Gamers don't age, WE level up ! ! !
Kostriktor
Switzerland Join Date: 2017-01-08 Member: 226342Members
Switzerland Join Date: 2017-01-08 Member: 226342Members
Hello divers,
I'm part of the community since some months now and experienced feelings of deep immersion to this game.
Unfortunately I'm disappointed for many reasons; imo the developers aren't real gamers, feels like they are VR fans and want to develop an amazing VR experience, which it is, obviously.
For us real gamers tho, there's not much space left.
I think they should take inspiration from this "Ideas and Suggestions" Thread really hard !
Back to my point:
We want to level up, the best feeling of progression!
Considering Subnauticas style, it would probably be unappropriated to level up the character, instead, we should be able to level up all of our gear, vehicles, stations and buildings.
Check my other thread and/or open your mind: Think about your best friend ingame; the fabricator. What if you could bring him a titan ingot, maybe another computer chip, and boom, you could upgrade him into Fabricator Mk II. Maybe he becomes faster at crafting? Maybe he can cook better Fish?
Think harder; everything in the game could be upgraded to work "faster", "stronger" or "longer"
There's plenty options to improve your experience, immersion and feeling of progression.
If you're a real gamer, you know what i mean.
If you're a VR fanboy, keep enjoying the amazing graphics.
Cheers
I'm part of the community since some months now and experienced feelings of deep immersion to this game.
Unfortunately I'm disappointed for many reasons; imo the developers aren't real gamers, feels like they are VR fans and want to develop an amazing VR experience, which it is, obviously.
For us real gamers tho, there's not much space left.
I think they should take inspiration from this "Ideas and Suggestions" Thread really hard !
Back to my point:
We want to level up, the best feeling of progression!
Considering Subnauticas style, it would probably be unappropriated to level up the character, instead, we should be able to level up all of our gear, vehicles, stations and buildings.
Check my other thread and/or open your mind: Think about your best friend ingame; the fabricator. What if you could bring him a titan ingot, maybe another computer chip, and boom, you could upgrade him into Fabricator Mk II. Maybe he becomes faster at crafting? Maybe he can cook better Fish?
Think harder; everything in the game could be upgraded to work "faster", "stronger" or "longer"
There's plenty options to improve your experience, immersion and feeling of progression.
If you're a real gamer, you know what i mean.
If you're a VR fanboy, keep enjoying the amazing graphics.
Cheers
Comments
Honestly, there's nothing about Subnautica as it is that breaks immersion. To add a bald-faced game mechanic like leveling would break that. We don't level up in life; we just get better at what we do and how we do it. In Subnautica, that means being smarter and more efficient about how we go about our tasks - gathering resources, procuring food, and so forth. To be leveling up and going through leveled unlocks would just shatter the world as it is.
Besides, how would leveling even be implemented? There are plenty of different play styles, so you'd need a way to reward all of them without letting players game the system at the same time. Games like Deus Ex can get away with that because they're highly linear, level-based games. Open-world games like Skyrim can get away with it because of the sheer enormity of the world and the game's combat-heavy design ethos, which pushes you into certain game paths, all of which can be designed for (since there are only a few anyway, it's easy). How would one level up in Subnautica? Swim a certain distance? Eat something? That reduces leveling to just participating in game mechanics, and that's the sphere of achievements, not leveling.
Speaking for myself, one of the things that will reliably get me ticked off at a game is seeing what I want to be able to do but being prevented by some arbitrary level requirement. If I have the blueprint and the materials, I should be able to do it, levels be damned. I really rather admire Subnautica for not falling into that trap. Found the blueprints, found the raw materials, have the tool - go. No farming for XP like in Skyrim. My feeling of progression comes from improving my base design, finally getting into deeper biomes, tricking out a base or a sub, doing something I've never tried. An arbitrary "Level Up!" really has never filled me with a sense of accomplishment in any game...truth told, the only feeling I get from leveling up is "well, it's about damn time you let me do (previously-prevented action here)."
I know you're not going to agree with me on this and that's completely cool. Only bear in mind that I'm not saying you're wrong; I'm just saying I don't agree it'd be for the best in this case.
Now I COULD see some kind of like... Career/Specialization system if they give us "Subnautica 2 - Here's Your Damn Multiplayer", where you rank up by following things your Career would do.
Like are you on a survey team? Rank up by placing beacons and the like, or identifying new species. Engineering? Build stuff.
These would unlock perks. Like say, Engineers can build bases more efficiently and use less resources. Surveyers might have a better chance of finding materials or something. I don't know, just throwing it out there.
I just don't think it fits THIS particular game as it is well to have a level up system.
I edited the post with BOLD, so even you guys start to understand other ppls posts : )
Then again, i recommend reading posts entirely, instead of stopping on the title and writing down an answer.
have a nice day
Leveling up requires some metric to determine when you've leveled up. Experience points are common, but whatever the mechanic, it's about accumulating enough somethings to level up. Whether the character or the equipment, I find a leveling mechanic applied to Subnautica to be poor game design, as it is in many cases where it's used. Furthermore, as I said before, level-gating the ability to produce or upgrade certain items nearly always detracts from the game experience rather than adding to it. Once the blueprint has been found and necessary materials gathered, applying an additional block in the form of a level requirement is a frustrating contrivance and a mark of weak game design.
Subnautica already gates its equipment in the availability of needed raw materials. Some items cannot be made until mid- to late-game because their required materials are difficult to obtain. Thus, a player is required to advance their play skills and the tech they've manufactured in order to "earn" the ability to get the necessary materials. This is good game design; creating a logical impediment to a player's ambitions, one which can be overcome through play, not grinding. An excellent example is the PRAWN jump jet upgrade. Kyanite simply cannot be obtained early in game; one needs to produce vehicles and appropriate upgrades in order to even get to the resource needed, and that's going to mean a lot of use of game mechanics and exploration - in other words, requiring the player to play the game. By the time enough effort has been invested to gather those difficult-to-obtain resources, the upgrade has been earned through that hard work; requiring a set level to be earned as well is an unnecessary encumbrance.
Incidentally, this applies to both player- and inventory-side leveling. Level-gating equipment and level-gating the player are two sides of the same cheap mechanic.
Bottom line, if I manage to come up with the materials either through the lengthy "preferred" path of getting to them or by an act of suicidal daring, I should be able to use them. Having to wait until the game decides through some arbitrary leveling mechanic means that I'm now allowed to do something I was otherwise able to do hours ago only breeds frustration and resentment.
You're kidding, right? Games have level-ups and experience points even where it doesn't make a lick of sense. Mass Effect has leveling systems, don't you tell me that kids today don't know what a leveling system is.
Edit: As for the bolded part... No, I don't think anything in this game needs leveling up. We have upgrades. Instead of the Cyclops leveling up, you find the materials to create a Mk II Pressure compensator.
That hardly matters. It takes literally seconds to look up "Modern Games With Leveling Systems". Just because YOU apparently don't play a lot of games with leveling systems doesn't mean there aren't any.
Look at literally any MMO. THOSE have leveling systems.
Frakking Overwatch has levels, albeit ones that lead to loot boxes rather than increase abilities.
The Mario RPGs on the DS have leveling systems that increase stats.
You said something that was factually incorrect and I provided evidence to the contrary, evidence that could have been looked up quickly, and you saying "I don't even play mass effect" literally has nothing to do with the point I was making.
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It simply doesn't fit the concept of the game.
There's old divers, and there's bold divers... But there ain't no old, bold divers.
we already can upgrade/level up, it's just so poor it wont be enough.
See those fins you turn into speed fins or charger fins, that's the cool way to level up.
look at that.... power usage reducer? (lol), that's the kind of vehicular upgrades one wants.
and yet, the whole system doesn't fit it's actual potential.
but hey, nobody is perfect.
as i mentioned in the other post, modules and upgrades are definitely not the same; achieving upgrades trough modules, that's poor game design ! @scifiwriterguy
and hey, let me read some of your scifi, i'll probably be more entertained than playing another crappy survival game on steam.
You seem to be the only one with this problem on this thread.
In what way is 'Unlocking and improving your technology to progress further' bad game design? Seems perfectly valid to me.
Y'know, since pretty much everything you've posted recently seems to be less "I think this game has potential but I'd like it to see it improve", you seem to mostly be here to complain. That combined with this comment... Do you even LIKE Subnautica?
@Kostriktor - There's a piece right here; an episodic called Downward Spiral. It's in the General Discussion page. Another episode comes out this weekend.
I don't like Subnautica at all.
It blew my mind with it's potential, but then you realize, the devs are another bunch of non-gamers trying to get some money from the gaming industry. a fucked up gaming industry.
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... I... Have nothing more to say to you that won't get a moderator to have Words with me. Good day, sir.
Then we read this:
It blew my mind with it's potential, but then you realize, the devs are another bunch of non-gamers trying to get some money from the gaming industry. a fucked up gaming industry.
You can't always get what you want, life will teach you this with the strongest and most painful kicks.
That's potentially unfair to Mexicans who are trying to learn English. Then again I suppose it IS possible that Kostriktor's first language isn't English.
In all honesty, with all those changes, it's probably going to do more harm than good in the long run; what with new bugs that could be introduced.
And to rephrase the question asked earlier, "Do you even like Survival Games?"
Because, as you stand now, it doesn't seem like you do.
Right, so YOU come in with YOUR expectations, the devs don't make the game YOU want, and that mean's the devs are sucking corporate boner?
Go back to your cave. I doubt you are a real gamer, because real gamers appreciate games that are made in the devs vision, and don't have a tantrum based do it my way or i'll insult you like a child mentality.. And the age thing, making that kind of comment means you were probably born around the time I joined these forums.
Your comments show you know nothing about Subnautica, UWE or Gaming.
Check out UWE's other non VR games. There are a few... They've been making games a while now..
Subnautica wants to be a survival/openworld experience, while it's basically a linear "go collect things, first this, then that, victory"-walktrough/swimtrough.
that's why i, and many others, are seriously disappointed.
fanbois finding this a great game ? obvious! these guys would pay it a tripleA full price straight away in its actual state. luckily these fanboi persons also exist, they help devs out a lot financially.
im sure though that some serious feedback and suggestions are also a great source to the devs.
regardless, the game could be fleshed out a bit, but it's fun as it is. I like the base-building mechanics a lot, and it provides a reason for resource collection and exploration.