I tried to convince a random tf2 player that completing dustbowl stage 3 was impossible due to that they got half the spawn time then the regular 20-25 seconds but he refused to understand. He started jabbering about building sentries and teleporters and then defending them with ubers and shoot away their heavy ubers so they don't get to kill our forward sentries. Because really, spawning right next to the final CP is just as fair as spawning on the other side of the map with the objective to take it, for every class in the game can teleport to the front or run across the map in the 3 second advantage we got in spawn time.
Now I realize I might have been trolled. No. I HOPE I was being trolled. It actually feels better if you know the other person understands but still try to ridicule anything you say.
<!--quoteo(post=1686227:date=Aug 19 2008, 03:32 PM:name=Svenpa)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Svenpa @ Aug 19 2008, 03:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1686227"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I tried to convince a random tf2 player that completing dustbowl stage 3 was impossible <b>due to that they got half the spawn time then the regular 20-25 seconds</b>[...]<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I believe this was the important part. I've seen dustbowl stage three point two captured plenty of times, but that was on servers with 24 players and normal spawn time. I'm willing to believe that with halved spawn time, it becomes all but impossible.
Only Red had adjusted spawn time, blu (my team) still got 5-7 second spawn against 10-12 seconds. With both teams rather equal in skill, tipping slightly on our favor (if you want to believe the scoreboard) it was very very tough and hardly fair. We did reach the final corner a few times but as the entire red team could respawn and rush in almost two times over before everyone on blu could get to the front we had extremely small chances of ever winning. Red also has the luxury of waiting with their own uber until blu triggers their own thus always winning in the end and pushing the rest back.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo(post=1686225:date=Aug 19 2008, 03:12 PM:name=Svenpa)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Svenpa @ Aug 19 2008, 03:12 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1686225"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Fast respawn or "custom spawn time" is the dumbest thing to ever become a plugin/setting for non-mirrored maps. It COMPLETELY breaks any balance the map had.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> QFT!
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
The necrophix TF2 server has had an arena map in rotation for quite a long time(called cp_arena). It's great for fewer players(below 6v6), but I'm skeptical of it scaling into anything but crazyness.
Might make is slightly useful when defending the last cap and preparing for an uber rush.
The pyro's airgun is useful for that but compared to a good soldier or demo he's still mince meat.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Ah, didn't think about that. One of the few useful bits I'd say.
I can't seriously think that they made each bullet effect speed every time it hit, there must be a second or two in cooldown or it would be ridiculously overpowered. Even if you barely do damage at long ranges it still often hits.
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
Thinking about the new minigun, it sure is a strange weapon. It's a very distinct teamplay vs skill tradeoff. It's much easy to track players if you're slowing them down, making playing heavy easier, but the ability is very helpful to your teammates nearby.
<!--quoteo(post=1686246:date=Aug 19 2008, 12:39 PM:name=Align)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Align @ Aug 19 2008, 12:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1686246"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You really feel that 25% less damage outweighs noone being able to run away or dodge?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Nobody can dodge a minigun, and if anyone is far enough to run away without the slow, then they're probablyf ar enough to escape WITH the slow, unless it's a huge amount of slow, because at that distance the minigun's damage output is moderate to low, and minus another 25% it won't be anything to fear.
We'll see, though. We'll get our hands on the gun pretty soon and then we'll know if it's any good.
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
New weapon is up. It's the sandwich. Not as a taunt, but as a shotgun replacement.
I am totally disappointed with this update. What a great idea... remove the heavy's only fast weapon... that will really help to make him not dependent on a medic!
uh... not only is it the shotgun replacement, as you say, but it's FOUR SECONDS of being unable to do anything, completely vulnerable... for 120 health =/
Link for the lazy: <a href="http://steamgames.com/tf2/heavy/sandvich.htm" target="_blank">http://steamgames.com/tf2/heavy/sandvich.htm</a>
I think some of you are taking "without a medic" to mean "alone", whereas I see it as being significantly more useful when moving with a team that you can duck behind while eating. Sure the other people don't have means of healing, but everyone else can avoid getting hurt in the first place a lot easier.
douchebagatronCustom member titleJoin Date: 2003-12-20Member: 24581Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
regardless of its usefulness, its still hilarious. especially the video. and what i like the most about the heavy update is that it makes teamwork help a lot more. heavies can be effective without a medic provided they have someone to cover them for their lunch, and a heavy with slow can help anyone get kills.
i think once we see these in game they are going to be pretty good.
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1686260:date=Aug 19 2008, 04:32 PM:name=Svenpa)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Svenpa @ Aug 19 2008, 04:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1686260"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->"Increased The Kritzkrieg's uber-charge rate bonus from 10% to 25%"<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> That is a very good thing. I might actually use the Kritz now.
Full changelog in case anyone else is having trouble getting on steam: <!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1-->Updates to Team Fortress 2 have been released. The updates will be applied automatically when your Steam client is restarted. The specific changes include:
Added 3 Heavy unlockables
* Natascha, The Sandvich, The Killing Gloves of Boxing * Added 35 new Heavy achievements
Added cp_steel, a community map by Jamie "Fishbus" Manson
Changes
* Added server map timeleft to upper right of scoreboard * Added new firing sounds to The Backburner * Removed the Custom Tab in the serverbrowser, and added the Tags field to the base Internet Tab * Increased The Kritzkrieg's uber-charge rate bonus from 10% to 25% * 32 player servers can now support an extra slot of SourceTV * Made the freezecam item panel description easier to read * Players now broadcast whether they chose a team directly or use autoteam * Added proper handling of cart blocking recognition to Payload maps
Bug fixes
* Fixed bug where switching from flaregun-wielding Pyro to another class meant you didn't get a full ammo loadout on first spawn * Fixed Spy watch arm not using team skins * Fixed weapon switching preventing you from using secondary attacks for a 0.2s window after the primary became available * Fixed players getting stuck in a bad animation state when class switching while spinning the minigun * Fixed a loophole that allowed players to pickup weapons of other classes * Fixed a bug that resulted in players earning more crit chance bonus in large, single damage events than they are supposed to * Fixed an issue with the floating HUD +X health indicators that resulted in them appearing incorrectly * Fixed a bug which caused the minigun spinning & firing sounds to occasionally stop while the Heavy was still firing * Fixes the Loadout player model panel causing the in-game player facial animation to perform incorrectly * Fixed spectators not having the target ID labels display correctly * Fixed the cart alarm sound occasionally getting stuck on in Payload maps<!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->
I like sandvich but it's definitively not worth the shotgun tradeoff. Eating is not as slow as I feared.
Natasha seems to be broken, or severely underpowered. I have yet to feel any special movement penalty when shot by it, then again, I haven't played scout either.
No comment yet on KGB gloves. All I know is that they give a nice do-run-the-hell-away-from-me sparkle when you actually get a kill.
The kill taunt is ridiculously hard to get unless someone is literally afk in the field. The pyro had speed and could get behind snipers but a heavy is just too big and slow to get near anyone standing still from behind.
<!--quoteo(post=1686272:date=Aug 19 2008, 08:08 PM:name=Svenpa)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Svenpa @ Aug 19 2008, 08:08 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1686272"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Natasha seems to be broken, or severely underpowered. I have yet to feel any special movement penalty when shot by it, then again, I haven't played scout either.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> It does work, I was hit by it as a medic and the speed reduction was <i>very</i> significant. I'd say 70-80% maybe, at the very least 65%.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
I've seen the kill taunt, kill trough the setup fence on goldrush. Natasha also slows you down when you sticky/rocketjump, quite annoying if you want to make a long jump and fall short.
And dustbowl is simply impossible now on third stage with 90% heavy defending team, they are so big and fat nothing can get past <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> Spray n' pray x 8 also works very well against spies on that stage...
cp_steel seem to like many small spaces rather then a few bigger ones. The best part is that you can always distract the team away from a CP by going for E directly, so in the end blu mostly get 3 points.
Arena maps crap on spies by showing "THIS IS YOUR TEAM" right at start, most skilled people know who is where or have died and such. Overall I find arena matches too short, dustbowl/payload maps reach around 25min at maximum, usually around 18min, which is just right. Guess it's some residue from NS which makes me like a bit longer games, heck, even NS combat was longer then 1 minute.
pl_badwater seems like a cool map so far, lots of paths for flanking, explosion jumping, spying etc. My only gripe is the final area. I can't say specifically, it just isn't to my liking.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Quick question...
Anyone else have this problem, where you filter on servers that have players. As a logical result you see servers with players in them (even checking game info of the server). Then you go ahead and start to join the server, only to find out that there are no player in there...
Can't compare it to other source based games as I only play TF2 on that platform. It's weird...
Anyone else have this problem, where you filter on servers that have players. As a logical result you see servers with players in them (even checking game info of the server). Then you go ahead and start to join the server, only to find out that there are no player in there...
Can't compare it to other source based games as I only play TF2 on that platform. It's weird...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeah, I've been getting that too.
I think some servers might be falsifying the reported players to try to get more people to join... Either that or there is just a bug in the server browser.
Comments
Now I realize I might have been trolled. No. I HOPE I was being trolled. It actually feels better if you know the other person understands but still try to ridicule anything you say.
<span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>You clever little troll</span>
I believe this was the important part. I've seen dustbowl stage three point two captured plenty of times, but that was on servers with 24 players and normal spawn time. I'm willing to believe that with halved spawn time, it becomes all but impossible.
QFT!
Might make is slightly useful when defending the last cap and preparing for an uber rush.
The pyro's airgun is useful for that but compared to a good soldier or demo he's still mince meat.
Might make is slightly useful when defending the last cap and preparing for an uber rush.
The pyro's airgun is useful for that but compared to a good soldier or demo he's still mince meat.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ah, didn't think about that. One of the few useful bits I'd say.
Still, I'd rather full damage.
Nobody can dodge a minigun, and if anyone is far enough to run away without the slow, then they're probablyf ar enough to escape WITH the slow, unless it's a huge amount of slow, because at that distance the minigun's damage output is moderate to low, and minus another 25% it won't be anything to fear.
We'll see, though. We'll get our hands on the gun pretty soon and then we'll know if it's any good.
I am totally disappointed with this update. What a great idea... remove the heavy's only fast weapon... that will really help to make him not dependent on a medic!
Link for the lazy:
<a href="http://steamgames.com/tf2/heavy/sandvich.htm" target="_blank">http://steamgames.com/tf2/heavy/sandvich.htm</a>
i think once we see these in game they are going to be pretty good.
"Increased The Kritzkrieg's uber-charge rate bonus from 10% to 25%"
Oh shi-
"Added new firing sounds to The Backburner"
Always nice with variation.
That is a very good thing. I might actually use the Kritz now.
Full changelog in case anyone else is having trouble getting on steam:
<!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1-->Updates to Team Fortress 2 have been released. The updates will be applied automatically when your Steam client is restarted. The specific changes include:
Added 3 Heavy unlockables
* Natascha, The Sandvich, The Killing Gloves of Boxing
* Added 35 new Heavy achievements
Added Arena game mode
* 5 arenas: Lumberyard, Ravine, Well, Granary, Badlands
Added cp_steel, a community map by Jamie "Fishbus" Manson
Changes
* Added server map timeleft to upper right of scoreboard
* Added new firing sounds to The Backburner
* Removed the Custom Tab in the serverbrowser, and added the Tags field to the base Internet Tab
* Increased The Kritzkrieg's uber-charge rate bonus from 10% to 25%
* 32 player servers can now support an extra slot of SourceTV
* Made the freezecam item panel description easier to read
* Players now broadcast whether they chose a team directly or use autoteam
* Added proper handling of cart blocking recognition to Payload maps
Bug fixes
* Fixed bug where switching from flaregun-wielding Pyro to another class meant you didn't get a full ammo loadout on first spawn
* Fixed Spy watch arm not using team skins
* Fixed weapon switching preventing you from using secondary attacks for a 0.2s window after the primary became available
* Fixed players getting stuck in a bad animation state when class switching while spinning the minigun
* Fixed a loophole that allowed players to pickup weapons of other classes
* Fixed a bug that resulted in players earning more crit chance bonus in large, single damage events than they are supposed to
* Fixed an issue with the floating HUD +X health indicators that resulted in them appearing incorrectly
* Fixed a bug which caused the minigun spinning & firing sounds to occasionally stop while the Heavy was still firing
* Fixes the Loadout player model panel causing the in-game player facial animation to perform incorrectly
* Fixed spectators not having the target ID labels display correctly
* Fixed the cart alarm sound occasionally getting stuck on in Payload maps<!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->
"Nom nom nom"
<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
Natasha seems to be broken, or severely underpowered. I have yet to feel any special movement penalty when shot by it, then again, I haven't played scout either.
No comment yet on KGB gloves. All I know is that they give a nice do-run-the-hell-away-from-me sparkle when you actually get a kill.
The kill taunt is ridiculously hard to get unless someone is literally afk in the field. The pyro had speed and could get behind snipers but a heavy is just too big and slow to get near anyone standing still from behind.
It does work, I was hit by it as a medic and the speed reduction was <i>very</i> significant. I'd say 70-80% maybe, at the very least 65%.
That is all.
And dustbowl is simply impossible now on third stage with 90% heavy defending team, they are so big and fat nothing can get past <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> Spray n' pray x 8 also works very well against spies on that stage...
Arena maps crap on spies by showing "THIS IS YOUR TEAM" right at start, most skilled people know who is where or have died and such. Overall I find arena matches too short, dustbowl/payload maps reach around 25min at maximum, usually around 18min, which is just right. Guess it's some residue from NS which makes me like a bit longer games, heck, even NS combat was longer then 1 minute.
pl_badwater seems like a cool map so far, lots of paths for flanking, explosion jumping, spying etc. My only gripe is the final area. I can't say specifically, it just isn't to my liking.
Anyone else have this problem, where you filter on servers that have players. As a logical result you see servers with players in them (even checking game info of the server). Then you go ahead and start to join the server, only to find out that there are no player in there...
Can't compare it to other source based games as I only play TF2 on that platform. It's weird...
Anyone else have this problem, where you filter on servers that have players. As a logical result you see servers with players in them (even checking game info of the server). Then you go ahead and start to join the server, only to find out that there are no player in there...
Can't compare it to other source based games as I only play TF2 on that platform. It's weird...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, I've been getting that too.
I think some servers might be falsifying the reported players to try to get more people to join... Either that or there is just a bug in the server browser.