Tabletop Ns?

breathstealer · June 2003

<div class="IPBDescription">hmmm...strange idea</div> Well, lately, i've been concocting rules for a tabletop ns game based on the Warhammer 40K rules. I think it would work fine, except that ppl who dont understand the rules to warhammer would find it impossible to learn from what i have written now on 2 nice sheets of a4 paper. I mean, they have a whole book of rules for that thing, so it might be good to learn that first. Anyway, heres a summary of what i have so far.

- Res system
- Alien evolutions/upgrades/chambers
- Rules for skulk and gorge
- New attribute (as yet unnamed) measures skill in detecting hiding enemies.

What will come soon:

- Marine rules
- A nice typed up version in this post

All i can say is, i have no idea where this thread should go, and it will probably be moved within a matter of seconds.

Watch for updates

Xzilen · June 2003

OMG, I love the idea! Serious!

clamatius · June 2003

"skill in detecting hiding enemies": Spot?

Jammer · June 2003

I played WH40k for a bit. The biggest problem I see is visibility. Tabeltop games can't handle 'hidden' things very well, and suprises is a big part of NS. I'm sure it will still be cool though :-)

Psycho-Kinetic_Hyper-Geek · June 2003

It would probably be easier to handle spot checks if you use 2nd edition rules instead of third. You want me to post the rules for the Lictor's visibility?

Redford · June 2003

skill in detecting hidden enemies should be "perception" which is a character's ability in fallout to detect anything out of the ordinary or conctrate with any of the five senses. perception should also provide a slight accuracy bonus.

nWAFFLES · June 2003

That'd be real cool, i loved playing WH40k til my local store closedc down. Would gimme a reason to play again. For spot checks you could always play a modified night fight rules type of thing, where the rine has reduced vision and can fire an assault weapon, then the alien has good vision (ala hive sight). Just a thought.

HellSpawn · June 2003

wow this sounds so cool...ive played warhammer fantasy for around 5 years now and havent thought of a reason to start 40k <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> ...this could be it..i look foreward to reading the rules and things u post in the future.. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'>

-best of luck to u

Flayra · June 2003

Cool stuff. May I recommend the extremely excellent "Advanced Space Crusade" by Games Workshop? It's out of print, but if you can get a copy, I think you'll see how influential it was on NS. It even handles visibility by allowing the alien player to move "blips" around, only converting them to the number/type of creature it represents when a marine get line of sight to it.

Black_Hawk_VS · June 2003

Great Idea. I used to play Battle Tech (Or Mechwarrior for those of you only familar with the computer version). They had a whole system for hidden units, Though I am not sure where my book is. If you can, you might want to look in to that too for some info

FiendHZ · June 2003

I SO want to get into Table games. I know some of the basic WH40K rules (friend of mine let me borrow a codec once, and i read most of it, but still, I never played and I would consider my grasp of the rules somewhat shakey). It just costs so much money, pen and paper RPGs is much cheaper (and I'm starting college in a few months, money is no where to be found).

However... I may have to start working on ideas for a pen and paper one. Although I don't know what rule set I would use or if I would jsut make up my own... any ideas, suggestions, rants telling me that if I don't use System X because it's better than System Y you'll find me and hurt me (That last one is a joke)?

Infected_Marine · June 2003

Now I can't just say that a total conversion of WH40K sounds perfect, I am always interested when two of my interests converge. Although I personally prefer the vanilla strategy scene, Space Hulk/Space Crusade where in a my radar because of the storyline connection. But if these games play simailer enough to 40K, I am liable to start making my own units.

And if any one knows, can they tell me exactly what Space Crusade is? I always had an impression that it was basically Space Hulk.

Edit: Here we go. It's a a MB RPG board game, but it sounds intensly interesting for simulating NS. Check <a href='http://www.boardgamegeek.com/viewitem.php3?gameid=1568' target='_blank'>this</a> and <a href='http://www.geocities.com/smithnewz/Imperium_Battles.html' target='_blank'>this</a> out.

Creepin_Jeezus · June 2003

maybe warhammer 40k aren't the perfect rules... considering the amount of players per side (say about 6-10) I'd say that inquisitor (40k spin off) have better (albeit more complex) rules, since NS would be more of a skirmish game, and not a full on battle like 40k is and inquisitor only uses a handful of characters per side (and it lets you put some character into the game <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'> )

smokingwreckage · June 2003

Here's a tabletop game with a builder for making up and assigning points to your own original creations:

<a href='http://www.mj12games.com/starslayer/index.html' target='_blank'>Starslayer</a>

There's an improved version (the same, but with more options and a better "builder") coming out, late summer USA time. To give you some idea, I ran a game with a beta of the troop-building rules that pitted near-future powered armour against Warhammer Undead. Loads of fun. Meanwhile you can grab the free "demo" of the rules at the site above.

Comparing it to Warhammer 40K, there's a bit more pure rules text to read up-front but the rules are super-well explained and you don't need so much dice-rolling for each shot (one shot, one roll, one kill. Nice.). Weapons are a fair bit deadlier but have clearer roles (anti-tank missiles are no good for sniping, for example). No codexes. (Yay!).

Using Starslayer I reckon I could simulate everything from Skulks to the Scorpian That Hovars Without Flaping, and the marine 60-ton mech you've been dreaming of..... that's before I start making rules up.

EDIT: it has rules for hidden units and detecting them that'd do the trick nicely.

Supernorn · June 2003

i was actually thinking a few days ago on converting some marines into frontiersman <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>
But then i would need to buy "green stuff" (wonderful product name) to add on the visors and armour and...Blah its alot of money.

HellSpawn · June 2003

i wonder if that warhammer spinoff game..what was it.o YES Morheim or something...i played that a couple times and seemed to work quite well with the hiding and such...but there was also an experience system in it...which actually mite be interesting..

n e one else played Mordheim?

HungryHippo · June 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Flayra @ Jun 28 2003, 11:29 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> May I recommend the extremely excellent "Advanced Space Crusade" by Games Workshop?  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
Advanced Space Cusade rocked, i loved that game.

rice crispie heads aproaching from all directions we need backup!!!

hehe top stuff

(ricecrispie heads = tyranid warriors btw <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'> )

HellSpawn · June 2003

not worriers..there called genestealers...look kinda like a fade..but smaller..and more arms <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/fade.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='fade.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/fade.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='fade.gif'>

HungryHippo · June 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (HellSpawn @ Jun 29 2003, 04:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> not worriers..there called genestealers...look kinda like a fade..but smaller..and more arms <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/fade.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='fade.gif'> <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/fade.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='fade.gif'>  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
not genestealers.. the big mutant ones with the guns were called tyranid warriors and they had ricecrispies for heads.

at least thats how i remember it, its been a while.

Creepin_Jeezus · June 2003

tyranid warriors rule! lol <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/fade.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='fade.gif'>

i havn't actually played mordhiem, but i know the style of game its like, its alot like inquisitor (which i mentioned ealier) except inquisitor is quite a bit more detailed, i guess it depends on what you prefer more, personally i'd go with inquisitor cos of the nice big sized models <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'>

also theres alot of rules in inquisitor that can suit a few attacks in NS (such as a gas grenade is similar for spores, all you need to do is change them around a bit so theyr emore suiting)

also the rules in it are made very well to let you make you own characters (such as all the types of alien tastyness)

if i wasnt so lazy and poor (im only 16) id have a go making some NS characters in inquisitor scale, i reckon i could do it, im a vet at modelling and playing warhammer [evil laugh]

KingKupo · June 2003

sounds cool, strange enough this thing had crossed my mind once too but i forgot it before i could actually make something of it.(i also play 40K)

Deacon · June 2003

The other day, while cleaning the kitchen, I got to thinking about the viability of NS as a wargame. In the traditional move-chits-around-on-hexes sense.

I'd imagine the board would be some number of stations/outposts connected by a web of trade routes. Each station could have one of three states:

1. Clean - No alien presence, produces resources for the TSA team.
2. Infested - Covert alien presence, produces resources for the TSA team, aliens can attempt to infest connected nodes.
3. Overrun - Overt alien presence, produces no resources for the TSA team, aliens cannot attempt to infest connected nodes.

So, the alien team would want to maintain a balance between Infested and Overrun. Too many Infested means the TSA team gets lots of resources. Too many Overrun, and the TSA team can halt alien expansion by cleaning all the Infested sites.

I think it would be best to use a card/bidding system for combat resolution. That way, you can reuse the cards for events:
<img src='http://robotrevolution.org/ns/sample_card.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>

Ah, idle thoughts. Never any time to folow up on them. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'>

HellSpawn · June 2003

mah apologies..but i didnt know there were worriers in space hulk...i only remember genestealers

breathstealer · June 2003

oh...my...god

I had no idea so many ppl were interested...im writing this the day after the first post, and wow...2 pages already.

Well, i haven't worked on the rules any more yet, as i've been busy painting my converted emperor's champ, and making terrain for 40k. lol...just got back from the store.

First of all, the models would have to be converted, but i already have some ideas:

Marine: Imperial guard w/ space marine jp
HA: Stormtrooper?
Skulk: Gaunt
Gorge: um....
Lerk: Gargoyles with some major converting
Fade: Heavily converted warrior eg. less shell, more human like
Onos: Land Raider <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>

And that doesn't even include buildings.

If anyone makes some stuff, take some photos and post em here.

Oh, and as for scenery, with a lot of time and some crazy patience, you could make a full ns map. Ask a mapper for some source code or something. I can already imagine...tabletop bast complete with working lift and airlock...whahahahahahahah!

Thanks for this huge show of interest.

(oh...im also lazy and poor...im 12 lol...thats why many of my models are completely out of bits...i cant afford anything more)

HellSpawn · June 2003

i think the new demon hunters for 40k would look real good as heavy armoured marienes.. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'>

GhostlyPea · June 2003

lol..i been playing G/W for 10 years..and HL pretty much since it comes out..if u can get it up n running it wud b great <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'>

(post rules in the post or something)

Creepin_Jeezus · June 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (HellSpawn @ Jun 29 2003, 09:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> mah apologies..but i didnt know there were worriers in space hulk...i only remember genestealers  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
there wasn't any warriors in space hulk, but that was also a spin off of warhammer 40k and in warhammer 40k you get many more types of aliens then just the genestealers (and all are just as nasty <b>[evil laugh])</b>

ThinG · June 2003

The idea would definately work
I see Space Hulk as a clear influence on NS (story-wise)
The dutch translation of Space Hulk sucks...

anyways, good to see so many fellow WH fans, and a couple of old-timers, although space crusade is before my time...

Cheers

Ph0enix · June 2003

Space Crusade was great, although the dreadnought was uber-tough.

breathstealer · July 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (GhostlyPea @ Jul 1 2003, 03:04 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>(post rules in the post or something)</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
which was exactly what i was going to do.

please...be patient, its hard work doing this.

Hida_Tsuzua · July 2003

As well as tabletop mini's what about tabletop rpgs?

D20 might work though I don't know how well it handles autofire which is common in NS. Shadowrun has a decent system though the combat rules might not fit NS here (the binary autofire rules for example). L5R 1&2 edition rocks, but the ring system and lack of rules for gun combat hurts it (though that shouldn't be too hard and the rings could be renamed). Mechwarrior would fit but I'm not crazy about its system. Big Eyes Small Mouth would be adaptable for NS and replicate the nanos well though it might end up giving NS an anime feel. Call of Cthulhu system would work as long you gave the marines a chance. All Flesh must be eaten is another possiblity.

Tabletop Ns?

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