MasterGgmfbstJoin Date: 2003-08-24Member: 20169Members, Squad Five Blue
Thank you UncleCrunch! Though I'd like for you to be a little more specific.
I know Drill Site is quite tall in the sense you are speaking of. I can think of a few things to make that a little bit better for aliens. Another thing to note is that jetpacks run out of fuel quite fast if staying in the air. I can't be 100% sure without testing, but I think that from ground level and up to some girders in Drill Site a jetpacker will be almost out of fuel at the top. The point is that you need to be very careful with your fuel to be effective. I will test my theory later today to check if I'm either right or wrong.
As for other tech point locations I'm not sure what you mean. Except maybe Automation System which has the nice spots on its pillars. Early game(lerk time ish) the room is a bit better for aliens than marines, and late game(jetpacks/fades) I feel like the room is actually quite balanced.
Another thing to note is that if aliens don't have fades up anymore by the time jetpacks arrive, unless it's early jetpacks which is very unlikely, that is not the map's fault. A skilled lerk can easily take out a jetpack and the same goes for a smart skulk in the right environment.
But as stated above, please elaborate on what you mean as it would be very helpful. I also don't know in what kind of setting you have been playing the map so that would be helpful to know as well. It should be stated that I am trying to balance the map based on 6v6 competitive play as well.
Thank you UncleCrunch! Though I'd like for you to be a little more specific.
I know Drill Site is quite tall in the sense you are speaking of. I can think of a few things to make that a little bit better for aliens. Another thing to note is that jetpacks run out of fuel quite fast if staying in the air. I can't be 100% sure without testing, but I think that from ground level and up to some girders in Drill Site a jetpacker will be almost out of fuel at the top. The point is that you need to be very careful with your fuel to be effective. I will test my theory later today to check if I'm either right or wrong.
As for other tech point locations I'm not sure what you mean. Except maybe Automation System which has the nice spots on its pillars. Early game(lerk time ish) the room is a bit better for aliens than marines, and late game(jetpacks/fades) I feel like the room is actually quite balanced.
Another thing to note is that if aliens don't have fades up anymore by the time jetpacks arrive, unless it's early jetpacks which is very unlikely, that is not the map's fault. A skilled lerk can easily take out a jetpack and the same goes for a smart skulk in the right environment.
But as stated above, please elaborate on what you mean as it would be very helpful. I also don't know in what kind of setting you have been playing the map so that would be helpful to know as well. It should be stated that I am trying to balance the map based on 6v6 competitive play as well.
Better meet on some server or connecting to one of us as server. I try to avoid wall of text.
MasterGgmfbstJoin Date: 2003-08-24Member: 20169Members, Squad Five Blue
edited September 2014
Same time zone. CET. I'm in Norway. I'll update my server shortly and maybe we can take a little spin. Look for G's Mineral Only, password will be "bitchplease"
Edit: I'll be around in around an hour. I'll start the server once I'm around and probably edit this post again. Or you could add me on steam for easier communication. I'm Master G with a twitch adress behind it and the lerk avatar.
So, I've watched the replay you just posted above.
This could take a while, and I might EDIT this post if I notice I forgot something, or if one of my teammates wants to add more feedback.
(I'm writing my feedback as I speak, I will update my post later when I'm done)
btw : the games looked more balanced than I thought. RT/control map-wise
- Sephii (commander) told me he had some issues dropping medpacks and ammo packs in some places. I will update this point when he gets back and tells me where he experienced that problem. From what I've noticed, commander dropped packs tend to get stuck on top of the pillar thingies in Automation. The walls/pillars just arround the Tech Point.
- Loading Bay and Lockers (marines natural RTs) seems to be a little too alien friendly. I saw you mentionned that in your replay (about Loading Bay) but I think this is also the case in Lockers. This big locker structure, cuts your lign of sight (that is usually required in marines natural RT rooms). You can easily be killed when building the RT. My suggestion so you can keep a lign of sight on both the lounge and cooling entrances (If you want to keep the layout that way)
Before
After
About Loading Bay, I don't have any idea, but yeah I found it too alien friendly
- At the very start of the game, it's not too hard to take and keep between 4 and 5 RTs for the marines. We saw that was the case during both marines sides. That allows them to focus upgrades pretty easily. Then mid-game when lerks are out and fades about to pop, you may have between 3 to 4 Rts, which still grants a nice res flow. In the meantime, Alien can easily have 3 Rts and keep them. We saw that both teams never got under 3RTs and mostly had 4 during the whole game (except late game). Layout is good, especially the center of the map. You take it, you have a decent map control, wiht PGs. But the map might be too large, especially on each side (left and right). For example, if you compare Mineral to Jambi (they kinda look alike when you think about it), it's must faster to get to Bay Wing than to get to Generators, and it's much faster to get to Organ donation (throught offload) than to get to Storage. I think the Transport room is useless and too large, or useless because too large and too alien friendly. I don't know what you want to do with it, but it might be better to do something more conventionnal with it.
- About the problem with Generators : it's easy to get there when you run through Automation, but not when you have to run all the way through Cooling, Production and Transfer. But since you told me you wanted to rework that side of the map, I'll let you deal with it.
- Onos get stuck in Pump Stations (as you already know).
- Maybe a direct connection from Automation to Storage through West Cross could solve the Transport room problem. I don't know.
- Cooling doesn't feel right. I don't know why, but as you said yesterday, you might want to get rid of it and do something else.
- Funny or weird thing : we almost never got to Pump Control to harrass this RT, on both sides. Storage and Generators yes, but almost never Pump Control. As a consequence, Marines never managed to get to Pump Stations. That might be an issue connectivity-wise.
I'll update when I'll think of smthg else
(hope my english isn't too bad xD I haven't re-read my post)
- about that constant 3 alien RTs thing. It might be related to the size of the map. We also never got the chance to harrass Drill site, Mineral Pro or Pump Control, because it was to far away, even with an Automation PG. When you play on Jambi, aliens have to struggle to keep 3 RTs, Organ Donation, Oxi and Bay Wing (even Waste and Pipeworks) are not that far from the marine start, and you can put a constant pressure on them. Which isn't the case in Mineral
UPDATE : what I got from my teammates :
- vents too OP, like the one connecting Mineral Pro and Transfer
- Loading Bay : ceiling too high, big flight of stairs, easy to ambush for aliens, short lign of sight
MasterGgmfbstJoin Date: 2003-08-24Member: 20169Members, Squad Five Blue
This is great feedback MV. I've been discussing things with Hynips, who commanded the other team as well. And I have come up with solutions to some problems, at least that's what I think. I still need to further analyse what you are saying now, watch the replays from everyone etc before I can be sure(I can never be sure).
I will get back to this after sundays test as well to see what happens there. I have a lot of ideas, but if I were to implement all of them at once it would be a different map so I'll focus on solving things bit by bit.
Thank you so much for the support and feedback, it really means a lot to me!
MasterGgmfbstJoin Date: 2003-08-24Member: 20169Members, Squad Five Blue
Hey guys. I have finally had some tests on Mineral and have had the time to analyze the map more in depth.
After the 6vs6 competitive play test held on Thursday I got a lot of great feedback from some of the participants. While watching the games I also came up with a lot of ideas on my own of what to do to make Mineral a more balanced experience for both teams. The games tonight on Mineral also confirmed my observations to some extent, though the teams were pretty uneven. SCC rounds are not part of the analysis below.
Here is the current layout:
The main issues were identified as the following:
- Resource points in the north are too easy to capture and hold for Aliens. The Alien team held at least 3 resource nodes the entire game(both rounds).
- Resource points in the north are too hard for Marines to properly push without getting out of position.
- Marine travel time from Surface to both Alien starting locations(Drill Site/Mineral Processing) and Automation is too long. It doesn’t matter which route is taken.
- Map connectivity in the north favors the Alien team heavily and is something that needs to be dealt with.
- Resource points in the south are too far apart and too hard for marines to defend.
- Lane-blocking in general is too hard for marines to achieve due to the high connectivity in the north.
After having a chat with some of the people that were in the test I was able to come up with some potential solutions to the problems and started working in Photoshop on a cut/edit layout for a sort of long-term plan for Mineral. This plan will make the map a bit smaller, travel times will be shorter, the south RTs will favor Marines a bit more and the north ones will favor Aliens a bit less. Some of the northern connectivity is removed/redone, the south of the map is pretty much completely reorganized and in general the map is a bit clearer to read and understand for anyone. I also think that the new plan doesn’t lock Marines to a certain tactic like the current version somewhat does(phase gates relatively fast). But instead of explaining everything in detail I will show this to you guys visually.
This first layout includes the new plan(everything inside the red lines) and contains the current version layout underneath:
The second layout shows only the plan forward without any mess from the current version under it:
Note that nothing in this layout is exactly as it could/will be in future versions. This is just the vision I have and everything is still subject to change. Resource placements are also nothing final, just a general guideline of where I want them to be. Another thing that is very important to mention is that Loading Bay in this layout mockup seems to be very open and friendly for Marines, that will not be the case. It all depends on how it plays and what kind of feedback I receive in the coming weeks. All in all the time it would take to complete this transition is around one week, if I can work on it every day. But to be more realistic I’m going to say around 2 weeks, because I have other assignments that need my attention as well. The reason for seemingly low transition time is that this operation is mostly about taking complete areas/rooms and moving/rotating them. Anything that needs a rebuild is still just grey-boxed geometry so all of that is fast to do. The next version is also the first version that I will classify as a Beta of Mineral so it will be a huge milestone in itself.
I would very much like to get some input on this from anyone. What could be good, what could be bad? And please give me reason for why something is good or bad, otherwise it’s not really helping.
Also! Thanks to everyone who played today and on Thursday.
So, I won't be explaining why it's awesome to you again. Already did. So yeah, I very much like the new layout, it seems to better fit competitive play (6v6).
MasterGgmfbstJoin Date: 2003-08-24Member: 20169Members, Squad Five Blue
edited September 2014
Ok guys!
I've been working VERY hard the last week. Unfortunately I didn't make it until the SCC test last night. But today I have made the finishing touches for Mineral BETA version 1.01.
Here's the change log(may have forgot somthing):
Mineral Beta 1.01 change log:
- Removed norther connection between the pumping stations and fixed the Onos trap pit.
- Removed the ventilation from Pump Stations to Generators.
- Removed the ventilation from Storage to Transport.
- Ventilation from Mineral Processing now goes to the connection between Mineral and Generators, instead of Transfer.
- Renamed Tunnel to Rupture.
- Removed West Cross.
- Fixed some pathing issues in Drill Site.
- Fixed some geometry and models that were obstructing the commander/spectator view. Should be better to drop ammo/medpacks now.(would like feedback on this!)
- Removed southern half and the western hallway of Transport.
- Moved Resource Node from Storage into Transport.
- Moved Resource Node in Generators to the western side of the room.
- Rebuilt the connection between Mineral Processing and Generators, now connects to the eastern part of Generators.
- Removed part of Transfer and moved the room to connect on the south of the eastern part of Generators. Also capped some holes in geometry in Transfer.
- Moved Production to the south of Transfer and made a direct connection between the rooms.
- Moved Lockers, Stasis Chambers and Surface a fair bit north-west to make the routes from Surface to Automation a little shorter for Marines.
- Built new connecting corridor between Lockers and Automation.
- Moved the Lockers Resource Node south to the hallway connecting to Stasis Chambers.
- Moved Lounge to the other side of Lockers(like it used to be in early versions) and connected it with a new small corridor to Production.
- Removed the old Loading Bay and moved Security so that it connects directly to Surface. Put the Resource Node that used to be in Loading bay into Security.
- Removed one entrance to Automation, the one that used to come from Security.
- Built a completely new room for Loading Bay that is larger. It connects directly to Automation(where West Cross entrance was), Pump Control, Transport and Security.
- Run times for Marines from Surface to Transport, Drill Site, Pump Control, Automation, Generators and Mineral Processing have been reduced as a result of any of the above changes.
- And another surprise!
Edit4: Here's the new layout so it's easier to see the changes that were made:
Everything I learned in both the 6vs6 playtest and the SCC test about a week ago have been considered to make this build happen. It was also a lot faster than I expected to make the transition. I was aiming for 2-3 weeks and instead made it happen in about 1 week. Now I need a little break to have some fun(mapping is fun too but not if it's all you do!).
The build is live on steam workshop right now!
Please let me know about any small issues that could need hotfixes and I will look into it as soon as possible!
ENJOY!
(As a side note I have started streaming all the work I do on Mineral. Check it out on my hitbox channel!)
Edit: Not sure if it's only on my end but I'm having issues loading the map via workshop/mod. Something about "failed to load calculateperformance" and such. I've tried publishing and republishing several times but it doesn't help. Every time I published it also seemed like it didn't upload anything. It just said "publishin.." for less than a second before saying "publish successful". Anyone had this issue before?
Edit2: Also checked my workshop folder and all the files there updated to the version that I have updated so I have no idea why it doesn't want to run. It's the same version as I have in my work files and that runs just fine. The map file in the workshop folder isn't broken either, cause I can open it in spark no problem.
Edit3: Fixed it. There was a game_setup.xml file causing the errors with the mod. Worked fine when I deleted that file and published again. The map is running on my "G's Mineral Only" server for anyone that wants to just run around or whatever.
The new layout is awesome, Generator is a little op for marines, maybe add a ventilation which is going through mineral to the vent between pump and generators, (like a T)
I love the path between lockers and Generator.
I really like the new loading bay and security, same for automation window ^^
The vent which connect Loading Bay and Transport should connect storage instead of Transport.
Pump Control is the new KeyPoint and Alien should defend it no matter what.
You should add a ladder behind container in Loading Bay to let marines escape this trap.
You should add more space to let the alien comm put more cyst near Pump Transition.
The overall is good imo, i'd love to play more often on this map.
Feedback from tonight's 6v6 game :
Of course, this will require more testing before being accurate.
Negative :
- Vent in Mineral should go all the way to Gen : it is useless as is. Or make a new vent that connects with the already existing vent that comes from Pump Control
- Pump Station corridor that goes before the Pump Control entrance should be larger, so it's not that easy to decyst. Think of X or Oxi on Jambi, you can decyst but if the alien commander wants to he can put like a lot of cysts in there, to avoid agressive pocky decysting.
- Lack of vents
- Vent in Loading Bay should go to Storage : it is useless as is
- Maybe too many human-sized doors, lifeforms shit their pants went going through them. Think of Tram for example, not that many doors.
Positive :
- Good atmosphere
- Good layout
- Nice balance
- Security is a good room (although some people think it's a bit too narrow)
Overall feedback is really good. People love the map.
They said that usually custom maps are huge and very messy, but Mineral has good balance, looks great and feels really smooth to play on.
I'd like to play way more often on this map. And btw, marines can pretty easily adapt to the layout, we had people that knew it, what lanes to cover etc... but it seems less easy to adapt and set priorities as aliens when you don't know Mineral. I'm sure when people will know it better, games will be way more balanced.
What are the timings ?
Number of seconds from TP xx to next RT etc.
I don't have any exact numbers for you, but I can say that the timings are good. Marine naturals from Surface are ca 10-12 seconds. Going from Surface to either Hive start location(Drill Site/Mineral Processing) is about 40 seconds(shortest route).
You cross 2 RT before the next hive except for Automation.
I think you should check every timing. You'll will find the most interesting TP... you could have a issue there.
Comments
I know Drill Site is quite tall in the sense you are speaking of. I can think of a few things to make that a little bit better for aliens. Another thing to note is that jetpacks run out of fuel quite fast if staying in the air. I can't be 100% sure without testing, but I think that from ground level and up to some girders in Drill Site a jetpacker will be almost out of fuel at the top. The point is that you need to be very careful with your fuel to be effective. I will test my theory later today to check if I'm either right or wrong.
As for other tech point locations I'm not sure what you mean. Except maybe Automation System which has the nice spots on its pillars. Early game(lerk time ish) the room is a bit better for aliens than marines, and late game(jetpacks/fades) I feel like the room is actually quite balanced.
Another thing to note is that if aliens don't have fades up anymore by the time jetpacks arrive, unless it's early jetpacks which is very unlikely, that is not the map's fault. A skilled lerk can easily take out a jetpack and the same goes for a smart skulk in the right environment.
But as stated above, please elaborate on what you mean as it would be very helpful. I also don't know in what kind of setting you have been playing the map so that would be helpful to know as well. It should be stated that I am trying to balance the map based on 6v6 competitive play as well.
Better meet on some server or connecting to one of us as server. I try to avoid wall of text.
Otherwise me and @UncleCrunch could go on my "internal" test server tonight and talk through the jetpack issues?
Me : Paris - France - la french baguette is a beast.
http://everytimezone.com/
Edit: I'll be around in around an hour. I'll start the server once I'm around and probably edit this post again. Or you could add me on steam for easier communication. I'm Master G with a twitch adress behind it and the lerk avatar.
What about you ?
Tonight's playtest session was very nice, hope to do that again next week. I'll post my feedback later (about some things I didn't tell you on TS)
Thanks to everyone who played! Here's the replay on my twitch. Didn't bother to highlight each round as everything happened pretty rapidly.
http://www.twitch.tv/gmfbst/c/5064964
This could take a while, and I might EDIT this post if I notice I forgot something, or if one of my teammates wants to add more feedback.
(I'm writing my feedback as I speak, I will update my post later when I'm done)
btw : the games looked more balanced than I thought. RT/control map-wise
- Sephii (commander) told me he had some issues dropping medpacks and ammo packs in some places. I will update this point when he gets back and tells me where he experienced that problem. From what I've noticed, commander dropped packs tend to get stuck on top of the pillar thingies in Automation. The walls/pillars just arround the Tech Point.
- Loading Bay and Lockers (marines natural RTs) seems to be a little too alien friendly. I saw you mentionned that in your replay (about Loading Bay) but I think this is also the case in Lockers. This big locker structure, cuts your lign of sight (that is usually required in marines natural RT rooms). You can easily be killed when building the RT. My suggestion so you can keep a lign of sight on both the lounge and cooling entrances (If you want to keep the layout that way)
After
- At the very start of the game, it's not too hard to take and keep between 4 and 5 RTs for the marines. We saw that was the case during both marines sides. That allows them to focus upgrades pretty easily. Then mid-game when lerks are out and fades about to pop, you may have between 3 to 4 Rts, which still grants a nice res flow. In the meantime, Alien can easily have 3 Rts and keep them. We saw that both teams never got under 3RTs and mostly had 4 during the whole game (except late game). Layout is good, especially the center of the map. You take it, you have a decent map control, wiht PGs. But the map might be too large, especially on each side (left and right). For example, if you compare Mineral to Jambi (they kinda look alike when you think about it), it's must faster to get to Bay Wing than to get to Generators, and it's much faster to get to Organ donation (throught offload) than to get to Storage. I think the Transport room is useless and too large, or useless because too large and too alien friendly. I don't know what you want to do with it, but it might be better to do something more conventionnal with it.
- About the problem with Generators : it's easy to get there when you run through Automation, but not when you have to run all the way through Cooling, Production and Transfer. But since you told me you wanted to rework that side of the map, I'll let you deal with it.
- Onos get stuck in Pump Stations (as you already know).
- Maybe a direct connection from Automation to Storage through West Cross could solve the Transport room problem. I don't know.
- Cooling doesn't feel right. I don't know why, but as you said yesterday, you might want to get rid of it and do something else.
- Funny or weird thing : we almost never got to Pump Control to harrass this RT, on both sides. Storage and Generators yes, but almost never Pump Control. As a consequence, Marines never managed to get to Pump Stations. That might be an issue connectivity-wise.
I'll update when I'll think of smthg else
(hope my english isn't too bad xD I haven't re-read my post)
- about that constant 3 alien RTs thing. It might be related to the size of the map. We also never got the chance to harrass Drill site, Mineral Pro or Pump Control, because it was to far away, even with an Automation PG. When you play on Jambi, aliens have to struggle to keep 3 RTs, Organ Donation, Oxi and Bay Wing (even Waste and Pipeworks) are not that far from the marine start, and you can put a constant pressure on them. Which isn't the case in Mineral
UPDATE : what I got from my teammates :
- vents too OP, like the one connecting Mineral Pro and Transfer
- Loading Bay : ceiling too high, big flight of stairs, easy to ambush for aliens, short lign of sight
I will get back to this after sundays test as well to see what happens there. I have a lot of ideas, but if I were to implement all of them at once it would be a different map so I'll focus on solving things bit by bit.
Thank you so much for the support and feedback, it really means a lot to me!
After the 6vs6 competitive play test held on Thursday I got a lot of great feedback from some of the participants. While watching the games I also came up with a lot of ideas on my own of what to do to make Mineral a more balanced experience for both teams. The games tonight on Mineral also confirmed my observations to some extent, though the teams were pretty uneven. SCC rounds are not part of the analysis below.
Here is the current layout:
The main issues were identified as the following:
- Resource points in the north are too easy to capture and hold for Aliens. The Alien team held at least 3 resource nodes the entire game(both rounds).
- Resource points in the north are too hard for Marines to properly push without getting out of position.
- Marine travel time from Surface to both Alien starting locations(Drill Site/Mineral Processing) and Automation is too long. It doesn’t matter which route is taken.
- Map connectivity in the north favors the Alien team heavily and is something that needs to be dealt with.
- Resource points in the south are too far apart and too hard for marines to defend.
- Lane-blocking in general is too hard for marines to achieve due to the high connectivity in the north.
After having a chat with some of the people that were in the test I was able to come up with some potential solutions to the problems and started working in Photoshop on a cut/edit layout for a sort of long-term plan for Mineral. This plan will make the map a bit smaller, travel times will be shorter, the south RTs will favor Marines a bit more and the north ones will favor Aliens a bit less. Some of the northern connectivity is removed/redone, the south of the map is pretty much completely reorganized and in general the map is a bit clearer to read and understand for anyone. I also think that the new plan doesn’t lock Marines to a certain tactic like the current version somewhat does(phase gates relatively fast). But instead of explaining everything in detail I will show this to you guys visually.
This first layout includes the new plan(everything inside the red lines) and contains the current version layout underneath:
The second layout shows only the plan forward without any mess from the current version under it:
Note that nothing in this layout is exactly as it could/will be in future versions. This is just the vision I have and everything is still subject to change. Resource placements are also nothing final, just a general guideline of where I want them to be. Another thing that is very important to mention is that Loading Bay in this layout mockup seems to be very open and friendly for Marines, that will not be the case. It all depends on how it plays and what kind of feedback I receive in the coming weeks. All in all the time it would take to complete this transition is around one week, if I can work on it every day. But to be more realistic I’m going to say around 2 weeks, because I have other assignments that need my attention as well. The reason for seemingly low transition time is that this operation is mostly about taking complete areas/rooms and moving/rotating them. Anything that needs a rebuild is still just grey-boxed geometry so all of that is fast to do. The next version is also the first version that I will classify as a Beta of Mineral so it will be a huge milestone in itself.
I would very much like to get some input on this from anyone. What could be good, what could be bad? And please give me reason for why something is good or bad, otherwise it’s not really helping.
Also! Thanks to everyone who played today and on Thursday.
--> I did it.
I rewarded you with an awesome
I wanted to give an awesome as well to thank you for your awesome but I don't want to give an awesome to you because there's too many awesome.
I want my awesome
I swear, I'm going to take away yours!
:P
(lets get b2t)
However, my wall of text above boiled down to something very simple. What does people think of the new layout? Anything goes!
Done. Now, I think it's time to go back to the layout subject.
(I didn't want to lose my awesome).
ps : incoming beacon kill video on MasterG
GET OWNED MAN, GO HOME !
(weird aspect ratio, I didn't use the same software to edit it, because the video had no sound with Movie Maker)
Pps : And here is Alien side (my POV) HD should be up soon
I've been working VERY hard the last week. Unfortunately I didn't make it until the SCC test last night. But today I have made the finishing touches for Mineral BETA version 1.01.
Here's the change log(may have forgot somthing):
- Removed norther connection between the pumping stations and fixed the Onos trap pit.
- Removed the ventilation from Pump Stations to Generators.
- Removed the ventilation from Storage to Transport.
- Ventilation from Mineral Processing now goes to the connection between Mineral and Generators, instead of Transfer.
- Renamed Tunnel to Rupture.
- Removed West Cross.
- Fixed some pathing issues in Drill Site.
- Fixed some geometry and models that were obstructing the commander/spectator view. Should be better to drop ammo/medpacks now.(would like feedback on this!)
- Removed southern half and the western hallway of Transport.
- Moved Resource Node from Storage into Transport.
- Moved Resource Node in Generators to the western side of the room.
- Rebuilt the connection between Mineral Processing and Generators, now connects to the eastern part of Generators.
- Removed part of Transfer and moved the room to connect on the south of the eastern part of Generators. Also capped some holes in geometry in Transfer.
- Moved Production to the south of Transfer and made a direct connection between the rooms.
- Moved Lockers, Stasis Chambers and Surface a fair bit north-west to make the routes from Surface to Automation a little shorter for Marines.
- Built new connecting corridor between Lockers and Automation.
- Moved the Lockers Resource Node south to the hallway connecting to Stasis Chambers.
- Moved Lounge to the other side of Lockers(like it used to be in early versions) and connected it with a new small corridor to Production.
- Removed the old Loading Bay and moved Security so that it connects directly to Surface. Put the Resource Node that used to be in Loading bay into Security.
- Removed one entrance to Automation, the one that used to come from Security.
- Built a completely new room for Loading Bay that is larger. It connects directly to Automation(where West Cross entrance was), Pump Control, Transport and Security.
- Run times for Marines from Surface to Transport, Drill Site, Pump Control, Automation, Generators and Mineral Processing have been reduced as a result of any of the above changes.
- And another surprise!
Edit4: Here's the new layout so it's easier to see the changes that were made:
Everything I learned in both the 6vs6 playtest and the SCC test about a week ago have been considered to make this build happen. It was also a lot faster than I expected to make the transition. I was aiming for 2-3 weeks and instead made it happen in about 1 week. Now I need a little break to have some fun(mapping is fun too but not if it's all you do!).
The build is live on steam workshop right now!
Please let me know about any small issues that could need hotfixes and I will look into it as soon as possible!
ENJOY!
(As a side note I have started streaming all the work I do on Mineral. Check it out on my hitbox channel!)
Edit: Not sure if it's only on my end but I'm having issues loading the map via workshop/mod. Something about "failed to load calculateperformance" and such. I've tried publishing and republishing several times but it doesn't help. Every time I published it also seemed like it didn't upload anything. It just said "publishin.." for less than a second before saying "publish successful". Anyone had this issue before?
Edit2: Also checked my workshop folder and all the files there updated to the version that I have updated so I have no idea why it doesn't want to run. It's the same version as I have in my work files and that runs just fine. The map file in the workshop folder isn't broken either, cause I can open it in spark no problem.
Edit3: Fixed it. There was a game_setup.xml file causing the errors with the mod. Worked fine when I deleted that file and published again. The map is running on my "G's Mineral Only" server for anyone that wants to just run around or whatever.
Number of seconds from TP xx to next RT etc.
The new layout is awesome, Generator is a little op for marines, maybe add a ventilation which is going through mineral to the vent between pump and generators, (like a T)
I love the path between lockers and Generator.
I really like the new loading bay and security, same for automation window ^^
The vent which connect Loading Bay and Transport should connect storage instead of Transport.
Pump Control is the new KeyPoint and Alien should defend it no matter what.
You should add a ladder behind container in Loading Bay to let marines escape this trap.
You should add more space to let the alien comm put more cyst near Pump Transition.
The overall is good imo, i'd love to play more often on this map.
Of course, this will require more testing before being accurate.
Negative :
- Vent in Mineral should go all the way to Gen : it is useless as is. Or make a new vent that connects with the already existing vent that comes from Pump Control
- Pump Station corridor that goes before the Pump Control entrance should be larger, so it's not that easy to decyst. Think of X or Oxi on Jambi, you can decyst but if the alien commander wants to he can put like a lot of cysts in there, to avoid agressive pocky decysting.
- Lack of vents
- Vent in Loading Bay should go to Storage : it is useless as is
- Maybe too many human-sized doors, lifeforms shit their pants went going through them. Think of Tram for example, not that many doors.
Positive :
- Good atmosphere
- Good layout
- Nice balance
- Security is a good room (although some people think it's a bit too narrow)
Overall feedback is really good. People love the map.
They said that usually custom maps are huge and very messy, but Mineral has good balance, looks great and feels really smooth to play on.
I'd like to play way more often on this map. And btw, marines can pretty easily adapt to the layout, we had people that knew it, what lanes to cover etc... but it seems less easy to adapt and set priorities as aliens when you don't know Mineral. I'm sure when people will know it better, games will be way more balanced.
I don't have any exact numbers for you, but I can say that the timings are good. Marine naturals from Surface are ca 10-12 seconds. Going from Surface to either Hive start location(Drill Site/Mineral Processing) is about 40 seconds(shortest route).
I think you should check every timing. You'll will find the most interesting TP... you could have a issue there.