Smart Players can craft ALL TOOLS with ONE BATTERY

KuBaNKuBaN Join Date: 2002-11-16 Member: 8979Members, Constellation Posts: 1,375 Advanced user
This is somewhat of a bug/suggestion/discussion, so not sure where it really should be.

Craft one battery, then craft a Flashlight, use up all the battery, then remove the battery, then use it in your next recipe to craft (for example) a Scanner. The Scanner has a completely charged battery in it. You've now crafted two tools with one battery, and recharged that battery, way before you've conceivably built a base, found the battery charger blueprint, and rounded up the materials to build a charger or two batteries.

Sure, you've ultimately got to craft multiple batteries to conveniently use each one without swapping back and forth, but in the meantime, you can have every tool available to you way before it seems like you were intended to (since in theory you should have had to farm for enough copper to craft as many batteries as you have tools).

Solutions
  • Removing the battery requirement and fabricating the tool without a battery has the problem of misleading new players into thinking they won't need a battery (simple fix, add a "Battery Sold Separately" tooltip in the recipe) until after they've crafted it.
  • Adding the raw materials for a battery (x1 copper, x2 acid mushroom) as required materials and spawning the tools with batteries solves the battery up-cycle abuse, but undervalues any batteries you may have already crafted or found in chests.
  • Transferring the charge % of the battery that's being used to craft the tool fixes the recharge exploit, but not the "one battery to craft them all" issue.

Thoughts?

Sidenote: Most recipes require a battery as a crafting requirement. The repair tool doesn't require one, which effectively let you craft a free battery. I get, no one's mass producing welders, and it's a challenge enough to find crashfish powder, but still, an inconsistency worth pointing out.
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nicojones
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Comments

  • TarkannenTarkannen North Carolina Join Date: 2016-08-15 Member: 221304Members Posts: 665 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    This has always pestered me when crafting items that use Batteries in the base recipe. However what''s more interesting is when crafting a Power Cell: if you use two dead batteries in the recipe, then the newly-created cell has 100% charge. While you might say the new cell just "re-energized" the components during fabrication, that''s fairly inaccurate. For those who know how 6 volt and 12 volt batteries work, they typically have multiple smaller batteries inside the larger casing (some 12v lantern batteries can have up to thirty-two AA batteries inside...) so while the recipe is accurate, recharging them this way is wrong.

    Also while on the subject, I'd like to point out the processing of fish. You can obviously cure fish vs cooking them so they stay fresh while moving about, but live fish stay alive indefinitely when stored in lockers, no water needed... shouldn't they die and rot?. Also, you can take fish that were killed by heat, poison clouds or Seamoth impacts (oops) and let them rot to maximum negative values... But if they're cooked or cured, they'll return to their maximum positive values, just as if they were still alive. :dizzy:

    Now this happens as the game tracks items with 'progress' meters, such as power values or fish freshness. Items that don't have them (such as normal fish) don't change values they don't have. Also when crafting, the game just checks to see if you have the base items and crafts the end result, whether the quality of the base items would logically affect the result or not.

    Now, it doesn't bother me at all now, but for the final retail launch I would like to see this changed. While I know this is more work for the devs to have to deal with, I feel it would make the game more realistic. An Old Dead Peeper should be inedible when cooked, and harm the player if he eats it. A Power Cell should have the average power level of the two Batteries that made it. I hate to be a nag, but that's just my thoughts on the matter. :blush:
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  • KuBaNKuBaN Join Date: 2002-11-16 Member: 8979Members, Constellation Posts: 1,375 Advanced user
    DrownedOut wrote: »
    I don't deny it's an exploit (one I gladly make use of in early game), but it's not all that illogical when the fabricator makes charged batteries to begin with. The fabricator as an indirect recharger nicely fills up the gap until the battery recharger is acquired, imo.

    I'm more concerned with the design/experience ramifications than the canonical logic of it. It's a convenient exploit, but not an intended one. If your battery dies, you should have to craft a new one, unless you have a Charger. That's what makes the Recharger useful; you no longer have to keep crafting batteries. The disadvantages are: you have to build a base, you have to build the Battery Charger, you have to power the base, and you have to wait a good bit of time for it to recharge. I'll cede the fact that you do eventually have to build a base and power it for a million other reasons, so we can ignore the cost of all of that and ignore that this exploit potentially alters the timeline of when a player would choose to build a base.

    If you can just circumvent all of that by crafting Flashlights at the cost of just 1 glass and INSTANTLY get a recharged battery, why would you ever waste the Computer Chip and the Copper Wire on a recharger? Those are resources better spent on a multitude of other structures, until later when you're swimming in those resources. Recharger rendered obsolete.

    This is the kind of thing that goes on behind close doors on normal game releases, where they are optimizing it right up until the end. You guys are just getting to play with a version of the game that normally only the developers see.

    --Cory


    nicojones
  • JackeJacke Calgary Join Date: 2017-03-20 Member: 229061Members Posts: 580 Advanced user
    Using discharged batteries to make other items could be solved by having the fabrication process carry over the average charge of the components into the new item. The issues with cooking fish killed losing all of their rot value could and should be changed too.

    But I think the problem with removing storing live fish is that's a big change to put into Subnautica this late in the development. Right now it's not too much of a burden hunting for fish as you can easily get an excess that you can stockpile. But if you couldn't store fish to cook and eat late, that means you'd have to cure them all. And that means more salt would be needed and it would be a slightly more complex start to the game, especially for a new player.
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  • DrownedOutDrownedOut Habitat Join Date: 2016-05-26 Member: 217559Members Posts: 1,056 Advanced user
    KuBaN wrote: »
    DrownedOut wrote: »
    I don't deny it's an exploit (one I gladly make use of in early game), but it's not all that illogical when the fabricator makes charged batteries to begin with. The fabricator as an indirect recharger nicely fills up the gap until the battery recharger is acquired, imo.

    I'm more concerned with the design/experience ramifications than the canonical logic of it. It's a convenient exploit, but not an intended one. If your battery dies, you should have to craft a new one, unless you have a Charger. That's what makes the Recharger useful; you no longer have to keep crafting batteries. The disadvantages are: you have to build a base, you have to build the Battery Charger, you have to power the base, and you have to wait a good bit of time for it to recharge. I'll cede the fact that you do eventually have to build a base and power it for a million other reasons, so we can ignore the cost of all of that and ignore that this exploit potentially alters the timeline of when a player would choose to build a base.

    If you can just circumvent all of that by crafting Flashlights at the cost of just 1 glass and INSTANTLY get a recharged battery, why would you ever waste the Computer Chip and the Copper Wire on a recharger? Those are resources better spent on a multitude of other structures, until later when you're swimming in those resources. Recharger rendered obsolete.

    Because I can repurpose a computer chip and copper wire when used in furniture. Anything spent on tools is Lost Forever. And in the given example, quartz/glass is a valuable material. Plus a battery charger requires nothing more of me than energy and can accommodate four batteries at once, while having to go out to collect materials to fabricate anything (+ dispose of the product later) as a recharge method is a hassle at one battery already.

    I don't agree the gameplay consequences are that big a deal because laziness is a powerful motivating factor. So's impatience, but once you've got about six batteries, which you easily get from looting wrecks, exchanging them in the battery recharger from time to time voids the waiting period. I know I don't bother with the fabricator recharge option anymore when I've got a functional collection because it loses its appeal compared to the battery recharger by then.

    If the fabricator recharge option would be removed, however, I need UWE to concurrently make plants regrow. Because as it is, the reason I like the exploit is because I loathe to destroy the environment and it takes to midgame (unless you force-play to the island early) before you can farm water plants. The exploit allows me to minimize the damage I cause.
  • L4NDSL1DEL4NDSL1DE Planet 4546B Join Date: 2017-04-22 Member: 229850Members Posts: 23 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    The inconsistency of the Repair Tool allowing a free Battery would be nice to see fixed. I think they can have up to 4(?) ingredients on a blueprint so there's room to add a Battery.

    As for the Battery being recharged, technically the Power used to fabricate the Tool does this. What if using a depleted (or anywhere between 0-99%) Battery for the blueprint resulted in an equal amount of Power used by the Battery Charger to charge it being added to the cost?

    I sort of trust the wiki when it says the Battery Charger takes 11 minutes to charge one Battery and uses 20 Power doing so. Now that's a bit of a whopper for your little Lifepod to take all at once, but the cost will vary depending on the charge level as it does with the Battery Charger. This way the energy is accounted for, neutralizing that part of the exploit.

    I don't think you'll be able to get away with not allowing an empty Battery to be used but you can put a price to it. Would that be reasonable?

  • dork42dork42 Michigan Join Date: 2017-03-30 Member: 229307Members Posts: 26 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    When we create a battery in the first place the doesn't seem to be any energy cost beyond the standard crafting cost. If they were to now give one item an additional energy requirement they would have to go back and reconsider it for every item. Its like giving the stupid mouse a cookie.

    As for the repair tool not needing a battery, I think sometimes it's ok for a recipe not to include every item (glass for light on seaglide,) especially at the beginning of the game where we already need to make plenty of batteries and the collection of the crafish powder is challenge enough. Copper and Shrooms are both readily available so not having to click three more buttons doesn't really ruin my experience.

    Power level carry over in batteries while crafting i can support though, seems fair and reasonable.
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  • JackeJacke Calgary Join Date: 2017-03-20 Member: 229061Members Posts: 580 Advanced user
    dork42 wrote: »
    When we create a battery in the first place the doesn't seem to be any energy cost beyond the standard crafting cost.
    That's because the energy of the battery comes from the chemical reaction of the copper and materials from the acid mushrooms, mostly in this case by the oxidation of the copper (I'd have suggestion using zinc instead of copper). It's rather fancy to be able to make a copper battery in a way that's it's rechargeable, but once over that hurdle, the first assembly has the copper all in metallic form instead of oxidized, so it's reasonable it starts out charged.

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  • ShuttleBugShuttleBug USA Join Date: 2017-03-15 Member: 228943Members Posts: 566 Advanced user
    I still like the 6 free pC from the cyclops :D
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  • TarkannenTarkannen North Carolina Join Date: 2016-08-15 Member: 221304Members Posts: 665 Advanced user
    Jacke wrote: »
    Using discharged batteries to make other items could be solved by having the fabrication process carry over the average charge of the components into the new item. The issues with cooking fish killed losing all of their rot value could and should be changed too.

    But I think the problem with removing storing live fish is that's a big change to put into Subnautica this late in the development. Right now it's not too much of a burden hunting for fish as you can easily get an excess that you can stockpile. But if you couldn't store fish to cook and eat late, that means you'd have to cure them all. And that means more salt would be needed and it would be a slightly more complex start to the game, especially for a new player.

    That's what I always assumed that the Aquariums were for (not the Alien Containment); a way to 'store' fish with the exchange of having a small storage - and then later upgrading to the AC. I've personally never made an Aquarium since Storage works as it does, then the AC will propagate fish indefinitely after. While I can get behind Storage Lockers storing stuff on a 'quantum level' (they don't decay) it renders Aquariums as pointless... not to mention the fact that cooked fish will decay and then rot in Storage, while live fish never changes. :open_mouth:

    I'm of the opinion that all organic stuff should decay unless they are Cured, but either way they should all react the same way. Having a split decision on both sides will cause more questions once 1.0 goes live, I think. :(
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  • DrownedOutDrownedOut Habitat Join Date: 2016-05-26 Member: 217559Members Posts: 1,056 Advanced user
    Tarkannen wrote: »
    That's what I always assumed that the Aquariums were for (not the Alien Containment); a way to 'store' fish with the exchange of having a small storage - and then later upgrading to the AC. I've personally never made an Aquarium since Storage works as it does, then the AC will propagate fish indefinitely after. While I can get behind Storage Lockers storing stuff on a 'quantum level' (they don't decay) it renders Aquariums as pointless... not to mention the fact that cooked fish will decay and then rot in Storage, while live fish never changes. :open_mouth:

    I'm of the opinion that all organic stuff should decay unless they are Cured, but either way they should all react the same way. Having a split decision on both sides will cause more questions once 1.0 goes live, I think. :(

    Problem there is that I've never been able to build an aquarium inside a corridor. Is that supposed to be possible (I tried last previous stable)? Because if it's MProom only, that means you have to wait a pretty while before you can store live fish.

    I've kinda been wanting a stasis fridge for a while as an excuse/means to keep food/fuel from dying and rotting. Could easily be a remodel of the current wall lockers. Throw in a lead-based wall locker for uranium & uranite and you could use both perks as upgrades for Seamoth/PRAWN storage modules too.
    Tarkannen
  • DaveyNYDaveyNY Schenectady, NY Join Date: 2016-08-30 Member: 221903Members Posts: 1,325 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    My question to the OP is...

    So What?

    If you don't like using a particular function in the game, then don't.

    This is a Solitary Player Game...

    Stop trying to make the game into something that only fits your particular playstyle, you ARE NOT the only one playing the game.

    Some folks may like that function, some may not, use it or don't, but "Less Options" is not a great way to draw in and keep people playing ones game.
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  • 0x6A72320x6A7232 US Join Date: 2016-10-06 Member: 222906Members Posts: 4,775 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    Tarkannen wrote: »
    This has always pestered me when crafting items that use Batteries in the base recipe. However what''s more interesting is when crafting a Power Cell: if you use two dead batteries in the recipe, then the newly-created cell has 100% charge. While you might say the new cell just "re-energized" the components during fabrication, that''s fairly inaccurate. For those who know how 6 volt and 12 volt batteries work, they typically have multiple smaller batteries inside the larger casing (some 12v lantern batteries can have up to thirty-two AA batteries inside...) so while the recipe is accurate, recharging them this way is wrong.

    Also while on the subject, I'd like to point out the processing of fish. You can obviously cure fish vs cooking them so they stay fresh while moving about, but live fish stay alive indefinitely when stored in lockers, no water needed... shouldn't they die and rot?. Also, you can take fish that were killed by heat, poison clouds or Seamoth impacts (oops) and let them rot to maximum negative values... But if they're cooked or cured, they'll return to their maximum positive values, just as if they were still alive. :dizzy:

    Now this happens as the game tracks items with 'progress' meters, such as power values or fish freshness. Items that don't have them (such as normal fish) don't change values they don't have. Also when crafting, the game just checks to see if you have the base items and crafts the end result, whether the quality of the base items would logically affect the result or not.

    Now, it doesn't bother me at all now, but for the final retail launch I would like to see this changed. While I know this is more work for the devs to have to deal with, I feel it would make the game more realistic. An Old Dead Peeper should be inedible when cooked, and harm the player if he eats it. A Power Cell should have the average power level of the two Batteries that made it. I hate to be a nag, but that's just my thoughts on the matter. :blush:

    You can recharge standard Alkaline batteries. The process just isn't efficient with the way that particular tech is implemented, and part of the discharge process isn't chemically reversible. They do however, have special rechargeable alkaline batteries that have these problems solved, so... in the futre, it's not inconceivable that any sensible battery that would be fabricated would do so with rechargeable chemistry.

    http://www.tested.com/tech/1992-can-you-really-recharge-standard-alkaline-batteries/
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rechargeable_alkaline_battery

    Therefore, it makes perfect sense that the fabricator would be able to revert any dead batteries to a charged state when used in crafting. (Although why it can't be used as an instant battery charger, I dunno, lol. Maybe to charge you for fabricating a battery charger when you get back to Alterra space?)
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  • SidchickenSidchicken Plumbing the subnautican depths Join Date: 2016-02-16 Member: 213125Members Posts: 1,000 Advanced user
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    My question to the OP is...

    So What?

    If you don't like using a particular function in the game, then don't.

    This is a Solitary Player Game...

    Stop trying to make the game into something that only fits your particular playstyle, you ARE NOT the only one playing the game.

    Some folks may like that function, some may not, use it or don't, but "Less Options" is not a great way to draw in and keep people playing ones game.

    That's a pretty weak argument. "Don't fix things that make no sense and probably don't work the way they were intended because someone might like the option of abusing that loophole"... I'm sure there's a good tax code joke here, but whatever.

    Personally I like the first suggestion - remove the batteries from all the crafting recipes, and you craft the tools without batteries. Then you can craft as many or as few batts as you want / think you can get by with.

    This would also fix the floodlight exploit where you build / deconstruct floodlights repeatedly to fully charge batteries.
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  • DaveyNYDaveyNY Schenectady, NY Join Date: 2016-08-30 Member: 221903Members Posts: 1,325 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    Sidchicken wrote: »
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    My question to the OP is...

    So What?

    If you don't like using a particular function in the game, then don't.

    This is a Solitary Player Game...

    Stop trying to make the game into something that only fits your particular playstyle, you ARE NOT the only one playing the game.

    Some folks may like that function, some may not, use it or don't, but "Less Options" is not a great way to draw in and keep people playing ones game.

    That's a pretty weak argument. "Don't fix things that make no sense and probably don't work the way they were intended because someone might like the option of abusing that loophole"... I'm sure there's a good tax code joke here, but whatever.

    Personally I like the first suggestion - remove the batteries from all the crafting recipes, and you craft the tools without batteries. Then you can craft as many or as few batts as you want / think you can get by with.

    This would also fix the floodlight exploit where you build / deconstruct floodlights repeatedly to fully charge batteries.

    IF we were dealing with the IRS here, you might have a valid argument, but we're not.

    It's A GAME.

    And a Single Player Game at that.

    What one person does in their particular game, has Absolutely No Effect one what another person does in their game.

    As I have said before, stop trying to make the game in your preferred image, you are not the only one playing it...
    Having the option to use or not use a particular function of the game, is the best way to accommodate any and all players that the Dev's most likely would want using Their creation.

    Limiting the players choices doesn't bring in more folks, it drives them away.

    If you can't figure out a way to get around NOT using something in the game, then that's on you, penalizing others should not be an option.
    Morph_GuyeastofdeathSidchicken
  • Casual_PlayerCasual_Player That...is a really good question Join Date: 2016-08-30 Member: 221875Members Posts: 692 Advanced user
    And, by the looks of it, discussing the possibility of some things is also forbidden. Oh wait, IT'S NOT!

    One way to make it work would be inserting the crafting requirements of the battery on the tool recipes. Instead of needing a battery, any tool would require 2 shrooms and copper.

    Meh, the only way to see if it sticks is if it is added on a update and tested. I can't say exactely if I agree with this change or not: testing is required to see the viability.
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  • TarkannenTarkannen North Carolina Join Date: 2016-08-15 Member: 221304Members Posts: 665 Advanced user
    Sidchicken wrote: »
    This would also fix the floodlight exploit where you build / deconstruct floodlights repeatedly to fully charge batteries.

    Wait, this is a thing?? Hmm, I must test this out the next time I play... for research, I mean! Totally not as an exploit... :sunglasses:
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  • Casual_PlayerCasual_Player That...is a really good question Join Date: 2016-08-30 Member: 221875Members Posts: 692 Advanced user
    Tarkannen wrote: »
    Sidchicken wrote: »
    This would also fix the floodlight exploit where you build / deconstruct floodlights repeatedly to fully charge batteries.

    Wait, this is a thing?? Hmm, I must test this out the next time I play... for research, I mean! Totally not as an exploit... :sunglasses:

    You know, What OP suggested said is valid. If these are exploits (not confirming nor denying :wink:), changing the recipes isn't something that would impact negatively on the gameplay. Hm, perhaps if the fabricator stopped accepting dead batteries for use (either on a tool or a power cell) and recognize as "battery" either a real one or it's base components, then the value of acquiring batteries would not be lost.

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  • RainstormRainstorm Montreal (Quebec) Join Date: 2015-12-15 Member: 210003Members Posts: 1,050 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    Tarkannen wrote: »
    Sidchicken wrote: »
    This would also fix the floodlight exploit where you build / deconstruct floodlights repeatedly to fully charge batteries.

    Wait, this is a thing?? Hmm, I must test this out the next time I play... for research, I mean! Totally not as an exploit... :sunglasses:

    You know, What OP suggested said is valid. If these are exploits (not confirming nor denying :wink:), changing the recipes isn't something that would impact negatively on the gameplay. Hm, perhaps if the fabricator stopped accepting dead batteries for use (either on a tool or a power cell) and recognize as "battery" either a real one or it's base components, then the value of acquiring batteries would not be lost.

    If the Fabricator used, say, a 54% charge battery, then the tool made with this battery should come with one at 54% charge imo. problem solved :wink: Same for the floodlight, when you deconstruct it the battery you get back should be at the charge it was when you deconstructed it. Im no programmer tho i dont know how easy/hard it'd be to code it that way

    Same goes for the Powercell exploit. the total charge of the Powercell should be the sum of the charges of the 2 batteries its made of I.E -- if one of the battery is at 55% charge and the second at 45% charge then the resulting Powercell should be at 100/200 energy when made (50% charge)

    JackeCasual_Player0x6A7232Tarkannen
  • TacticalHogTacticalHog Join Date: 2017-05-04 Member: 230229Members Posts: 75 Advanced user
    oh wow, never thought of that, nice catch man
  • SidchickenSidchicken Plumbing the subnautican depths Join Date: 2016-02-16 Member: 213125Members Posts: 1,000 Advanced user
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    It's A GAME.

    And a Single Player Game at that.

    What one person does in their particular game, has Absolutely No Effect one what another person does in their game.

    As I have said before, stop trying to make the game in your preferred image, you are not the only one playing it...
    Having the option to use or not use a particular function of the game, is the best way to accommodate any and all players that the Dev's most likely would want using Their creation.

    Limiting the players choices doesn't bring in more folks, it drives them away.

    If you can't figure out a way to get around NOT using something in the game, then that's on you, penalizing others should not be an option.

    Being a single-player game does not somehow invalidate all discussion about fixing glaring exploits / bugs. And suggesting that said exploits should be fixed is not the same as trying to make the game all about one's self or one's own preferences.

    If I were to say, write a chess game, and my game allowed you to do things that the rules of chess definitely do not allow, like move a pawn sideways, people would be completely within their rights to complain, even if my chess game were single-player only. Because it's not right. If exploits were "whatever, who cares, do as you like" space, then why did Skyrim get patched to close the loophole where you could read the Ogma Infinium (I probably got the name wrong, don't care) over and over again and instantly reach max level? You're talking like people are trampling on your rights or something because they dare to suggest that exploits are exploits and aught to be fixed. That's absurd.
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  • DaveyNYDaveyNY Schenectady, NY Join Date: 2016-08-30 Member: 221903Members Posts: 1,325 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    Why is it assumed that something They designed into the game from the get-go, is now considered an "exploit"?
    Post edited by DaveyNY on
  • 0x6A72320x6A7232 US Join Date: 2016-10-06 Member: 222906Members Posts: 4,775 Advanced user
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    Why is it assumed that something They designed into the game from the get-go, is now considered an "exploit"?

    ...So the Ogma Infinium exploit was also designed into the game from the get-go? Also, Subnautica development isn't even done yet, so you can't really call it a closed book, it's still being written. :shrug:
    UWE Community guidelines | Guide to play in VR with Google Cardboard or Gear | Increase Subnautica view distance | Useful info to post with error reports | Recovery of corrupted saved games
    Crashing, lag problems? Or maybe your old save didn't get the latest update? Upload your saved game folder to help the devs troubleshoot, then try clearing your cache directories | Automatic Cache cleaning tool here | How to use the Debug Console | How to play any version of Subnautica using Steam | Tips for Subnautica beginners | Why can't the devs "just fix it"? - a modding session for you to educate yourself with Want more frames? Try adding this to your launch options: -window-mode exclusive
    Slow loading / textures popping in? Try moving Subnautica to an SSD | How to switch Subnautica to Experimental mode (clear cache afterwards) | How to run chkdsk on your drive | How to verify integrity of your game cache (in the "Installation" section) | Blue screens or computer freezing up? Try this fix (updates a corrupted DX10 compatibility file in the graphics driver that sometimes doesn't get updated)
    Subnautica launches in a tiny window? Use Task Manager to Maximize it (Thanks FlippingPower) | How to place your Moonpool so it connects correctly (includes diagrams) | Want to hang out with fellow players and the devs? Subnautica Discord server ← swing on by! | Subnautica mods - Hey look! Mods! | ReShade mods | Humans don't crush at the depths you might think
    Joystick problems? | Xpadder | UJR / vJoy | JoyToKey | Get detailed info for troubleshooting: CPU-Z | GPU-Z | HWiNFO64 | Speccy | Pastebin | Recover the data on your crashed hard disk! | I'm a Total Geek
  • DaveyNYDaveyNY Schenectady, NY Join Date: 2016-08-30 Member: 221903Members Posts: 1,325 Advanced user
    0x6A7232 wrote: »
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    Why is it assumed that something They designed into the game from the get-go, is now considered an "exploit"?

    ...So the Ogma Infinium exploit was also designed into the game from the get-go? Also, Subnautica development isn't even done yet, so you can't really call it a closed book, it's still being written. :shrug:

    Heh...

    I don't even know what that is.

    :|
  • nesrak1nesrak1 Places Join Date: 2016-12-04 Member: 224536Members Posts: 299 Advanced user
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    0x6A7232 wrote: »
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    Why is it assumed that something They designed into the game from the get-go, is now considered an "exploit"?

    ...So the Ogma Infinium exploit was also designed into the game from the get-go? Also, Subnautica development isn't even done yet, so you can't really call it a closed book, it's still being written. :shrug:

    Heh...

    I don't even know what that is.

    :|

    I took 5 seconds out of my life to search this on Google as a skyrim exploit for gaining xp.
    It took 30 seconds to type this on my phone though
    0x6A7232garath
  • 0x6A72320x6A7232 US Join Date: 2016-10-06 Member: 222906Members Posts: 4,775 Advanced user
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    0x6A7232 wrote: »
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    Why is it assumed that something They designed into the game from the get-go, is now considered an "exploit"?

    ...So the Ogma Infinium exploit was also designed into the game from the get-go? Also, Subnautica development isn't even done yet, so you can't really call it a closed book, it's still being written. :shrug:

    Heh...

    I don't even know what that is.

    :|

    In context, if you read the post before your post (which is what I was responding to):
    Sidchicken wrote: »
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    It's A GAME.

    And a Single Player Game at that.

    What one person does in their particular game, has Absolutely No Effect one what another person does in their game.

    As I have said before, stop trying to make the game in your preferred image, you are not the only one playing it...
    Having the option to use or not use a particular function of the game, is the best way to accommodate any and all players that the Dev's most likely would want using Their creation.

    Limiting the players choices doesn't bring in more folks, it drives them away.

    If you can't figure out a way to get around NOT using something in the game, then that's on you, penalizing others should not be an option.

    Being a single-player game does not somehow invalidate all discussion about fixing glaring exploits / bugs. And suggesting that said exploits should be fixed is not the same as trying to make the game all about one's self or one's own preferences.

    If I were to say, write a chess game, and my game allowed you to do things that the rules of chess definitely do not allow, like move a pawn sideways, people would be completely within their rights to complain, even if my chess game were single-player only. Because it's not right. If exploits were "whatever, who cares, do as you like" space, then why did Skyrim get patched to close the loophole where you could read the Ogma Infinium (I probably got the name wrong, don't care) over and over again and instantly reach max level? You're talking like people are trampling on your rights or something because they dare to suggest that exploits are exploits and aught to be fixed. That's absurd.

    And, when in doubt,


    nesrak1 wrote: »
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    0x6A7232 wrote: »
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    Why is it assumed that something They designed into the game from the get-go, is now considered an "exploit"?

    ...So the Ogma Infinium exploit was also designed into the game from the get-go? Also, Subnautica development isn't even done yet, so you can't really call it a closed book, it's still being written. :shrug:

    Heh...

    I don't even know what that is.

    :|

    I took 5 seconds out of my life to search this on Google as a skyrim exploit for gaining xp.
    It took 30 seconds to type this on my phone though

    ...get Google out.
    UWE Community guidelines | Guide to play in VR with Google Cardboard or Gear | Increase Subnautica view distance | Useful info to post with error reports | Recovery of corrupted saved games
    Crashing, lag problems? Or maybe your old save didn't get the latest update? Upload your saved game folder to help the devs troubleshoot, then try clearing your cache directories | Automatic Cache cleaning tool here | How to use the Debug Console | How to play any version of Subnautica using Steam | Tips for Subnautica beginners | Why can't the devs "just fix it"? - a modding session for you to educate yourself with Want more frames? Try adding this to your launch options: -window-mode exclusive
    Slow loading / textures popping in? Try moving Subnautica to an SSD | How to switch Subnautica to Experimental mode (clear cache afterwards) | How to run chkdsk on your drive | How to verify integrity of your game cache (in the "Installation" section) | Blue screens or computer freezing up? Try this fix (updates a corrupted DX10 compatibility file in the graphics driver that sometimes doesn't get updated)
    Subnautica launches in a tiny window? Use Task Manager to Maximize it (Thanks FlippingPower) | How to place your Moonpool so it connects correctly (includes diagrams) | Want to hang out with fellow players and the devs? Subnautica Discord server ← swing on by! | Subnautica mods - Hey look! Mods! | ReShade mods | Humans don't crush at the depths you might think
    Joystick problems? | Xpadder | UJR / vJoy | JoyToKey | Get detailed info for troubleshooting: CPU-Z | GPU-Z | HWiNFO64 | Speccy | Pastebin | Recover the data on your crashed hard disk! | I'm a Total Geek
  • DaveyNYDaveyNY Schenectady, NY Join Date: 2016-08-30 Member: 221903Members Posts: 1,325 Advanced user
    edited May 2017
    Two things...

    I haven't played Skyrim in about two years and, I don't go actively looking for exploits to the games I do play.

    Call me old fashioned but, purposely cheating, isn't my forte.


    I didn't even realize that the battery thing was an exploit until you pointed it out.

    I just assumed that the fabricator somehow reenergized the whole new unit being built, since it is pulling energy from my base to create the things I want.


    Perhaps instead of using just ten energy units, it should use 15 or 20 when a used battery is involved.
    B)
    0x6A7232
  • RainstormRainstorm Montreal (Quebec) Join Date: 2015-12-15 Member: 210003Members Posts: 1,050 Advanced user
    @DaveyNY

    I love your account picture very much, makes me smile everytime i see it
    that is all
    :smiley:

    Tarkannen
  • EridianVaultEridianVault Join Date: 2018-05-14 Member: 240709Members Posts: 3 Fully active user
    I love watching people argue this way.
    Kouji_San
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands, Hoogezand Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue Posts: 15,626 Advanced user
    I love watching people argue this way.
    giphy.gif

    FTFY :D

    Guardian of the "magic cookiejar" AdminModerator

    Existence Unknown

    Retired forum Admin, I mostly used a flamethrower tank for disputes... Mostly
    Retired EUPT Deputy | Moral Support | Squad 5 Blue
    102 1HP Skulk escapes and counting | Play the Latest Version of Booster Z-Frame
    YouTube NS2 Playlists: Unusual Selection | NS2 Stuff | NS2PT | NS2 Tuts

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