Zig...I am Captain Planet!Join Date: 2002-10-23Member: 1576Members
<!--QuoteBegin--Liku+Aug 31 2003, 09:58 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Liku @ Aug 31 2003, 09:58 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Zig+Aug 31 2003, 02:46 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Zig @ Aug 31 2003, 02:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i said it. in mockery. lol. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> lol
The reason I hate the movie is because they don't add important parts to the movie [Like Tom Bombadil and the Barrow Downs] and at 30 Minutes of all the travelling Helicopter rotation shots. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> i dunno.. if you're into scenery, like i am, the helicopter rotations are like instant-orgasmothon.
Zig...I am Captain Planet!Join Date: 2002-10-23Member: 1576Members
<!--QuoteBegin--Liku+Sep 1 2003, 12:02 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Liku @ Sep 1 2003, 12:02 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I am, I love it. But don't replace that with story is what I'm saying. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> i dig.
<!--QuoteBegin--Dread+Aug 31 2003, 11:47 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dread @ Aug 31 2003, 11:47 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> -Tom Bombadil missing? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> What purpose does Tom Bombadil hold? In the end, when you must cut, and shorten films you take away that which isn't entertaining, and hold no real purpose. All Tom does is frees them from Old Man Willow and gives them a place to stay. That's it. In the end he has no effect so it makes sense as to why he got cut.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-"Mr Smith" as an elf?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Generally actors play more than one role...
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-Ents?! They were stupid looking and way too small<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Too small? Take a look at the movie again son. They are about 7, maybe 8 times the size of Orcs. How big would you want the Ents?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-The way Aragorn banished the nazguls. Director could've taken the liberty of making the scene more logical<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Seemed pretty logical to me. Nazguls do not like fire. Fire = burning. Burning + Nazguls = pain. Pain = Nazguls running.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-The flying monster in the end of two towers. It didn't have a head! Dumb looking thing.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> It had a head. Its head was on the end of his neck, oddly enough.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-Orcs climbing on the walls...duh<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> They were goblins. (assuming you are talking about the mines of Moria)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-"Comedic" scenes: Gimlis one-liners, legolas riding with the shield, Aragorn throwing gimli around. *sigh*<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Is comedic relief such a bad thing? I bet you the majority of people who went to see LoTR had never read the books, and went there for entertainment. I bet the majority loved the funny things like gimli in Helms Deep – they added a nice touch to the movies. The whole “gomgogmo HAVE TO BE SERIOUS!11!11!!! does get old, as enough movies are doing it…
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> -I know it's from LotR books but Aragorns, Gimlis and Legolas' fighting skills are a tad too good against the Orcs. I mean only the three of them must've killed couple of hundred Orcs without getting a scratch. Fantasy...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well they started out with 9 in the fellowship. One died, the other assumed dead. So for being "elite heros" and the best of their kin, they did take some losses. Aragorn almost died, and was assumed dead. In that same scene Gimli was just barley saved by Aragorn. So they have had their close calls - and have had their scratches.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Orcs climbing on the walls...duh<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->They were goblins. (assuming you are talking about the mines of Moria)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They really did a poor job of differentiating between the two.
<!--QuoteBegin--Liku+Aug 31 2003, 04:58 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Liku @ Aug 31 2003, 04:58 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Zig+Aug 31 2003, 02:46 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Zig @ Aug 31 2003, 02:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> i said it. in mockery. lol. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> lol
The reason I hate the movie is because they don't add important parts to the movie [Like Tom Bombadil and the Barrow Downs] and at 30 Minutes of all the travelling Helicopter rotation shots. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> To be fair though, Tom Bombadil is not exactly essential to the story.
I think given the sheer volume of stuff that could conceivably be included, you have to give credit to the fact that the essence of the story is captured (at least IMO).
And let's face it, the fantasy genre - as far as movies go - needed this badly ! Alot of cheapo fantasy movies were made in the 80's... the renewal of interest in LOTR because of these high-budget/well-acted movies can be only be a good thing.
I can only hope that someday they'll turn some Raymond E. Feist stuff (Magician !!) into movie form as well.
LikuI, am the Somberlain.Join Date: 2003-01-10Member: 12128Members
<!--QuoteBegin--FilthyLarry+Aug 31 2003, 07:53 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (FilthyLarry @ Aug 31 2003, 07:53 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> To be fair though, Tom Bombadil is not exactly essential to the story. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> He helped them through the Barrowdowns, and that's were, I believe, Frodo gets his First Sword. Oh, and nice removal of Shegoth in TTT.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Alot of cheapo fantasy movies were made in the 80's..<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
i'm goin with doom and i don't care how leet you guys think i am...
i didn't like the movie much at all. sure it would have been sweet in itself, but it totally destroyed the book. the fellowship of the ring did, in my opinion, do pretty good. the only thing that went wrong was how they took some good scenes out. but in the two towers movie, they changed stuff. that's where i got mad.
overall, it didn't suck too much. i was just disappointed with the way they changed stuff. characters i thought were cool sounded like buttheads in the movie *cough faramir cough*.
so yeah, mock me all you like. that's just my opinion <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--BlaqWolf+Aug 31 2003, 11:22 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (BlaqWolf @ Aug 31 2003, 11:22 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> characters i thought were cool sounded like buttheads in the movie *cough faramir cough*. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You know you'd be tempted by the ring.
LikuI, am the Somberlain.Join Date: 2003-01-10Member: 12128Members
edited September 2003
<!--QuoteBegin--SentrySteve+Aug 31 2003, 06:35 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SentrySteve @ Aug 31 2003, 06:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-Ents?! They were stupid looking and way too small<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Too small? Take a look at the movie again son. They are about 7, maybe 8 times the size of Orcs. How big would you want the Ents? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> In the books, they're HUGE, clearing miles with each step and rubbling the earth.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-Orcs climbing on the walls...duh<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> They were goblins. (assuming you are talking about the mines of Moria)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Umm... they're Orcs. There's the Uruk-Hai and Orcs, I believe there's no Goblins in Middle Earth.
<!--QuoteBegin--Liku+Aug 31 2003, 11:34 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Liku @ Aug 31 2003, 11:34 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Umm... they're Orcs. There's the Uruk-Hai and Orcs, I believe there's no Goblins in Middle Earth. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, in the movie, right after they enter Moria, Legolas pulls an arrow out from one of the dwarf corpses, says "Goblins" and looks concerned.
<!--QuoteBegin--Liku+Aug 31 2003, 11:13 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Liku @ Aug 31 2003, 11:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Alot of cheapo fantasy movies were made in the 80's..<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
HEY! WILLOW IS AWESOME! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> "Willow" was good <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
but then again things like "Red Sonja"...well <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Clearly you are taking this a bit too seriously seeing those were only my opinion and we can't argue about taste but I still take my stab at your arguments:
[quote]What purpose does Tom Bombadil hold? In the end, when you must cut, and shorten films you take away that which isn't entertaining, and hold no real purpose. All Tom does is frees them from Old Man Willow and gives them a place to stay. That's it. In the end he has no effect so it makes sense as to why he got cut.[/quote]
What purpose does Moria hold? Couldn't they just skip that part? I mean they did meet Balrog and lose Gandalf but Gandalf comes back anyway so in the end, moria has no effect so it makes sense as to why it should be cut out.
[quote]"Mr Smith" as an elf? Generally actors play more than one role...[/quote]
...but it was an obviously bad choice and only chosen because he is "Mr Smith", not because he looks like an elf and can act like one. He just didn't fit the part or did you picture Elrond like that? I understand that some people are hardcore fans and that's why defend some movies even though they know in deep inside that they didn't like some scenes.
[quote]Too small? Take a look at the movie again son. They are about 7, maybe 8 times the size of Orcs. How big would you want the Ents?[/quote]
I'm not your son or your relative in anyway. Ents were pictured as huge creatures in books. Film-ents were about 10-15m tall? Book ents were 20-40m tall. There is a difference.
[QUOTE]-The way Aragorn banished the nazguls. Director could've taken the liberty of making the scene more logical Seemed pretty logical to me. Nazguls do not like fire. Fire = burning. Burning , Nazguls = pain. Pain = Nazguls running.[/quote]
So tell me again, why were they afraid of the Nazguls? If you can get rid of them by shooting a flaming arrow or torching them, why should anyone run from them? I thought they were supposed to be invincible and unstoppable dead kings.
<!--QuoteBegin]-The flying monster in the end of two towers. It didn't have a head! Dumb looking thing.[/QUOTE] It had a head. Its head was on the end of his neck, oddly enough.
Again this is matter of taste. I think it was a dumb looking thing with rather stupid looking head attached to its neck. If you can find a pocture of its head I woul be more than happy to show you what I mean.
[QUOTE]-Orcs climbing on the walls...duh[/QUOTE] They were goblins. (assuming you are talking about the mines of Moria)
Goblins and orcs looked very much a like and they were orcs in the book.
[QUOTE]-"Comedic" scenes: Gimlis one-liners, legolas riding with the shield, Aragorn throwing gimli around. *sigh*[/QUOTE] Is comedic relief such a bad thing? I bet you the majority of people who went to see LoTR had never read the books, and went there for entertainment. I bet the majority loved the funny things like gimli in Helms Deep – they added a nice touch to the movies.
That was excactly the problem. I'm not part of the majority these films are trying to please. I've read the books and I don't need hollywood comedy in the film of my favourite fantasy book. LotR is not supposed to be funny. "Let's kill some ORcs!1" Yeah, everyone laughs. "Hey look at me, I'm riding with a shield and shooting arrows! And you are watching at Lethal Weapon 7" Yes, lmao indeed.
[QUOTE] -I know it's from LotR books but Aragorns, Gimlis and Legolas' fighting skills are a tad too good against the Orcs. I mean only the three of them must've killed couple of hundred Orcs without getting a scratch. Fantasy...[/QUOTE]
Well they started out with 9 in the fellowship. One died, the other assumed dead. So for being "elite heros" and the best of their kin, they did take some losses. Aragorn almost died, and was assumed dead. In that same scene Gimli was just barley saved by Aragorn. So they have had their close calls - and have had their scratches.
How can I take normal Orcs seriously if even Uruk-Hai's get slaughtered singlehandedly by few men. It's like the Orcs are not even TRYING to hurt you.
<!--QuoteBegin--Dread+Sep 1 2003, 07:19 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dread @ Sep 1 2003, 07:19 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> What purpose does Moria hold? Couldn't they just skip that part? I mean they did meet Balrog and lose Gandalf <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You answered you own question.
<!--QuoteBegin--Dread+Sep 1 2003, 12:19 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dread @ Sep 1 2003, 12:19 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> What purpose does Moria hold? Couldn't they just skip that part? I mean they did meet Balrog and lose Gandalf but Gandalf comes back anyway so in the end, moria has no effect so it makes sense as to why it should be cut out. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> so then how would Gandalf the Gray become Gandalf the White? A quick change of cloths, and a new cain?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->...but it was an obviously bad choice and only chosen because he is "Mr Smith", not because he looks like an elf and can act like one. He just didn't fit the part or did you picture Elrond like that? I understand that some people are hardcore fans and that's why defend some movies even though they know in deep inside that they didn't like some scenes.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I pictured Elrond as an much wiser elf, who was logical in his thinking. I really had no visual picutre of him in my head. I really dont think he was chosen based purly on the fact that he played the role of "Mr Smith." The way that he can say his lines, his voice, his facial movements, all fits the part of Elrond (to me at least)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->So tell me again, why were they afraid of the Nazguls? If you can get rid of them by shooting a flaming arrow or torching them, why should anyone run from them? I thought they were supposed to be invincible and unstoppable dead kings.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Are they always slowly walking up to their pray, making themselfs an easy target? I doubt that one flaming arrow would actually torch them anyway. I bet it would hurt them, but not force them to run away. Aragorn had a bunch of twigs/sticks lit of fire that he pushed into thier hoods.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How can I take normal Orcs seriously if even Uruk-Hai's get slaughtered singlehandedly by few men. It's like the Orcs are not even TRYING to hurt you.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
One Uruk-Hai killed a member of the fellowship. That same one almost killed another before he was killed. At Helms Deep one of them took two direct hits from Legolas's arrows. I'd say they are about a fair match to anyone in the fellowship, minus Gandalf.
InsaneAnomalyJoin Date: 2002-05-13Member: 605Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Subnautica Developer, Pistachionauts, Future Perfect Developer
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->omg, sweet baby jesus. i know it's not LoTR2, but you'd have to tie me down and give it to me with a cat o' nine tails before i'd type out LotRTTTPToLoTR (Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers, Part Two of Lord of the Rings) for any reason other than to explain this to you.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lol, you could just type out TTT. That's shorter than both. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Oh, and nice removal of Shegoth in TTT.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Shelob's going to be in the beginning of RotK. It's kind of silly that's she's not in TTT, I know, especially when there are several scenes that they seem to have just made up themselves that they could have cut and therefore fit her in. It just makes me wonder how they're going to fit her, and all of the crucial stuff in RotK (of which there's quite a lot.. I won't be best pleased if they leave the Scouring of the Shire or the Grey Havens out).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Umm... they're Orcs. There's the Uruk-Hai and Orcs, I believe there's no Goblins in Middle Earth.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh, there are indeed. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> In The Hobbit, Bilbo and his company get waylaid by a troop of Goblins in the Misty Mountains. Orcs, Goblins and Uruk-Hai are all rather similar though.
<!--QuoteBegin--SentrySteve+Sep 1 2003, 03:12 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SentrySteve @ Sep 1 2003, 03:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> so then how would Gandalf the Gray become Gandalf the White? A quick change of cloths, and a new cain? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> That was trying to be a sarcastic question implying that any scene could be removed with slight moderation. Apparently my sarcasm still needs some work <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> Point: Tom Bombadil and Tomb wraths were just as important as any other scene.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I pictured Elrond as an much wiser elf, who was logical in his thinking.? I really had no visual picutre of him in my head.? I really dont think he was chosen based purly on the fact that he played the role of "Mr Smith."? The way that he can say his lines, his voice, his facial movements, all fits the part of Elrond (to me at least)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Matter of opinion. I and many many people I know, didn't dig Smith playing Elrond.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Are they always slowly walking up to their pray, making themselfs an easy target?? I doubt that one flaming arrow would actually torch them anyway.? I bet it would hurt them, but not force them to run away.? Aragorn had a bunch of twigs/sticks lit of fire that he pushed into thier hoods.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Listen to yourself, please <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> You really think fire could even <b>hurt</b> immortal ghost kings? Hardly. It's not much of an opponent if you can just stick it once with a torch and make it escape.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->One Uruk-Hai killed a member of the fellowship.? That same one almost killed another before he was killed.? At Helms Deep one of them took two direct hits from Legolas's arrows.? I'd say they are about a fair match to anyone in the fellowship, minus Gandalf.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Count all the Orcs that die and then how many member of the fellowship. That's right, 563 - 1 Not bad score for home team?
I wouldn't be so percistant on this thing if I wouldn't know several other people that agree with me, so it can't be just my own imagination that LotR's script and some visuals could've been made way better with the budget they had/have.
Oh and I remembered another scene that I didn't like: The part where Frodo offered the Ring to that elf-queen whos name I don't remember right now. Even if they would've made the CGI's look good, the whole changing was ridiculous. When Tolkien discribed the change of her in the book, he didn't mean that her body transformed literally but she changed emotionally. Something that LotR's makers obviously didn't get while skipping through the book <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Dread+Sep 1 2003, 12:54 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dread @ Sep 1 2003, 12:54 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Are they always slowly walking up to their pray, making themselfs an easy target? I doubt that one flaming arrow would actually torch them anyway. I bet it would hurt them, but not force them to run away. Aragorn had a bunch of twigs/sticks lit of fire that he pushed into thier hoods.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Listen to yourself, please <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> You really think fire could even <b>hurt</b> immortal ghost kings? Hardly. It's not much of an opponent if you can just stick it once with a torch and make it escape.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Vampires are not much of an opponent when you have a stake and a cross.
Werewolves are not much of an opponent when you have silver bullets.
The point is there wouldn't ever be much of a story if nothing could hurt these fantasy/mythical creatures now would there ? You have to give your heroes some sort of a chance for survival.
Just because the kings are immortal does not mean that their physical form cannot be harmed, just that they will always regenerate/reconstitute themselves over time. Not only that, but during the fight Frodo is stabbed and pretty much killed for all intents and purposes - proving that the wraiths make for deadly and relentless assassins. It's only very specific healing magic that saves Frodo in the end.
<!--QuoteBegin--Dread+Sep 1 2003, 12:54 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dread @ Sep 1 2003, 12:54 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Count all the Orcs that die and then how many member of the fellowship. That's right, 563 - 1 Not bad score for home team?
.....
When Tolkien discribed the change of her in the book, he didn't mean that her body transformed literally but she changed emotionally. Something that LotR's makers obviously didn't get while skipping through the book <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> You have to think of the movie in terms of Dungeons and Dragons. Certain members of the fellowship are _elite_ fighters, absolutely the best of the best. Gandalf, Legolas, Gimli, Aragorn and Boromir are for all intents and purposes on a much higher "level" than the Orc regulars that they dispatch. If you play D&D you'd immediately understand this. Hell even if you don't, look at just about any action movie out there... almost always the heroe defies ridiculous numbers/odds to survive.
.....
I'm sure the LotR's makers understood what Tolkien meant; but chose a more dynamic way to represent this to the audience. Artistic license.
<!--QuoteBegin--Dread+Sep 1 2003, 12:54 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dread @ Sep 1 2003, 12:54 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Oh and I remembered another scene that I didn't like: The part where Frodo offered the Ring to that elf-queen whos name I don't remember right now. Even if they would've made the CGI's look good, the whole changing was ridiculous. When Tolkien discribed the change of her in the book, he didn't mean that her body transformed literally but she changed emotionally. Something that LotR's makers obviously didn't get while skipping through the book <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> "She lifted up her hand and from the ring that she wore there issued a great light that illumined her alone and left all else dark. She stood before Frodo seeming now tall beyond measurement, and beautiful beyond enduring, terrible and worshipful."
That's a direct quote from the book ("Her" and "She" refers of course to Galadriel, in the scene where Frodo offers her the ring). Maybe you ought to stop "skipping through the book", as you put it, and read one of the articles about how this has been Peter Jackson's dream to direct these movies. I for one think he's done an amazing job getting it out to the approval of a mainstream audience, and the nitpickers just seem to want everything to be catered directly to their own desires, screw what appeals to the rest of the world. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> yourself.
Sure, they took a few minor liberties with the plot in the interests of making a cool film, but speaking as a long term Tolkien fanboy, I was very pleased with the results.
They missed or changed a few details, but the essence of the story is completely intact so far. ( Although Faramir got it a bit harsh I thought...)
If you didn't enjoy it I can suggest a few possibilities why.
1) Just not your type of movie, fair enough I say. 2) You didn't read / understand the books. 3) Obsessive fanboy.."omg that didn't happen in teh holy books!!" 4) No appreciation of fine cinema. 5) Pretentious toss who "doesn't like mainstream movies".
2p worth.
( Hard to believe it was the same guy who made "Braindead"..<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> )
<!--QuoteBegin--Dread+Sep 1 2003, 12:54 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dread @ Sep 1 2003, 12:54 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Matter of opinion. I and many many people I know, didn't dig Smith playing Elrond. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> That's really not fair on the actor. It's not Hugo Weaving's fault that you've seen The Matrix too many times. Okay, I admit the first thing I thought when I saw Elrond was "The ring, Mr. Anderson. Give us the ring.", but the fact that you can't stop thinking about Smith is not his fault. This is just the kind of thinking that made Leonard Nimoy write the book "I Am Not Spock".
I have had that movie on my computer for months, got it last winter on my computer <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> i watched it alot, maybe ill watch it now <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> books are so much better though <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
i think the guy who played elrond fit well. but the way they depicted the whole elvish people in the movie was wrong. The elves were far to serious, there was no joy, joking, or singing, like Tolkien described in the Books. Thats what bothered me most about the movie.
That and how are they gonna fit the rest in? They are only a bit more than half through the second book, in the movies. I hope the last movie doesnt go through it to fast. and miss alot. <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo--> i cant see how they are gonna pull this off putting that much into one more movie. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
otherwise the movies were really good. i could watch them everyday. but the books are still so much better <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> its hard to take such good books and make a movie out of them. but they did very good!!
I thought Fellowship was decent, even with the lack of Tom Bombadil, because they at least didn't change the characters all that much, and they didn't add new stupid scenes, for the most part.
Two Towers was okay in parts, but it also bugged me a lot because they did change characters (notably Faramir, Theoden, the Ents, and even Frodo), and they added new stupid scenes (the entire time they spent having Faramir drag them to Osgiliath). And IMHO, it only changed the story for the worse - even disregarding that it was less faithful to the book than it could have been, it was still just not as exciting of a story as it would have been had they preserved the characters and the general flow of events a bit better.
If those of you who haven't read the books several times would like a dissertation on how exactly they changed the characters and why it would have been better if they had left it alone, let me know. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->It had a head. Its head was on the end of his neck, oddly enough. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Zig...I am Captain Planet!Join Date: 2002-10-23Member: 1576Members
edited September 2003
lol, everyone's arguing.
good thing LoTR2 is such an awesome movie, or i might waste time bickering too, instead of basking in the glow of its uncanny awesomeness.
and yes, i read all your posts. i'm sorry, i don't have my own copy of the hobbit, but i'm about 95% sure there's an excerpt i would have quoted here saying that the word goblin is interchangible with orc, when regarding lesser, crappier orcs.
edit: i searched for an online text, too, but not very hard. i guess i don't really have to prove this to you. just try to believe me, crappy orc = goblin.
Comments
lol
The reason I hate the movie is because they don't add important parts to the movie [Like Tom Bombadil and the Barrow Downs] and at 30 Minutes of all the travelling Helicopter rotation shots. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
i dunno.. if you're into scenery, like i am, the helicopter rotations are like instant-orgasmothon.
i dig.
What purpose does Tom Bombadil hold? In the end, when you must cut, and shorten films you take away that which isn't entertaining, and hold no real purpose. All Tom does is frees them from Old Man Willow and gives them a place to stay. That's it. In the end he has no effect so it makes sense as to why he got cut.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-"Mr Smith" as an elf?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Generally actors play more than one role...
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-Ents?! They were stupid looking and way too small<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Too small? Take a look at the movie again son. They are about 7, maybe 8 times the size of Orcs. How big would you want the Ents?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-The way Aragorn banished the nazguls. Director could've taken the liberty of making the scene more logical<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Seemed pretty logical to me. Nazguls do not like fire. Fire = burning. Burning + Nazguls = pain. Pain = Nazguls running.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-The flying monster in the end of two towers. It didn't have a head! Dumb looking thing.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It had a head. Its head was on the end of his neck, oddly enough.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-Orcs climbing on the walls...duh<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They were goblins. (assuming you are talking about the mines of Moria)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-"Comedic" scenes: Gimlis one-liners, legolas riding with the shield, Aragorn throwing gimli around. *sigh*<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Is comedic relief such a bad thing? I bet you the majority of people who went to see LoTR had never read the books, and went there for entertainment. I bet the majority loved the funny things like gimli in Helms Deep – they added a nice touch to the movies. The whole “gomgogmo HAVE TO BE SERIOUS!11!11!!! does get old, as enough movies are doing it…
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
-I know it's from LotR books but Aragorns, Gimlis and Legolas' fighting skills are a tad too good against the Orcs. I mean only the three of them must've killed couple of hundred Orcs without getting a scratch. Fantasy...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well they started out with 9 in the fellowship. One died, the other assumed dead. So for being "elite heros" and the best of their kin, they did take some losses. Aragorn almost died, and was assumed dead. In that same scene Gimli was just barley saved by Aragorn. So they have had their close calls - and have had their scratches.
They really did a poor job of differentiating between the two.
<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
lol
The reason I hate the movie is because they don't add important parts to the movie [Like Tom Bombadil and the Barrow Downs] and at 30 Minutes of all the travelling Helicopter rotation shots. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
To be fair though, Tom Bombadil is not exactly essential to the story.
I think given the sheer volume of stuff that could conceivably be included, you have to give credit to the fact that the essence of the story is captured (at least IMO).
And let's face it, the fantasy genre - as far as movies go - needed this badly ! Alot of cheapo fantasy movies were made in the 80's... the renewal of interest in LOTR because of these high-budget/well-acted movies can be only be a good thing.
I can only hope that someday they'll turn some Raymond E. Feist stuff (Magician !!) into movie form as well.
He helped them through the Barrowdowns, and that's were, I believe, Frodo gets his First Sword. Oh, and nice removal of Shegoth in TTT.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Alot of cheapo fantasy movies were made in the 80's..<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
HEY! WILLOW IS AWESOME!
i didn't like the movie much at all. sure it would have been sweet in itself, but it totally destroyed the book. the fellowship of the ring did, in my opinion, do pretty good. the only thing that went wrong was how they took some good scenes out. but in the two towers movie, they changed stuff. that's where i got mad.
overall, it didn't suck too much. i was just disappointed with the way they changed stuff. characters i thought were cool sounded like buttheads in the movie *cough faramir cough*.
so yeah, mock me all you like. that's just my opinion <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
You know you'd be tempted by the ring.
<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Too small? Take a look at the movie again son. They are about 7, maybe 8 times the size of Orcs. How big would you want the Ents? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In the books, they're HUGE, clearing miles with each step and rubbling the earth.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->-Orcs climbing on the walls...duh<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They were goblins. (assuming you are talking about the mines of Moria)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Umm... they're Orcs. There's the Uruk-Hai and Orcs, I believe there's no Goblins in Middle Earth.
Well, in the movie, right after they enter Moria, Legolas pulls an arrow out from one of the dwarf corpses, says "Goblins" and looks concerned.
<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
HEY! WILLOW IS AWESOME! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
"Willow" was good <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
but then again things like "Red Sonja"...well <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
[quote]What purpose does Tom Bombadil hold? In the end, when you must cut, and shorten films you take away that which isn't entertaining, and hold no real purpose. All Tom does is frees them from Old Man Willow and gives them a place to stay. That's it. In the end he has no effect so it makes sense as to why he got cut.[/quote]
What purpose does Moria hold? Couldn't they just skip that part? I mean they did meet Balrog and lose Gandalf but Gandalf comes back anyway so in the end, moria has no effect so it makes sense as to why it should be cut out.
[quote]"Mr Smith" as an elf?
Generally actors play more than one role...[/quote]
...but it was an obviously bad choice and only chosen because he is "Mr Smith", not because he looks like an elf and can act like one. He just didn't fit the part or did you picture Elrond like that? I understand that some people are hardcore fans and that's why defend some movies even though they know in deep inside that they didn't like some scenes.
[quote]Too small? Take a look at the movie again son. They are about 7, maybe 8 times the size of Orcs. How big would you want the Ents?[/quote]
I'm not your son or your relative in anyway. Ents were pictured as huge creatures in books. Film-ents were about 10-15m tall? Book ents were 20-40m tall. There is a difference.
[QUOTE]-The way Aragorn banished the nazguls. Director could've taken the liberty of making the scene more logical
Seemed pretty logical to me. Nazguls do not like fire. Fire = burning. Burning , Nazguls = pain. Pain = Nazguls running.[/quote]
So tell me again, why were they afraid of the Nazguls? If you can get rid of them by shooting a flaming arrow or torching them, why should anyone run from them? I thought they were supposed to be invincible and unstoppable dead kings.
<!--QuoteBegin]-The flying monster in the end of two towers. It didn't have a head! Dumb looking thing.[/QUOTE]
It had a head. Its head was on the end of his neck, oddly enough.
Again this is matter of taste. I think it was a dumb looking thing with rather stupid looking head attached to its neck. If you can find a pocture of its head I woul be more than happy to show you what I mean.
[QUOTE]-Orcs climbing on the walls...duh[/QUOTE]
They were goblins. (assuming you are talking about the mines of Moria)
Goblins and orcs looked very much a like and they were orcs in the book.
[QUOTE]-"Comedic" scenes: Gimlis one-liners, legolas riding with the shield, Aragorn throwing gimli around. *sigh*[/QUOTE]
Is comedic relief such a bad thing? I bet you the majority of people who went to see LoTR had never read the books, and went there for entertainment. I bet the majority loved the funny things like gimli in Helms Deep – they added a nice touch to the movies.
That was excactly the problem. I'm not part of the majority these films are trying to please. I've read the books and I don't need hollywood comedy in the film of my favourite fantasy book. LotR is not supposed to be funny. "Let's kill some ORcs!1" Yeah, everyone laughs. "Hey look at me, I'm riding with a shield and shooting arrows! And you are watching at Lethal Weapon 7" Yes, lmao indeed.
[QUOTE]
-I know it's from LotR books but Aragorns, Gimlis and Legolas' fighting skills are a tad too good against the Orcs. I mean only the three of them must've killed couple of hundred Orcs without getting a scratch. Fantasy...[/QUOTE]
Well they started out with 9 in the fellowship. One died, the other assumed dead. So for being "elite heros" and the best of their kin, they did take some losses. Aragorn almost died, and was assumed dead. In that same scene Gimli was just barley saved by Aragorn. So they have had their close calls - and have had their scratches.
How can I take normal Orcs seriously if even Uruk-Hai's get slaughtered singlehandedly by few men. It's like the Orcs are not even TRYING to hurt you.
I hope this won't go in to "imo imo imo" debate.
You answered you own question.
<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
so then how would Gandalf the Gray become Gandalf the White? A quick change of cloths, and a new cain?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->...but it was an obviously bad choice and only chosen because he is "Mr Smith", not because he looks like an elf and can act like one. He just didn't fit the part or did you picture Elrond like that? I understand that some people are hardcore fans and that's why defend some movies even though they know in deep inside that they didn't like some scenes.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I pictured Elrond as an much wiser elf, who was logical in his thinking. I really had no visual picutre of him in my head. I really dont think he was chosen based purly on the fact that he played the role of "Mr Smith." The way that he can say his lines, his voice, his facial movements, all fits the part of Elrond (to me at least)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->So tell me again, why were they afraid of the Nazguls? If you can get rid of them by shooting a flaming arrow or torching them, why should anyone run from them? I thought they were supposed to be invincible and unstoppable dead kings.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Are they always slowly walking up to their pray, making themselfs an easy target? I doubt that one flaming arrow would actually torch them anyway. I bet it would hurt them, but not force them to run away. Aragorn had a bunch of twigs/sticks lit of fire that he pushed into thier hoods.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->How can I take normal Orcs seriously if even Uruk-Hai's get slaughtered singlehandedly by few men. It's like the Orcs are not even TRYING to hurt you.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
One Uruk-Hai killed a member of the fellowship. That same one almost killed another before he was killed. At Helms Deep one of them took two direct hits from Legolas's arrows. I'd say they are about a fair match to anyone in the fellowship, minus Gandalf.
Lol, you could just type out TTT. That's shorter than both. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Oh, and nice removal of Shegoth in TTT.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Shelob's going to be in the beginning of RotK. It's kind of silly that's she's not in TTT, I know, especially when there are several scenes that they seem to have just made up themselves that they could have cut and therefore fit her in. It just makes me wonder how they're going to fit her, and all of the crucial stuff in RotK (of which there's quite a lot.. I won't be best pleased if they leave the Scouring of the Shire or the Grey Havens out).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Umm... they're Orcs. There's the Uruk-Hai and Orcs, I believe there's no Goblins in Middle Earth.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh, there are indeed. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> In The Hobbit, Bilbo and his company get waylaid by a troop of Goblins in the Misty Mountains. Orcs, Goblins and Uruk-Hai are all rather similar though.
That was trying to be a sarcastic question implying that any scene could be removed with slight moderation. Apparently my sarcasm still needs some work <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> Point: Tom Bombadil and Tomb wraths were just as important as any other scene.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I pictured Elrond as an much wiser elf, who was logical in his thinking.? I really had no visual picutre of him in my head.? I really dont think he was chosen based purly on the fact that he played the role of "Mr Smith."? The way that he can say his lines, his voice, his facial movements, all fits the part of Elrond (to me at least)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Matter of opinion. I and many many people I know, didn't dig Smith playing Elrond.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Are they always slowly walking up to their pray, making themselfs an easy target?? I doubt that one flaming arrow would actually torch them anyway.? I bet it would hurt them, but not force them to run away.? Aragorn had a bunch of twigs/sticks lit of fire that he pushed into thier hoods.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Listen to yourself, please <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> You really think fire could even <b>hurt</b> immortal ghost kings? Hardly. It's not much of an opponent if you can just stick it once with a torch and make it escape.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->One Uruk-Hai killed a member of the fellowship.? That same one almost killed another before he was killed.? At Helms Deep one of them took two direct hits from Legolas's arrows.? I'd say they are about a fair match to anyone in the fellowship, minus Gandalf.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Count all the Orcs that die and then how many member of the fellowship. That's right, 563 - 1
Not bad score for home team?
I wouldn't be so percistant on this thing if I wouldn't know several other people that agree with me, so it can't be just my own imagination that LotR's script and some visuals could've been made way better with the budget they had/have.
Oh and I remembered another scene that I didn't like: The part where Frodo offered the Ring to that elf-queen whos name I don't remember right now. Even if they would've made the CGI's look good, the whole changing was ridiculous. When Tolkien discribed the change of her in the book, he didn't mean that her body transformed literally but she changed emotionally. Something that LotR's makers obviously didn't get while skipping through the book <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Listen to yourself, please <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> You really think fire could even <b>hurt</b> immortal ghost kings? Hardly. It's not much of an opponent if you can just stick it once with a torch and make it escape.
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Vampires are not much of an opponent when you have a stake and a cross.
Werewolves are not much of an opponent when you have silver bullets.
The point is there wouldn't ever be much of a story if nothing could hurt these fantasy/mythical creatures now would there ? You have to give your heroes some sort of a chance for survival.
Just because the kings are immortal does not mean that their physical form cannot be harmed, just that they will always regenerate/reconstitute themselves over time. Not only that, but during the fight Frodo is stabbed and pretty much killed for all intents and purposes - proving that the wraiths make for deadly and relentless assassins. It's only very specific healing magic that saves Frodo in the end.
Not bad score for home team?
.....
When Tolkien discribed the change of her in the book, he didn't mean that her body transformed literally but she changed emotionally. Something that LotR's makers obviously didn't get while skipping through the book <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You have to think of the movie in terms of Dungeons and Dragons. Certain members of the fellowship are _elite_ fighters, absolutely the best of the best. Gandalf, Legolas, Gimli, Aragorn and Boromir are for all intents and purposes on a much higher "level" than the Orc regulars that they dispatch. If you play D&D you'd immediately understand this. Hell even if you don't, look at just about any action movie out there... almost always the heroe defies ridiculous numbers/odds to survive.
.....
I'm sure the LotR's makers understood what Tolkien meant; but chose a more dynamic way to represent this to the audience. Artistic license.
"She lifted up her hand and from the ring that she wore there issued a great light that illumined her alone and left all else dark. She stood before Frodo seeming now tall beyond measurement, and beautiful beyond enduring, terrible and worshipful."
That's a direct quote from the book ("Her" and "She" refers of course to Galadriel, in the scene where Frodo offers her the ring). Maybe you ought to stop "skipping through the book", as you put it, and read one of the articles about how this has been Peter Jackson's dream to direct these movies. I for one think he's done an amazing job getting it out to the approval of a mainstream audience, and the nitpickers just seem to want everything to be catered directly to their own desires, screw what appeals to the rest of the world. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> yourself.
Sure, they took a few minor liberties with the plot in the interests of making a cool film, but speaking as a long term Tolkien fanboy, I was very pleased with the results.
They missed or changed a few details, but the essence of the story is completely intact so far. ( Although Faramir got it a bit harsh I thought...)
If you didn't enjoy it I can suggest a few possibilities why.
1) Just not your type of movie, fair enough I say.
2) You didn't read / understand the books.
3) Obsessive fanboy.."omg that didn't happen in teh holy books!!"
4) No appreciation of fine cinema.
5) Pretentious toss who "doesn't like mainstream movies".
2p worth.
( Hard to believe it was the same guy who made "Braindead"..<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> )
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That's really not fair on the actor. It's not Hugo Weaving's fault that you've seen The Matrix too many times. Okay, I admit the first thing I thought when I saw Elrond was "The ring, Mr. Anderson. Give us the ring.", but the fact that you can't stop thinking about Smith is not his fault. This is just the kind of thinking that made Leonard Nimoy write the book "I Am Not Spock".
i watched it alot, maybe ill watch it now <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
books are so much better though <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
i think the guy who played elrond fit well.
but the way they depicted the whole elvish people in the movie was wrong.
The elves were far to serious, there was no joy, joking, or singing, like Tolkien described in the Books.
Thats what bothered me most about the movie.
That and how are they gonna fit the rest in?
They are only a bit more than half through the second book, in the movies. I hope the last movie doesnt go through it to fast. and miss alot. <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo--> i cant see how they are gonna pull this off putting that much into one more movie. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
otherwise the movies were really good.
i could watch them everyday.
but the books are still so much better <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
its hard to take such good books and make a movie out of them.
but they did very good!!
Two Towers was okay in parts, but it also bugged me a lot because they did change characters (notably Faramir, Theoden, the Ents, and even Frodo), and they added new stupid scenes (the entire time they spent having Faramir drag them to Osgiliath). And IMHO, it only changed the story for the worse - even disregarding that it was less faithful to the book than it could have been, it was still just not as exciting of a story as it would have been had they preserved the characters and the general flow of events a bit better.
If those of you who haven't read the books several times would like a dissertation on how exactly they changed the characters and why it would have been better if they had left it alone, let me know. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
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He's right you know....
good thing LoTR2 is such an awesome movie, or i might waste time bickering too, instead of basking in the glow of its uncanny awesomeness.
and yes, i read all your posts. i'm sorry, i don't have my own copy of the hobbit, but i'm about 95% sure there's an excerpt i would have quoted here saying that the word goblin is interchangible with orc, when regarding lesser, crappier orcs.
edit: i searched for an online text, too, but not very hard. i guess i don't really have to prove this to you. just try to believe me, crappy orc = goblin.