<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->You could be writing stuff like, where do you cloak? above doorways or on top of a hive? inside the marine base? All you've been posting is stuff like, 'sensory is good because you can be invisible and nobody can see you'. To be honest, you ain't gonna get much respect for your cause if you don't have anything worthwhile reading.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You got it, friend. Is demo form allright because if you want it in .jpg someone would have to go and do each map..folder isn't like cs.
The stratagy is obvoiusly going to be to parasite and contain the enemy as much as possible, when they're parasited you run infront of them cloak and munch.
Will acctually be improved in 1.04 because any com who scans every room on the way to a hive is going to be outta cash befor he gets there <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
It is defeatest to say 'the marines will certainly get where they want to go and be able to build phase gates'. If you can contain them for long enough then you'll have 2nd hive and fades with adren get your intire team in fade, lurk or gorge and you've won.
Problem is this stratagy requries a huge amount more organization than dev/mov which is why I personally don't think it should be used on pubs.
spai_duhz: Why exactly are you downplaying the importance of attacking marine bases? Are you are saying that it's very hard to do, therefore carapace is useless? That just doesn't make sense. Kharaa don't have the option of whether or not to attack marine installations, it's a necessity. They question is how best to destroy them, and so far Carapace and Celerity\Adrenaline are winning.
crisquo: <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How about killing them before they start? Or if you get there late, do a massive skulk rush and jump around like banshees to make it harder for them to hit you.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Killing them before they start requires you to attack their base. Attacking requires you to be moving. Moving prevents you from cloaking. If you can't cloak then you're visible. If you're visible you're being fired at. If you're being fired at, you need to move quickly and dodge gunfire. If you're dodging gunfire, you need carapace to give you a few more chances before your mistakes kill you.
Okay...So if you move you uncloak, however; when you have carapace and you try to ambush marines by hanging from the ceiling they can and probably will see you. Sensory is good for ambush tactics while defense is used to run full speed and eat marines i'm not disagreeing with you on that, but i still prefere the guerilla tactics which is why i brought this up in the first place. The point of this whole thread is to prove that you can still win with sensory first, and I feel I have done that, anyone disagree?
<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=21&t=18297' target='_blank'>Here is my idea.</a>
Defense is always first because, on top of upgrades, it is usefull for other alien chambers...ALL upgrade chambers need to interact with each other in some way, especially with Offense CHambers.
<!--QuoteBegin--Crisqo+Jan 4 2003, 04:33 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Crisqo @ Jan 4 2003, 04:33 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The point of this whole thread is to prove that you can still win with sensory first, and I feel I have done that<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yes. Fair enough <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
ChurchMeatshield grunt-fodder // Has pre-ordered NS2Join Date: 2002-12-31Member: 11646Members, Constellation
Weeeeeee! I get to post the 100th post on this MUCH over-treaded topic. I think I've said this before, but cloaking just isn't as good as it should be(Flayra will fix this in 1.1 hopefully), based on the fact that in my experience, more and more comms are building an Observatory right after the armory, and not building a turret factory. This means early motion tracking (and possible scanner sweeps) which makes cloaking much less useful. Marines would always know your general vicinity before you stopped moving in your ambush spot, and they'd either ask for a scanner sweep or (if they're good) just know which nook you're hiding in anywhere (probably due to their own experiences at playing skulk). Motion tracking is very, very good (that's why it costs 45 res) and will render your cloaked aliens much less useful. Many times the aliens don't even know the marines have MT and then wonder why they get slaughtered when they've hidden oh so well.
About hives: Yes, if the skulks are good enough to keep the marines still fighting for that second hive at 5 minutes, then the aliens have won. Marines needs to have semi-secured the first hive by 5 minutes, and very shortly after start heading towards that second hive. This is when the critical point in the game is with 1.03: 5-10 minutes into the game. Willt he aliens of the marines get that second hive? Will the skulks and the gorge heading to that second hive destroy the intruders, or will the marines either seige their way to victory, or possible walk into the empty second hive and set up shop?
Depending on whether the gorge(s) have been putting up chambers or not, 10 minates may or may not be enough time for a new hive. Many times when I have been gorge I don't even put up any chambers (read: no wall of lames. NO structures whatsover except 2-3 res nozzles) so I can get that 2nd hive up quickly. I depend on my skulks to protect me. What this means is that by the time I get my first chambers up, the second hive is already on its way so whatever chamber I pick first will not really be that important.
Uhhh...Meathshield, I think you're a little late with your points against cloaking...in fact you just told us the same point that basically everyone in this anti-sensory thread was trying to exploit...which crisqo (and others) have told what they would do...And plus, sure, (good) Marines WILL check all the corners and such and all the obvious hinding spots...so that's why you hang in some open part of a ceiling or something so they have the least possible chance of shooting you randomly. And don't think I mean stand in the middle of the floor...that's just stupid...
You can win with sensory first, sure. You can also win with zero upgrade chambers. Pubs vary so wildly in skill levels that it is impossible to judge any strategy based on them.
imo a skulk should be in constant motion, patrolling everywhere.... not sitting on a wall cloaked and hoping the marines actually come that way. Figuring out enemy paths is something that requires more communication than you will find on a public server. I'd have to take off my shoes to count the number of times (just today mind you) I have switched to teammates' views to see them clinging to a random ceiling over a node while the marines are setting up siege next to our hive.
Now, if they could be tricked into something neat like giving cloak a toned down umbra effect while in motion (like 1, 1.5, 2) it might be useful. But as far as sensory goes I normally pick hivesight to illuminate marines in dark corridors.
hey, would you actually READ the other posts before you post something like that?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Everyone seems to think when i say "camp" i mean sitting in some remote place and sit there, I don't. By "camp" i mean running around then if you hear marine footsteps you stop, wait for them to pass, then eat. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Which is precisely where the argument that it goes out with motion tracking holds water. A good marine team is going to move in groups larger than one, and have it before the second hive pops usually. They are also going to survive a good while after the second hive pops.
NS is based around two hives. If you can only get one you are likely to lose, if you get two you are likely to win. If you get three it should be assured.... well that or the game will last more hours than folks are willing to play. When you choose an upgrade chamber, you are giving up one of the other two.
So, with that in mind, when you choose sensory you have one more choice. At the two hive game, marines are upgraded and heavy weapons begin to appear. S+D offers no adrenaline and no quick transport to assaulted hives, S+M offers no carapace/regen and no forward unmanned healing stations. Cloak, which is entering its twilight of usefulness, was exchanged for one of these. On maps where resources don't flow like water it is not as much of a kick in the groin, but you have to shoot for a quick end.
9 out of 10 people just aren't willing to give up adren/regen in the mid game for cloak in the beginning. It's really not a fair trade.
ShockehIf a packet drops on the web and nobody's near to see it...Join Date: 2002-11-19Member: 9336NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
Right, I'm back, and I seem to have missed the fun bit.... <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
First. <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And don't think I mean stand in the middle of the floor...that's just stupid... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not a chance. I ALWAYS cloak there first, as often, marines will walk right UP to my jaws, and I get a kill BEFORE I start assaulting, thus meaning I can often get 3-4 rather than 2-3 in each 'attack run'
Next,
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->At the two hive game, marines are upgraded and heavy weapons begin to appear. S+D offers no adrenaline and no quick transport to assaulted hives<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Right. Sensory at this point is MORE useful than Movement in fact. The movement ability is useless. Sorry, get over trying to use it. It's just not going to work. It'll either send you to the wrong place, or you won't be able to locate one in time. As for Adrenaline, Fades NEVER kill HA's with Acid. They just don't. They try, and get HMG'ed to death. The only Fades that DO get HA kills regularily, are those who melee. And those of us who melee, well, we cloak until HA's walk nearby, and claw em to death, which is by comparison, SIMPLE. But how do I get them to walk near my cloaked position you ask? Read on, my friends...
As for aggresive cloaking not working. I'm afraid not. The reason you can aggresively cloak with aliens is because you have <b>SPEED</b>. Once you can find some marines (Shouldn't be hard if your fellow Skulks are doing their job, and parasiting plenty, or marines are being their usual selves, and spamming rounds at the first DC or OC that comes into view) you move ahead of their predicted route (also, generally quite easy, as they will 99% of the time be building towards a rez point or hive) and wait say, a chamber or two ahead.
You'll be sat cloaked usually maybe 15-20 seconds, you get several easy kills, (ESPECIALLY if you pick corridors, for some reason, Comms always scan chambers, like hives, but never the corridors leading up to those chambers. meh to them I say) and you're happily alive at the end of this, with easy routes back to your hive for healing.
Base assaults are more tricky, and this is where I become aware that for some people, they will (for obvious reasons) find Movement / Defense more appropriate, because it requires a modicum of trust between alien players, and some good timing. The art is to kill a signifcant proportion of the marine team as they come out, (with melee in my case, as I still hate acid spamming <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> ) from a cloaked position nearby to spawn (once again, rarely scanned due to overassumption that Obs will be sufficient) and during respawn cycle, you have a minimum of 10-15 seconds (usually more, due to initial disorientation of marines upon spawning, and obsessive Armoury cluster using) to blink in, and cause all the damage you can to the appropriate structures.
Once you've got the TF down, all available aliens rush in (some are better at this hit & run on the TF than others, I've got that used to it it's now my primary base assault method <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> ) and game ends.
Yes, it may be slightly less forgiving to newbs than the acid spam method, BUT once you've got a team proficient at it, it's actually MUCH harder to cope with, and much more in keeping with the 'dream' of how Fades would operate at spawn attacking.
Lastly, you end up with SCARED marines, which can't be bad, who won't leave their spawn. This means that even if they are being good shots, and you're not killing the TF, the Gorges are having free reign, and generally means game over within 10 mins tops anyway.
Well, that's my method. Now all I want to hear is....
W000t. New stuff! Tell us Flayra, tell us! <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
I personally love the DC+SC combo for fades. Cara+cloak+blink+claws= marines who aren't moving away from phase gates/turret farms.. I sat at docking wing 1 on nothing for 4 minutes while the marines welded a RT( I took 55 damage waiting for them to finish from their welders, thats how close to them I was.). Then as they moved out to start seiging cargo bay, I blinked to within their midst, and clawed all 4 to peices, with 2 HA/HMG's included. Having said that you also need to remember you have to tailor your upgrades you get for the flow of the game... Are the marines pinned in, only traveling thru phase gates? If so, MC's are probably a better call then SC's, as you are going to be attacking them, not you sitting and waiting for them to move.
Yes shockwave, the noob acid-rocket thing bothers me also. Nothing irritates me more when we are 2 hives, and I go lerk and am sitting outside the base with 3 fades, and they wont just rush in even after I tell them to "next time I open this door, blink in and rush them, I'll give you umbra" and the fades just sit there and spam acid-rockets like noobs saving a gun for the next round.. The bile bombs are much better as ranged weapons then the acid rockets, especially in 1.04, get used to using claws now, makes for an easier time when it will come out..
Flayraa: make sensories like TF's, in that they have a fixed range, and anything marine that moves in that range can be seen thru hive sight. That right there makes SC's>MC's. As making SC after hive #2 makes it easier to spot those irritating marines trying to seige hive #2. Also let any aliens moving in said range be cloaked also, # SC's should give lvl3 cloak to any aliens moving or not moving withing that same sight radius. That is a real strategic upgrade, as that also forces marines to get MT if aliens get SC, and harm marines who go HA/JT/HMG rushes. that change alone possibly forces marines to forgo getting 2 hives, especially if the aliens go SC first. Imagine grabbing hive #2 early in a phase rush, and while the marines are still setting up, a gorge drops a SC someone close, but outside the hive, close enough to cloak aliens in the hive, but far enough to not be easily spotted/killed by the marines. That gives the aliens more of a chance in fighting for hive #2 if marines PG for it, and if the marines dont rush for 2 hives, and grab's nodes for upgrades, makes for 1 heck of a fight shortly after hive 2 is up..
that and make MC's do for the "yellow bar", what DC's do for your "health bar". Imagine silenced skulks, who have scent of fear, moving within range of a SC at lvl3, who can move into a group of marines trying to seige a hive quietly,(remaining cloaked of course from proximity of the SC) take a bite out of the 2 HA marines (since they chose HA/HMG fast instead of obs/PG/MT), then they move back to the MC to "reup" their biting power quick, then rush back in to finish the job....
I would prefer changes along that line as that would seem to balance things out more. Marine upgrade structures are good for multiple upgrades/actions, whereas aliens upgrade structures are good for only 1 upgrade. That makes all the alien structures more usefull overall, which I feel is the main reason why DC's are first now, they have more then just 1 use. (they heal as well as give upgrades). While I know MC's have a PG-like quality, and SC's infect marines who touch them with parasites, those are of very limited effects, where a DC has a good area effect also..
ShockehIf a packet drops on the web and nobody's near to see it...Join Date: 2002-11-19Member: 9336NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
edited January 2003
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->8 pages of retarded theories, and lucky experiences against newbies, and this hasn't been locked yet? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
See previous post on Flamebaiting. Begone child.
Edited due to deciding I might just be helping with the flamebaiting. As the adage goes...
"If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."
Just as an incidental point, but one of the people posting their 'retarded theories' was Flayra. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Shockwave+Jan 5 2003, 04:02 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Shockwave @ Jan 5 2003, 04:02 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->8 pages of retarded theories, and lucky experiences against newbies, and this hasn't been locked yet? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
See previous post on Flamebaiting. Begone child.
Edited due to deciding I might just be helping with the flamebaiting. As the adage goes...
"If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."
Just as an incidental point, but one of the people posting their 'retarded theories' was Flayra. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wow! Eight entire pages of awesome theories, and amazing experiences! Too bad they're all useless though. I love you guys.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And those of us who melee, well, we cloak until HA's walk nearby, and claw em to death, which is by comparison, SIMPLE<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We do? That's news to me. I usually go carapace\celerity, run into the room, dodge their gunfire matrix-style and kill them with my claws. Like a skulk, only bigger and tougher.
Although I can see your method having its advantages... *shrug* personally I prefer the speed boost. It helps for dodging turret fire. I try to attack buildings more thna I try to attack players.
I'd be interested to hear more cloaking tactics <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
ShockehIf a packet drops on the web and nobody's near to see it...Join Date: 2002-11-19Member: 9336NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
edited January 2003
OMG. I'm actually shocked.
Me, putting cloaking uses on the board, and them NOT getting shot down by mass Adren obsesives? Woah.
I want this thread preserved, get Flayra over here, this is, like a first. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Incidentally, for those who may (or may not...) be interested, I take Celerity too from MC's... Adrenaline to me is just overkill. I can chuck enough acid when I need to anyway (primarily for discouraging m's from charging me when low on health) and otherwise, hey? Who needs it?
<!--QuoteBegin--Shockwave+Jan 5 2003, 06:56 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Shockwave @ Jan 5 2003, 06:56 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Me, putting cloaking uses on the board, and them NOT getting shot down by mass Adren obsesives? Woah.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's because all the reasonable people have arrived at the proper conclusion for chamber upgrade order.
<b>Chamber upgrade order is a matter of personal preference</b>.
Debating about chamber upgrade order is like debating about which is a better colour, red or blue. There is no better colour, it's just what you prefer.
<!--QuoteBegin--Fantasmo+Jan 5 2003, 08:02 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Fantasmo @ Jan 5 2003, 08:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->That's because all the reasonable people have arrived at the proper conclusion for chamber upgrade order.
<b>Chamber upgrade order is a matter of personal preference</b>.
Debating about chamber upgrade order is like debating about which is a better colour, red or blue. There is no better colour, it's just what you prefer.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Exactement!
<!--QuoteBegin--SoulSkorpion+Jan 4 2003, 10:27 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SoulSkorpion @ Jan 4 2003, 10:27 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->spai_duhz: Why exactly are you downplaying the importance of attacking marine bases? Are you are saying that it's very hard to do, therefore carapace is useless? That just doesn't make sense. Kharaa don't have the option of whether or not to attack marine installations, it's a necessity. They question is how best to destroy them, and so far Carapace and Celerity\Adrenaline are winning.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> skulk rushes are fun. they dont require carapace if done right. i have done it without upgrading at all. hell, i do it mostly without. why? because my team will be with me while i rush, making the marines spread their fire, and hence some get hit, some dont at all. get this? some dont, AT ALL.
kharaa indeed do not have the option of just letting the marine base be, and allow them have upgrades, which cost resourses. but they do not have to always destroy the marine base while in skulk form, right? the only part where DCs were a nessecity was when my team were a skulk happy rushers, and we won with just one hive. granted the marines were a little hard of aim and the sort, but in that case, carapace helped. not much, since it absorbes only ard 4-5 shots, but it did.
now before you tell me that i am diverting your attention, just shut up. you dont tell a story teller to get on with it when he is building up the story, no? so just READ.
marines rely on their upgrade, kharaa rely on hives. both require resources. deprive the other of resources, and the other team is well done for. with cloak, you can hide outside their base after their base in inpenetrable due to turret farms, and bite them when they run past. heck, you can hide in any good place, cloak, and wait for somone to run past before you chomp. i have been trying to say this most of my previous posts. HAI!
you want strategy? i'll give you strategy.
beginning, all rush to marine base get killed sooner or later. next respawn, somone gorges, all the rest regroup, and rush together again. this batch die again. regroup, and rush untill marine defence is inpenetrable.
by this time, the gorge would have already built two resources on the way to another hive, and have returned to first hive. builds one or two sensory chambers by the time the third skulk rush has been done. now the force regroups into two teams of skulks, one is the guerilla skulk team(now known as team1), and another is the hive-defence team(now known as team2).
team one rushes to good spots outside marine base, and around the map. one if this guy goes around, scouting if any marines managed to go out of marine base during the skulk rushes. they have lv 2 or 3 cloak, and lv2 is pretty okay enough at this point. marines have the bias that aliens mostly start with defence, so they wont know what hit them. yet. the point of team1 is to induce paranoia in the marines, making the commander waste RPs doing scanner sweeps everywhere, if possible. their point is also to slow down marine advancement. being extremely careful of cloaked aliens will make them advance very slowly, which is the point.
team two will be split up into 2, 3 if the game is going as well as it should be. they will be holding key points BEFORE the hive location, so they will be able to take note of any marines trying to secure it. they then prevent the marines from even setting foot on the hive location. you can just let them pop on the turret factory to make them waste some RPs, but thats up to you.
the gorge will be getting RTs at this point again untill he is at the second wanted base. will need only about 10 or 15 more RPs at this point, so he waits. when nuff rts, he builds the hive. no defence, because as i mentioned, the skulks are the defence at this point, and works far better then letting offence chamber do the work. i managed to weld a wall of lame as marine (maybe tahts luck, maybe it not). that shows how effective offence chambers are. skulks, are always , ALWAYS better defence.
kharaa: 2nd hive going up. marines: turtled up, if you played your cards right.
gorge will build movement chambers when the hive is up, then become some kinda combat medic, healing all of his skulks that do need healing. normally, you should not be needing to use healing since well guerilla awrfare means to kill the enemy before they even know what hit them, and kill them before they even know where their doom is comming from. i wont be too worried about the marines ability to detect movement if i were you. the marine commander HUD isnt big nuff to show the whole map. the minimap, is not that great. know how damn big enemy and friendly blips are? with this, it will be hard for marines to just rely on their commander to say "3 things just moved in atmospheric processing). even if the commander scans the area, aliens can just relocate and cloak another place. unless the marines were also in the room, which by then aliens would have put they guerilla warfare tactics to good use.
gorge walks to another hive, getting RTs along the way. if the marines secured the last hive, cloak somewhere near the entrance.
one or two skulks upgrade to lerks to worry this marine emplacement. i should not need to tell you how to play, but if i were true to the formula, id fire for one or two seconds, fly another spot and cloak. wait awhile to see if marines phase into the area. if they dont, rinse and repeat. if you fire continuesly and not cloak, you're mincemeant, since the marines should have HAs and HMGs by now. if they dont, well then you know marines got a newbie commander. worry the outpost untill everyone else can become fades. well, maybe not everyone, but a couple of, how shall i say, skulk "commandos" will remain skulk and take silence when movement is up. they run around the map with silence, and chomp marines from behind as they start shooting at uncarapaced fades. uncarapaced.... hmm, carapace i never bothered with. i guess people like me know why... if YOU have to ask, then you will never know.
after a spectacular battle, the third hive is yours. i guess you CAN celebrate, but not yet. continue to worry the marines in their base. go ahead, get killed if you want to get rid of cloak. when you have the needed resources to make your good team (1 or 2 onos, a crapload of fades, 1 or 2 lerks to cast umbra or spores. whatever tickles your fancy. 3. yes, three combat gorges to heal and/or spam marine base with web/OC. whatever gorge offence tactic you use.'
with that done, now may i please ask how have i, by promoting sensory chambers as starting chambers, downplays attacking marine bases. humour me please.
why didnt you post before i did? then i could have kept my postcount low, and therefore let people have the opinion that i have the "silent and strong" character...BAH
now to add something to the discussion so this wont get deleted..
Lets look at this from the gorges' view, if the aliens get sensory first (or second) the gorges lifespan increases dramatically. First, they gorge could have got SoF (this gorge wasn't to bright), but with it theres the off chance a wounded marine is comming to the gorge's location, the gorge sees it and wobbles away. Cloaking, however, is much better because it just has to stand still whenever it hears marines footsteps (better upgrade.) I'm not going to talk about enhanced hive sight because you can turn the brightness up on your monitor and get the same effect...and it doesn't help you run away from marines.
Ok this wasn't my best post but i needed to add something so the post wouldn't get deleted! FORGIVE ME!!!!
Oh, and to Bobbyfat, please keep your useless points elsewhere. I mean, I respect the people that defend the "always defense or die" theory more than you, at least they show some sort of intelligence and true dedication to a tactic rather than your mindless boobery that you post here.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->That's because all the reasonable people have arrived at the proper conclusion for chamber upgrade order.
Chamber upgrade order is a matter of personal preference.
Debating about chamber upgrade order is like debating about which is a better colour, red or blue. There is no better colour, it's just what you prefer.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll beat the dead horse again and tell you that I KNOW it's personal preference, but it just gets me frustrated when some people's preferences aren't even looked at. There are way too many servers where people go sensory (or even SUGGEST sensory) and the Vote Kick comes on, not even giving it a chance...but of course none of you here have tried to kick someone like that before..
(If this post isn't fully coherent, too bad, I want this thread to survive)
Comments
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->You could be writing stuff like, where do you cloak? above doorways or on top of a hive? inside the marine base? All you've been posting is stuff like, 'sensory is good because you can be invisible and nobody can see you'. To be honest, you ain't gonna get much respect for your cause if you don't have anything worthwhile reading.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You got it, friend. Is demo form allright because if you want it in .jpg someone would have to go and do each map..folder isn't like cs.
Will acctually be improved in 1.04 because any com who scans every room on the way to a hive is going to be outta cash befor he gets there <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
It is defeatest to say 'the marines will certainly get where they want to go and be able to build phase gates'. If you can contain them for long enough then you'll have 2nd hive and fades with adren get your intire team in fade, lurk or gorge and you've won.
Problem is this stratagy requries a huge amount more organization than dev/mov which is why I personally don't think it should be used on pubs.
BlueGhost
Why exactly are you downplaying the importance of attacking marine bases? Are you are saying that it's very hard to do, therefore carapace is useless? That just doesn't make sense. Kharaa don't have the option of whether or not to attack marine installations, it's a necessity. They question is how best to destroy them, and so far Carapace and Celerity\Adrenaline are winning.
crisquo:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How about killing them before they start? Or if you get there late, do a massive skulk rush and jump around like banshees to make it harder for them to hit you.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Killing them before they start requires you to attack their base. Attacking requires you to be moving. Moving prevents you from cloaking. If you can't cloak then you're visible. If you're visible you're being fired at. If you're being fired at, you need to move quickly and dodge gunfire. If you're dodging gunfire, you need carapace to give you a few more chances before your mistakes kill you.
Can I make this any more clear?
Defense is always first because, on top of upgrades, it is usefull for other alien chambers...ALL upgrade chambers need to interact with each other in some way, especially with Offense CHambers.
Yes. Fair enough <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
About hives: Yes, if the skulks are good enough to keep the marines still fighting for that second hive at 5 minutes, then the aliens have won. Marines needs to have semi-secured the first hive by 5 minutes, and very shortly after start heading towards that second hive. This is when the critical point in the game is with 1.03: 5-10 minutes into the game. Willt he aliens of the marines get that second hive? Will the skulks and the gorge heading to that second hive destroy the intruders, or will the marines either seige their way to victory, or possible walk into the empty second hive and set up shop?
Depending on whether the gorge(s) have been putting up chambers or not, 10 minates may or may not be enough time for a new hive. Many times when I have been gorge I don't even put up any chambers (read: no wall of lames. NO structures whatsover except 2-3 res nozzles) so I can get that 2nd hive up quickly. I depend on my skulks to protect me. What this means is that by the time I get my first chambers up, the second hive is already on its way so whatever chamber I pick first will not really be that important.
imo a skulk should be in constant motion, patrolling everywhere.... not sitting on a wall cloaked and hoping the marines actually come that way. Figuring out enemy paths is something that requires more communication than you will find on a public server. I'd have to take off my shoes to count the number of times (just today mind you) I have switched to teammates' views to see them clinging to a random ceiling over a node while the marines are setting up siege next to our hive.
Now, if they could be tricked into something neat like giving cloak a toned down umbra effect while in motion (like 1, 1.5, 2) it might be useful. But as far as sensory goes I normally pick hivesight to illuminate marines in dark corridors.
Kheras
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Everyone seems to think when i say "camp" i mean sitting in some remote place and sit there, I don't. By "camp" i mean running around then if you hear marine footsteps you stop, wait for them to pass, then eat. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
NS is based around two hives. If you can only get one you are likely to lose, if you get two you are likely to win. If you get three it should be assured.... well that or the game will last more hours than folks are willing to play. When you choose an upgrade chamber, you are giving up one of the other two.
So, with that in mind, when you choose sensory you have one more choice. At the two hive game, marines are upgraded and heavy weapons begin to appear. S+D offers no adrenaline and no quick transport to assaulted hives, S+M offers no carapace/regen and no forward unmanned healing stations. Cloak, which is entering its twilight of usefulness, was exchanged for one of these. On maps where resources don't flow like water it is not as much of a kick in the groin, but you have to shoot for a quick end.
9 out of 10 people just aren't willing to give up adren/regen in the mid game for cloak in the beginning. It's really not a fair trade.
Kheras
First.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And don't think I mean stand in the middle of the floor...that's just stupid...
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not a chance. I ALWAYS cloak there first, as often, marines will walk right UP to my jaws, and I get a kill BEFORE I start assaulting, thus meaning I can often get 3-4 rather than 2-3 in each 'attack run'
Next,
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->At the two hive game, marines are upgraded and heavy weapons begin to appear. S+D offers no adrenaline and no quick transport to assaulted hives<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Right. Sensory at this point is MORE useful than Movement in fact. The movement ability is useless. Sorry, get over trying to use it. It's just not going to work. It'll either send you to the wrong place, or you won't be able to locate one in time. As for Adrenaline, Fades NEVER kill HA's with Acid. They just don't. They try, and get HMG'ed to death. The only Fades that DO get HA kills regularily, are those who melee. And those of us who melee, well, we cloak until HA's walk nearby, and claw em to death, which is by comparison, SIMPLE. But how do I get them to walk near my cloaked position you ask? Read on, my friends...
As for aggresive cloaking not working. I'm afraid not. The reason you can aggresively cloak with aliens is because you have <b>SPEED</b>. Once you can find some marines (Shouldn't be hard if your fellow Skulks are doing their job, and parasiting plenty, or marines are being their usual selves, and spamming rounds at the first DC or OC that comes into view) you move ahead of their predicted route (also, generally quite easy, as they will 99% of the time be building towards a rez point or hive) and wait say, a chamber or two ahead.
You'll be sat cloaked usually maybe 15-20 seconds, you get several easy kills, (ESPECIALLY if you pick corridors, for some reason, Comms always scan chambers, like hives, but never the corridors leading up to those chambers. meh to them I say) and you're happily alive at the end of this, with easy routes back to your hive for healing.
Base assaults are more tricky, and this is where I become aware that for some people, they will (for obvious reasons) find Movement / Defense more appropriate, because it requires a modicum of trust between alien players, and some good timing. The art is to kill a signifcant proportion of the marine team as they come out, (with melee in my case, as I still hate acid spamming <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> ) from a cloaked position nearby to spawn (once again, rarely scanned due to overassumption that Obs will be sufficient) and during respawn cycle, you have a minimum of 10-15 seconds (usually more, due to initial disorientation of marines upon spawning, and obsessive Armoury cluster using) to blink in, and cause all the damage you can to the appropriate structures.
Once you've got the TF down, all available aliens rush in (some are better at this hit & run on the TF than others, I've got that used to it it's now my primary base assault method <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> ) and game ends.
Yes, it may be slightly less forgiving to newbs than the acid spam method, BUT once you've got a team proficient at it, it's actually MUCH harder to cope with, and much more in keeping with the 'dream' of how Fades would operate at spawn attacking.
Lastly, you end up with SCARED marines, which can't be bad, who won't leave their spawn. This means that even if they are being good shots, and you're not killing the TF, the Gorges are having free reign, and generally means game over within 10 mins tops anyway.
Well, that's my method. Now all I want to hear is....
W000t. New stuff! Tell us Flayra, tell us! <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Constructive criticism / other ideas / generalised ranting welcomed.... <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Yes shockwave, the noob acid-rocket thing bothers me also. Nothing irritates me more when we are 2 hives, and I go lerk and am sitting outside the base with 3 fades, and they wont just rush in even after I tell them to "next time I open this door, blink in and rush them, I'll give you umbra" and the fades just sit there and spam acid-rockets like noobs saving a gun for the next round.. The bile bombs are much better as ranged weapons then the acid rockets, especially in 1.04, get used to using claws now, makes for an easier time when it will come out..
Flayraa: make sensories like TF's, in that they have a fixed range, and anything marine that moves in that range can be seen thru hive sight. That right there makes SC's>MC's. As making SC after hive #2 makes it easier to spot those irritating marines trying to seige hive #2. Also let any aliens moving in said range be cloaked also, # SC's should give lvl3 cloak to any aliens moving or not moving withing that same sight radius. That is a real strategic upgrade, as that also forces marines to get MT if aliens get SC, and harm marines who go HA/JT/HMG rushes. that change alone possibly forces marines to forgo getting 2 hives, especially if the aliens go SC first. Imagine grabbing hive #2 early in a phase rush, and while the marines are still setting up, a gorge drops a SC someone close, but outside the hive, close enough to cloak aliens in the hive, but far enough to not be easily spotted/killed by the marines. That gives the aliens more of a chance in fighting for hive #2 if marines PG for it, and if the marines dont rush for 2 hives, and grab's nodes for upgrades, makes for 1 heck of a fight shortly after hive 2 is up..
that and make MC's do for the "yellow bar", what DC's do for your "health bar". Imagine silenced skulks, who have scent of fear, moving within range of a SC at lvl3, who can move into a group of marines trying to seige a hive quietly,(remaining cloaked of course from proximity of the SC) take a bite out of the 2 HA marines (since they chose HA/HMG fast instead of obs/PG/MT), then they move back to the MC to "reup" their biting power quick, then rush back in to finish the job....
I would prefer changes along that line as that would seem to balance things out more. Marine upgrade structures are good for multiple upgrades/actions, whereas aliens upgrade structures are good for only 1 upgrade. That makes all the alien structures more usefull overall, which I feel is the main reason why DC's are first now, they have more then just 1 use. (they heal as well as give upgrades). While I know MC's have a PG-like quality, and SC's infect marines who touch them with parasites, those are of very limited effects, where a DC has a good area effect also..
Just a thought
See previous post on Flamebaiting. Begone child.
Edited due to deciding I might just be helping with the flamebaiting. As the adage goes...
"If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."
Just as an incidental point, but one of the people posting their 'retarded theories' was Flayra.
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
See previous post on Flamebaiting. Begone child.
Edited due to deciding I might just be helping with the flamebaiting. As the adage goes...
"If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."
Just as an incidental point, but one of the people posting their 'retarded theories' was Flayra.
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wow! Eight entire pages of awesome theories, and amazing experiences! Too bad they're all useless though. I love you guys.
We do? That's news to me. I usually go carapace\celerity, run into the room, dodge their gunfire matrix-style and kill them with my claws. Like a skulk, only bigger and tougher.
Although I can see your method having its advantages... *shrug* personally I prefer the speed boost. It helps for dodging turret fire. I try to attack buildings more thna I try to attack players.
I'd be interested to hear more cloaking tactics <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
lol
Me, putting cloaking uses on the board, and them NOT getting shot down by mass Adren obsesives? Woah.
I want this thread preserved, get Flayra over here, this is, like a first. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Incidentally, for those who may (or may not...) be interested, I take Celerity too from MC's... Adrenaline to me is just overkill. I can chuck enough acid when I need to anyway (primarily for discouraging m's from charging me when low on health) and otherwise, hey? Who needs it?
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's because all the reasonable people have arrived at the proper conclusion for chamber upgrade order.
<b>Chamber upgrade order is a matter of personal preference</b>.
Debating about chamber upgrade order is like debating about which is a better colour, red or blue. There is no better colour, it's just what you prefer.
<b>Chamber upgrade order is a matter of personal preference</b>.
Debating about chamber upgrade order is like debating about which is a better colour, red or blue. There is no better colour, it's just what you prefer.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactement!
Why exactly are you downplaying the importance of attacking marine bases? Are you are saying that it's very hard to do, therefore carapace is useless? That just doesn't make sense. Kharaa don't have the option of whether or not to attack marine installations, it's a necessity. They question is how best to destroy them, and so far Carapace and Celerity\Adrenaline are winning.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
skulk rushes are fun. they dont require carapace if done right. i have done it without upgrading at all. hell, i do it mostly without. why? because my team will be with me while i rush, making the marines spread their fire, and hence some get hit, some dont at all. get this? some dont, AT ALL.
kharaa indeed do not have the option of just letting the marine base be, and allow them have upgrades, which cost resourses. but they do not have to always destroy the marine base while in skulk form, right? the only part where DCs were a nessecity was when my team were a skulk happy rushers, and we won with just one hive. granted the marines were a little hard of aim and the sort, but in that case, carapace helped. not much, since it absorbes only ard 4-5 shots, but it did.
now before you tell me that i am diverting your attention, just shut up. you dont tell a story teller to get on with it when he is building up the story, no? so just READ.
marines rely on their upgrade, kharaa rely on hives. both require resources. deprive the other of resources, and the other team is well done for. with cloak, you can hide outside their base after their base in inpenetrable due to turret farms, and bite them when they run past. heck, you can hide in any good place, cloak, and wait for somone to run past before you chomp. i have been trying to say this most of my previous posts. HAI!
you want strategy? i'll give you strategy.
beginning, all rush to marine base get killed sooner or later. next respawn, somone gorges, all the rest regroup, and rush together again. this batch die again. regroup, and rush untill marine defence is inpenetrable.
by this time, the gorge would have already built two resources on the way to another hive, and have returned to first hive. builds one or two sensory chambers by the time the third skulk rush has been done. now the force regroups into two teams of skulks, one is the guerilla skulk team(now known as team1), and another is the hive-defence team(now known as team2).
team one rushes to good spots outside marine base, and around the map. one if this guy goes around, scouting if any marines managed to go out of marine base during the skulk rushes. they have lv 2 or 3 cloak, and lv2 is pretty okay enough at this point. marines have the bias that aliens mostly start with defence, so they wont know what hit them. yet. the point of team1 is to induce paranoia in the marines, making the commander waste RPs doing scanner sweeps everywhere, if possible. their point is also to slow down marine advancement. being extremely careful of cloaked aliens will make them advance very slowly, which is the point.
team two will be split up into 2, 3 if the game is going as well as it should be. they will be holding key points BEFORE the hive location, so they will be able to take note of any marines trying to secure it. they then prevent the marines from even setting foot on the hive location. you can just let them pop on the turret factory to make them waste some RPs, but thats up to you.
the gorge will be getting RTs at this point again untill he is at the second wanted base. will need only about 10 or 15 more RPs at this point, so he waits. when nuff rts, he builds the hive. no defence, because as i mentioned, the skulks are the defence at this point, and works far better then letting offence chamber do the work. i managed to weld a wall of lame as marine (maybe tahts luck, maybe it not). that shows how effective offence chambers are. skulks, are always , ALWAYS better defence.
kharaa: 2nd hive going up. marines: turtled up, if you played your cards right.
gorge will build movement chambers when the hive is up, then become some kinda combat medic, healing all of his skulks that do need healing. normally, you should not be needing to use healing since well guerilla awrfare means to kill the enemy before they even know what hit them, and kill them before they even know where their doom is comming from. i wont be too worried about the marines ability to detect movement if i were you. the marine commander HUD isnt big nuff to show the whole map. the minimap, is not that great. know how damn big enemy and friendly blips are? with this, it will be hard for marines to just rely on their commander to say "3 things just moved in atmospheric processing). even if the commander scans the area, aliens can just relocate and cloak another place. unless the marines were also in the room, which by then aliens would have put they guerilla warfare tactics to good use.
gorge walks to another hive, getting RTs along the way. if the marines secured the last hive, cloak somewhere near the entrance.
one or two skulks upgrade to lerks to worry this marine emplacement. i should not need to tell you how to play, but if i were true to the formula, id fire for one or two seconds, fly another spot and cloak. wait awhile to see if marines phase into the area. if they dont, rinse and repeat. if you fire continuesly and not cloak, you're mincemeant, since the marines should have HAs and HMGs by now. if they dont, well then you know marines got a newbie commander. worry the outpost untill everyone else can become fades. well, maybe not everyone, but a couple of, how shall i say, skulk "commandos" will remain skulk and take silence when movement is up. they run around the map with silence, and chomp marines from behind as they start shooting at uncarapaced fades. uncarapaced.... hmm, carapace i never bothered with. i guess people like me know why... if YOU have to ask, then you will never know.
after a spectacular battle, the third hive is yours. i guess you CAN celebrate, but not yet. continue to worry the marines in their base. go ahead, get killed if you want to get rid of cloak. when you have the needed resources to make your good team (1 or 2 onos, a crapload of fades, 1 or 2 lerks to cast umbra or spores. whatever tickles your fancy. 3. yes, three combat gorges to heal and/or spam marine base with web/OC. whatever gorge offence tactic you use.'
with that done, now may i please ask how have i, by promoting sensory chambers as starting chambers, downplays attacking marine bases. humour me please.
heres my rant.
why didnt you post before i did? then i could have kept my postcount low, and therefore let people have the opinion that i have the "silent and strong" character...BAH
jk. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
that was beautiful friend.
now to add something to the discussion so this wont get deleted..
Lets look at this from the gorges' view, if the aliens get sensory first (or second) the gorges lifespan increases dramatically. First, they gorge could have got SoF (this gorge wasn't to bright), but with it theres the off chance a wounded marine is comming to the gorge's location, the gorge sees it and wobbles away. Cloaking, however, is much better because it just has to stand still whenever it hears marines footsteps (better upgrade.) I'm not going to talk about enhanced hive sight because you can turn the brightness up on your monitor and get the same effect...and it doesn't help you run away from marines.
Ok this wasn't my best post but i needed to add something so the post wouldn't get deleted! FORGIVE ME!!!!
Oh, and to Bobbyfat, please keep your useless points elsewhere. I mean, I respect the people that defend the "always defense or die" theory more than you, at least they show some sort of intelligence and true dedication to a tactic rather than your mindless boobery that you post here.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->That's because all the reasonable people have arrived at the proper conclusion for chamber upgrade order.
Chamber upgrade order is a matter of personal preference.
Debating about chamber upgrade order is like debating about which is a better colour, red or blue. There is no better colour, it's just what you prefer.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll beat the dead horse again and tell you that I KNOW it's personal preference, but it just gets me frustrated when some people's preferences aren't even looked at. There are way too many servers where people go sensory (or even SUGGEST sensory) and the Vote Kick comes on, not even giving it a chance...but of course none of you here have tried to kick someone like that before..
(If this post isn't fully coherent, too bad, I want this thread to survive)