Congress Moves To Criminalize P2p

2

Comments

  • ThansalThansal The New Scum Join Date: 2002-08-22 Member: 1215Members, Constellation
    mathblaster did rock hard.

    As for the topic?

    Well, technicaly p2p is mostly illegal (the legal uses are there, they just are a very SMALL percent of the total content).

    I am curious as to any one who can come up with a way to keep p2p viable to legal uses, and yet stop the illegal ones.

    I dono, It just seems kinda silly to watch a bunch of people gripe about how the gov't is taking steps to stamp out something that is honestly illegal (and anyone who argues that all media should be free need to go look at economics again).

    oh well...


    Oh, and I would be sad if I could nolonger download all of my pirated music and videos, however.... I don't see any reason to get all pissy at the gov't for trying to shut down piracy. (RIAA is diferent, they just suck and have a strong tendancy to do stupid things, like arresting the granny who downloads her grandson's music <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->)
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  • Cold_NiTeCold_NiTe Join Date: 2003-09-15 Member: 20875Members
    edited March 2004
    No Thansal, most of the <i>American</i> people here are angry because they don't feel represented... That's pretty different from what you think we are thinking.
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  • dr_ddr_d Join Date: 2003-03-28 Member: 14979Members
    edited March 2004
    <!--QuoteBegin-ElectricSheep+Mar 29 2004, 05:43 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (ElectricSheep @ Mar 29 2004, 05:43 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-dr.d+Mar 29 2004, 02:47 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (dr.d @ Mar 29 2004, 02:47 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Well as soon as Bush gets his "Broadban Plan" passed you can expect a solid and real internet tax, don't have any doubts about it.

    This is the kind of crap that is ruining our economy, they put taxes on stuff to avoid loss but at the same time smother the market.  What's going to happen to internet sales when they put mandatory sales tax on items you purchase?

    Bunch of old farts that know nothing about the internet making our laws, ugh!

    They need to survey congress and if less than 70% of them use the internet at home on a regular basis take this matter out of their hands.  Really I think an independent commity needs to handle e-commerce. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Did you read the article? The proposal was by a republican and a democrat. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Bush's "Broadban Plan" is a seprate topic from p2p criminalization, but its all because of the same lack of knowledge from lawmakers.

    Bush is making a national Broadban backbone and is pushing to have broadban in everyhome, this sounds good in theory but since it will be a fedearlly funded project that means one thing, taxes. I for one am not looking forward to paying tax on my internet use.
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  • QuaunautQuaunaut The longest seven days in history... Join Date: 2003-03-21 Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    This is BS. First off, All P2P? Comon. That means banning progs like Skype, and basically halting almost all internet transfers but FTP.

    I doubt this'll get passed at all. It'll probably be just like that law to increase driving age to 18- only 1 vote for it, and that would be by the one who introduced it.

    Also- Bush's broadband tax won't happen. Think about it- more people are on broadband than dialup right now(not much more, but in fact more). If it gets passed, people'll just do it black market, like when they banned alcohol in the 60s(or 70s, forgot when).
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  • dr_ddr_d Join Date: 2003-03-28 Member: 14979Members
    Of course Quan, I wouldn't pay a dime of internet tax. But that doesn't mean it won't get passed, look what happened after prohibition the goverment made it legal and comercialized the crap out of it.

    So now we have tax free internet that is easily accessed by anyone, in 20 years we might have an internet that you buy in chunks of 6 hours at a time for 15 bucks a "segment"?

    With the US it'll be more likely they declare the Internet has intoxicating effects and make it a contorlled substance. Let's see you have more than 30 hours of internet time logged, thats 25-life buddy.
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  • QuaunautQuaunaut The longest seven days in history... Join Date: 2003-03-21 Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    Hey, they do that, they'll have me and 100 million of my closest friends with Torches, Pitchforks, and Shotguns knocking on the White House door.
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  • XzilenXzilen Join Date: 2002-12-30 Member: 11642Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin-Gadzuko+Mar 29 2004, 02:51 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Gadzuko @ Mar 29 2004, 02:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Article+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Article)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->If the draft becomes law, anyone sharing 2,500 or more pieces of content, such as songs or movies, could be fined or thrown in jail.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Soooo... I guess we can't upload more than one or two big linux distributions with included software, huh? Seeing as the entire internet could be classified as a peer-to-peer network. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    <!--emo&::lerk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/lerk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='lerk.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::lerk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/lerk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='lerk.gif' /><!--endemo--> So no grandfathering on this law? Its not right to pass a law to get people who commited it in the past, in fact, I don't think it can be done.
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  • XzilenXzilen Join Date: 2002-12-30 Member: 11642Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin-Xyth+Mar 29 2004, 03:00 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Xyth @ Mar 29 2004, 03:00 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Im going to download twice as much music now just to spite them.

    Anyway, 2500 files?! My library including video/music/etc is only like 175 items large... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    And I believe its people like you, who don't excerise any sort of moderation that cause these kinds of things to happen *Sigh*. Way to ruin it for the casual users such as myself.
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  • XzilenXzilen Join Date: 2002-12-30 Member: 11642Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin-TommyVercetti+Mar 29 2004, 03:20 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TommyVercetti @ Mar 29 2004, 03:20 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Nemesis Zero+Mar 29 2004, 03:04 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nemesis Zero @ Mar 29 2004, 03:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Stuff like this should only show our American members one thing: It's about time you start using your election rights - both active <i>and</i> passive.
    The 'geek culture' has reached maturity, and is thus a possibly significant voting demographic. Why in hell should you leave internet legislation to old farts when you can do it yourselves? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Yea... remember who got the majority vote last election but still lost because the American goverment is in the hands of 100% corrupt Men With Power? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Oh please, don't even start with that crap here. Try to sort of keep on topic.
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  • XzilenXzilen Join Date: 2002-12-30 Member: 11642Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin-Quaunaut+Mar 29 2004, 06:40 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Quaunaut @ Mar 29 2004, 06:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> This is BS. First off, All P2P? Comon. That means banning progs like Skype, and basically halting almost all internet transfers but FTP.

    I doubt this'll get passed at all. It'll probably be just like that law to increase driving age to 18- only 1 vote for it, and that would be by the one who introduced it.

    Also- Bush's broadband tax won't happen. Think about it- more people are on broadband than dialup right now(not much more, but in fact more). If it gets passed, people'll just do it black market, like when they banned alcohol in the 60s(or 70s, forgot when). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Um. Try much earlier. Like the 20's.
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  • MantridMantrid Lockpick Join Date: 2003-12-07 Member: 24109Members
    I'm sorry, but you can't tax people for using the internet. Maybe you could if the internet was only in America, but its not.


    And regarding Peer-to-Peer, it has legitimate uses. For example, right now I'm using a P2P program to download Grim Fandango and Thief 2? I = teh haxxorz you say? Nope.

    I own both of those games. However, my Grim Fandango disks got cracked (physically, they can't be read), and I've lost ONE of the two disks needed for Thief 2.

    Now, tell me I'm wrong for doing that.
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  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    edited March 2004
    As they say on slashdot . . . rtfa.

    The wired article was actually incorrect if you read the text of the proposed bill. It doesn't not "ban p2p". It just makes the penalties for copyright violation criminal instead of merely civil. Any legal use of p2p will still be perfectly legal.

    Edit: actually, that was incorrect. It does not make it criminal, but it allows the attorney general to enforce the civil penalties and directs funds for doing it.
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  • dr_ddr_d Join Date: 2003-03-28 Member: 14979Members
    edited March 2004
    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I'm sorry, but you can't tax people for using the internet. Maybe you could if the internet was only in America, but its not.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    What does a US federal tax have to do with other countries. You're not paying US income tax on money you make outside of the country are you?

    Think of it this way, the national backbone wll be federally owned, and anyone using it (US citizens) will be taxed. So if someone from Europe connects to your server they are playing for free, you are paying the tax.

    PS the above is a theory it is not actually happening yet so don't panic.
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  • DOOManiacDOOManiac Worst. Critic. Ever. Join Date: 2002-04-17 Member: 462Members, NS1 Playtester
    <!--QuoteBegin-Quaunaut+Mar 29 2004, 05:40 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Quaunaut @ Mar 29 2004, 05:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> ... If it gets passed, people'll just do it black market, like when they banned alcohol in the 60s(or 70s, forgot when). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    ...

    And this is why people whouldn't be allowed to vote.


    I think that as soon as my parents die and I have no family left (that I care about), I'll be moving to Canada...
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  • Boy_who_lost_his_wingsBoy_who_lost_his_wings Join Date: 2003-12-03 Member: 23924Banned
    whats better, britian or canada?
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  • UZiUZi Eight inches of C4 between the legs. Join Date: 2003-02-20 Member: 13767Members
    edited March 2004
    <img src='http://wewearfoilhats.com/confed.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

    Did somebody say rebellion?
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  • Boy_who_lost_his_wingsBoy_who_lost_his_wings Join Date: 2003-12-03 Member: 23924Banned
    no, but i think somebody said something about red x's <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
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  • DOOManiacDOOManiac Worst. Critic. Ever. Join Date: 2002-04-17 Member: 462Members, NS1 Playtester
    The thing is, rebellion is well and fine back when we had a chance, but if there was any kind of revolution about to even START here in the US the military would execute everyone involved and we wouldn't have that 5 or 6 month boat ride to prepare for it...
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  • Boy_who_lost_his_wingsBoy_who_lost_his_wings Join Date: 2003-12-03 Member: 23924Banned
    it dont work that way with a volenteer army =\
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  • UZiUZi Eight inches of C4 between the legs. Join Date: 2003-02-20 Member: 13767Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-DOOManiac+Mar 29 2004, 08:21 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Mar 29 2004, 08:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The thing is, rebellion is well and fine back when we had a chance, but if there was any kind of revolution about to even START here in the US the military would execute everyone involved and we wouldn't have that 5 or 6 month boat ride to prepare for it... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    not really Doomie. whos to say their would be defections...and gurillia warfare is a mother****.
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  • MulletMullet Join Date: 2003-04-28 Member: 15910Members, Constellation
    edited March 2004
    Ohwell....we will always have iRC <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->

    /edit

    I still use kazaalite, does anyone else use it?
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  • XzilenXzilen Join Date: 2002-12-30 Member: 11642Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin-UZi+Mar 29 2004, 08:25 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (UZi @ Mar 29 2004, 08:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-DOOManiac+Mar 29 2004, 08:21 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Mar 29 2004, 08:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The thing is, rebellion is well and fine back when we had a chance, but if there was any kind of revolution about to even START here in the US the military would execute everyone involved and we wouldn't have that 5 or 6 month boat ride to prepare for it... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    not really Doomie. whos to say their would be defections...and gurillia warfare is a mother****. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    If people are willing to actually die for a cause, then a rebellion could happen. I personally, would fight and die for some changes to be made to our government, but I would not do it if I were to do it alone.
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  • UZiUZi Eight inches of C4 between the legs. Join Date: 2003-02-20 Member: 13767Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-Xzilen+Mar 29 2004, 08:37 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Xzilen @ Mar 29 2004, 08:37 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-UZi+Mar 29 2004, 08:25 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (UZi @ Mar 29 2004, 08:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-DOOManiac+Mar 29 2004, 08:21 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Mar 29 2004, 08:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The thing is, rebellion is well and fine back when we had a chance, but if there was any kind of revolution about to even START here in the US the military would execute everyone involved and we wouldn't have that 5 or 6 month boat ride to prepare for it... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    not really Doomie. whos to say their would be defections...and gurillia warfare is a mother****. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    If people are willing to actually die for a cause, then a rebellion could happen. I personally, would fight and die for some changes to be made to our government, but I would not do it if I were to do it alone. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    <a href='http://161.58.5.90/fmj/supsitry.wav' target='_blank'>Famous Quote</a>
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  • HydraHydra Join Date: 2003-06-14 Member: 17366Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited March 2004
    EDIT
    I think I might not have quite gotten the train of thought I had across, oh well.
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  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    <!--QuoteBegin-moultano+Mar 29 2004, 07:35 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (moultano @ Mar 29 2004, 07:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> As they say on slashdot . . . rtfa.

    The wired article was actually incorrect if you read the text of the proposed bill. It doesn't not "ban p2p". It just makes the penalties for copyright violation criminal instead of merely civil. Any legal use of p2p will still be perfectly legal.

    Edit: actually, that was incorrect. It does not make it criminal, but it allows the attorney general to enforce the civil penalties and directs funds for doing it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I don't think anyone read this.
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  • SkulkBaitSkulkBait Join Date: 2003-02-11 Member: 13423Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-moultano+Mar 29 2004, 09:04 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (moultano @ Mar 29 2004, 09:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-moultano+Mar 29 2004, 07:35 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (moultano @ Mar 29 2004, 07:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> As they say on slashdot . . . rtfa.

    The wired article was actually incorrect if you read the text of the proposed bill. It doesn't not "ban p2p". It just makes the penalties for copyright violation criminal instead of merely civil. Any legal use of p2p will still be perfectly legal.

    Edit: actually, that was incorrect. It does not make it criminal, but it allows the attorney general to enforce the civil penalties and directs funds for doing it. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I don't think anyone read this. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Its too bad. I kinda wish they would make it criminal, then the burden of proof would be higher.
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  • ironpancakeironpancake Join Date: 2003-05-23 Member: 16643Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-TrueChaos+Mar 29 2004, 08:59 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TrueChaos @ Mar 29 2004, 08:59 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Taxing <i>information</i>? That strikes me as rediculous, but I dunno maybe they have not done a reality check recently. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    They wouldn't be taxing information. They would be taxing the use of the broadband they installed "for you".
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  • QuaunautQuaunaut The longest seven days in history... Join Date: 2003-03-21 Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--QuoteBegin-DOOManiac+Mar 29 2004, 05:57 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Mar 29 2004, 05:57 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Quaunaut+Mar 29 2004, 05:40 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Quaunaut @ Mar 29 2004, 05:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> ... If it gets passed, people'll just do it black market, like when they banned alcohol in the 60s(or 70s, forgot when). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    ...

    And this is why people whouldn't be allowed to vote.


    I think that as soon as my parents die and I have no family left (that I care about), I'll be moving to Canada... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Hey, you could work for Black Isle. I myself am going to Japan.
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  • RenegadeRenegade Old school Join Date: 2002-03-29 Member: 361Members
    <!--QuoteBegin-DOOManiac+Mar 29 2004, 05:21 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DOOManiac @ Mar 29 2004, 05:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The thing is, rebellion is well and fine back when we had a chance, but if there was any kind of revolution about to even START here in the US the military would execute everyone involved and we wouldn't have that 5 or 6 month boat ride to prepare for it... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Don't worry, I won't execute anyone. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo-->
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  • Cold_NiTeCold_NiTe Join Date: 2003-09-15 Member: 20875Members
    God I hate this country sometimes.
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