Ye are forgetting that this is a mod and not a full game. Nobody ever rates mods and everyone is allowed to download mods even if they contained lots of violence
<!--QuoteBegin--Zawath+Oct. 02 2002,14:51--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Zawath @ Oct. 02 2002,14:51)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->Nobody ever rates mods<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wrong. There´s websites for JUST that and even some of the popular gaming magazines do that from time to time (some even monthly). So... no.
<!--QuoteBegin--Zawath+Oct. 02 2002,10:38--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Zawath @ Oct. 02 2002,10:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->Blood is needed. Otherwise those little kiddies think that nothing happens when you shoot somebody with a shotgun.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> hahahhaha, that is true, but Doom had blood and all the kids that shot down their friends said "Doom made me do it" or "I didnt know it would hurt"
Necro<insert non-birthday-related title here>Join Date: 2002-08-09Member: 1118Members
<!--QuoteBegin--Flea+Oct. 02 2002,15:09--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Flea @ Oct. 02 2002,15:09)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--Zawath+Oct. 02 2002,10:38--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Zawath @ Oct. 02 2002,10:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->Blood is needed. Otherwise those little kiddies think that nothing happens when you shoot somebody with a shotgun.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> hahahhaha, that is true, but Doom had blood and all the kids that shot down their friends said "Doom made me do it" or "I didnt know it would hurt"<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> rofl
Hmm... you have huge aliens with sharp claws and aliens that hock up buildings as structures.... and they bleed... yet the marines have super metal or what? No blood?
I dunno... I've said this before... but... Why make your mod Teen for a Mature game?....Well, of course, if it is Teen, and it goes Retail you can get more audience but oh well....
I myself am in favour of blood. However, if the devs don't want blood, no blood it shall be and i'm behind that. However, they now FORCE people to play without marine blood (with the HA i think its a good thing there are sparks instead of blood), while they actually should make it an option (to my idea). Some people like gore, others don't.
I dont say i need massive goreness (without blood as it is now its good to, you don't notice it really), but i think NS feels pretty realistic (for how realistic you can get in fighting marines against aliens in the near future) and bleeding is part of it. So, i say make a cl_blood or something wich is automatically turned off, so people who like to see some blood when they shoot/bite someone can put effort into getting blood in.
but hey, nobody ever listens to me *mumble grumble* <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->
no, i think its good as it is, i just would rather have a small amount of blood in, as it's more realistic...
Totaly agree with Shuvit. Noone <i>needs</i> blood and/or gore and it definative(?) shouldn't be used excessive. But I think when there were a option like "enable Blood&Gore" somewhere in the customize-tab everything would be fine. But then again I'm not sure how strikt the mentioned laws are about that, so a simple cvar (console-variable) would do it as well, as long as the default disables blood. In my opinion blood adds sometimes a bit to the atmosphere, but I think in a fast and action-paced (?) game like NS (it is fast, isn't it?) you won't notice it and NS doesn't need anything more in the atmosphere-section...
A little bit of blood would only make sense, I mean you're not killing their armor are you? Besides, when I see sparks fly off of something I think "Wow, I must not be hurting him" instead of vice versa.
To me blood and gore is just something I take for granted and pretty much ignore in a game. And I don't recall NS being about imitating life-like scenarios- it's about having fun. Fun in strategy and skill and teamplay, not texas chainsaw massacre.
It seems to me that blood is being discussed as a graphical enhancement right now, but it's a little more than that.
Blood to me is a tactical feature somewhat, rather than a graphical 'enhancement'. Of course I'm talking about the blood decals that get pasted onto a wall when someone gets shot/mauled/manually amputated/etc., but not killed and therefore, lacking a corpse on the ground. Without some blood patches, there's no easily identifiable evidence of conflict.
I use these blood decals in other mods to see where battle has taken place and not necessarily to gawk at the pretty red paint.
Some examples: I see blood splatter on a house wall a little distance away, I'm gonna assume there's a sniper who just missed a frag shot but got some hits nontheless on some poor soul. Also in this case, bullet holes from missed shots may be a little difficult to see.
I'm an alien when I finally get to play NS, my buddy just attacked a marine and got killed, doing some damage. But since marines don't leave blood, I'll have nearly no idea that there was conflict, unless I notice a disappearing alien outline through a wall (you know, b/c aliens can see each other through walls, right?) It might have been a team of marines that are now setting up an ambush, or just one left straggling away.
Of course I haven't played NS yet, so I don't know if this is how the game really is or if there are any other idicators of conflict.
So I hope that blood will be included in future releases; not in massive amounts, but just enough to get some use out of it.
Oh, I'm new to this forum so, greetings to all of you and I'll try to refrain from being a stupid newbie.
Welcome monkeyfruit, I hope you have a nice time here. Some cogent points but not neccesarily applicable to NS. What with movement tracking, hivesight and the commander, staring at blood spots isnt neccesary. Plus, aliens do bleed so there should still be signs of a conflict. Oh and your not tracking the aliens down really, you know where they need to be, resource nodes, hive points, choke points etc and blood wont help you to meet up with them between those points, that comes down to experiance. Finally, just seeing blood on the floor is no guarentee there has been a fight there. A stupid marine could have accidently shot himself with a GL or something (happens more than it should in most games, why would NS be any different).
Again, welcome to the forums. Just read all the FAQs and follow basic ettiquette and youll be huggled repeatedly.
IF you take time to look at the blood on the floor, you're missing the HMG leveled in your direction. The sniper scenario isn't really applicable in NS. I'm hoping that players have a tendancy to move around enough that a blood splatter won't give away their position in an advantageous manner. (is that a word?)
Blood wouldn't ruin the game, but I really don't think it holds any significance either. Ah well, what will be will be. <!--emo&::onos::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tiny.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::onos::'><!--endemo-->
Oh, and uh.. heh. WELCOME TO THE FORUMS <!--emo&:D--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'><!--endemo-->
>I realize I probably sound condscending(sp??) but I was simply trying to point out why they left out blood- it's been discussed MANY times as I hear it<
<!--QuoteBegin--Flea+Oct. 02 2002,00:09--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Flea @ Oct. 02 2002,00:09)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--Zawath+Oct. 02 2002,10:38--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Zawath @ Oct. 02 2002,10:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->Blood is needed. Otherwise those little kiddies think that nothing happens when you shoot somebody with a shotgun.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> hahahhaha, that is true, but Doom had blood and all the kids that shot down their friends said "Doom made me do it" or "I didnt know it would hurt"<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeah, its funny when you read anti-video game violence articles. I just read one in which a "successful scientific study" was made on 60 8-year-old boys. 30 played Double Dragon for 20 minutes, the other 30 played Excite Bike. Afterwards, the children were paired up to play together. Apparently more "violent behavior" was displayed in the DD kids. Absolute proof that violent video games should be banned forever <!--emo&???--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'><!--endemo--> I'm not joking at all. They actually do these kinds of tests, and it actually convinces people too. Wow, if I could get my hands on these people I'd show them my own kinda violence. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/asrifle.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::asrifle::'><!--endemo-->
ok when you are using one of your few projectiles as an alien against a marine, its easier to lock onto them with your crossheirs if they squirt blood when you hit them. Sparks are all dandy and everything, but there not easy as blood to see from down a dark long corridor, red really sticks out good against all the metalic tones I have seen on the levels. Sparks, dont stick out that well against metallic tones. Now I was fine with this when I thought we could put blood in ourselves, now I find out we cant even do that, this will put me at a huge disadvantage using aliens.
[edit]Plus shooting a marind in the face without him bleeding would looks tacky <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->[/edit]
You wouldn't know, because you haven't played the game.
Those who have played the game says it doesn't really matter. <!--emo&:D--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'><!--endemo-->
This isn't a debate about gameplay mechanics, we're all quite aware of how blood looks in Half-Life and it's mods. So we can pretty much assume what that will be like, even if we have no idea how the game will play.
<!--QuoteBegin--Radiocage+Oct. 02 2002,18:45--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Radiocage @ Oct. 02 2002,18:45)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->You wouldn't know, because you haven't played the game.
Those who have played the game says it doesn't really matter. <!--emo&:D--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Im sorry im not a PT, does that mean I cant make suggestions or voice my oppinions? <!--emo&???--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'><!--endemo-->
However, i think blood is necesary for marines in NS. Why? Hmm, lets see... I remember GW, when their hitboxes and sprites were somewhat messed up. You would shoot someone and when it hit them you would see sparks flying out instead of blood. How bad could this be? VERY bad. Most people shoot something and watch for bleeding to see whether they are missing or hitting their target. When i see sparks fly out of something, i believe i missed the target because my bullets hit the metallic wall behind it and therefore indicates bullets ricocheting off the walls.
My most important question though, is why do marines not bleed and aliens can? Does it really make it suitable for more audiences for humans not to bleed but there and there, you see them shooting aliens and splattering blood all over the walls? How is it different? Wouldnt that make little kids start shooting animals around their neighborhoods, start hunting their neighbor's cat with a shotgun, shooting it and saying "HA! I 0wnZed j00 evil skulk!"
No... i believe blood should be in for marines also, and if anyones comes here with the "realistic" excuse, then tell me why not have both sparks AND blood squirt out? It would be more realistic, because no one gets hurt if bullets bounce off their armor. Heck, i would just keep on going and shooting those damned aliens.
So, i would like to know why blood isnt visible for marines. I understand not having gibs, and i wouldnt miss them at all, but blood IS necessary. Not just a detail but it also plays a major role gameplay wise for some people. The fact that it doesnt for others is just personal taste.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->When i see sparks fly out of something, i believe i missed the target because my bullets hit the metallic wall behind it and therefore indicates bullets ricocheting off the walls. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Will you think that when youve played NS for more than 5 mins? Answer: No
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin--> Wouldnt that make little kids start shooting animals around their neighborhoods, start hunting their neighbor's cat with a shotgun, shooting it and saying "HA! I 0wnZed j00 evil skulk!" <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Aliens have green blood and are trying to rip your face off. Cats arent quite that bad. Answer: No
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin--> and if anyones comes here with the "realistic" excuse <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> The realism argument is <i>for</i> blood. We dont want blood as it adds nothing to the game and means the game wouldnt be suitable for younger players.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->but blood IS necessary. Not just a detail but it also plays a major role gameplay wise for some people. The fact that it doesnt for others is just personal taste.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Answers:No, No and No. It isnt necessary, it doesnt play a major role in gameplay and it isnt just down to personal taste.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->Sparks are all dandy and everything, but there not easy as blood to see from down a dark long corridor<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Sparks are easier, sparks are... well sparks, they show up in dark places (if they didnt they wouldnt be sparks would they). Blood can often be lost, in fact I hardly notice it. TBH I know Im hitting the enemy through instinct and experience, when my crosshairs are over them and when they die, blood makes no difference.
<!--QuoteBegin--CMEast+Oct. 03 2002,08:01--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (CMEast @ Oct. 03 2002,08:01)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->Cats arent quite that bad.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> No! all the evil earth-skulks must die! DIE!!!
-
seriously, this whole discussion is not about gameplay or anything. The marines letting of sparks could be quite realistic, because they are in mechanical-like armor wich is hit and not the real marine (exept for the head)... However, the HA is the only marine totally mechanical (from wich i think its good that he bleeds sparks)...
the normal marine has pads, wich means he can be hit for real and so he can die and bleed. Of course the suit would get this blood and contain it, but for me it just doesnt feel right when you shoot someone and he does not bleed.
You can say that its PG-13 and that people must stop watching violence and so on, but then again, dont go play a game where the goal is to kill your enemy.
<!--QuoteBegin--{US-DF}Rico+Oct. 02 2002,20:41--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> ({US-DF}Rico @ Oct. 02 2002,20:41)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->When i see sparks fly out of something, i believe i missed the target because my bullets hit the metallic wall behind it and therefore indicates bullets ricocheting off the walls.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Then you've been brainwashed by bad movie physics. Bullets don't cause sparks to fly when they hit metal walls in real life.
Now don't any of you say 'then how do marines make sparks when they're hit by bullets?' or I'll scream. There needs to be some way to tell you're hitting a marine. Of course, the only time you'll ever really notice the sparks is when you're spiking the marines as a Lerk. Just about every other attack is either something that wouldn't really cause bleeding (spores, acid rocket/spit/explosion, trampling) or is a melee attack that has sound confirmation when you hit (you'll understand once you play), the sound being a much easier way to tell you got him then a splatter of blood with your mouth closed.
Furthermore, I had something important to put in this third paragraph, but have since forgotten what it was going to be.
coilAmateur pirate. Professional monkey. All pance.Join Date: 2002-04-12Member: 424Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
Actually, that's an excellent point.
Blood spatters in HL and mods are presumed to be exit-would splatters - hence they appear on the wall behind the victim. There is not a single alien weapon that would make such a wound.
As Greedo said as well, the only alien weapon that relies on hit confirmation, really, is the Lerk's spike gun. There is a very clear (and attractive) sprite to represent the lerk hitting something, and it's obvious when that "something" is a marine or a wall. And then there's the spikes to boot. The other ranged weapons:
Parasite: little-no blood involved. Has a hit-confirmation sound. Spit: liquid attack. No breaking the skin, no blood. Splash sound denotes hit. Healing Spray: spore-like, short range attack. Spikes: Penetration, but no exit wound. Sprite and sound hit confirmation. Spore cloud: duh. Acid Rocket: see "Spit". Splash confirmation sound. Paralyze: no damage. no blood. Confirmation = immobile marine.
As for Bite, Leap, Babblers, Bite, Slash, Bite, and Charge... they're melee attacks and have very obvious hit confirmation sounds, as Greedo said. Xenocide and Bile Bomb are area effect; hit confirmation is either unnecessary or obvious.
Point? Blood as confirmation that you hit a marine isn't needed. It works excellently for the marines; you know you hit the Lerk in the vent when your flashlight shows green splotches on the wall from your bullets. But there's no need or point for it on the other side.
On another note. This has been discussed a million times, and the devs are not changing their minds. Can we drop and/or lock this?
And so are some cats. I live with one <!--emo&:0--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'><!--endemo-->
Personaly, I would rather see alien blood than human blood, and besides, the PT's/Devs have all made excellent examples and points as to why there is not blood for the marines. Sounds cool to me, I'm sure you won't notice it ingame(as a problem).
<!--QuoteBegin--Silver Fox+Oct. 03 2002,00:27--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Silver Fox @ Oct. 03 2002,00:27)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->another 'omfg we need blood cause ns needs to be realistic and we need to know where battles have taken place!' thread.
ffs.
You dont need blood in NS. Period.
It will provide no additional gameplay. Period.
Its not needed nor is it wanted by the DEV's.
If you want blood, go play SOF/2. Plenty of it to keep you happy.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Emm you dont "need" guns in ns you dont "need" aliens in ns, you dont "need" a commander mode in ns, you dont "need" blood in ns either, I personally think it would add to the effect of gameplay atmosphere just as much as those other things. It adds to the effect, for some people a bit of fun. Period
Yes its Flayras decision to leave it out, but we are wrong about our oppinions because of this? No, <b>they are oppinions</b>no one is right or wrong about the subject either way, and no one deserves a snappy response telling them there wrong.
BTW silverfox, you dont "need" to flame every one for saying they would perfer blood. I havnt cussed out any one or done anything to deserve your hosile respones.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin--> or done anything to deserve your hosile respones. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sorry, I didnt realise I was stalking you on this forum and posting in such a manor to offend you. Nor did I think my original post was dirrected toward you or any one individual in anyway. I must have forgot my PC mask in my closet. So very, very sorry.
Dont need guns?
wtf are you going to kill the other team with? your hands? NS - the Boxing game.
Dont need aliens?
"Squad! Move out and eliminate ... the .. uh .. er, never mind ..."
Dont need commander mode?
I suppose your right there. Its not <b>needed</b>, however its one of the most intriguing features of the mod. Its as much a part of NS as guns, aliens, or what ever you want to be sarcastic about.
What kind of gameplay could it possibly enhance? NS isn't ment to be a super suspenseful game when your hearts beating 100 miles an hour and there's barely any light anywhere with body parts, blood every where and toppled structures. Sure, it is suspenseful, but its more of a by-product of the game. It doesnt need the blood to create that enviroment - it can create it just fine without it.
It will offer <b>no</b> enhancement into NS, at all and in my <b><i>opinion</b></i> would only make NS look tacky.
Your entitled to your opinions and go ahead and state them. However, when the same damn topic has been brought up before with the same conclusion thats going to happen here, its rather redundant to keep spewing your <i>opinion</i> all over the place.
Apparently, you've never seen me flame someone before. My original post wasnt an attack on anyone. I was simply stating my <b>opinions</b> on the subject and you assumed I was attacking someone. Nor is this ment to be an attack on you, I'm mearly defending myself and my original post.
I don't think I've singled out any single person in any of my posts and 'flame' them in my whole history on this forum.
Also, if you want to get sarcastic even more, who says we "need" huds, weapons, teams, gameplay, servers, or hell, even NS itself? We could just all imagine it in our heads! Then, it could be what you always wanted it to be and be as damn bloody as you please.
Ok, so the last part was borderline flame, but I guess theres a first time for everything.
Comments
Wrong. There´s websites for JUST that and even some of the popular gaming magazines do that from time to time (some even monthly). So... no.
hahahhaha, that is true, but Doom had blood and all the kids that shot down their friends said "Doom made me do it" or "I didnt know it would hurt"
hahahhaha, that is true, but Doom had blood and all the kids that shot down their friends said "Doom made me do it" or "I didnt know it would hurt"<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
rofl
I dunno... I've said this before... but... Why make your mod Teen for a Mature game?....Well, of course, if it is Teen, and it goes Retail you can get more audience but oh well....
I dont say i need massive goreness (without blood as it is now its good to, you don't notice it really), but i think NS feels pretty realistic (for how realistic you can get in fighting marines against aliens in the near future) and bleeding is part of it. So, i say make a cl_blood or something wich is automatically turned off, so people who like to see some blood when they shoot/bite someone can put effort into getting blood in.
but hey, nobody ever listens to me *mumble grumble* <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->
no, i think its good as it is, i just would rather have a small amount of blood in, as it's more realistic...
Noone <i>needs</i> blood and/or gore and it definative(?) shouldn't be used excessive.
But I think when there were a option like "enable Blood&Gore" somewhere in the customize-tab everything would be fine. But then again I'm not sure how strikt the mentioned laws are about that, so a simple cvar (console-variable) would do it as well, as long as the default disables blood.
In my opinion blood adds sometimes a bit to the atmosphere, but I think in a fast and action-paced (?) game like NS (it is fast, isn't it?) you won't notice it and NS doesn't need anything more in the atmosphere-section...
Remind why your shooting a fellow marine with a shotgun.
Blood to me is a tactical feature somewhat, rather than a graphical 'enhancement'. Of course I'm talking about the blood decals that get pasted onto a wall when someone gets shot/mauled/manually amputated/etc., but not killed and therefore, lacking a corpse on the ground. Without some blood patches, there's no easily identifiable evidence of conflict.
I use these blood decals in other mods to see where battle has taken place and not necessarily to gawk at the pretty red paint.
Some examples:
I see blood splatter on a house wall a little distance away, I'm gonna assume there's a sniper who just missed a frag shot but got some hits nontheless on some poor soul. Also in this case, bullet holes from missed shots may be a little difficult to see.
I'm an alien when I finally get to play NS, my buddy just attacked a marine and got killed, doing some damage. But since marines don't leave blood, I'll have nearly no idea that there was conflict, unless I notice a disappearing alien outline through a wall (you know, b/c aliens can see each other through walls, right?) It might have been a team of marines that are now setting up an ambush, or just one left straggling away.
Of course I haven't played NS yet, so I don't know if this is how the game really is or if there are any other idicators of conflict.
So I hope that blood will be included in future releases; not in massive amounts, but just enough to get some use out of it.
Oh, I'm new to this forum so, greetings to all of you and I'll try to refrain from being a stupid newbie.
Plus, aliens do bleed so there should still be signs of a conflict.
Oh and your not tracking the aliens down really, you know where they need to be, resource nodes, hive points, choke points etc and blood wont help you to meet up with them between those points, that comes down to experiance.
Finally, just seeing blood on the floor is no guarentee there has been a fight there. A stupid marine could have accidently shot himself with a GL or something (happens more than it should in most games, why would NS be any different).
Again, welcome to the forums. Just read all the FAQs and follow basic ettiquette and youll be huggled repeatedly.
Blood wouldn't ruin the game, but I really don't think it holds any significance either. Ah well, what will be will be. <!--emo&::onos::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tiny.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::onos::'><!--endemo-->
Oh, and uh.. heh. WELCOME TO THE FORUMS <!--emo&:D--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'><!--endemo-->
>I realize I probably sound condscending(sp??) but I was simply trying to point out why they left out blood- it's been discussed MANY times as I hear it<
hahahhaha, that is true, but Doom had blood and all the kids that shot down their friends said "Doom made me do it" or "I didnt know it would hurt"<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, its funny when you read anti-video game violence articles. I just read one in which a "successful scientific study" was made on 60 8-year-old boys. 30 played Double Dragon for 20 minutes, the other 30 played Excite Bike. Afterwards, the children were paired up to play together. Apparently more "violent behavior" was displayed in the DD kids. Absolute proof that violent video games should be banned forever <!--emo&???--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'><!--endemo--> I'm not joking at all. They actually do these kinds of tests, and it actually convinces people too. Wow, if I could get my hands on these people I'd show them my own kinda violence. <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/asrifle.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::asrifle::'><!--endemo-->
[edit]Plus shooting a marind in the face without him bleeding would looks tacky <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->[/edit]
Those who have played the game says it doesn't really matter. <!--emo&:D--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'><!--endemo-->
Those who have played the game says it doesn't really matter. <!--emo&:D--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Im sorry im not a PT, does that mean I cant make suggestions or voice my oppinions? <!--emo&???--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'><!--endemo-->
However, i think blood is necesary for marines in NS. Why? Hmm, lets see... I remember GW, when their hitboxes and sprites were somewhat messed up. You would shoot someone and when it hit them you would see sparks flying out instead of blood. How bad could this be? VERY bad. Most people shoot something and watch for bleeding to see whether they are missing or hitting their target. When i see sparks fly out of something, i believe i missed the target because my bullets hit the metallic wall behind it and therefore indicates bullets ricocheting off the walls.
My most important question though, is why do marines not bleed and aliens can? Does it really make it suitable for more audiences for humans not to bleed but there and there, you see them shooting aliens and splattering blood all over the walls? How is it different? Wouldnt that make little kids start shooting animals around their neighborhoods, start hunting their neighbor's cat with a shotgun, shooting it and saying "HA! I 0wnZed j00 evil skulk!"
No... i believe blood should be in for marines also, and if anyones comes here with the "realistic" excuse, then tell me why not have both sparks AND blood squirt out? It would be more realistic, because no one gets hurt if bullets bounce off their armor. Heck, i would just keep on going and shooting those damned aliens.
So, i would like to know why blood isnt visible for marines. I understand not having gibs, and i wouldnt miss them at all, but blood IS necessary. Not just a detail but it also plays a major role gameplay wise for some people. The fact that it doesnt for others is just personal taste.
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Will you think that when youve played NS for more than 5 mins? Answer: No
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Wouldnt that make little kids start shooting animals around their neighborhoods, start hunting their neighbor's cat with a shotgun, shooting it and saying "HA! I 0wnZed j00 evil skulk!"
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Aliens have green blood and are trying to rip your face off. Cats arent quite that bad. Answer: No
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and if anyones comes here with the "realistic" excuse
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The realism argument is <i>for</i> blood. We dont want blood as it adds nothing to the game and means the game wouldnt be suitable for younger players.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->but blood IS necessary. Not just a detail but it also plays a major role gameplay wise for some people. The fact that it doesnt for others is just personal taste.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Answers:No, No and No. It isnt necessary, it doesnt play a major role in gameplay and it isnt just down to personal taste.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->Sparks are all dandy and everything, but there not easy as blood to see from down a dark long corridor<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sparks are easier, sparks are... well sparks, they show up in dark places (if they didnt they wouldnt be sparks would they). Blood can often be lost, in fact I hardly notice it. TBH I know Im hitting the enemy through instinct and experience, when my crosshairs are over them and when they die, blood makes no difference.
No! all the evil earth-skulks must die! DIE!!!
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seriously, this whole discussion is not about gameplay or anything. The marines letting of sparks could be quite realistic, because they are in mechanical-like armor wich is hit and not the real marine (exept for the head)... However, the HA is the only marine totally mechanical (from wich i think its good that he bleeds sparks)...
the normal marine has pads, wich means he can be hit for real and so he can die and bleed. Of course the suit would get this blood and contain it, but for me it just doesnt feel right when you shoot someone and he does not bleed.
You can say that its PG-13 and that people must stop watching violence and so on, but then again, dont go play a game where the goal is to kill your enemy.
Then you've been brainwashed by bad movie physics. Bullets don't cause sparks to fly when they hit metal walls in real life.
Now don't any of you say 'then how do marines make sparks when they're hit by bullets?' or I'll scream. There needs to be some way to tell you're hitting a marine. Of course, the only time you'll ever really notice the sparks is when you're spiking the marines as a Lerk. Just about every other attack is either something that wouldn't really cause bleeding (spores, acid rocket/spit/explosion, trampling) or is a melee attack that has sound confirmation when you hit (you'll understand once you play), the sound being a much easier way to tell you got him then a splatter of blood with your mouth closed.
Furthermore, I had something important to put in this third paragraph, but have since forgotten what it was going to be.
Blood spatters in HL and mods are presumed to be exit-would splatters - hence they appear on the wall behind the victim. There is not a single alien weapon that would make such a wound.
As Greedo said as well, the only alien weapon that relies on hit confirmation, really, is the Lerk's spike gun. There is a very clear (and attractive) sprite to represent the lerk hitting something, and it's obvious when that "something" is a marine or a wall. And then there's the spikes to boot. The other ranged weapons:
Parasite: little-no blood involved. Has a hit-confirmation sound.
Spit: liquid attack. No breaking the skin, no blood. Splash sound denotes hit.
Healing Spray: spore-like, short range attack.
Spikes: Penetration, but no exit wound. Sprite and sound hit confirmation.
Spore cloud: duh.
Acid Rocket: see "Spit". Splash confirmation sound.
Paralyze: no damage. no blood. Confirmation = immobile marine.
As for Bite, Leap, Babblers, Bite, Slash, Bite, and Charge... they're melee attacks and have very obvious hit confirmation sounds, as Greedo said. Xenocide and Bile Bomb are area effect; hit confirmation is either unnecessary or obvious.
Point? Blood as confirmation that you hit a marine isn't needed. It works excellently for the marines; you know you hit the Lerk in the vent when your flashlight shows green splotches on the wall from your bullets. But there's no need or point for it on the other side.
On another note. This has been discussed a million times, and the devs are not changing their minds. Can we drop and/or lock this?
Answer: Yes
ffs.
You dont need blood in NS. Period.
It will provide no additional gameplay. Period.
Its not needed nor is it wanted by the DEV's.
If you want blood, go play SOF/2. Plenty of it to keep you happy.
Skunks ARE evil!
And so are some cats. I live with one <!--emo&:0--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'><!--endemo-->
Personaly, I would rather see alien blood than human blood, and besides, the PT's/Devs have all made excellent examples and points as to why there is not blood for the marines. Sounds cool to me, I'm sure you won't notice it ingame(as a problem).
ffs.
You dont need blood in NS. Period.
It will provide no additional gameplay. Period.
Its not needed nor is it wanted by the DEV's.
If you want blood, go play SOF/2. Plenty of it to keep you happy.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Emm you dont "need" guns in ns you dont "need" aliens in ns, you dont "need" a commander mode in ns, you dont "need" blood in ns either, I personally think it would add to the effect of gameplay atmosphere just as much as those other things. It adds to the effect, for some people a bit of fun. Period
Yes its Flayras decision to leave it out, but we are wrong about our oppinions because of this? No, <b>they are oppinions</b>no one is right or wrong about the subject either way, and no one deserves a snappy response telling them there wrong.
BTW silverfox, you dont "need" to flame every one for saying they would perfer blood. I havnt cussed out any one or done anything to deserve your hosile respones.
or done anything to deserve your hosile respones.
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I'm sorry, I didnt realise I was stalking you on this forum and posting in such a manor to offend you. Nor did I think my original post was dirrected toward you or any one individual in anyway. I must have forgot my PC mask in my closet. So very, very sorry.
Dont need guns?
wtf are you going to kill the other team with? your hands? NS - the Boxing game.
Dont need aliens?
"Squad! Move out and eliminate ... the .. uh .. er, never mind ..."
Dont need commander mode?
I suppose your right there. Its not <b>needed</b>, however its one of the most intriguing features of the mod. Its as much a part of NS as guns, aliens, or what ever you want to be sarcastic about.
What kind of gameplay could it possibly enhance? NS isn't ment to be a super suspenseful game when your hearts beating 100 miles an hour and there's barely any light anywhere with body parts, blood every where and toppled structures. Sure, it is suspenseful, but its more of a by-product of the game. It doesnt need the blood to create that enviroment - it can create it just fine without it.
It will offer <b>no</b> enhancement into NS, at all and in my <b><i>opinion</b></i> would only make NS look tacky.
Your entitled to your opinions and go ahead and state them. However, when the same damn topic has been brought up before with the same conclusion thats going to happen here, its rather redundant to keep spewing your <i>opinion</i> all over the place.
Apparently, you've never seen me flame someone before. My original post wasnt an attack on anyone. I was simply stating my <b>opinions</b> on the subject and you assumed I was attacking someone. Nor is this ment to be an attack on you, I'm mearly defending myself and my original post.
I don't think I've singled out any single person in any of my posts and 'flame' them in my whole history on this forum.
Also, if you want to get sarcastic even more, who says we "need" huds, weapons, teams, gameplay, servers, or hell, even NS itself? We could just all imagine it in our heads! Then, it could be what you always wanted it to be and be as damn bloody as you please.
Ok, so the last part was borderline flame, but I guess theres a first time for everything.