=== ignoring the last 2 pages (except the tram: <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo--> )
ideas to improve ms: - all spawnpoints are set upon the greater lift - the lift starts halfway between ceiling and floor, droping slowly with an hydraulic sound or something - after passing the (thought) center between start and end of movement, the top ceiling door (which is currently just a black hole like the ceiling of ther hive in eclipse command was, if i rememeber both right) closes - until its closed (from round start), it shows something like the interior of a dropship or anything else. { ok, this would just explode the limits, but this are ideas, that i'd like to see at least tested <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> } - the small lift, which is now unfunctional, is turned for 90? and goes further into the wall, creating a cut-out effect of the higher area - maybe could be able to move up and down, but when it moves down again, it breaks and any stuff on it drops into a bottomless pit (joking about that, that would be insane) - anyway: it just looks "incorrect". If i would design a spaceship, this wouldn't be an option. you can't move cargo up the ramp when the lift is down (yes, down - because it is <i>now</i>, as posted in the screenie, in upper position!).
walkway to short issue: -could bend it left and right (which would be boring) -return of the rotating door, BUT! it isn't a complete carboncopy of that deathtrap, it's a redone version, instead. it should be open so its like an airlock or something (to seal an area, not for "space walks" in suits), and after reaching open state, it breaks and can't be closed again. -ladders? but that would look silly...
refinery: it's still to large... sitting uppon the melter in that 2 black holes as lerk, sporing unbuild-hive-camping marines, get's you pistol sniped or grenade-pumped suggestions~ more broken look, like broken pipes or something hanging from the roof, loose cables, under-the-wall mats (for heat/cold/noise dampening), etc (i hope you get the point).
-----
what's about that door, leading to dres? how large, speed of opening (in relativation to "old" versions), everything which is avaible in stats
*wanted to ask about replacements for the rotators and the bbomb vent, but after re-investigating the very first screens, i guess: they are replace-less deleted - good*
------> about that stuck bug: i got it once, it's freakin annoying to hang in the air, and just be able to kill yourself - i thought it's an enginebug, because several different slopes are meeting each other at this point (i glided into that hole where the lines hit)
Was just running around the latest remake version I've managed to get my hands on, and I noticed one thing I've been meaning to mention forever. Databank access. Without the RT there it's pretty much an odd little pointless room that for no remaining reason can be shot into from a crack too small to admit a skulk through. It might be nice, eventually, to see that mini-room prettied up a bit so that it looks like it serves some function, and maybe to have that crack either removed or widened enough to allow skulks to use it to get behind marines who are shooting the hive from the far end.
Great changes on the layout. I think that even if it turns out that it needs rebalancing in the future, changes will be easier with engine hive up there. Theres more room for change, if you get my saying.
Someone posted a couple pages back that the rotating door added to the "interactivity" of the map. I think that's a point that is more important than the "rotating" part of the door. Interactivity is really beginning to lack in NS maps in general (I know, it adds lag...) so I'm wondering if more functional doors are possible? Using trigger_presence's, and fast speeds, they can be setup to hardly hinder (at least in offline testing I've found) but they don't slow everyone down, and they make good bullet blockers for running skulks!
Another suggestion for the "rotating door lovers"... why not just make one of them functional again? Sure they don't lead anywhere, but people like me could just go spinning around in it for hours of non-stop fun! (Set-up like 1.04 with it's jittery, non-killingness.)
I'm kind of serious here. The biggest problem IMO with that door, is that it was a major, high-traffic route. I love a good choke point, and love not knowing what's on the other side of a door, but it's placement before was just tooo important, and I think that had a lot of reason to do with why people hated the door. (Maybe have it lead to the big shaft thingy that used to have the electrical spikes back in 1.04? You know the route that leads to top of refinery?) An idea anyway. (Might get you less hate mail.) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
As for the steps in Marine spawn, how about making steps func_walls? Wouldn't change r_speeds and it's one extra entity.
And for the feedwater lighting, I have a suggestion there. I'm not sure if it's the screen shot, but it just looks to me like it's a darker version of the old lighting. My gripe with it is there is just too much green. The res node over on the right contrasts well with it's yellow-white colored lighting, so maybe it would be possible to put another light like that somewhere central in the hive? It would break up all that green and I think would look quite sharp.
Anyway, good job, keep up the good work! And don't let the naysayers get you guys down, keep in mind that there are some people who think atmosphere is greater than gameplay, and that's not going to change. (I think having a ns_bast_classic as a custom map is the only way to beat them.) It's a tough, cruel balance, but that's life.
Mend, just ignore the... ahem... *ssh*les plz... I'm a fellow mapper and know how frustrating it can be to alter something existing while still making it fit with where it is... I do wish we still had the airlock... funny as HELL to scare gorges as the commander by clicking on it repeatedly XD I killed a few good onos that way <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
lol, did no one read my earlier posts. Got overlooked in the flame war I guess. I like what you have done with the tram entrance. It's as good or better than my solution. But I'm surprised the onos can fit through now because the base of the door is still the same narrow width?
The other thing I suggested earlier was that you could still keep the rotating door as an alternative 3rd entrance to MS. You wouldn't have to actually <i>use</i> it while playing, but at least it would keep a significant percentage of players happy <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> .
<!--QuoteBegin-venomus+Jul 1 2004, 04:14 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (venomus @ Jul 1 2004, 04:14 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> lol, did no one read my earlier posts. Got overlooked in the flame war I guess. I like what you have done with the tram entrance. It's as good or better than my solution. But I'm surprised the onos can fit through now because the base of the door is still the same narrow width?
The other thing I suggested earlier was that you could still keep the rotating door as an alternative 3rd entrance to MS. You wouldn't have to actually <i>use</i> it while playing, but at least it would keep a significant percentage of players happy <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> . <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It's 4 units wider than the top part, that's why the onos can go through it <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
The revolving door used a lot of push entities to avoid the players from being instafragged by the door, and even with that, it still killed the players. I don't think it'll be back soon... sorry :S
I see now about the tram door being wider at the bottom, cleverly done.
Just as a matter of interest, what were these entities besides the door and the buttons? I never even realised there was an 'anti-gib system' in there.
You could at least have the corridor leading to the door, but the door would not actually be usable, like it has become jammed or something. Kind of pointless from a gameplay perspective, but it would just help to tie-in better with the old Bast (and thus endear your efforts more to the skeptical among us). <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-Mendasp+Jul 1 2004, 09:37 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mendasp @ Jul 1 2004, 09:37 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> 8 func_push, try to get close to the walls <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I always wondered. Honestly, I thought it was just down to me lagging around or the dodgy rotational behaviour <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->.
I think I'm going to miss that door even more now. Every map need a bouncy castle of gibbing death! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It's not entirely gone *hint* *hint* <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I think I'm going to miss that door even more now. Every map need a bouncy castle of gibbing death! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> It's not entirely gone *hint* *hint* <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> <spoil> Yes, the new ready room secret actually is a bouncy castle with spike pits all around it and circus music playing in the background ^_^ </spoil>
Is it possible to maybe move double res into the center of the map (Main Aftish), That way aliens won't be scrooed if they start with engine or ref. I'm thinking move ONE of the 2 res from that the old double res and add it to a middle part of the map like main aft. Then you could move that remaing res at Auxiliary (old double res place) from below the cat walk to the platform with the light from the ceiling shining on it. That way, feed won't be THE focus of the map and people will explore more of the other places.
I also think you should add some cover at tram because it really is a deathtrap for an Onos. Also the Onos will be needed at times because you CAN siege feed from tram.
Main Aft has virtually two nodes already (one in Main Aft itself, and the other one on the bottom) and it's practically the center of the map, moving another res there would make it even better, and that's not really a good thing...
Anyways, here is the finalized tram train, I also added a vent that goes from Feedwater to Tram Tunnel...
hey, what's about feed itself? is it still possible to siege from above the rt? its a damn bunkerhole >_>
can only be taken out by a xenociding skulk or a sporing lerk... (last time i played bast a marine managed somehow to get up there without jp - bug? O_o)
<!--QuoteBegin-Alienplayer09061983+Jul 3 2004, 11:05 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Alienplayer09061983 @ Jul 3 2004, 11:05 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> (last time i played bast a marine managed somehow to get up there without jp - bug? O_o) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> There's a passage that goes up to that room above the hive from the hive room itself now. And if the marines managed to build a full fledged siege base up there without anyone noticing, something is quite wrong. Drop an OC up there if it worries you.
they relocated to the airlock after the door to engine ~ they kept us busy with engine hive and random assaults, and some ninjas sneaked around... well,... *starting up steam and looking for that passage*
NolSinklerOn the ClorfJoin Date: 2004-02-15Member: 26560Members, Constellation
Great job Mendasp <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> I love bast and nothing could possibly ruin it.
Great job with the tram, I always hated walking through as Onos...
I LOVE BAST!!!! <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Well, Bast has always had a love-hate relationship for me.
It's quite harsh for low-spec pc's such as the pentium3 I had until recently, It's quite disturbing to find out the layout is utterly unbalanced, It's quite frustrating to have such a horrific marine start as your base,
But..
It's quite fun sometimes to play the #1 athmospheric map in NS, It's quite fun to play a different map from all the Veils, Eclipses, and Taniths sometime, It's quite fascinating to see how Bast, despite its flaws, creates the holy "good games" of forgotten days.
I would predict this beta5 remake will take out some Hate parts, as well as a few Love parts. Whether or not this comes true, and if the balancing of love/hate is a good thing, I'll see once beta5 comes out.
What some of the flamers in this topic fail to realize, though, is that without this remake team, we wouldnt be playing a 3.0 Bast at all, as far as I know.
So for that, thank you, remake team, thank you all!
Except MrBen, he sucks <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I mean... thanks <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I thought this version was final (as I said, I was going to send it to Flayra...), but I've been doing some changes, I know that the beta 5 bast is not going to be perfectly balanced, but it will be an improvement over the original (I hope). I'll post new pics and a new overview (and I'll probably post a changelog) when I have the final version ready.
I know about the problems with Ref, but I don't think I'll make any changes until beta 6 or so... <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo--> It's a room hard to "fix". I'll probably get totally rid of the -gamma .7 on the compile, but that's going to take a while since I'll have to redo all the lighting, that's why I don't want to do it now...
And please, to the people that think I just want to delete memorable areas, I still respect Relic's work on this map and treat it like <b>his</b> map <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> but those two things were breaking the balance.
Oh, and sorry for the harsh replies on the other pages of this thread.
Looks like Mendasp has been to the doctors and got some happy pills. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-CheesyPeteza+Jul 5 2004, 12:06 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CheesyPeteza @ Jul 5 2004, 12:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Looks like Mendasp has been to the doctors and got some happy pills. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> In truth, he was bitten by a leprechaun.
bast was the first map I ever played in ns. I could say something like "dont fix what isnt broken." or "ok, one more map to avoid in servercycle."
seriously, ns_bast was first candidate for changes in my eyes. but this changes are little bit too much.
- removed the elevator at ms: great, I asked myself many times why the hell this "gameplay" stopper hadnt been dropped since 2.0 - removed the rotating door: its up to someones taste but the path had to be the same, not changing the complete route - moved engine hive: this idea isnt bad but obviously you never thought about the double res. engine room now is TOO far away to take advantage of this area, so only feedwater as starthive wins the price. - additional entrance to engine: bonus for this hive - rebuild the tram in tramtunnel: great job, it even looks cooler now, should have been changed since the onos hull changed... - you DONT changed the refinery hive: this is not too nice, one of the main disadvantages for aliens on this map, no chance in endgame with only one hive...
Comments
ideas to improve ms:
- all spawnpoints are set upon the greater lift
- the lift starts halfway between ceiling and floor, droping slowly with an hydraulic sound or something
- after passing the (thought) center between start and end of movement, the top ceiling door (which is currently just a black hole like the ceiling of ther hive in eclipse command was, if i rememeber both right) closes - until its closed (from round start), it shows something like the interior of a dropship or anything else.
{ ok, this would just explode the limits, but this are ideas, that i'd like to see at least tested <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> }
- the small lift, which is now unfunctional, is turned for 90? and goes further into the wall, creating a cut-out effect of the higher area - maybe could be able to move up and down, but when it moves down again, it breaks and any stuff on it drops into a bottomless pit (joking about that, that would be insane) - anyway: it just looks "incorrect". If i would design a spaceship, this wouldn't be an option. you can't move cargo up the ramp when the lift is down (yes, down - because it is <i>now</i>, as posted in the screenie, in upper position!).
walkway to short issue:
-could bend it left and right (which would be boring)
-return of the rotating door, BUT! it isn't a complete carboncopy of that deathtrap, it's a redone version, instead. it should be open so its like an airlock or something (to seal an area, not for "space walks" in suits), and after reaching open state, it breaks and can't be closed again.
-ladders? but that would look silly...
refinery:
it's still to large... sitting uppon the melter in that 2 black holes as lerk, sporing unbuild-hive-camping marines, get's you pistol sniped or grenade-pumped
suggestions~
more broken look, like broken pipes or something hanging from the roof, loose cables, under-the-wall mats (for heat/cold/noise dampening), etc (i hope you get the point).
-----
what's about that door, leading to dres? how large, speed of opening (in relativation to "old" versions), everything which is avaible in stats
*wanted to ask about replacements for the rotators and the bbomb vent, but after re-investigating the very first screens, i guess: they are replace-less deleted - good*
------> about that stuck bug: i got it once, it's freakin annoying to hang in the air, and just be able to kill yourself - i thought it's an enginebug, because several different slopes are meeting each other at this point (i glided into that hole where the lines hit)
awsome to see it woud be
Someone posted a couple pages back that the rotating door added to the "interactivity" of the map. I think that's a point that is more important than the "rotating" part of the door. Interactivity is really beginning to lack in NS maps in general (I know, it adds lag...) so I'm wondering if more functional doors are possible? Using trigger_presence's, and fast speeds, they can be setup to hardly hinder (at least in offline testing I've found) but they don't slow everyone down, and they make good bullet blockers for running skulks!
Another suggestion for the "rotating door lovers"... why not just make one of them functional again? Sure they don't lead anywhere, but people like me could just go spinning around in it for hours of non-stop fun! (Set-up like 1.04 with it's jittery, non-killingness.)
I'm kind of serious here. The biggest problem IMO with that door, is that it was a major, high-traffic route. I love a good choke point, and love not knowing what's on the other side of a door, but it's placement before was just tooo important, and I think that had a lot of reason to do with why people hated the door. (Maybe have it lead to the big shaft thingy that used to have the electrical spikes back in 1.04? You know the route that leads to top of refinery?) An idea anyway. (Might get you less hate mail.) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
As for the steps in Marine spawn, how about making steps func_walls? Wouldn't change r_speeds and it's one extra entity.
And for the feedwater lighting, I have a suggestion there. I'm not sure if it's the screen shot, but it just looks to me like it's a darker version of the old lighting. My gripe with it is there is just too much green. The res node over on the right contrasts well with it's yellow-white colored lighting, so maybe it would be possible to put another light like that somewhere central in the hive? It would break up all that green and I think would look quite sharp.
Anyway, good job, keep up the good work! And don't let the naysayers get you guys down, keep in mind that there are some people who think atmosphere is greater than gameplay, and that's not going to change. (I think having a ns_bast_classic as a custom map is the only way to beat them.) It's a tough, cruel balance, but that's life.
GJ DUDE!
I like what you have done with the tram entrance. It's as good or better than my solution. But I'm surprised the onos can fit through now because the base of the door is still the same narrow width?
The other thing I suggested earlier was that you could still keep the rotating door as an alternative 3rd entrance to MS. You wouldn't have to actually <i>use</i> it while playing, but at least it would keep a significant percentage of players happy <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> .
I like what you have done with the tram entrance. It's as good or better than my solution. But I'm surprised the onos can fit through now because the base of the door is still the same narrow width?
The other thing I suggested earlier was that you could still keep the rotating door as an alternative 3rd entrance to MS. You wouldn't have to actually <i>use</i> it while playing, but at least it would keep a significant percentage of players happy <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> . <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's 4 units wider than the top part, that's why the onos can go through it <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
The revolving door used a lot of push entities to avoid the players from being instafragged by the door, and even with that, it still killed the players. I don't think it'll be back soon... sorry :S
Just as a matter of interest, what were these entities besides the door and the buttons? I never even realised there was an 'anti-gib system' in there.
You could at least have the corridor leading to the door, but the door would not actually be usable, like it has become jammed or something. Kind of pointless from a gameplay perspective, but it would just help to tie-in better with the old Bast (and thus endear your efforts more to the skeptical among us). <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I think I'm going to miss that door even more now. Every map need a bouncy castle of gibbing death!
I always wondered. Honestly, I thought it was just down to me lagging around or the dodgy rotational behaviour <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->.
I think I'm going to miss that door even more now. Every map need a bouncy castle of gibbing death! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's not entirely gone *hint* *hint* <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I think I'm going to miss that door even more now. Every map need a bouncy castle of gibbing death! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's not entirely gone *hint* *hint* <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
<spoil>
Yes, the new ready room secret actually is a bouncy castle with spike pits all around it and circus music playing in the background ^_^
</spoil>
u'd have to pass through)
but then again it would mean more work for ono to get through so meh
I also think you should add some cover at tram because it really is a deathtrap for an Onos. Also the Onos will be needed at times because you CAN siege feed from tram.
Anyways, here is the finalized tram train, I also added a vent that goes from Feedwater to Tram Tunnel...
can only be taken out by a xenociding skulk or a sporing lerk...
(last time i played bast a marine managed somehow to get up there without jp - bug? O_o)
There's a passage that goes up to that room above the hive from the hive room itself now. And if the marines managed to build a full fledged siege base up there without anyone noticing, something is quite wrong. Drop an OC up there if it worries you.
well,... *starting up steam and looking for that passage*
Shame we have to have people like "gigabite" on this forum, it can really put you off your work, but keep it up !
OMG NEW ICON <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Great job with the tram, I always hated walking through as Onos...
I LOVE BAST!!!!
<!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo-->
It's quite harsh for low-spec pc's such as the pentium3 I had until recently,
It's quite disturbing to find out the layout is utterly unbalanced,
It's quite frustrating to have such a horrific marine start as your base,
But..
It's quite fun sometimes to play the #1 athmospheric map in NS,
It's quite fun to play a different map from all the Veils, Eclipses, and Taniths sometime,
It's quite fascinating to see how Bast, despite its flaws, creates the holy "good games"
of forgotten days.
I would predict this beta5 remake will take out some Hate parts, as well as a few Love parts. Whether or not this comes true, and if the balancing of love/hate is a good thing, I'll see once beta5 comes out.
What some of the flamers in this topic fail to realize, though, is that without this remake team, we wouldnt be playing a 3.0 Bast at all, as far as I know.
So for that, thank you, remake team, thank you all!
Except MrBen, he sucks <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I mean... thanks <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I thought this version was final (as I said, I was going to send it to Flayra...), but I've been doing some changes, I know that the beta 5 bast is not going to be perfectly balanced, but it will be an improvement over the original (I hope). I'll post new pics and a new overview (and I'll probably post a changelog) when I have the final version ready.
I know about the problems with Ref, but I don't think I'll make any changes until beta 6 or so... <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo--> It's a room hard to "fix". I'll probably get totally rid of the -gamma .7 on the compile, but that's going to take a while since I'll have to redo all the lighting, that's why I don't want to do it now...
And please, to the people that think I just want to delete memorable areas, I still respect Relic's work on this map and treat it like <b>his</b> map <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> but those two things were breaking the balance.
Oh, and sorry for the harsh replies on the other pages of this thread.
In truth, he was bitten by a leprechaun.
bast was the first map I ever played in ns.
I could say something like "dont fix what isnt broken." or "ok, one more map to avoid in servercycle."
seriously, ns_bast was first candidate for changes in my eyes. but this changes are little bit too much.
- removed the elevator at ms: great, I asked myself many times why the hell this "gameplay" stopper hadnt been dropped since 2.0
- removed the rotating door: its up to someones taste but the path had to be the same, not changing the complete route
- moved engine hive: this idea isnt bad but obviously you never thought about the double res. engine room now is TOO far away to take advantage of this area, so only feedwater as starthive wins the price.
- additional entrance to engine: bonus for this hive
- rebuild the tram in tramtunnel: great job, it even looks cooler now, should have been changed since the onos hull changed...
- you DONT changed the refinery hive: this is not too nice, one of the main disadvantages for aliens on this map, no chance in endgame with only one hive...
only playing the map will show us the real fun.