Time Travel N Stuff
NightCrawlerz
Join Date: 2003-04-18 Member: 15609Members
Join Date: 2003-04-18 Member: 15609Members
<div class="IPBDescription">im board</div> Here is my thesis:
Time travel is possible, but changing the past or future is impossible. ill try to make a good example.
Pretend i am standing alone in my room and i say to my self, "self in 20 years im going to come back to this very point in time and slap my past self" You would then appear in frount of your self and then would be slaped.... by your self. thats the easyiest example i could think of.
Anything you are going to try to do in the past you would have already tried to do. there for there is no way to change the past. But this also aplys to the future mainly because you have to ask yourself if you are the present or just somone elses past? And if you are somone else past then anything you will do has already been done. And that my friend leads to a irreversible past and an unchangable future.
i hope ive made my self clear.
Time travel is possible, but changing the past or future is impossible. ill try to make a good example.
Pretend i am standing alone in my room and i say to my self, "self in 20 years im going to come back to this very point in time and slap my past self" You would then appear in frount of your self and then would be slaped.... by your self. thats the easyiest example i could think of.
Anything you are going to try to do in the past you would have already tried to do. there for there is no way to change the past. But this also aplys to the future mainly because you have to ask yourself if you are the present or just somone elses past? And if you are somone else past then anything you will do has already been done. And that my friend leads to a irreversible past and an unchangable future.
i hope ive made my self clear.
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Comments
If it is possible to go back in time you can change your past. Imagine you were 20 years old. You just finished your time-travel machine, when, wham! A 20 year old and 1 day older than you form of yourself comes back and destroys the machine's plans, thereby making it impossible to clone it, and then sabotages the machine to self destruct itself, and punches you in the gut, then injects a killing poison into you. How would that affect your future self, or the one who traveled? First, if you boasted about your machine, when the people you bragged about it to get there, you would have nothing to show for it. Then they'd get ****, and then punch you, probably again. Then you'd die as a result of the poison. That would greatly affect the future self, because because of what he just did, he just killed himself in the past, making him impossible to be 20 because he just died 1 day ago. I think. Do I know what I'm talking about? I'm just blabbing. but I think if anyway, if you could travel back in time--I wouldn't. It would be too risky.
The reality you are living right now is unchangeable, both past and future.
ill try a longer and more weirder example.
Say you go back intime to tell yourself not to build a time machine and go back in time but you doing that only makes you curious about going back in time to see why you would want to stop your self from doing it in the past. you realise that going back in time made you really depresed. so you go back in time to stop your self from doing it. THere for you are the one that made yourself go back in time in the first place. The very thing you tryed to do caused it to happen. Do you get it??? thats why your above example is flawed.
If i went back in time to distroy my time machine plans which i used in my time to create the machine I would have to fail because other wise i would have never went back in time.
Edit: no licku, say i did try to tell everyone about my time machine but who would belive me??? mybe it caused me alot of grief and that why i went back in time to slap myself. Which in turn made me slap myself.
1 i appeard next to myself
2.wonderd why i did such a thing
3. relized i forgot what i looked like as a child
4. built a time machine
5 went back in time to see myself
I FYOU HAVENT SEEN IT GO WATCH 13 MONKEYS IT SHOWS MY THEORY PERFECTLY!!! <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Heh. I'm sorry, that was pretty mean, but seriously, can you structure your sentences better? All I understood was monkeys fitted your logic.
time travel forward is however possible by merely slowing down your personal clock relative to the rest of the universe's. for example, go orbit a black hole right near the event horizon and youll get whipping about at 99% the speed of light for a few decades, but it will feel like seconds! somehow survive the G forces and get away from the black hole (yes it is possible to escape if you stayed outside the event horizon) and you will feel like a few seconds have passed, while everyone else has aged and died. you ahve effectively traveled into the future. congrats, youre a hobo without a job or any skills or money that works in 3200 AD.
so what would happen would time split up making an parraell universe branching the orignal
or would time loop forever from that point of when you stoped your self and when you disided to stop you self
or you just ruined space and time it self
did you understand that
I hardly did my self <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
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YOUR logic doesn't make sense. If I pop back in time, and I see my time machine sitting there, what stops me from taking a crowbar to it? Some magical force? I know, it would have been impossible for me to come back to that time if I wreck the thing, but hey, who's going to stop me?
Then there's the other paradoxes. Like, some scientists make an experiment: at 3:02, they are going to recieve a marble from the future. At 3:04, they are going to send it back in time two minutes. Sounds good, right?
Okay, but <i>where did the first marble come from?</i> All of the scientists have been sending marbles backwards that they got from 3:04, but where did the first group get the marble? Did it appear at 3:02 from nowhere?
Then, let's say you go back in time and kill yourself, seeing as some magical force would have to stop you to keep that from happening. What happens to the food you ate from the time you killed yourself to when you traveled back in time? Does it disappear? But matter can't be created and destroyed. SOMETHING has to happen to it. Does it appear, undigested, back at the supermarket? But what if the apple you ate, being back there, would have caused something else to happen? Then what?
Time travel can't be possible, and if it is, I'd rather nobody try it, because I like the space time continuum like it is.
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YOUR logic doesn't make sense. If I pop back in time, and I see my time machine sitting there, what stops me from taking a crowbar to it? Some magical force? I know, it would have been impossible for me to come back to that time if I wreck the thing, but hey, who's going to stop me?
Then there's the other paradoxes. Like, some scientists make an experiment: at 3:02, they are going to recieve a marble from the future. At 3:04, they are going to send it back in time two minutes. Sounds good, right?
Okay, but <i>where did the first marble come from?</i> All of the scientists have been sending marbles backwards that they got from 3:04, but where did the first group get the marble? Did it appear at 3:02 from nowhere?
Then, let's say you go back in time and kill yourself, seeing as some magical force would have to stop you to keep that from happening. What happens to the food you ate from the time you killed yourself to when you traveled back in time? Does it disappear? But matter can't be created and destroyed. SOMETHING has to happen to it. Does it appear, undigested, back at the supermarket? But what if the apple you ate, being back there, would have caused something else to happen? Then what?
Time travel can't be possible, and if it is, I'd rather nobody try it, because I like the space time continuum like it is. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Amen.
Like I said, if you were to go back in time to destroy your time machine, since you traveled into the future and got stuck or something...
Once you've traveled back in time, you've already changed about a thousand things. Your very presence isn't allowed there, since there's already one of you. Imagine if you saw a clone of yourself, maybe a few weeks older than you, take a scythe and rip up your machine? Then the plans for it? Then slice off your hand? For one, the future version would eventually lose his hand, and then he would snap back into regular time, because he <b>can't be there</b>. There was never a time machine, because he destroyed it.
Changing your future is easy, though. Your past--it's happening right when you go back.
And yeah, I would prefer no one ever make a fully-functional time machine. It would wreck havoc into space-time if you went into the past. Hell, you could clone yourself! It would be about 5 seconds older! Imagine cloning <b>money</b>? That no one knew about? That would cause serious problems.
<b>Time travel can't be possible, and if it is, I'd rather nobody try it, because I like the space time continuum like it is.</b> Yeah, to finish off my post.
Dirty harry potter understands! GJ!
Same Pjofski, you couldnt distroy it.
If i go back in time to distroy the machine something has to stop me from doing it otherwise i would have never gone back intime in the first place seeing as how i wouldnt have the time machine.
What if you went back in time to stop the kenndy assasination?
say you setup with your own sniper rifle to shoot Harvy LEoswald before he could shoot the president. So you set up on a little grass hill so you have a veiw from which to shoot oswald. Soo kenndys car comes around and you see Oswald aiming at the presedent so you line up and fire but right before you pull the trigger a dog barks behind you and it startels you and it makes you miss oswald and the building completly. Your shot sails off into the sky. But oswald startled by your shot pulls the trigger hitting Kennedy in the head and killing him just like we've all seen. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> you see "I" was the shooter on the grassy noll, "I" was the second shot, "I" tryed to stop it but i couldnt because Anything i will try to do in the future to change the past i will have al ready tried and failed seeign as how it happend.
I tryed to stop him but all i did was end up failing and contributing to history.
YOur right harry the past is unchangeable. BUT, are you really the one leading the pack for the stream that is to follow, or are you just stick in the already flowing river.
When you reach the event horizon of a Quantam Singularity (black hole) time slows down to an infintissamal speed so that you are essentially frozen in time. In <i>Ender's Game, Speaker For The Dead, Xenocide, Children Of The Mind</i> they use Light-speed travel to slow down natural aging. That is the only type time travel that is possible, namely because WE can't alter reality because the slightest change in the past can have broad-reaching results that might wipe out your self. Every little action would have a reaction. If you don't exist to travel back in time to do whatever, then you should, by all means, collapse dead and be born again in about xxx years.
Dirty harry potter understands! GJ!
Same Pjofski, you couldnt distroy it.
If i go back in time to distroy the machine something has to stop me from doing it otherwise i would have never gone back intime in the first place seeing as how i wouldnt have the time machine.
What if you went back in time to stop the kenndy assasination?
say you setup with your own sniper rifle to shoot Harvy LEoswald before he could shoot the president. So you set up on a little grass hill so you have a veiw from which to shoot oswald. Soo kenndys car comes around and you see Oswald aiming at the presedent so you line up and fire but right before you pull the trigger a dog barks behind you and it startels you and it makes you miss oswald and the building completly. Your shot sails off into the sky. But oswald startled by your shot pulls the trigger hitting Kennedy in the head and killing him just like we've all seen. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> you see "I" was the shooter on the grassy noll, "I" was the second shot, "I" tryed to stop it but i couldnt because Anything i will try to do in the future to change the past i will have al ready tried and failed seeign as how it happend.
I tryed to stop him but all i did was end up failing and contributing to history.
YOur right harry the past is unchangeable. BUT, are you really the one leading the pack for the stream that is to follow, or are you just stick in the already flowing river. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
DUDE!
The past is changeable if you travel back. Read my whole post! The fact that you are even there in the first place is enough to wreak havoc in space-time. For starters, you can't just appear out of no where. And what if someone <b>saw</b> you setting up the sniper rifle? If you only traveled a day backwards, someone would go and alert the press of who was seen with a sniper rifle, ready to take out Kennedy. Did they ever prove that Lee Harvey Oswald shot him? It doesn't matter--you were seen with a sniper rifle, near the incident. Think they care if you were taking out Oswald? "Officer, I only had these illegally acquired F18s in my backyard so I could kill the gangsters!"
If you managed to go back to your future time (regular time to the future version) the past one will be jailed, possibly for life. SMACK. Instantly (or not =D), you are snapped into prison, as a day older version of yourself (if you did travel back only a day, assuming you lived back then). You would have to live out the rest of your life in prison just because you shot and missed Kennedy, but Oswald got him, and someone saw you. Please, think out your posts for a second. If you traveled back 5 seconds earlier, you'd see yourself in almost a perfect clone except for inside features like... cells and stuff. What would happen to you if you saw yourself? Say a day earlier (I keep using a day earlier because it's a good example) you were going to scrap your plans for the machine. FWACK! Here comes a future version of yourself. Even if it appeared for a second, it would encourage you, would it not? Humans are like that. I mean, look at the WTC, people instantly saw the "devil" faces in it. And when they folded the dollar bill up--it's just a biiiiig coincidence, in my opinion, but they're like OMG! THE DEVIL IS RELATED! HELP US IT'S THE APOCALYPSE!
If they go nuts over smoke, what will happen when you see a future version of yourself appear then snap back? It would definently encourage you to make it, and possibly make even more! Then everyone would travel back/forward in time, and the whole world would be in chaos. Just because of those few precious seconds, you caused the human race to eventually destroy itself! "Ok, that guy's a jerk, I'm going to kill him when he tries to steal my pencil--oh crap wth! there he is! 20 years older! I stand no chance as a 10 year old!"
Get real. Time is like a decimal point--one <b>small</b> point can make the difference between a million and a millionth.
[edit] WHY would you not be able to change the past in a big way (aside from the fact that your very presence there makes space-time angry)? Why would the dog bark to make you not shoot? WHY?! Explain! Explain clearly, too, make it sound like English was actually your first language [/edit]
Before you claim that time travel is possible you must consider one thing first.....
What is time ?
Time is a man made invention, it's a measuring utility the same as length of an object. It helps us to measure events. In the end when you cut it down to it's bare meaning. Time travelling into the past would mean that you moved every rock, plant, person, animal, atom, molecule, quark, what have you.. BACK to where it was at a certain point in time. You're talking about an energy drain on such a massive scale that by DEFINITION the energy to pull it off is 100% of the energy in the universe used 2 times over (once to reverse things, and once again to set them back in motion).
The closest you could ever get to time travel into the past is the alternate dimension theories, you'd have to travel into an alternate dimension that happened to be exactly like the place and time you wanted to go to. But I find that to be highly unlikely. Even if alternate dimensions did exist I think there would be a finite amount of them instead of that "Every decision makes a new dimension" crap.
And just to add my $0.02 to the forward travel discussion, the only method I think that would work would be cryo-freezing. I don't claim to be an expert on Einstein's special theory of relativity. But I think it's a bunch of crap. I don't believe in black holes in the sense that they're infintessimally small. And the slowing down of time all relies on the idea that the speed of light is constant no matter what frame of reference you're in which just bugs the crap out of me.
btw, I have never seen Back to the Future in my entire life. I've also never seen Wizard of Oz. I am one deprived-of-cool-classics child.
it's right now. no not when you said now, it's "now". no not back then now.. yes then, but a bit after.. right now you see :o nope too late, it's now now. Not then. it's now <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo-->
hmm reminds me of spaceballs <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
When are we? now sir. everything that happens now happens now. now?
Time travel is possible <i>and has already been proven</i>.
When you are accelerating, you are experiencing the Doppler effect of both sound and time. When you accelerate to nearly light-speed, light isn't coming to your eyes anymore... And neither is time. Therefore, if you accelerate to nearly light-speed, you will go back in time. This has been proven by propelling an atom fast enough that it "left" our time dimension.
Haven't you seen back to the future?
Does the term Trans Dementional Rift mean anything to you?
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Remember what happend to Homer when he went back in time?
ok look. Here is the physics of it. You can never reach the speed of light. As you move faster your mass increases. Not your weight or volume it is your mass.. what you are made up of. The closer you go to 100% the speed of light the more mass you gain needing more energy to push you faster. As soon as you reach the speed of light, which isn't possible, you have an infinite amount of mass. You cannot be pushed father because your mass requires more energy than the universe. (there is an equatino to show that as you move faster your mass increases i forget it tho) I'll try and explain how the light thing works by looking at an example of a boxcar (train). A man is standing on a moving train that has a light on the roof. When he sees the light it appears to be just going stright to the floor. (if we say light moves in a linear motion). If there is another man on the side of the train tracks looking at that same light in the box car it would seem as if the light was bending. He begins observing it at one point and as the boxcar moves along the lightbulb moves with it. That means that the light has farther to travel from his eyes because it is in motion. If he could somehow record how long the light took to reach the floor of the car it would be longer than the man on in the car watching it. The man on the side feels more time, although it might be only 0.000000000006 of a second. This was prooven using an two atomic clocks. One was laid out on a table and the other was taken on an plane from point to point. As one flight ended it would board another. The clocks (which measure about .00000000000000000000001 of a second) where brought around in a plan and left in the office for one year. Because of the relation to time and light the clock traveling in the planes measured 2 seconds longer than the one in the office. Now say your moving at 99.99 the speed of light. If you stay in orbit for one year, 20 years will past for a friend on earth. Time is relative to you so you experience less time. anyways this is getting boring to write so ill just let you ponder over this. Some very interesting stuff. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->