TalesinOur own little well of hateJoin Date: 2002-11-08Member: 7710NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators
Eh, I favor PvE myself. PvP is more of a pain in the posterior, given the number of gankers just waiting to make your day a little more difficult. Much prefer to just quest in peace, and not have to worry about some fully decked-out level 60 rogue who decides to sit just outside the border of the Contested Area, and one-shot me every time I try to complete a quest, or just follow bits of the storyline in the game.
Maybe if they included the Dishonorable Kill mechanic, it'd be a little less compelling... but I've seen over ten gankers just camping out to kill newbies. PvP can **** off, far as I'm concerned.
The DK system in it's current state is ###### retarded, through and through. But, really, it's really not hard to escape level 60 gankers. I levelled alts more than I played my 60's and never had many ganking issues. I never really saw why people complain about it. Never got on my nerves. WoW's PvE is pretty good, and so is its PvP. The main problem with WoW isn't in either of them, it's in how static the whole game is. Nothing changes and after a year everything is the same, there's no surprises.
<!--quoteo(post=1568581:date=Sep 30 2006, 04:36 PM:name=Talesin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Talesin @ Sep 30 2006, 04:36 PM) [snapback]1568581[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Eh, I favor PvE myself. PvP is more of a pain in the posterior, given the number of gankers just waiting to make your day a little more difficult. Much prefer to just quest in peace, and not have to worry about some fully decked-out level 60 rogue who decides to sit just outside the border of the Contested Area, and one-shot me every time I try to complete a quest, or just follow bits of the storyline in the game.
Maybe if they included the Dishonorable Kill mechanic, it'd be a little less compelling... but I've seen over ten gankers just camping out to kill newbies. PvP can **** off, far as I'm concerned. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Obviously when I talk about PvP I'm talking about cap lvl vs cap lvl (ie lvl 60 vs lvl 60 in WoW). Not talking about some random 60 walking all over a bunch of lvl 20s. Of course that's not fun.
DAoC is where the good PvP is now, imo, with the classic servers (fu ToA).
As for PvE, it's just boring. You kill monsters so that you can kill monsters better so that you can kill monsters. PvE is just doing something new once, and then repeating that over and over. It sucks and it's terrible that so many mmorpgs do it like that.
<!--quoteo(post=1568589:date=Sep 30 2006, 10:23 PM:name=Nadagast)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Nadagast @ Sep 30 2006, 10:23 PM) [snapback]1568589[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> As for PvE, it's just boring. You kill monsters so that you can kill monsters better so that you can kill monsters. PvE is just doing something new once, and then repeating that over and over. It sucks and it's terrible that so many mmorpgs do it like that. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> As for PvP, it's just boring. You kill players, so you can rank up to get items, so you can kill players. PvE endgame has far more variation then any PvP currantly. It's about doing something, and getting involved in greater then "lolz, rank 14 ######z, you suck". You get something on farm, it gets boring, you move on to the next thing, it's just the way the world works. PvP is far more mindless repetition then PvE, simply because there's nothing to learn and perfect in PvP. How would you do PvE then, if the currant method is terrible?
PvP is less about following a simple, set routine and more about fluid adaption. BG farming hardly counts as PvP. It's kicking puppies unless you're against another good team.
<!--quoteo(post=1568607:date=Sep 30 2006, 08:20 PM:name=Aldaris)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Aldaris @ Sep 30 2006, 08:20 PM) [snapback]1568607[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> As for PvP, it's just boring. You kill players, so you can rank up to get items, so you can kill players. PvE endgame has far more variation then any PvP currantly. It's about doing something, and getting involved in greater then "lolz, rank 14 ######z, you suck". You get something on farm, it gets boring, you move on to the next thing, it's just the way the world works. PvP is far more mindless repetition then PvE, simply because there's nothing to learn and perfect in PvP. How would you do PvE then, if the currant method is terrible? <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I agree WoW PvP is terrible. DAoC has far better PvP. Organized groups competing, or you can zerg and take keeps (sucks imo but some people like it). When I said I like PvP I didn't mean WoW PvP <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
As for changing PvE, I dunno haven't thought about it much (I'm not a game developer <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> ) but my initial reaction would be to reduce the time needed to get to cap level significantly, and make caps on gains from items so that there isn't an endless treadmill of items to be constantly upgrading. My ideal MMO would have low to no PvE and mostly skilled group based PvP. I'm thinking about trying GW <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1568610:date=Oct 1 2006, 02:35 AM:name=Testament)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Testament @ Oct 1 2006, 02:35 AM) [snapback]1568610[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> PvP is less about following a simple, set routine and more about fluid adaption. BG farming hardly counts as PvP. It's kicking puppies unless you're against another good team. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Go do some of the more chaotic endgame fights, like Vael or C'thun, and tell me it's all just a simple set routine <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> Can't say I see much adaption needed in PvP really. As a Hunter, I sit back and multi/arcane, with the occasional aimed shot if I have room to pull one off. Spam flares all over the place, and FD/Trap when needed.
I can't say I understand people who pay-to-play, simply for PvP. If I wanted large skill based fights, I'd go play on a 64 player CS:S server <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Leveling is WoW is already incredibly lenient. What more do you want?
<!--quoteo(post=1568616:date=Sep 30 2006, 11:25 PM:name=Aldaris)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Aldaris @ Sep 30 2006, 11:25 PM) [snapback]1568616[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Go do some of the more chaotic endgame fights, like Vael or C'thun, and tell me it's all just a simple set routine <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> Can't say I see much adaption needed in PvP really. As a Hunter, I sit back and multi/arcane, with the occasional aimed shot if I have room to pull one off. Spam flares all over the place, and FD/Trap when needed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I've killed both Cthun and Vael, and they aren't fun at all. PvE is easy and boring. At least to me. Of course in WoW PvP it's boring because WoW PvP sucks. It's not a good PvP game at all.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I can't say I understand people who pay-to-play, simply for PvP. If I wanted large skill based fights, I'd go play on a 64 player CS:S server <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I can't say I understand why people would pay to play for PvE. It's unbelievably mindless repitition.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Leveling is WoW is already incredibly lenient. What more do you want?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Are you joking? You think hundreds of hours /played just to get to 60 is lenient? Plus hundreds of more hours to get gear to compete in PvP against uber geared people. WoW is not a lenient game in terms of PvE.
I've cleared BWL a bunch of times, it's easier than MC as far as wipes, speed, and predictability goes when you have the routine down. And hunter PvP is the worst in the entire game, in my experience. 90% of the time it all goes out the window as soon as you get snared, and any time you don't get snared it's a free win. Levelling my hunter was a waste of time, even with free epix in the deal.
<b>I got the Destroyer of Worlds tonight!</b> - <a href="http://www.wowhead.com/?item=19854" target="_blank">http://www.wowhead.com/?item=19854</a> I'm the happiest little paladin that you ever saw! ^^
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've killed both Cthun and Vael, and they aren't fun at all. PvE is easy and boring. At least to me. Of course in WoW PvP it's boring because WoW PvP sucks. It's not a good PvP game at all.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I assume from that, that you've only killed them after your guild has got them on farm.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I can't say I understand why people would pay to play for PvE. It's unbelievably mindless repitition.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Because I can't get the PvE experience or community in single, or normal multiplayer. I can get a good skill based 'PvP' by picking up any decent FPS.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Are you joking? You think hundreds of hours /played just to get to 60 is lenient? Plus hundreds of more hours to get gear to compete in PvP against uber geared people. WoW is not a lenient game in terms of PvE.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> No, I'm not joking. You can get to 60 in or around 10 days, or even less for some. With the death penalty being barely existant, as well as rest XP, WoW is incredibly lenient, compared to other MMOs.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've cleared BWL a bunch of times, it's easier than MC as far as wipes, speed, and predictability goes when you have the routine down<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I agree BWL is faster, as there's far less trash but there's no way you can claim it's more predictable or wipe free - Vael in particular is a crapshoot, if your priests get BA in a row first it's probably a wipe no matter what your gear is. One tank mistake at the drakes can cause a wipe if a drake shadowflames the raid. For Nef and Chrom, you don't know precisely what you're facing, until you pull. This is hardly easy or predictable. Of MC and BWL, the latter is by far harder.
I think he meant that in general, MMO's take up a lot of time. And it's true that it does take quite some time to get to 60 compared to getting level 10 on Combat or even level 20 in GW.
PvE is great fun. I really enjoy the fights when you first attempt them, and they're fresh, new. The guild I'm currently in was formed from a multitude of RP guilds on Maelstrom that merged together, all being mostly casual players and living in drasitically different timezones from eachother (the Kiwi's eat breakfast after we raid while we go to sleep =P). As such, I've seen the complete PvE progression, from guild BRS, Scholo and Strat runs up to (what we're currently at) ZG complete clears and half way through AQ20. I was there when ZG progressed to farm status and I was there when we first attempted general Rajaxx (coolest fight <i>ever</i>).
I guess PvE would be less fun for someone who wasnt there to see the guild's failures, near victories and then that final down of that end game boss that you've been attempting all night/week. Its a nice fuzzy feeling seeing Hakkar collapse at the first time and walking out with a huge honking sword.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> I agree BWL is faster, as there's far less trash but there's no way you can claim it's more predictable or wipe free - Vael in particular is a crapshoot, if your priests get BA in a row first it's probably a wipe no matter what your gear is. One tank mistake at the drakes can cause a wipe if a drake shadowflames the raid. For Nef and Chrom, you don't know precisely what you're facing, until you pull. This is hardly easy or predictable. Of MC and BWL, the latter is by far harder.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Unpredictability on Nef, sure, but Chrom? No way. Our guild (Futility) was a fresh crew and we did BWL start-to-finish from first Vael to first Nef kill over the course of a month. Chrom was a definite dissapointment as far as challenge goes... got him on the 6th pull with IF/TL and one-shot him every time I've been there since then.
The only really good fight in BWL is Vael. Chromaggus is actually more than anything an example that PvE is just following a set routine, same for the drakes as well.
<!--quoteo(post=1568647:date=Oct 1 2006, 09:42 AM:name=Aldaris)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Aldaris @ Oct 1 2006, 09:42 AM) [snapback]1568647[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> I assume from that, that you've only killed them after your guild has got them on farm.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Vael yes, and I joined when the guild was at Huhu in AQ40, so I was there for all of the post-huhu trash, twin emps, cthun trash, and cthun learning.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Because I can't get the PvE experience or community in single, or normal multiplayer. I can get a good skill based 'PvP' by picking up any decent FPS.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Shrug, I just don't enjoy PvE at all, it feels like a huge waste of time, the only reason people spend so much time killing mobs is for leet purples so they can kill mobs better. Dunno <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> And yes you can get skill based PvP in a FPS but PvP in a FPS is a lot different from PvP in a RPG.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No, I'm not joking. You can get to 60 in or around 10 days, or even less for some. With the death penalty being barely existant, as well as rest XP, WoW is incredibly lenient, compared to other MMOs.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Maybe compared to some but it's also incredibly time consuming compared to some. For example, in GW I'm told you don't even have to PvE a character at all. In DAoC you can PL to 50 in under 20 hours. I don't consider having to play a character for ~250 hours before being cap lvl 'lenient', I dunno.
On the PvE thing I guess we might just have a difference of opinion. It takes so much time and it's so damn boring...
<!--quoteo(post=1568710:date=Oct 2 2006, 01:11 AM:name=The_Necroscope)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(The_Necroscope @ Oct 2 2006, 01:11 AM) [snapback]1568710[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Does anyone know how many Rugged Armor Kits i'd need to hand in to the Dark Moon Fair to get the Epic Necklace they offer ?
Thottbot refuses to load :-(
( This badboy - <a href="http://www.wowwiki.com/Amulet_of_the_Darkmoon" target="_blank">http://www.wowwiki.com/Amulet_of_the_Darkmoon</a> ) <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
QuaunautThe longest seven days in history...Join Date: 2003-03-21Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
edited October 2006
<!--quoteo(post=1568016:date=Sep 26 2006, 12:31 PM:name=Shoebox)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Shoebox @ Sep 26 2006, 12:31 PM) [snapback]1568016[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> To me, if I understand you correctly, being on Nef is good but the guild im in had Nef on farm status, meaning what he drops lot of the times we would shard. You can check out the site at <a href="http://www.mulletgamer.com" target="_blank">www.mulletgamer.com</a> <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No, you don't understand the point.
We made it there in 'record' time for our server. We literally 'skipped' several weeks of our own projected progression. We know being on Nef is nothing- til you're in Naxx you're behind the game - but the fact that us, 5 seperate guilds who raid together only so we could raid at all, are progressing into Nefarian at all, is an amazing feat, and as fast as we are is quite noteworthy.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Learn2dualwield. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I'm beating our dual wielders without much trouble, currently. Soon they'll overtake me- but we still have awhile to go til that, eh?
Edit: And something I can't understand for the life of me: How can you say WoW's endgame sucks, when most raiding guilds would easily say its the best raiding endgame of all the MMOs out currently? PvP is a little lacking currently because of the repetitive nature of BGs and the fruitless world PvP flavor, but even then, its easy to have quite a bit of fun. And saying that PvP requires no skill is just ignorant, I'm sorry. I've taken Warriors with my IBS who would walk around with Spinal Reapers, Ashkandi's, Untamed Blades, who are decked out in proper PvP/DPH weaponry- while I've got mere valor and average blues. I've done my fair share of handing out the pain, and I'll be damned if I'm not remembered in many a PvP fight before multi-server BGs. Saying PvP requires no skill- or even little skill- is completely ignorant, in every sense of the word. Its gear heavy only if you let it be.
As to PvE, I love the Vael fight, as its a insane test in DPS/Aggro control, and for a under-3 minute fight, is just fun as hell- though I'll say I love the Razorgore fight so much more. Controlled Chaos...mm. Same with Broodlord- Lyceum on steroids and cream? Sexy sexy.
Its one thing to not like a game, but what happened to the age when people on these boards were expected to actually give damned reasons beyond "it sucks"?
DY357LXPlaying since day 1. Still can't Comm.EnglandJoin Date: 2002-10-27Member: 1651Members, Constellation
<!--quoteo(post=1568769:date=Oct 2 2006, 04:04 PM:name=Duff-Man)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Duff-Man @ Oct 2 2006, 04:04 PM) [snapback]1568769[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> 1200, says right on the WoWWiki page. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes... that says 1200 Tickets. I asked how many Rugged Armor Kits. I'm not sure how many kits are exchaned for 1, 5, or 10 tickets. (And like I said before.. Thottbot refuses to load.)
Did anyone happen to see Wednesday's episode of South Park? "Make Love Not Warcraft" I was pretty much a machinima using the WoW engine, with some special animations made for the show (whether by the SP crew or by Blizzard I'm not sure).
Anyway, it was a fantastic episode. I don't play, have never played, WoW but it was really entertaining none-the-less.
You can download (illegally, not that the makers of SP care) it on certain sites.
<!--quoteo(post=1569055:date=Oct 4 2006, 10:09 PM:name=The_Necroscope)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(The_Necroscope @ Oct 4 2006, 10:09 PM) [snapback]1569055[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Yes... that says 1200 Tickets. I asked how many Rugged Armor Kits. I'm not sure how many kits are exchaned for 1, 5, or 10 tickets. (And like I said before.. Thottbot refuses to load.) <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
8 Rugged Armor Kits = 20 Tickets
1200 / 20 = 60 Turn Ins
60 * 8 = <b>480 Rugged Armor Kits.</b>
Also, I do play WoW as well, not as much as I used to though. Currently waiting for Burning Crusade of course. That's all there is to do now for me anyways.
The account I used to keep in touch with friends I met in wow has recently had its password changed.. Its only a matter of time before I actually start paying for my own account again. I'm so screwed D:
Yawn. I'm almost finished with gearing up until the expansion comes out. =P Anticipation isnt the word I'd use to describe it. Happy that I'm finally done running instances or grinding <i>anything</i> since I'll have everything I need.
TalesinOur own little well of hateJoin Date: 2002-11-08Member: 7710NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators
Speaking of the expansion, did anyone else make it into the closed BC beta? Trying to find folks to bomb around with, so I won't be lost in a sea of twinks.
...and they said I was crazy, running a Shammy in the first-to-fifty contest. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
Comments
Maybe if they included the Dishonorable Kill mechanic, it'd be a little less compelling... but I've seen over ten gankers just camping out to kill newbies. PvP can **** off, far as I'm concerned.
Eh, I favor PvE myself. PvP is more of a pain in the posterior, given the number of gankers just waiting to make your day a little more difficult. Much prefer to just quest in peace, and not have to worry about some fully decked-out level 60 rogue who decides to sit just outside the border of the Contested Area, and one-shot me every time I try to complete a quest, or just follow bits of the storyline in the game.
Maybe if they included the Dishonorable Kill mechanic, it'd be a little less compelling... but I've seen over ten gankers just camping out to kill newbies. PvP can **** off, far as I'm concerned.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Obviously when I talk about PvP I'm talking about cap lvl vs cap lvl (ie lvl 60 vs lvl 60 in WoW). Not talking about some random 60 walking all over a bunch of lvl 20s. Of course that's not fun.
DAoC is where the good PvP is now, imo, with the classic servers (fu ToA).
As for PvE, it's just boring. You kill monsters so that you can kill monsters better so that you can kill monsters. PvE is just doing something new once, and then repeating that over and over. It sucks and it's terrible that so many mmorpgs do it like that.
Putting in stupid amounts of time doing the same thing over and over. WoW is fun for the first month of anything new you do in it.
Attempting <a href="http://www.wowwiki.com/Maexxna" target="_blank">Maexxna</a> now.
--Scythe--
As for PvE, it's just boring. You kill monsters so that you can kill monsters better so that you can kill monsters. PvE is just doing something new once, and then repeating that over and over. It sucks and it's terrible that so many mmorpgs do it like that.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As for PvP, it's just boring. You kill players, so you can rank up to get items, so you can kill players. PvE endgame has far more variation then any PvP currantly. It's about doing something, and getting involved in greater then "lolz, rank 14 ######z, you suck". You get something on farm, it gets boring, you move on to the next thing, it's just the way the world works. PvP is far more mindless repetition then PvE, simply because there's nothing to learn and perfect in PvP. How would you do PvE then, if the currant method is terrible?
As for PvP, it's just boring. You kill players, so you can rank up to get items, so you can kill players. PvE endgame has far more variation then any PvP currantly. It's about doing something, and getting involved in greater then "lolz, rank 14 ######z, you suck". You get something on farm, it gets boring, you move on to the next thing, it's just the way the world works. PvP is far more mindless repetition then PvE, simply because there's nothing to learn and perfect in PvP. How would you do PvE then, if the currant method is terrible?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree WoW PvP is terrible. DAoC has far better PvP. Organized groups competing, or you can zerg and take keeps (sucks imo but some people like it). When I said I like PvP I didn't mean WoW PvP <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
As for changing PvE, I dunno haven't thought about it much (I'm not a game developer <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> ) but my initial reaction would be to reduce the time needed to get to cap level significantly, and make caps on gains from items so that there isn't an endless treadmill of items to be constantly upgrading. My ideal MMO would have low to no PvE and mostly skilled group based PvP. I'm thinking about trying GW <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
PvP is less about following a simple, set routine and more about fluid adaption. BG farming hardly counts as PvP. It's kicking puppies unless you're against another good team.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Go do some of the more chaotic endgame fights, like Vael or C'thun, and tell me it's all just a simple set routine <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> Can't say I see much adaption needed in PvP really. As a Hunter, I sit back and multi/arcane, with the occasional aimed shot if I have room to pull one off. Spam flares all over the place, and FD/Trap when needed.
I can't say I understand people who pay-to-play, simply for PvP. If I wanted large skill based fights, I'd go play on a 64 player CS:S server <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Leveling is WoW is already incredibly lenient. What more do you want?
Go do some of the more chaotic endgame fights, like Vael or C'thun, and tell me it's all just a simple set routine <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /> Can't say I see much adaption needed in PvP really. As a Hunter, I sit back and multi/arcane, with the occasional aimed shot if I have room to pull one off. Spam flares all over the place, and FD/Trap when needed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've killed both Cthun and Vael, and they aren't fun at all. PvE is easy and boring. At least to me. Of course in WoW PvP it's boring because WoW PvP sucks. It's not a good PvP game at all.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I can't say I understand people who pay-to-play, simply for PvP. If I wanted large skill based fights, I'd go play on a 64 player CS:S server <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I can't say I understand why people would pay to play for PvE. It's unbelievably mindless repitition.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Leveling is WoW is already incredibly lenient. What more do you want?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Are you joking? You think hundreds of hours /played just to get to 60 is lenient? Plus hundreds of more hours to get gear to compete in PvP against uber geared people. WoW is not a lenient game in terms of PvE.
I assume from that, that you've only killed them after your guild has got them on farm.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I can't say I understand why people would pay to play for PvE. It's unbelievably mindless repitition.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because I can't get the PvE experience or community in single, or normal multiplayer. I can get a good skill based 'PvP' by picking up any decent FPS.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Are you joking? You think hundreds of hours /played just to get to 60 is lenient? Plus hundreds of more hours to get gear to compete in PvP against uber geared people. WoW is not a lenient game in terms of PvE.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No, I'm not joking. You can get to 60 in or around 10 days, or even less for some. With the death penalty being barely existant, as well as rest XP, WoW is incredibly lenient, compared to other MMOs.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've cleared BWL a bunch of times, it's easier than MC as far as wipes, speed, and predictability goes when you have the routine down<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree BWL is faster, as there's far less trash but there's no way you can claim it's more predictable or wipe free - Vael in particular is a crapshoot, if your priests get BA in a row first it's probably a wipe no matter what your gear is. One tank mistake at the drakes can cause a wipe if a drake shadowflames the raid. For Nef and Chrom, you don't know precisely what you're facing, until you pull. This is hardly easy or predictable. Of MC and BWL, the latter is by far harder.
I guess PvE would be less fun for someone who wasnt there to see the guild's failures, near victories and then that final down of that end game boss that you've been attempting all night/week. Its a nice fuzzy feeling seeing Hakkar collapse at the first time and walking out with a huge honking sword.
As for myself, I enjoy both equally. ^.~
<b>I got the Destroyer of Worlds tonight!</b> - <a href="http://www.wowhead.com/?item=19854" target="_blank">http://www.wowhead.com/?item=19854</a> I'm the happiest little paladin that you ever saw! ^^
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HUNTER WEAPON
This weekend (almost over! Oh noes!) is Alterac Valley weekend so there's Honor bonuses a-plenty!
See you in there! (EU Battlegroup 8)
I agree BWL is faster, as there's far less trash but there's no way you can claim it's more predictable or wipe free - Vael in particular is a crapshoot, if your priests get BA in a row first it's probably a wipe no matter what your gear is. One tank mistake at the drakes can cause a wipe if a drake shadowflames the raid. For Nef and Chrom, you don't know precisely what you're facing, until you pull. This is hardly easy or predictable. Of MC and BWL, the latter is by far harder.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Unpredictability on Nef, sure, but Chrom? No way. Our guild (Futility) was a fresh crew and we did BWL start-to-finish from first Vael to first Nef kill over the course of a month. Chrom was a definite dissapointment as far as challenge goes... got him on the 6th pull with IF/TL and one-shot him every time I've been there since then.
The only really good fight in BWL is Vael. Chromaggus is actually more than anything an example that PvE is just following a set routine, same for the drakes as well.
With that said, <!--coloro:red--><span style="color:red"><!--/coloro-->*ILLEGAL ADVERTISEMENT NUKED.* -Talesin<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
I assume from that, that you've only killed them after your guild has got them on farm.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Vael yes, and I joined when the guild was at Huhu in AQ40, so I was there for all of the post-huhu trash, twin emps, cthun trash, and cthun learning.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Because I can't get the PvE experience or community in single, or normal multiplayer. I can get a good skill based 'PvP' by picking up any decent FPS.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Shrug, I just don't enjoy PvE at all, it feels like a huge waste of time, the only reason people spend so much time killing mobs is for leet purples so they can kill mobs better. Dunno <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
And yes you can get skill based PvP in a FPS but PvP in a FPS is a lot different from PvP in a RPG.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No, I'm not joking. You can get to 60 in or around 10 days, or even less for some. With the death penalty being barely existant, as well as rest XP, WoW is incredibly lenient, compared to other MMOs.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Maybe compared to some but it's also incredibly time consuming compared to some. For example, in GW I'm told you don't even have to PvE a character at all. In DAoC you can PL to 50 in under 20 hours. I don't consider having to play a character for ~250 hours before being cap lvl 'lenient', I dunno.
On the PvE thing I guess we might just have a difference of opinion. It takes so much time and it's so damn boring...
Thottbot refuses to load :-(
( This badboy - <a href="http://www.wowwiki.com/Amulet_of_the_Darkmoon" target="_blank">http://www.wowwiki.com/Amulet_of_the_Darkmoon</a> )
Does anyone know how many Rugged Armor Kits i'd need to hand in to the Dark Moon Fair to get the Epic Necklace they offer ?
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1200, says right on the WoWWiki page.
To me, if I understand you correctly, being on Nef is good but the guild im in had Nef on farm status, meaning what he drops lot of the times we would shard. You can check out the site at <a href="http://www.mulletgamer.com" target="_blank">www.mulletgamer.com</a>
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No, you don't understand the point.
We made it there in 'record' time for our server. We literally 'skipped' several weeks of our own projected progression. We know being on Nef is nothing- til you're in Naxx you're behind the game - but the fact that us, 5 seperate guilds who raid together only so we could raid at all, are progressing into Nefarian at all, is an amazing feat, and as fast as we are is quite noteworthy.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Learn2dualwield.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I'm beating our dual wielders without much trouble, currently. Soon they'll overtake me- but we still have awhile to go til that, eh?
Edit: And something I can't understand for the life of me: How can you say WoW's endgame sucks, when most raiding guilds would easily say its the best raiding endgame of all the MMOs out currently? PvP is a little lacking currently because of the repetitive nature of BGs and the fruitless world PvP flavor, but even then, its easy to have quite a bit of fun. And saying that PvP requires no skill is just ignorant, I'm sorry. I've taken Warriors with my IBS who would walk around with Spinal Reapers, Ashkandi's, Untamed Blades, who are decked out in proper PvP/DPH weaponry- while I've got mere valor and average blues. I've done my fair share of handing out the pain, and I'll be damned if I'm not remembered in many a PvP fight before multi-server BGs. Saying PvP requires no skill- or even little skill- is completely ignorant, in every sense of the word. Its gear heavy only if you let it be.
As to PvE, I love the Vael fight, as its a insane test in DPS/Aggro control, and for a under-3 minute fight, is just fun as hell- though I'll say I love the Razorgore fight so much more. Controlled Chaos...mm. Same with Broodlord- Lyceum on steroids and cream? Sexy sexy.
Its one thing to not like a game, but what happened to the age when people on these boards were expected to actually give damned reasons beyond "it sucks"?
1200, says right on the WoWWiki page.
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Yes... that says 1200 Tickets. I asked how many Rugged Armor Kits.
I'm not sure how many kits are exchaned for 1, 5, or 10 tickets.
(And like I said before.. Thottbot refuses to load.)
Anyway, it was a fantastic episode. I don't play, have never played, WoW but it was really entertaining none-the-less.
You can download (illegally, not that the makers of SP care) it on certain sites.
Yes... that says 1200 Tickets. I asked how many Rugged Armor Kits.
I'm not sure how many kits are exchaned for 1, 5, or 10 tickets.
(And like I said before.. Thottbot refuses to load.)
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8 Rugged Armor Kits = 20 Tickets
1200 / 20 = 60 Turn Ins
60 * 8 = <b>480 Rugged Armor Kits.</b>
Also, I do play WoW as well, not as much as I used to though. Currently waiting for Burning Crusade of course. That's all there is to do now for me anyways.
Its only a matter of time before I actually start paying for my own account again.
I'm so screwed D:
And guys, unless you're over level 50, all the Darkmoon Faire stuff sucks. The Halloween thing, though, is going to have cool stuff.
...and they said I was crazy, running a Shammy in the first-to-fifty contest. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />