Joining The Military Upon Completion Of School.
Depot
The ModFather Join Date: 2002-11-09 Member: 7956Members
The ModFather Join Date: 2002-11-09 Member: 7956Members
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<div class="IPBDescription">Should this be mandatory, or not?</div> Having served a 3 year hitch with the U.S. Army following the completion of high school, I was recently forced to reflect on how this affected the rest of my adult life. In doing so I determined it was probably the most influential and character-forming time in my life, short of the fine job my parents did in raising me. It has forced me to wake up when the alarm goes off <i>early</i>, to appreciate a <i>hot</i> home-cooked meal, to be orderly, organised, and disciplined, and to respect authority, just to name a few things. It made a young man out of me.
I contend that it should be mandatory for all graduates of high school (or the equivalent thereof) to do a 2 year hitch in the armed forces of their choice, minimum age 18. That's my oppinion, we welcome yours.
I contend that it should be mandatory for all graduates of high school (or the equivalent thereof) to do a 2 year hitch in the armed forces of their choice, minimum age 18. That's my oppinion, we welcome yours.
Comments
That said, if I actually joined the army, I might enjoy it. But I definately want the choice .
You are being presumptuous. How do you know I wasn't drafted?
And I know there must be others who think like me. I hate not being in control of what happens to me.
I must say I would prefer to choose to join the military, albiet it still strongly descrimnates against women joining since it is a "mans" job to fight.
If you were drafted I do feel sorry for, even if it had positive influence on you when you were younger. 68-73 were not very fun years for the vietnam war and especially its vetrans after they returned home, considering many considered them bad for being somewhere most american's didnt' want them to be.
*Ninja edit* Simply being forced into something is the one thing this country was founded against. That is why it would be a horrible thing to force people (men and women) to join right after high school.
Don't think I wouldn't join a branch of the military if there was something worth fighting for. But most people simply wouldn't accept going straight into the military right after school.
Unless, of course, people learn to appreciate things and have some work ethic before they get out of high school. A stint in the military would then just be 2 wasted years for those people. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I'm glad you derived something positive from the experience.
South Africa used to have mandatory military service until around '92 or so. Pretty much all my friends described it as "a wasted 2 years". My age was such that by time I became eligible it was a volunteer based service and I had no interest in going.
I think different people will be affected in varying ways by service and not always positively. I remember an incident where a black soldier killed several white soldiers on base after essentially "snapping" under all the pressures. Theres a case here in the states of a 19 year old that was essentially left to drown in a pool during basic training I believe.
My opinion is that there is a fine line between inculcating discipline and outright abuse for the sake of enjoyment. There are sadly people in this world that "get off" on having power over others.
Why should I put myself at the mercy of potentially unethical superiors and lose 2 years that I could put towards a great tertiary education? If parents do a decent job there is no need for military style shaping of a young person IMO.
I am glad there are people that volunteer as sadly we do need an army for protection. I would think that volunteers would make for better battle comrades as they would be more willing to risk life and limb for country and their fellow soldiers i.e. they would make better soldiers in general.
If we were at peace this idea might be plausible because I believe as you seem to that time in the military can make people better more productive citizens.
But in this time of war this would be nothing but a draft and everybody would end up in the Army or Marines. Sorry guys the Navy and Air Force aren't hiring, in fact they just laid a bunch of people off.
Also the entire way we view education would have to change seeing as you would no longer go straight to college after high school. Which may or may not be a bad thing. We all know how high school pushes college as the only option...heh you want to see a room full of open jaws tell some adults who ask you that you aren’t planning on going to college. There are many other options out there and this program would help people get a taste of a career that they might never have considered.
It would also help take some pressure off of students who want to get into a good 4 year college because I can only see this program driving down the competition.
Any prospective student would also be much more mature and disciplined after a stint in the military which would help with any number of things.
I would assume that you would be paid in full during your 2 year stay?
Obviously having a 2 year salary saved up would help anyone after high school.
I could see the program succeeding well if it were a time of peace, it could even, in time, be seen as the next natural step after high school; just another part of our educational system.
Of course this is all in a fanciful world where everyone is nice to us and we don't have to go to war.
Interesting choice of topic Depot.
I must say I would prefer to choose to join the military, albiet it still strongly descrimnates against women joining since it is a "mans" job to fight.
If you were drafted I do feel sorry for, even if it had positive influence on you when you were younger. 68-73 were not very fun years for the vietnam war and especially its vetrans after they returned home, considering many considered them bad for being somewhere most american's didnt' want them to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Indeed the military (and the workplace) still discriminate against women. Great strides have been made though. Under heavy threat of getting drafted, I enlisted to prevent having to go to Viet Nam, so however you look at it I was forced. As it wound up I spent 30 months in Korea as a missile/launcher technician. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Sky Posted: Feb 20 2005, 01:01 PM
QUOTE (Depot @ Feb 20 2005, 11:32 AM)
I understand fully. I simply feel the benefits from it far outweigh any cons.
Unless, of course, people learn to appreciate things and have some work ethic before they get out of high school. A stint in the military would then just be 2 wasted years for those people.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I had a deep appreciation for most of what live threw at me, and had a very good work ethic when I joined. It <b>STILL</b> did a lot for me.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->FilthyLarry Posted: Feb 20 2005, 01:04 PM
QUOTE (Depot @ Feb 20 2005, 11:32 AM)
I understand fully. I simply feel the benefits from it far outweigh any cons.
I'm glad you derived something positive from the experience.
South Africa used to have mandatory military service until around '92 or so. Pretty much all my friends described it as "a wasted 2 years". My age was such that by time I became eligible it was a volunteer based service and I had no interest in going.
I think different people will be affected in varying ways by service and not always positively. I remember an incident where a black soldier killed several white soldiers on base after essentially "snapping" under all the pressures. Theres a case here in the states of a 19 year old that was essentially left to drown in a pool during basic training I believe.
My opinion is that there is a fine line between inculcating discipline and outright abuse for the sake of enjoyment. There are sadly people in this world that "get off" on having power over others.
Why should I put myself at the mercy of potentially unethical superiors and lose 2 years that I could put towards a great tertiary education? If parents do a decent job there is no need for military style shaping of a young person IMO.
I am glad there are people that volunteer as sadly we do need an army for protection. I would think that volunteers would make for better battle comrades as they would be more willing to risk life and limb for country and their fellow soldiers i.e. they would make better soldiers in general. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree the military and particularly basic training affects different people in different ways. I recall seeing a 90lb boy harassed to the point of an attempted suicide by a drill sergeant. Of course that was 35 years ago, long before trainees had any "civil rights". The abuse nowadays is almost non-existent compared to what it was in my days of service.
I agree if one's parental units have done an exceptional job of raising them the military may not benefit them much ... but mine did a fine job on me and as stated, the Army mad a young man out of me.
Yeah Spacer, that'd be real cool - an Army full of FLUNKIES! <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Whan I get on my bike and ride into work, doing 40 down Caister Road (which is a 30 zone) I know the risk that I am taking in breaking the speed limit. I also know what risk I am taking by riding in adverse weather conditions, and I can appreciate the risks, as I have come off of my bike at 35mph, so I know what the consequences are (2 weeks with sore knees, and a need for a new jacket...)
Someone joining the forces would need to be able to know and appreciate the risks. I don't think most people do, which is why it would end up culling just as many people as the Iraqis do...
Unless they've changed things in the U.S. Armed Forces you are entitled to educational benefits after you complete your hitch - it's covered under the GI Bill of Rights I believe.
I can fully understand anyone having reservations about this in a time of war - that's why I enlisted as opposed to getting drafted. But for as long as I can remember there's been one conflict or another going on, so is there EVER a good time to join? Probably not ...
Funny, I just don't remember this as being significant in the scheme of all that I DID learn. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Funny, I just don't remember this as being significant in the scheme of all that I DID learn. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
So all you do is get up early and work? That's what jobs are for.
Funny, I just don't remember this as being significant in the scheme of all that I DID learn. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So all you do is get up early and work? That's what jobs are for. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
A job won't hold a candle to what you'll learn serving a hitch in the army. Perhaps you need to re-read the thread?
Yeah Spacer, that'd be real cool - an Army full of FLUNKIES! <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I thought the idea was to send them to the military in order to shape up. at least that's what you implied.
When Bush drafts me to go shoot iranians (iranians who have never done anything to me) im either going to canada or just sitting my **** down on the ground. they can drag me around, drag me to boot camp, but they wont get a single pushup, and they will NOT get me on a plane.
Funny, I just don't remember this as being significant in the scheme of all that I DID learn. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Um....2 years in the military, and you never learned how to, say, fire a gun? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
geeze spacer... I wonder if the people who flunk highschool turn into the kind of people that rape innocent women and commit horrible war crimes.... probly not tho
and even setting that aside. I'm sure I want people who can't pass basic algebra to be launching complex ballistic missles...
hmm, the man brings up a good point
Manditory, No.
Neither will Mr T. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Funny, I just don't remember this as being significant in the scheme of all that I DID learn. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Um....2 years in the military, and you never learned how to, say, fire a gun? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not the point, DUH. I learned a lot more from the experience than how to kill people at war. Re-read the thread, geeeeeeeeeeeze...
and even setting that aside. I'm sure I want people who can't pass basic algebra to be launching complex ballistic missles... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
True. Would make good cannon fodder though. Or at least LEARN SOME RESPECT FOR THE MOTHERLAND as Depot is suggesting.
Funny, I just don't remember this as being significant in the scheme of all that I DID learn. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Um....2 years in the military, and you never learned how to, say, fire a gun? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not the point, DUH. I learned a lot more from the experience than how to kill people at war. Re-read the thread, geeeeeeeeeeeze... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Dude, you're in the bloody army. Your job description is to use force to protect the country. How you could say that learning to fight wasn't even a significant part of your time there makes me think our country'd be in trouble if we ever went to war on the ground.
Oh wait.... <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo-->