Alright, please don't vent about it here (there's a reddit thread right there you can do that in), but this is what I was talking about by extremes not being able to be appeased.
Alright, please don't vent about it here, but this is what I was talking about by extremes not being able to be appeased.
This being the official forums are exactly the right place to vent. This happened to Bethesda and Bungie. It's not because the company in question made Subnautica (a good game, yes, with some flaws) they should be exempt of this criticism.
But, well, I said my piece. Like it, dislike it, doesn't matter. At least there is only this thread about it, instead of dozens upon dozens.
There's nothing wrong with criticizing open borders policy. You would have to be pretty damn stupid to assume other countries have no criminals at all and all immigrants, legal or otherwise, are 100% good honest people that just want a place to live.
But what I really take from all this is that UWE is going for diversity hires, meaning new staff members will be hired based on race, religeon, and gender rather than talent which bodes ill for all future projects.
Wow. So he was dragged out of his home, castrated, hung from a tree, burned to death, and then hacked to pieces for souvenirs, by a mob who had no evidence but a lot of hatred (and usually a hidden financial motive)? Yeah... no. That's the exact opposite of what happened.
This thread is an excellent way to determine who in here is RL trash, and it's about the percentage of you commenting that I expected. Y'all seem to think that expressing bigotry is harmless fun and nobody should ever receive any kind of negative repercussions from it. That worldview is out of date.
In conclusion: You're so angry? Good. Die mad about it.
It is good that this happened because I just got a new computer and was about to buy the game when I saw this.
I do not spend money on sjws. It's a great shame, I've been looking forward to this game with it's excellent sound and atmosphere.
Curious, is there any way to measure the impact of something like this? Or would those kind of numbers not be something that could be extrapolated or not available to the general public?
Curious, is there any way to measure the impact of something like this? Or would those kind of numbers not be something that could be extrapolated or not available to the general public?
The impact is likely to be small. The game is already a huge success and it is a great game. The "reviews backlash on steam" took place mostly yesterday, today it is already positive. Some people won't buy it, and they are louder voicing their opinion. But there's the other side of the coin, there are people whom agrees with the company decision and might buy the game for it.
The rest of the discussion is becoming quite sensitive. Immigration, reasons on why some countries remain poor while others thrived, racism and so on...
I for one believe that if Simon did not took the time to explain the reason behind his statements, then I take the liberty to interpret them as racist.
And I think that if you post racist comments on your personal account and you post work related stuff on that same account, then people will relate those comments to the company. It's that simple.
Another issue is to assume that the entire discussion which certainly happened behind "closed doors" between the parties prior to the firing was completely exposed by the fired part.
When I was a kid there was this friend of mine, her father worked for Pepsi and he did not allow her to drink Coke, ever. Nor did him allow Coke to be brought to his house. As soon as he retired that stopped being an issue. Why do you think he did that? Company loyalty? That was the nineties. We live on the internet age now, but this has always happened.
I agree with we are getting too off-topic, but I would like to touch some points.
The internet grew with me and, currently, I'm perceiving growing hatred, mostly xenophobia and gender related. On all sides.
As @Kouji_San, I believe, mentioned: This seems to derives from the apparent notion of anonymity.
I also had the opportunity to meet many people in this life, in many different places. Always tried to understand the way they see the world.
Coming from a "third world country" I get extremely saddened whenever someone from a highly privileged background tries to blame the poorest countries "failure" on its people, or imply in any way that they are inferior. Not offended, just sad. Because it feels like these people are taking a confrontational instance and detaching themselves from the problem.
There's too much text behind, but I think it was @0x6A7232 who said that maybe we should discuss on why those places got like that and how to improve them, and that is so on point. Discussing is the first step. But "fixing" it is a little harder, as it would require messing with the current status quo of the world.
There's no way we can compare a country such as Germany, or Japan, whose thousands years of history and whose people have a strong notion of community to a country whose people is composed of scattered tribes, artificially brought together by foreigners. We can't compare a new country which was formerly an exploitation colony with one which was a settling colony. There are many nuances to take into consideration, and everyone wants to blame the next, instead of looking inside and trying to understand where is their share of the blame.
The same applies to the "SJW" movement. Discarding the extremes, is everything they preach really so inane? We act like we eradicated all forms of sexism in the western world, but the feminist movement was nearly fifty years ago. My grandma alone doubles that. There are Men running large companies who were in their twenties when it started.
Adapting what a buddy used to say: Nearly nothing in this life is black and white, there are many colors in between them.
I'm a strong advocate of education. I believe that if you educate people everything improves, everywhere.
Well I been reading a lot of people's post and I have notice people are saying well he should not posting personal political views ect link to the companies he works for. Only one problem you keep forgetting it doesn't matter what account he used or if it was linked or not to the companie . Because these social justice warriors would still complain to the companie and in the end he still would of got fired because they caved . That's just my 2 cents on the issue about posting stuff on social media outlets .
The one thing that does disgust me is the massive dump of negative reviews for reasons completely irrelevant to Subnautica. It's a beautiful game that deserves respect , even the former sound designer would agree.
The one thing that does disgust me is the massive dump of negative reviews for reasons completely irrelevant to Subnautica. It's a beautiful game that deserves respect , even the former sound designer would agree.
There is also one thing to consider. With the time, the review system on Steam started to be used as a way for consumers to directly make a statement to a developer, kinda of how the "Agree" or "Disagree" votes work on this forum - you could exchange them to "Upvote" and "Downvote" and the meaning would be the same, if not more accurate.
Subnautica is a good game that certainly doesn't deserve the backlash for anything else besides itself, I completely agree with you. But, with the current usage of the review system to, let's say "make a protest", the review bombing of Subnautica was inevitable. Not because of the game, but because of that being the sometimes only effective way for the consumers to show displesure with something the devs have said, and how they said.
The same thing happened when the Creation Club was implemented on Fallout 4 and later, Skyrim Special Edition (but in this later case it may be more related to the fact Bethesda removed the original Skyrim from the store front, making it only available if you have a link to the store page). Things like that happen, and will continue happening for a very long time.
The one thing that does disgust me is the massive dump of negative reviews for reasons completely irrelevant to Subnautica. It's a beautiful game that deserves respect , even the former sound designer would agree.
I completely agree. Why are so many people refusing to buy the game because of how UWE runs it’s company?
If the devs ban you or remove this thread, really shows they're pussy bois
At least have respect for the other people in this 'room' with you and try to keep it within the rules, eh? There's nicer ways to say what you're trying to convey without resorting to antagonistic name calling.
Think of it as people having a mostly respectful, but heated disagreement at a bar. If you start shouting insults and flailing your arms aggressively it's only going to make the police break it up to prevent a fight, to the loss of everyone else who was behaving appropriately.
I recently bought 'Subnautica', have enjoyed it, loved the sounds and the whole survival role of the game. However, I woke up this morning and discovered the controversy blowing up at UWE.
While I do enjoy the game I was wondering, since I have played longer than Steam will allow me to get a refund, if UWE will be willing to personally refund my purchase price. I mean, since the 'player base' is sacrosanct to them and this member of the 'player base' is both offended and disgusted by the heavy-handed Fascist SJW Group-Think evidenced by their actions.
If someone doing a masterful job at what they have been hired to do isn't a good enough reason to keep that person employed than Mr. Cleveland would not want my contaminated money since I also feel that SOME of the fired employees posts were relevant and logical.
Since I also happen to be an American and feel that people have the right to Free-speech I look at the whole brouhaha as a 'I see we agree to disagree', NOT as something to go seal-clubbing those ideals that may or may not be important to the vast majority of said same base.
Yes, they have the right to fire him, I have the right to disagree and not want my money to encourage this sort of behavior. So I guess we all are at an impasse. Your move, Mr. Cleveland.
That's why I, as the OP, asked moderators to close this thread before it devolves into something none of us would like to see here. If they choose to do that, please respect that decision, if they do not... please do stay civil and respectful.
Since the OP has asked for the thread to be closed, and since it seems that everyone who is actually a member of this community has had the opportunity to share their views, I'm going to close this thread before more posts appear that break the community rules.
For those of you that have not seen it, our statement on the matter is as follows:
"Over the weekend we discovered that one of our team members had made many hateful statements online that are against our company values. After discussing the matter with him, we decided to stop working with him immediately."
Comments
This being the official forums are exactly the right place to vent. This happened to Bethesda and Bungie. It's not because the company in question made Subnautica (a good game, yes, with some flaws) they should be exempt of this criticism.
But, well, I said my piece. Like it, dislike it, doesn't matter. At least there is only this thread about it, instead of dozens upon dozens.
But what I really take from all this is that UWE is going for diversity hires, meaning new staff members will be hired based on race, religeon, and gender rather than talent which bodes ill for all future projects.
Wow. So he was dragged out of his home, castrated, hung from a tree, burned to death, and then hacked to pieces for souvenirs, by a mob who had no evidence but a lot of hatred (and usually a hidden financial motive)? Yeah... no. That's the exact opposite of what happened.
This thread is an excellent way to determine who in here is RL trash, and it's about the percentage of you commenting that I expected. Y'all seem to think that expressing bigotry is harmless fun and nobody should ever receive any kind of negative repercussions from it. That worldview is out of date.
In conclusion: You're so angry? Good. Die mad about it.
This is a contentious issue and one that people clearly wish to debate. Let's keep this thread civil.
I do not spend money on sjws. It's a great shame, I've been looking forward to this game with it's excellent sound and atmosphere.
The impact is likely to be small. The game is already a huge success and it is a great game. The "reviews backlash on steam" took place mostly yesterday, today it is already positive. Some people won't buy it, and they are louder voicing their opinion. But there's the other side of the coin, there are people whom agrees with the company decision and might buy the game for it.
The rest of the discussion is becoming quite sensitive. Immigration, reasons on why some countries remain poor while others thrived, racism and so on...
I for one believe that if Simon did not took the time to explain the reason behind his statements, then I take the liberty to interpret them as racist.
And I think that if you post racist comments on your personal account and you post work related stuff on that same account, then people will relate those comments to the company. It's that simple.
Another issue is to assume that the entire discussion which certainly happened behind "closed doors" between the parties prior to the firing was completely exposed by the fired part.
When I was a kid there was this friend of mine, her father worked for Pepsi and he did not allow her to drink Coke, ever. Nor did him allow Coke to be brought to his house. As soon as he retired that stopped being an issue. Why do you think he did that? Company loyalty? That was the nineties. We live on the internet age now, but this has always happened.
I agree with we are getting too off-topic, but I would like to touch some points.
The internet grew with me and, currently, I'm perceiving growing hatred, mostly xenophobia and gender related. On all sides.
As @Kouji_San, I believe, mentioned: This seems to derives from the apparent notion of anonymity.
I also had the opportunity to meet many people in this life, in many different places. Always tried to understand the way they see the world.
Coming from a "third world country" I get extremely saddened whenever someone from a highly privileged background tries to blame the poorest countries "failure" on its people, or imply in any way that they are inferior. Not offended, just sad. Because it feels like these people are taking a confrontational instance and detaching themselves from the problem.
There's too much text behind, but I think it was @0x6A7232 who said that maybe we should discuss on why those places got like that and how to improve them, and that is so on point. Discussing is the first step. But "fixing" it is a little harder, as it would require messing with the current status quo of the world.
There's no way we can compare a country such as Germany, or Japan, whose thousands years of history and whose people have a strong notion of community to a country whose people is composed of scattered tribes, artificially brought together by foreigners. We can't compare a new country which was formerly an exploitation colony with one which was a settling colony. There are many nuances to take into consideration, and everyone wants to blame the next, instead of looking inside and trying to understand where is their share of the blame.
The same applies to the "SJW" movement. Discarding the extremes, is everything they preach really so inane? We act like we eradicated all forms of sexism in the western world, but the feminist movement was nearly fifty years ago. My grandma alone doubles that. There are Men running large companies who were in their twenties when it started.
Adapting what a buddy used to say: Nearly nothing in this life is black and white, there are many colors in between them.
I'm a strong advocate of education. I believe that if you educate people everything improves, everywhere.
Judging how this thread is still going with a moderator posting in it and hasn't degenerated into name calling, let's not start now shall we
There is also one thing to consider. With the time, the review system on Steam started to be used as a way for consumers to directly make a statement to a developer, kinda of how the "Agree" or "Disagree" votes work on this forum - you could exchange them to "Upvote" and "Downvote" and the meaning would be the same, if not more accurate.
Subnautica is a good game that certainly doesn't deserve the backlash for anything else besides itself, I completely agree with you. But, with the current usage of the review system to, let's say "make a protest", the review bombing of Subnautica was inevitable. Not because of the game, but because of that being the sometimes only effective way for the consumers to show displesure with something the devs have said, and how they said.
The same thing happened when the Creation Club was implemented on Fallout 4 and later, Skyrim Special Edition (but in this later case it may be more related to the fact Bethesda removed the original Skyrim from the store front, making it only available if you have a link to the store page). Things like that happen, and will continue happening for a very long time.
I completely agree. Why are so many people refusing to buy the game because of how UWE runs it’s company?
At least have respect for the other people in this 'room' with you and try to keep it within the rules, eh? There's nicer ways to say what you're trying to convey without resorting to antagonistic name calling.
Think of it as people having a mostly respectful, but heated disagreement at a bar. If you start shouting insults and flailing your arms aggressively it's only going to make the police break it up to prevent a fight, to the loss of everyone else who was behaving appropriately.
While I do enjoy the game I was wondering, since I have played longer than Steam will allow me to get a refund, if UWE will be willing to personally refund my purchase price. I mean, since the 'player base' is sacrosanct to them and this member of the 'player base' is both offended and disgusted by the heavy-handed Fascist SJW Group-Think evidenced by their actions.
If someone doing a masterful job at what they have been hired to do isn't a good enough reason to keep that person employed than Mr. Cleveland would not want my contaminated money since I also feel that SOME of the fired employees posts were relevant and logical.
Since I also happen to be an American and feel that people have the right to Free-speech I look at the whole brouhaha as a 'I see we agree to disagree', NOT as something to go seal-clubbing those ideals that may or may not be important to the vast majority of said same base.
Yes, they have the right to fire him, I have the right to disagree and not want my money to encourage this sort of behavior. So I guess we all are at an impasse. Your move, Mr. Cleveland.
Since the OP has asked for the thread to be closed, and since it seems that everyone who is actually a member of this community has had the opportunity to share their views, I'm going to close this thread before more posts appear that break the community rules.
For those of you that have not seen it, our statement on the matter is as follows:
"Over the weekend we discovered that one of our team members had made many hateful statements online that are against our company values. After discussing the matter with him, we decided to stop working with him immediately."
We have nothing further to add at this time.