I miss being able to build stuff

PlasmaPlasma Join Date: 2003-04-26 Member: 15855Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
<div class="IPBDescription">... as gorge/marine</div>Anyone else feel the same way?

I miss the part of having commander's drop things and building them as a marine, or welding something in front of me to repair it - I feel useless.

Gorge's don't get much use now either' they were fun to use when building but that's no longer the case.

I reckon bring back the building assistance of marines/gorges like NS1 had, in addition to the commander - would remove some of the stressful work too.
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Comments

  • AsranielAsraniel Join Date: 2002-06-03 Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
    i think for the marines it feels ok, because you an still help to build, just not place the initial building.

    But it's true that the gorge more or less lost it's meaning. But i'm not sure how to change that.

    I think it's better that the commander builds the crags and the whipes, but perhaps the gorge could build other stuff than hydras? i don't know, we will see how it evolves trough the different releases :)
  • BitPonBitPon Join Date: 2010-11-20 Member: 75104Members
    I actually find escorting mac's and protecting them while they build far more fun and interesting than building myself.
  • WhiteZeroWhiteZero That Guy Join Date: 2004-06-24 Member: 29511Members, Constellation
    i REALLY miss building stuff as a Gorge... :<
  • kababkabab Join Date: 2003-12-15 Member: 24384Members, Constellation
    I agree the gorge needs to build again it was such a core aspect of the class that peopled loved.
  • SatireSatire Join Date: 2010-11-19 Member: 75016Members
    I really want my welder back... Want to weld some doors and ######. That and burn some Gorges eye out.
  • weepweep Join Date: 2009-08-21 Member: 68556Members
    I agree. That awesome feeling of contributing to the team is now gone as I no longer need to build anything. As a gorge I get bored pretty fast with having only one thing to build. And as a marine I tend to go on solo rambo missions more often.

    I am probably going to get flamed to death for this, but: I wish NS2 would be pretty much exactly as NS1, except with better graphics and minor changes (power nodes, DI)...
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    Marines can already build... Welder would be nice to fix stuff when the comm is to busy to do that...
  • devel666devel666 Join Date: 2010-07-20 Member: 72606Members
    got to admit i feel same in ns1 i loved gowing gorg ond building my way upto the frunt lines now thay seem a little worthyles more of an afterthaught imo
  • echsechs Join Date: 2002-12-27 Member: 11568Members, Constellation
    Marines need welders, being able to weld doors is too great a feature to leave it to the MAC only. :(

    And it's annoying playing as alien, you have to be Gorge, a commander AND run from A to B to build things now, silly.
  • CruorCruor Join Date: 2004-11-07 Member: 32677Members
    Well we can only hope the gorge will get more minor structures for him to build, offensive, defensive and passive boost structures etc.

    As per the marines I think they're pretty solid as is, welder would surely add back some dynamics to the gameplay for those who love to aid commander in all things. So yes bring back the welder as being purchasable in the armory.
  • SewlekSewlek The programmer previously known as Schimmel Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16247Members, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Developer
    some mechanic that requires a gorge / marine somewhere to expand the territory would be nice. for example gorge has to create infestation and marine has to manually activate a powernode
  • QuovatisQuovatis Team Inversion Join Date: 2010-01-26 Member: 70321Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    Gorge is pretty useless now. The heal spray is worthless. It takes a LONG time to heal yourself or a friendly. The heal spray needs a big buff or use far less energy. Gorges used to be NEEDED to build RTs, upgrades, etc, but in NS2, you can easily play a game and not need them at all. Crags are superior to the gorge, and the whips are pretty decent alternatives to the hydra. Why bother with a gorge?
  • w0dk4w0dk4 Join Date: 2008-04-22 Member: 64129Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    Yeah, a gorge that could "build" infestation or something along those lines would be epic.

    Also, welder definately needed, otherwise marines are only there to shoot stuff.. no more suspense when welding something relying on other to cover your back, etc..
  • [R8]DJBourgeoisie[R8]DJBourgeoisie Join Date: 2007-09-05 Member: 62176Members
    I definitely miss building things, gorge felt like a really important piece to the bigger puzzle in NS1 and could change the flow of a map by building mixtures of defense towers with oc's and mc's choking off routes. Right now he feels like an incomplete class (which I know he is) but I guess time will tell if the plan for him will pan out or not with the current design plan.
  • SewlekSewlek The programmer previously known as Schimmel Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16247Members, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Developer
    i could imagine gorges walking around vomiting infestation to build their own personal little "hive" covered by hydras, where he feels warm, safe and loved.
  • peregrinusperegrinus Join Date: 2010-07-16 Member: 72445Members
    I only see people playing gorges to spam hydras and kill servers. They have no other use. :(

    It's better for the alien commanders to place really key objects like whips and crags because they have a tactical overview which gorges on the ground lack.

    So I suggest:

    - bring back gorge's webbing ability. That was so much fun and really adds to the level atmosphere.
    - When Dynamic Infestation is implemented, gorges must have a key role in it somehow...like spreading it or affecting it somehow.
    - Improved healing ability.
    - Hydras: they really need to be fixed so they dont cause so much lag and crashing
    - If Alien commanders oversee the whole map, I can envision gorges being kind of 'junior managers' managing a hive area or a part of the map.
  • yourbonesakinyourbonesakin Join Date: 2005-08-06 Member: 57682Members
    You know, since Marines can build structures slowly, why not Gorges too?

    Gorges could help building structures. Maybe double the innate rate or something. That would make them feel useful and helping the commander. Sounds like something to add and tweak with.

    UWE, add this feature! :D
  • AsranielAsraniel Join Date: 2002-06-03 Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
    i THINK they can healspray a building to get it done faster. But i'm not sure about that.
  • RuntehRunteh Join Date: 2010-06-26 Member: 72163Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Gorge is a fairly useless class now, imo. But when DI comes around and other features are added, it could become a more important role.
  • gimpyboygimpyboy Join Date: 2008-07-29 Member: 64725Members
    edited November 2010
    The cool thing about NS1 => Two extremly different Teams
    In NS2 i miss this special. Both teams have a com and have these "builders"
    Not having a com and having to work as a team was the best in NS1 as aliens!
    Another thing. Rines had to build a TF first. This was the difference to the ocs. Now teams are similar again.

    Can't wait for a NS1 mod for NS2 :)
  • finch07finch07 Join Date: 2008-12-06 Member: 65676Members
    So far, I do miss this. I also miss the larger, slower paced levels.
  • SewlekSewlek The programmer previously known as Schimmel Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16247Members, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Gold, Subnautica Developer
    it would be cool if gorges could also trigger the special abilities of structures
  • WhiteZeroWhiteZero That Guy Join Date: 2004-06-24 Member: 29511Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1809876:date=Nov 24 2010, 12:10 PM:name=gimpyboy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gimpyboy @ Nov 24 2010, 12:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1809876"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Can't wait for a NS1 mod for NS2 :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Brilliant!
  • SolitarioSolitario Join Date: 2006-10-29 Member: 58097Members
    I think gorge needs more buildings, which the alien commander can't build!
    maybe resource tower as well. otherwise, like you guys say, he's really useless
  • PoNeHPoNeH Join Date: 2006-12-01 Member: 58801Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester
    <!--quoteo(post=1809888:date=Nov 24 2010, 07:38 PM:name=Solitario)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Solitario @ Nov 24 2010, 07:38 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1809888"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think gorge needs more buildings, which the alien commander can't build!
    maybe resource tower as well. otherwise, like you guys say, he's really useless<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Nah man, there's already too many as it is. It's going to get too confusing. Simple is better if done right.

    Gorge just needs more importance, which was taken away from him with this new alien commander BS.
  • yourbonesakinyourbonesakin Join Date: 2005-08-06 Member: 57682Members
    Mm, it's more like the Gorge was left over when the builder role was expanded. The alien builder is still there. It's bigger, faster, more important and more fun than a single Gorge ever was in NS1.

    It's just that the Gorge is left behind. Which is sad. So I'll wait for some cool updates to give Gorge more importance (as you said PoNeH).
  • weepweep Join Date: 2009-08-21 Member: 68556Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1809876:date=Nov 24 2010, 08:10 PM:name=gimpyboy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gimpyboy @ Nov 24 2010, 08:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1809876"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Can't wait for a NS1 mod for NS2 :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    LOL, that would be a big FU to the devs haha.
  • weepweep Join Date: 2009-08-21 Member: 68556Members
    edited November 2010
    NS is a very unique game. The distinct difference between the two races and the ammount of teamplay required for a successfull win made me love NS1. As a marine commander your faith is in the hands of other players. No matter how good you are, if your teammates refuse to build your building, you as a commander, are screwed. For the marines, without a good and helpfull commander you will be nothing more than alien food. Teamwork is a must.

    For Kharaa on the other hand it was a bit different. Even though teamwork is good, you could still manage with less of it. Even without that super tight teamwork that is needed for marine, you could still take your own initiatives and build whatever was needed without having to wait for someone else. Gorges were essential and often in the beginning of a round, people would debate between one and other who should go on res hunt and who will save for a hive. It was fun to be a gorge, not only did you feel usefull to your team but you could also go on solo missions where you could create yourself a little nest and raise hell on your own.

    I feel that a lot of this is missing in NS2. Commanders can now pretty much work on their own. As a marine I no longer have to prove myself to the commander that I am worthy of that first HMG with HA or JP. So what if I drop it time after time, I can just get a new one at the armory! As a gorge, well I am pretty much completely useless.

    I am not a big fan of alien commander, but its here to stay. In my opinion following should be done:
    <ul><li>All building placed by commanders can be built by marines/gorges and MAC/drifters. <b>However MAC and drifters should only be at full capacity near base</b>. Once they go outside, make their building abillity drop to like 25%.</li><li>Gorges can build minor offence/defence structures without the involvement of the commander.</li><li>Welders to marines should be an option.</li></ul>
  • PsiWarpPsiWarp Gifted Gorge Richmond, B.C., Canada Join Date: 2010-08-28 Member: 73810Members
    On the bright side, Gorge can still help grow structures faster with +use, just lacking the proper animation (tongue lick?).

    But I agree, either give him more stuff to barf, or make him affect DI in a way.
  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    I actually find the gorge to be a little op in the early game. Within a minute, you can rush the marine natural expansion (or main base) and drop 5-10 hydras before you die. It usually slows or even prevents marines from capturing a 2nd tech node, which means no gl and ft, and a gg for you.
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