Weapons 1 or Armour 1?



  • CrazyEddieCrazyEddie Join Date: 2013-01-08 Member: 178196Members
    I guess we can both only speak for ourselves then.
    Fair enough. No point in arguing over who's the better representative of the worst players. :-)

    I have terrible aim but my movement is great, so I almost never kill a skulk before it's in melee range. Pretty much the only way I kill skulks is by buying me more time to shoot them by 'juking' and surviving as many bites as my armour allows.
    Maybe you're trying to solo too often? I think the real key is to travel in twos and threes, and shoot your buddy's skulk first. The skulks attacking your fellow marines make for easy targets. They're at the perfect range: they're close enough to be a large target but far enough away that their movements are small, and they're somewhat anchored at a single spot (your buddy's guts) rather than bouncing off the walls.

    That is... my point exactly?
    Ah, yes, I see now that was your point. I thought you were discounting the importance of killing fades during the midgame.

    ScardyBob wrote: »
    most NS2 combat is 2v2 or greater, where the benefit of w1 increases dramatically with more marines shooting.
    I think Bob's point here is compelling. Multiplayer engagements mean that skulks spend more time exposed to fire at range relative to the time they spend biting, which increases the value of weapons upgrades relative to armor.
  • halfofaheavenhalfofaheaven Join Date: 2012-11-09 Member: 168660Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Gold
    CrazyEddie wrote: »
    Maybe you're trying to solo too often?
    Yeah. Virtually the only thing I do as marine is suiciding on RTs over and over and generally being a PITA for aliens. Always funny how a lot of pub alien players and comms simply don't deal with me shooting all their shit down at all. Good times!
  • Angry Hillbilly 2Angry Hillbilly 2 Join Date: 2012-03-31 Member: 149741Members
    Like people said I would LOVE to see the stats on any correlations it may have made on researching W1 or A1 first. Like SBob said, that vital damage increase against BUILDINGS can make or break a first push. Taking out early alien harvesters can and in many cases HAS prevented Onos for a long time and that single switch axe swipe makes all the difference. Also W1 is being thought of as a 1vs1 scenario a group of marries with combined fire will take out a skulk faster than W0 if focused fire.
  • briatxbriatx Join Date: 2013-01-18 Member: 180352Members
    Dusteh wrote: »
    A1 > W1 > W2 > W3 > A2 > A3

    I think this is generally the best path for pub games and typically what I go with.

  • ZEROibisZEROibis Join Date: 2009-10-30 Member: 69176Members, Constellation
    Depends on how well team is preforming prior to the upgrade. If too many getting killed A if we are holding well then W.
  • FrothybeverageFrothybeverage Join Date: 2003-02-15 Member: 13593Members
    If you go W1 before A1, you have to get W2 too or it's not worth it.
  • 1dominator11dominator1 Join Date: 2010-11-19 Member: 75011Members

    It takes 2-3 bullets less to kill a skulk with W1 compared to W0. A1 gives you an extra 5+ bullets before you die.

    Simple maths, really.
    Unfortunately skulks do not fire bullets, they bite and it takes 3 bites with either a0 or a1.
    But a1 does prevent you getting parasite 2 bited.
  • halfofaheavenhalfofaheaven Join Date: 2012-11-09 Member: 168660Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Gold
    But a1 does prevent you getting parasite 2 bited.
    That was the whole point. Also, don't forget glancing bites.

  • kelevra386kelevra386 Join Date: 2012-12-18 Member: 175425Members
    A1 everytime, more staying power on the field. Especially in pub games.
  • MaximumSquidMaximumSquid Join Date: 2010-07-20 Member: 72593Members
    edited March 2013
    Marines with perfect accuracy = get welders & shotguns
    Marines with 0 accuracy or in a low player games = get mines

    When your econ isn't crap (4+ res nodes) think about dropping 2 arms labs and get both upgrades at the same time

    Single Arms Lab should be avoided unless you're planning on rushing some other tech and can't afford 2
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    I generally prefer W1 because it helps with my usual tactic of bumrushing aliens over and over doing as much damage to things that cost money as possible. It doesn't do much for skulks but it does significantly improve your ability to damage buildings. Every harvester, hydra, cyst, and even egg you destroy hurts the aliens and pushes them back, while you can die repeatedly for no loss but time.

    A marine or two relentlessly killing objects with no regard to their personal safety beyond what helps them stay alive to kill more objects is incredibly valuable early game.
  • luminalumina Join Date: 2012-06-15 Member: 153300Members
    I go a1, then w1-3, and then a2-3.
  • GorgenapperGorgenapper Join Date: 2012-09-05 Member: 157916Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    ChrisAUS wrote: »
    Skulk without Cara = 90hp
    W0 = 10 bullets
    W1 = 9 bullets

    Wait...what? I thought W0 was 10 dmg a shot.
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    ChrisAUS wrote: »
    Skulk without Cara = 90hp
    W0 = 10 bullets
    W1 = 9 bullets

    Wait...what? I thought W0 was 10 dmg a shot.

    1 regen tick
  • archwaykittenarchwaykitten Join Date: 2013-01-18 Member: 180431Members
    Wow. Well debated Strofix. You've got me wanting to try out all sorts of W3 builds now. I especially like the points you made about how the entire build order and game plan can and should change to provide better synergy with the W3 choice.
  • ellnicellnic Join Date: 2010-07-19 Member: 72559Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    All depends really. If the alien team are any where decent I would like armour 1st. If not then wepons level 1 First.
  • MrPinkMrPink Join Date: 2002-05-28 Member: 678Members
    It's definitely not worth it to get 2 tiers out, so weap3 before armor2 or weap2 before armor1. Maybe if there's onos on the field before you're 2/2, but that's pretty rare for a game that isn't completely lost.
  • |strofix||strofix| Join Date: 2012-11-01 Member: 165453Members
    edited March 2013
    ChrisAUS wrote: »
    I would rather have w2 a1 vs a fade than w3 a0.
    Strofix, which servers do you play on? Seems like there is alot of hidden talent sitting around unnoticed when NA or EU teams seem to always be looking for players.

    Intoxicated and MWEB server... in South Africa.
    The average level of raw skill tends to be pretty high in all games over here, simply because we don't have the casual player base, and most of everyone who plays, plays a lot. However its always difficult to take a game to the next level with things like coordination and teamwork because there isn't any competition to play against.
    ellnic wrote: »
    All depends really. If the alien team are any where decent I would like armour 1st. If not then wepons level 1 First.

    Armour is essentially only usable in melee range. To me, I interpret this as "If the alien team is decent, I want to fight them in melee range". You can't always kill a skulk before it gets into melee, obviously, but why get upgrades to benefit a marine when he is at his weakest, when you can rather get upgrades that improve a marine at his best, and potentially prevent his weakness from ever being exploited?

  • Ghosthree3Ghosthree3 Join Date: 2010-02-13 Member: 70557Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    Why not make a marines weakness not so weak?

    Even Archaea goes A1 first, just sayin.
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