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yup and i'm the guy "trying to sound pretentious"....
I'm not even gonna bother to answer to the stuff you wrote, other people allready did that. Fact is you have been confusing things, has nothing to do with beeing lazy or me "dissecting" your words you have been plain and simply wrong in what you wrote.
Going steam had been pretty much clear for months if not years, it's a smart move for UWE and it's a good move for us players. It's saving UWE alot of work, it's making the game aviable to way more people and it's been expected to happen.
And i doubt that you are any kind of gamer with your outdated opion on steam...
Wow, Nice work ns2 team, there is just a few problems, 1. is that it loads very slowly and u can't see your gun just a black square in the middle of the screen but anyay nice work (I can't wait until the alpha comes out).
steam version seems to have terrible performance, compared to the flawless high settings performance the regular engine-test download had. I don't know if its the NEW steam taking up more resources, or what, but
<!--quoteo(post=1771348:date=May 15 2010, 11:54 PM:name=Tig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tig @ May 15 2010, 11:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771348"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->omg guys! your first flame war in forum! another UW milestone!! its all downhill from here...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Bhop, anyone? :D
hey took a glance through the thread and forums but has the spark map editor been uploaded to steam yet? and if so how do I go about accessing it? would like to give it a try :)
<!--quoteo(post=1771276:date=May 15 2010, 05:27 AM:name=Rothgar)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rothgar @ May 15 2010, 05:27 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771276"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well I loaded it up today and the performance was fine, so the updates must have fixed it.
I did get stuck in a part of the map though, not sure if it's a collision issue or something but I could not move from this place.
Comments
Now, I was a little slow on the whole Steam thing... you left, to create a new Engine, right? Then why are you going back to Steam?
Honestly, I used to think Steam was a great company. And while they have great prices and tons of games to choose from, I've been fortunate enough to follow them through thick and thin. I've been around since the original Natural Selection days and so far, up until this update, I was excited. But this changed to Steam? It's been in my honest opinion, that people only sign up with Steam when it's all about the money. And because of personal reasons, I'm a little pissed off that you went back to them.
I can just see it now. Playing with a load of morons, only playing to get their ridiculous achievements. Of which I'm sure you'll fill it with a bunch of half-witty crappy achievements that are only going to make me wish I wasn't playing it on Steam. Then again, I can certainly see how important it'll be for marketing purposes for me to show all my friends, that I'm playing NS2. Very smart. ######.
This is the first time I've been disappointed and as long as you work with Steam, I'm sure I can expect more.
Thanks a lot.
Now, I was a little slow on the whole Steam thing... you left, to create a new Engine, right? Then why are you going back to Steam?
Honestly, I used to think Steam was a great company. And while they have great prices and tons of games to choose from, I've been fortunate enough to follow them through thick and thin. I've been around since the original Natural Selection days and so far, up until this update, I was excited. But this changed to Steam? It's been in my honest opinion, that people only sign up with Steam when it's all about the money. And because of personal reasons, I'm a little pissed off that you went back to them.
I can just see it now. Playing with a load of morons, only playing to get their ridiculous achievements. Of which I'm sure you'll fill it with a bunch of half-witty crappy achievements that are only going to make me wish I wasn't playing it on Steam. Then again, I can certainly see how important it'll be for marketing purposes for me to show all my friends, that I'm playing NS2. Very smart. ######.
This is the first time I've been disappointed and as long as you work with Steam, I'm sure I can expect more.
Thanks a lot.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
1. Steam is not an game engine.
2. Steam is not an company
3. Steam is a digital distribution service by Valve
4. The original Natural Selection has been on steam like every half life mod had been since 2004 when WON got shutdown by Valve.
5. Having a game on steam has nothing to do with having achievements in your game.
6. The steam community is the very same community that NS1 had back than.
How about you google what steam actually is before ranting on about how bad it is? You know it certainly helps knowing what you are talking about when you talk about something...
2. Steam is not an company
3. Steam is a digital distribution service by Valve
4. The original Natural Selection has been on steam like every half life mod had been since 2004 when WON got shutdown by Valve.
5. Having a game on steam has nothing to do with having achievements in your game.
6. The steam community is the very same community that NS1 had back than.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Or you can be a whiny about it.
Why do you insist on numbering things when it's not even consistent. Technically, 1, 2, and 3, should all be in the same sentence. Steam is not a game engine or company, rather a distribution service by valve. (which by the way I know. I've been using them for years. But when your old like me, you just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.)
And NS, is still a running mod. On the "Steam" or not. It's called adding a program to your list which is what I did.
Having a game on steam has EVERYTHING to do with achievements. You really musta just crawled out of a cave. About 80% of ALL games supported by the Steam client have achievements. I think the only one I do have, that doesn't is RCT3.
And the Steam community is NOT the same community that NS1 had back then. Are you dumb? Have you been asleep for the last 7 years? There was no Steam Community when NS1 launched and wasn't one for a while, afterwards. XFire was the thing to use, back when NS1 launched, because it was the Friendslist program at the time, that held its game. After a while of XFire growing, finally Steam fixed their ######. And still they can't hold up to live broadcasting, taking video, and screenshot abilities.
It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.
I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.
Anyway not like what I've said hasn't been said 1,000 times- Looking forward to running around NS2 with my awesome black armor! My way of paying for ns-1.
Why do you insist on numbering things when it's not even consistent. Technically, 1, 2, and 3, should all be in the same sentence. Steam is not a game engine or company, rather a distribution service by valve. (which by the way I know. I've been using them for years. But when your old like me, you just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.)
And NS, is still a running mod. On the "Steam" or not. It's called adding a program to your list which is what I did.
Having a game on steam has EVERYTHING to do with achievements. You really musta just crawled out of a cave. About 80% of ALL games supported by the Steam client have achievements. I think the only one I do have, that doesn't is RCT3.
And the Steam community is NOT the same community that NS1 had back then. Are you dumb? Have you been asleep for the last 7 years? There was no Steam Community when NS1 launched and wasn't one for a while, afterwards. XFire was the thing to use, back when NS1 launched, because it was the Friendslist program at the time, that held its game. After a while of XFire growing, finally Steam fixed their ######. And still they can't hold up to live broadcasting, taking video, and screenshot abilities.
It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.
I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
your arguement is empty.
you don't mention anything that is actually wrong with steam... just ###### about how you don't like achievments and how there's no video recording or ss ability integrated (i lol'd at you a bit when I read that btw). FYI achievements are nothing more then bragging rights added to a game... they have little to no effect on any gameplay elements... and video recording and SS can be done with third party programs... the same thrid party programs you would be using if you wernt using steam...
If you can't see the value of steam for an indie company such as UWE I'll explain. Steam offers exposure to an audience that is most likely going to be interested in the products in question... i.e. NS2. A gamer such as your self logs into steam... an advertisement pops up for NS2 (imagine you have never heard of it). Theres a pretty picture of a fade or onos or marine that catches your eye... you click the link to see more and get intrigued by the style of the game... you decide to do some research on it and find out it's a good game... you purcase it and voila... UWE made $40 minus whatever steam commissons...
CURSE THE MAN WHO INVENTED MARKETING STRATEGIES!!!!!!!
there's absolutly no reason to question why UWE decide to use steam to distribute thier product.
P.S. if you are implying that UWE turned to steam beacuse they are "all about the money" you should look back at the history of NS2's development. UWE could have easily released a half finished product with the money they made from pre-orders but instead they are useing that money to complete their vision of what NS2 is supposed to be.
Furthermore, i'm willing to bet dollars to doughnuts that 99% of NS1 players have steam still installed. This move will only help NS2 to generate more sales, more publicity, easier distribution of patches, and improved quality of service for us, the customers.
A note to the devs: Have the NS2 forums open when you right click on the game in steam and select "Visit forum".
Wow, that just kinda sounds self-entitled and dìckhole-ish to me, but okay.
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 14 2010, 11:56 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 14 2010, 11:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->you just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, I would presume you're a moron because saying "Steam" when you are referring to a game engine is pretty stupid. Achievements don't have to affect your game and if you get butthurt over the inclusion of them in a game, get over yourself. The fact that a game is on Steam has ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING on whether there are achievements or not. I guess I missed the part where achievements exist on XBox Live, etc.
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 14 2010, 11:56 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 14 2010, 11:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
QQ, go get a refund. Honestly, if you care that much about whether you have to have Steam installed to automatically update your game and work your server browser for you and track achievements that may or may not be in the game, then you should get a refund now. If you didn't think that NS2 would be on Steam from the very beginning (regardless of whether or not the devs said it would be), then you're a bit naïve.
<!--quoteo(post=1771207:date=May 14 2010, 01:13 PM:name=todd1Ok)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (todd1Ok @ May 14 2010, 01:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771207"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Furthermore, i'm willing to bet dollars to doughnuts that 99% of NS1 players have steam still installed. This move will only help NS2 to generate more sales, more publicity, easier distribution of patches, and improved quality of service for us, the customers.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is basically what it boils down to. Not everyone has to love Steam but for most people it's a very good service, and I think having NS2 on Steam is absolutely and unequivocally the right move.
I would be pleased with as little as a screenshot of the heavy suit/powered armor/whatever it's called.
It'll prolly just be a screenshot and some editor updates though.
I believe Max (or it may have been Flayra), explained in another thread that this would start working (although probably pointing to an NS2 forum on the steam forums rather than here), when NS2 gets added to the Steam Store and things like the product news start showing release notes.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Wow, that just kinda sounds self-entitled and dìckhole-ish to me, but okay.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lets not mix anything up... it was ######hole-ish and probably over-confident...
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well, I would presume you're a moron because saying "Steam" when you are referring to a game engine is pretty stupid. Achievements don't have to affect your game and if you get butthurt over the inclusion of them in a game, get over yourself. The fact that a game is on Steam has ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING on whether there are achievements or not. I guess I missed the part where achievements exist on XBox Live, etc.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I refer to it in that manner, because before Steam was this "distribution and store with a buddylist"... it was just for Half-Life, HL:S and other Source games that only had the Source Engine. As I said before, I was in a rush. I wasn't expecting people to dissect my words, but perhaps shed more light on maybe something I don't see. Even now, I'm not getting any credible answers. Just rants to my rants.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->QQ, go get a refund. Honestly, if you care that much about whether you have to have Steam installed to automatically update your game and work your server browser for you and track achievements that may or may not be in the game, then you should get a refund now. If you didn't think that NS2 would be on Steam from the very beginning (regardless of whether or not the devs said it would be), then you're a bit naive.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't want a refund. I didn't ask for a refund and I'm not commenting anything based on gameplay or anything on that nature, that I feel would merit taking my money back.... what I think I said, is that I've earn my right to express my opinion. I said their result dealings with Steam upset me. Perhaps using the wrong words or a context you can't understand... but it's been in my opinion that sell-outs goto Steam. Rockstar, EA and lots of others have jumped on the Steam Bandwagon, to make sales... I'm asking why NS2 decided to do so aswell, when I feel they can do much better than falling back onto the (somewhat) roots they spouted out from. It was my understanding that they did not wish to be supported by Steam/Valve or anyone else associated.
I thought I read that I few years ago, when Natural Selection 2 was considered for launch on the "Source Engine". But later they decided to go standalone and create something new. I can't remember, considering all the hoopla about over the last year and awaiting for the Alpha to released. I just didn't expect this, and already issues are spouting up. Not unlike the Steam-Client either...
Steams automatic updates aren't spot on either. A few times they've updated material that could break a game. (A.K.A. Day of Defeat : Source) and I've got nothing to say on achievements system. I just feel that game developers should be spending more time concentrating on OTHER gaming features, rather than some achievement perks and awards that mean diddly. Developers loose track of what's important. It's about money and ###### over the consumer... I just don't ever want to feel like this pure water, has been tainted with Valve piss. While I love their games, NS2 is better than them. I'm just hoping they don't sucked into the bull###### and forget what's important.
And hopefully I don't have to remind anyone what <b>that</b> is. I'm still waiting to see a working "creep" in action. Still waiting to see how they've taken what was BEST about NS1 and putting it into NS2, without surcoming to the gaming industries set of moralities. I don't want hogwash. I want the dream I was sold into... that's all.
Why do you insist on numbering things when it's not even consistent. Technically, 1, 2, and 3, should all be in the same sentence. Steam is not a game engine or company, rather a distribution service by valve. (which by the way I know. I've been using them for years. But when your old like me, you just skip the BS and say "Steam" instead of the HL:S engine or "The Orange Box Engine" which is what it is now. Don't presume I'm a moron, because I was in a rush.)
And NS, is still a running mod. On the "Steam" or not. It's called adding a program to your list which is what I did.
Having a game on steam has EVERYTHING to do with achievements. You really musta just crawled out of a cave. About 80% of ALL games supported by the Steam client have achievements. I think the only one I do have, that doesn't is RCT3.
And the Steam community is NOT the same community that NS1 had back then. Are you dumb? Have you been asleep for the last 7 years? There was no Steam Community when NS1 launched and wasn't one for a while, afterwards. XFire was the thing to use, back when NS1 launched, because it was the Friendslist program at the time, that held its game. After a while of XFire growing, finally Steam fixed their ######. And still they can't hold up to live broadcasting, taking video, and screenshot abilities.
It's seems kinda obvious the direction this is moving towards and since I dropped 40 bucks on a game not even close to being released, I'd like to think earned my right to complain. You don't like it, don't respond.
I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah not to start a flame war but you are wrong about "Steam". Valve own Steam "Valve" being a company and "Steam" obviously being one of their products which is used as a game hub and distribution service through the "Steam Network".
So your comment about "Steam" being the "Orange Box Engine" is wrong, Steam is just a program not an engine. the "Orange Box Engine" is the engine that TF2, DoD:S and a number of newer "Mods" use. That has no relevance for Natural Selection moving to Steam. Natural Selection 1 is on Steam but it does not use the Orange Box Engine it uses the old Half-Life Engine still.
Look at games like EA's Bad Company 2. It's on Steam as far as integration and distribution is concerned but it does not contain any "Achievements" through Valve's Achievement system. EA use Steam for added exposure and ease of use for people to purchase and track their gameand communicate with other gamers. Hell EA's in-game friends list is really really bad.
So it seems logical to me that Natural Selection is moving to Steam. It gives them marketing opportunities and targets a large established gaming market. It allows them to also if they want add their game to the Steam Store so people can purchase it through there (Extra Revenue which is important to them) and allows them to easily have things like Update Notices etc. They may even be able to integrate properly with Steam as far as game information is concerned to show what server a player is in hopefully. I am not sure if this is possible without using Valve's game engine.
Overall Steam seems like a wise choice and I myself hated Steam when it was first released as it was a piece of ######, however these days it does the job and has turned out to be a decent program.
So in the end NS2 moving to Steam does not mean they are using the "Orange Box Engine" they are still using their own engine as far as I know, they are just utilizing the Steam services. For Achievements it will be up to the devs whether they add any, I am not even sure if by adding NS to Steam they could use Achievements, I don't know if they are somehow integrated or built into the Engine. I would say they are part of the Orange Box Engine as a number of games that were on the older "Source Engine" didn't have Achievements but once moving to Orange box they added some.
So if NS has achievements they would probably be independent like EA's.
Hopefully that clarifies some of the things for you.
In regards to the "community" well that is always a problem. Of course if we kept a close-nit community of die hard NS players Unknown Worlds would probably not make enough money to cover development. So they need to target a large audience. There will always be idiots who make their way into a gaming community from advertising exposure but it'll come down to server admins and game communities to keep things in order to make for a good playing experience.
I thought I read that I few years ago, when Natural Selection 2 was considered for launch on the "Source Engine". But later they decided to go standalone and create something new. I can't remember, considering all the hoopla about over the last year and awaiting for the Alpha to released. I just didn't expect this, and already issues are spouting up. Not unlike the Steam-Client either...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah the reasoning behind Unknown Worlds not using the Orange Box Engine I believe don't quote me on this was because of limitations. They believed it would require too much customization to do what they wanted and would be easier to create their own engine rather than heavily modify the Valve one. So that is why it didn't start on Steam.
<!--quoteo(post=1771217:date=May 15 2010, 06:29 AM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 15 2010, 06:29 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771217"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Steams automatic updates aren't spot on either. A few times they've updated material that could break a game. (A.K.A. Day of Defeat : Source) and I've got nothing to say on achievements system. I just feel that game developers should be spending more time concentrating on OTHER gaming features, rather than some achievement perks and awards that mean diddly. Developers loose track of what's important. It's about money and ###### over the consumer... I just don't ever want to feel like this pure water, has been tainted with Valve piss. While I love their games, NS2 is better than them. I'm just hoping they don't sucked into the bull###### and forget what's important.
And hopefully I don't have to remind anyone what <b>that</b> is. I'm still waiting to see a working "creep" in action. Still waiting to see how they've taken what was BEST about NS1 and putting it into NS2, without surcoming to the gaming industries set of moralities. I don't want hogwash. I want the dream I was sold into... that's all.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah that is not a Steam issue, that is just Valve ###### around and doing willy-nilly updates without proper testing. That will not affect Natural Selection as long as they retain their own engine. That only affects anyone using their "Orange Box Engine" as a core.
Maybe you should look at a few bits of information on Valve's website about what they state Steam is:
<a href="http://store.steampowered.com/about/" target="_blank">http://store.steampowered.com/about/</a>
<a href="http://www.valvesoftware.com/business/" target="_blank">http://www.valvesoftware.com/business/</a>
lol even the more reading I do I can see why a lot of people move to Steam for distribution. There are no licensing fees and Valve pay for all the bandwidth sounds like a win-win right there and again they get exposure to a well established gaming market.
I find it to be a waste of time when people stray off from topic, in hopes of making someone sound like an idiot. I'm sure I did... but, I'm pretty sure he succeeded further by responding only to that, with no other personal thoughts on my comment.
As far as EA, I used them in my last post. EA is a huge company, which houses and controls many smaller developing teams. Most dedicated to its own project, in which some have been perfecting for literally, almost 15 years for some titles. But don't give them too much credit. They do suck. Most of their games fail... and with their recent money sucking device, I've just about had all I can take with EA. Modern Warfare 2 downright pissed me off. While many of the game is actually good, there's a few things that EA forget and fudged up. Things I'm sure you've all seen and been just as mad about, if you play MW2. And they're only accomplishing exactly what I thought they would. I'm referring to their abilities to turn PC into Console, by making all servers, owned and run by MW2. Taking away modding possibilities, player created maps and extra alternative game modes, all for what? Control. Now you can't get any new maps for MW2, unless you pay 15 dollars for them. And 2 out of those 5 maps, are recycled. Which means, they didn't even create a NEW map, but just reskinned an old map.
They did it in those first few titles, which was cool... but now that they're charging, it's a little ridiculous and redundant to expect people to not take this bending over. It's only going to get worse, as they start flooding map-packs until their new COD comes out. Then, there will be no more maps for MW2 and slowly the world will change again.
As I said... Don't give EA too much credit. They don't have the stuff to be experimental. They don't have the balls to throw the idea of money out the window and just make a game because they want to or because they have a revolutionary idea. They make game for one reason and one reason only.
I was not a fan of MW2's or L4D's rather console-type server setup. Dedicated servers make more sense to me but I guess we are straying off-topic.
To be honest, I am glad they went with Steam because it's so convenient. I have yet to see a good argument to the fact that Steam auto-updates your games, has a giant userbase and is great (now-a-days) for keeping track of other people, and NS1 was on Steam so wouldn't the sequel be? I would really rather not have to sign up for "UWE online" to keep track of the small group of people I would keep track of in NS2, that would be such a hassle. UWE isn't a company that's just going to sell out or make things harder for their customers for the sake of perpetuating their brand or keeping everything in-house (See: EA Online, Rockstar Social Club, Games for Windows Live, ETC ETC ETC).
Calling a company a sell-out for trying to spread their game to a larger audience is really _____. You can fill in the blank with whatever you want. That's like calling a band who gets on the radio or packs a stadium full of fans a sell-out because they're trying to spread their name and become more popular (just like UWE would love to do). Just because something/someone is popular doesn't mean that they're sell-outs. Kind of a silly thing to say if you ask me.
As a disclaimer: I'm trying really hard not to come off as jumping all over UWE's dìck by coming to their defense but this whole "OMG wtf Steam is lame!" stuff is so, so stupid. I'm the last guy that will unilaterally defend UWE on pretty much any issue but going with Steam is a no-brainer. Not that there are NO drawbacks to using Steam, just that the positives obviously outweigh the negatives.
Things get patched for a reason.
And auto patching helps not having the userbase split. It wasn't fun on non steam games seeing which patch version had the most users. "Oh. I have 1.3 but everyone seems to be playing on 1.23."
Yeah sorry for pointing out the obvious, it's just that too many people don't know what steam is or does. Seen it too often that people confuse steam with some kind of "game" or that having a game on steam requires you to stay online to play and all kinds of other BS.
Just like the BS about "the evil steam community" when NS has been running trough steam since WON got shutdown so the NS community had been part of the Steam/WON community for as long as it existed.
<!--quoteo(post=1771190:date=May 14 2010, 05:56 PM:name=TGunz81)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TGunz81 @ May 14 2010, 05:56 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1771190"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm more of a gamer than you could ever hope to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yup and i'm the guy "trying to sound pretentious"....
I'm not even gonna bother to answer to the stuff you wrote, other people allready did that. Fact is you have been confusing things, has nothing to do with beeing lazy or me "dissecting" your words you have been plain and simply wrong in what you wrote.
Going steam had been pretty much clear for months if not years, it's a smart move for UWE and it's a good move for us players. It's saving UWE alot of work, it's making the game aviable to way more people and it's been expected to happen.
And i doubt that you are any kind of gamer with your outdated opion on steam...
I did get stuck in a part of the map though, not sure if it's a collision issue or something but I could not move from this place.
<a href="http://www.dawgclan.net/images/ns2/" target="_blank">http://www.dawgclan.net/images/ns2/</a>
Bhop, anyone? :D
Just respect the devs authoritah...
E:\Program\Steam\steamapps\common\natural selection 2
Everything you want is there.
I did get stuck in a part of the map though, not sure if it's a collision issue or something but I could not move from this place.
<a href="http://www.dawgclan.net/images/ns2/" target="_blank">http://www.dawgclan.net/images/ns2/</a><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I just got stuck at the same place :)