This looks awesome so far Remedy. I agree that it -may- need some small redesign to work with NS2, but there will undoubtedly be an NS1 mod for NS2 so we might need two versions of this map (classic & nextgen)
Remedy, please keep in mind that skulks have to walk on the walls and on the ceiling. Complicated geometry makes it difficult or impossible, so you need to take that seriously into account when you design an area, and provide sufficiently smooth surface if the skulk are supposed to fight or move in this particular area.
Marine start is a bit too complicated for wall walking, it's ok since the skulks are not really supposed to be in there anyway. Here is some attempts to cross marine start through the ceiling to illustrate the problem :
swalkSay hello to my little friend.Join Date: 2011-01-20Member: 78384Members, Squad Five Blue
edited January 2012
<!--quoteo(post=1897694:date=Jan 27 2012, 07:21 PM:name=Yuuki)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Yuuki @ Jan 27 2012, 07:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1897694"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Remedy, please keep in mind that skulks have to walk on the walls and on the ceiling. Complicated geometry makes it difficult or impossible, so you need to take that seriously into account when you design an area, and provide sufficiently smooth surface if the skulk are supposed to fight or move in this particular area.
Marine start is a bit too complicated for wall walking, it's ok since the skulks are not really supposed to be in there anyway. Here is some attempts to cross marine start through the ceiling to illustrate the problem :<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think that's more of a problem with the wall cling code. The force that keeps you on walls/cielings, should be increased on cielings. Not on walls, wall cling is fine.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think that's more of a problem with the wall cling code.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've being looking into the wall walking code in details and I don't think there is a big problem with it (some stuff here <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=115926&st=40&p=1896657&#entry1896657)" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...;#entry1896657)</a>. However there is fundamental limitations of what you can do with limited computation power and complex surfaces, and there is a lot of trade-offs involved, for example increasing stickiness force makes transition from surface to another harder. The code can probably be improved but I wouldn't expect huge changes.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As a skulk, in the marine start, you shouldn't have the time to do that, so it is irrelevant.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Maybe you read my post a bit too fast :)
Anyway I'm not saying there is something wrong with Remedy's work, only that he should keep in mind that skulk can walk on wall and ceiling when designing an area.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
We still have the CollisionGeometry group in the editor, which can be used to simplify the collisions of props while still being able to have lots of detail...
Hey everyone! I've got a new version of eclipse out for public hands. I've done more visuals extending out from Marine Start, though not as much as I have been intending to have completed as I've had other NS2 commitments this current week. I'll hopefully have Station Access West and Horseshoe done sometime next week.
Download from Duplex Gaming: <a href="http://www.duplexgaming.co.uk/downloads/maps/66/ns2_eclipse_v02/" target="_blank">http://www.duplexgaming.co.uk/downloads/ma...s2_eclipse_v02/</a>
Open 'v02' and extract the folder to Steam\steamapps\common\natural selection 2\ns2\maps
I added in the overviews for the new version or you can simply change the 1 from 'v01' to a 2 for 'v02' and the original overview files will work with any upcoming release of eclipse.
Changes:
-Added powernodes to 'Generator Monitors' and Core Access' for marines to set up bases outside alien hive rooms -Added Vent from 'Computer Core' to the northern end of 'Power Sub Junction' -Fixed Minimap names overlapping res/tech point icons. -Fixed Players being able to exit the map -Added a ledge for players getting stuck in 'Access Alpha' to jump back up on -Added grates to the 'Triad' gaps to stop players getting stuck
So far so good, no crates, pipes, electronics, or an assortment of other clutter. The moment I see movement-flow obstructing crap in there, you'll take an arrow in the elbow.
<!--quoteo(post=1898162:date=Jan 30 2012, 12:24 PM:name=Obraxis)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Obraxis @ Jan 30 2012, 12:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1898162"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What's great about this work, is that it 'looks' like Eclipse, in HD. It's what my minds-eye saw when playing NS1. Brilliant work Remedy!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1898165:date=Jan 30 2012, 05:34 AM:name=player)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (player @ Jan 30 2012, 05:34 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1898165"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So far so good, no crates, pipes, electronics, or an assortment of other clutter. The moment I see movement-flow obstructing crap in there, you'll take an arrow in the elbow.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1898165:date=Jan 30 2012, 09:34 PM:name=player)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (player @ Jan 30 2012, 09:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1898165"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So far so good, no crates, pipes, electronics, or an assortment of other clutter. The moment I see movement-flow obstructing crap in there, you'll take an arrow in the elbow.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--quoteo(post=1898193:date=Jan 31 2012, 01:48 AM:name=marks)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (marks @ Jan 31 2012, 01:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1898193"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Very nice forms, needs more attention to detail though. PM me if you need some tips on that stuff ;)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> There will be more detailing done to the map as I continue, though it's not a high priority at this point. I'll be trying to get the map primarily done in brush work where I can do so effectively and efficiently at the same time. Though the map will get more attention with more brush work and props to break up some of the plain repetitive areas eventually.
There will be a point when some larger props will be needed to break up LOS and some of the longer corridors where marines can clearly dominate from range. These additions will also allow aliens more places to hide or take cover from fire.
zombiehellmonkeyJoin Date: 2007-08-31Member: 62093Members, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo(post=1898164:date=Jan 30 2012, 07:32 AM:name=LV426-Colonist)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (LV426-Colonist @ Jan 30 2012, 07:32 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1898164"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Starting to look like an NS1 classic. Great work!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
AurOn2COOKIES! FREEDOM, AND BISCUITS!AustraliaJoin Date: 2012-01-13Member: 140224Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Forum staff
edited February 2012
question, when onos and welding are in, will you add doors to marine start (both entrances maybe) and a few rooms, just to NS2 ize it? And also, marine start could take the res point from aplha (lol typo maybe?) and put it in that spot where there is nothing, oposite of the other one. Just to make turtling better for marines, since the map is so FREAKING HUGE. Lol. OH AND PS, you didnt fix the windows in RR. Auron out.
Comments
:-)
Hugh is certainly excited.
Marine Start looks pretty good so far, lots of room for riflework and the bright tone make for different gameplay it seems.
Marine start is a bit too complicated for wall walking, it's ok since the skulks are not really supposed to be in there anyway. Here is some attempts to cross marine start through the ceiling to illustrate the problem :
<center><object width="450" height="356"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/zDZUcNAOl-8"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/zDZUcNAOl-8" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="356"></embed></object></center>
Marine start is a bit too complicated for wall walking, it's ok since the skulks are not really supposed to be in there anyway. Here is some attempts to cross marine start through the ceiling to illustrate the problem :<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think that's more of a problem with the wall cling code.
The force that keeps you on walls/cielings, should be increased on cielings. Not on walls, wall cling is fine.
Remedy's work is actually simpler to walk on than that of other NS2 maps so far. So I don't think there is anything wrong with it.
I've being looking into the wall walking code in details and I don't think there is a big problem with it (some stuff here <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=115926&st=40&p=1896657&#entry1896657)" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...;#entry1896657)</a>. However there is fundamental limitations of what you can do with limited computation power and complex surfaces, and there is a lot of trade-offs involved, for example increasing stickiness force makes transition from surface to another harder. The code can probably be improved but I wouldn't expect huge changes.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As a skulk, in the marine start, you shouldn't have the time to do that, so it is irrelevant.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Maybe you read my post a bit too fast :)
Anyway I'm not saying there is something wrong with Remedy's work, only that he should keep in mind that skulk can walk on wall and ceiling when designing an area.
though not as much as I have been intending to have completed as I've had other NS2 commitments this current week.
I'll hopefully have Station Access West and Horseshoe done sometime next week.
Download from Duplex Gaming: <a href="http://www.duplexgaming.co.uk/downloads/maps/66/ns2_eclipse_v02/" target="_blank">http://www.duplexgaming.co.uk/downloads/ma...s2_eclipse_v02/</a>
Open 'v02' and extract the folder to Steam\steamapps\common\natural selection 2\ns2\maps
I added in the overviews for the new version or you can simply change the 1 from 'v01' to a 2 for 'v02' and the original
overview files will work with any upcoming release of eclipse.
Changes:
-Added powernodes to 'Generator Monitors' and Core Access' for marines to set up bases outside alien hive rooms
-Added Vent from 'Computer Core' to the northern end of 'Power Sub Junction'
-Fixed Minimap names overlapping res/tech point icons.
-Fixed Players being able to exit the map
-Added a ledge for players getting stuck in 'Access Alpha' to jump back up on
-Added grates to the 'Triad' gaps to stop players getting stuck
Marine Start exit left:
<img src="http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/8256/2012013000001.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Marine Start exit right:
<img src="http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/4426/2012013000002.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Enjoy! and thanks for the feedback so far.
Continue your good work.
Exactly this. I love it!
Btw v02 link in OP seems borked.
+1
<!--quoteo(post=1898193:date=Jan 31 2012, 01:48 AM:name=marks)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (marks @ Jan 31 2012, 01:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1898193"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Very nice forms, needs more attention to detail though. PM me if you need some tips on that stuff ;)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There will be more detailing done to the map as I continue, though it's not a high priority at this point. I'll be trying to get the map primarily done in brush work where I can do so effectively and efficiently at the same time. Though the map will get more attention with more brush work and props to break up some of the plain repetitive areas eventually.
There will be a point when some larger props will be needed to break up LOS and some of the longer corridors where marines can clearly dominate from range. These additions will also allow aliens more places to hide or take cover from fire.
Starting to look like a NS2 classic too!
Keep up the amazing work Remedy!
And also, marine start could take the res point from aplha (lol typo maybe?) and put it in that spot where there is nothing, oposite of the other one. Just to make turtling better for marines, since the map is so FREAKING HUGE. Lol.
OH AND PS, you didnt fix the windows in RR. Auron out.