Gorge tunnels should be "fixed" the right way...Agree or Disagree?
MoFo
Join Date: 2013-09-09 Member: 188047Members
Join Date: 2013-09-09 Member: 188047Members
I know there was a thread on Tunnels already, but I couldn't find it, so here goes...
I understand why they made it so Gorge tunnels can't be placed in elevated positions or in vents... really I do... I may not agree with it, but I understand it...
But this is really just too much... I'm coming across SO many places on ground level that are blocked off.. It's like you can only place tunnels right out in the open where Marines are guaranteed to see them...
A few examples....
Refinery - Under the stairs in the room next to flow control... You can't place the tunnel unless it's far enough forward for Marines to see it while running down the stairs...
Tram - In server room, you can't place them behind the servers in the back anymore... they can only be placed out in the open where Marines can easily see them from nearly anywhere in the room.
Summit - In Flight, back in the corner (which used to be a regular tunnel spot) - now you can't place the tunnel around the corner so it's out of sight... it has to be out in the open where Marines can see it.
and that's just 3... If you want to sneak up a tunnel you have to be lucky enough to grow it (and with all the noise you make this isn't easy) then you have to have a comm drop a shade on it (sadly, many don't want to spend the res on it) then hope you can build the shade before being discovered (which again is hard because the heal spray is so loud)
- I get not wanting them to be placable in glitchy/bugged or unfair positions... but this "fix" has really taken it much too far. Why couldn't they just block off our ability to place them in vents/platforms/etc?!? Would it really have been that much more work?
The worst part is that now Tunnels are only useful between two Alien bases... Anywhere else and they're not only a waste of res, but a liability since Marines can use them to enter your base.
I understand why they made it so Gorge tunnels can't be placed in elevated positions or in vents... really I do... I may not agree with it, but I understand it...
But this is really just too much... I'm coming across SO many places on ground level that are blocked off.. It's like you can only place tunnels right out in the open where Marines are guaranteed to see them...
A few examples....
Refinery - Under the stairs in the room next to flow control... You can't place the tunnel unless it's far enough forward for Marines to see it while running down the stairs...
Tram - In server room, you can't place them behind the servers in the back anymore... they can only be placed out in the open where Marines can easily see them from nearly anywhere in the room.
Summit - In Flight, back in the corner (which used to be a regular tunnel spot) - now you can't place the tunnel around the corner so it's out of sight... it has to be out in the open where Marines can see it.
and that's just 3... If you want to sneak up a tunnel you have to be lucky enough to grow it (and with all the noise you make this isn't easy) then you have to have a comm drop a shade on it (sadly, many don't want to spend the res on it) then hope you can build the shade before being discovered (which again is hard because the heal spray is so loud)
- I get not wanting them to be placable in glitchy/bugged or unfair positions... but this "fix" has really taken it much too far. Why couldn't they just block off our ability to place them in vents/platforms/etc?!? Would it really have been that much more work?
The worst part is that now Tunnels are only useful between two Alien bases... Anywhere else and they're not only a waste of res, but a liability since Marines can use them to enter your base.
Comments
EDIT: I agree with OP that tunnels should ONLY have been stopped from being put in places no single marine with no JP could get to. So low vents are fine, under stairs is fine, etc.
I think you just contradicted yourself there, friend...
Other than that.. i agree.
The solution: Make them researchable again..
I don't care if its "more fun" or "more toys" for the gorge early game.. we've lost the creative positioning due to the mobile team having even quicker transport method within the first minute of a round. (i.e. balance)
I don't remember anyone asking for this.. or it ever being an idea people supported in here :-/
Is anyone actually opposed to it going back to being researchable?
I already said no. But I'm going to have to say no.
Where exactly did Mofo contradict himself? And how is having a tunnel between two fortified bases a liability? Most marines who walk into an alien base get slaughtered quickly unless its a an organized effort of a group of marines.
Read that sentence of his again.
He says the "only useful" method is between two bases, but then states that "anywhere else" - wording that implies exclusivity and a distinction from what he just mentioned - has its downsides, which included "Marines [using] them to enter your base"... which.. can only be done by adhering to the method he just previously declared as being the "only useful" method? The very one he just made a distinction from and isn't speaking about? *scratches head*
Its really irrelevant to the discussion at hand, though, hehe, i just thought i'd say something after re reading his sentence like 5 times :-P
I think you misunderstood or are confused, marines can enter your base as long as one of the two exits is in it. This is how 98% of the tunnels I have ever seen are placed, and is likely what he meant. One exit by the hive, one elsewhere on the map (if this second exit is by a diff hive it is if anything safer).
Another reason why shade could be considered as viable first (second) pub hive. Nobody believes me.
I don't get what you mean.... you don't need a shade hive to drop a shade? And going shift hive first would even allow you to echo one that's already built, which is obviously safer.
Would be bad for an Onos or Gorge who went through one without knowing that it was off the floor since he couldn't get back in it.
Silence. Silently get tunnel up, silently get shade up. Not even to mention camo to get behind enemy lines.
Well they should fix that, maybe allow it to be place a few feet of the ground, in gorge/onos jump height.
Only other answer i got from a fellow player was that it looked too much like a butthole if it was on a wall, and i agree
I do! I do! But they are all so keen on their crags!
I've wasted precious seconds finding a better spot, but in the end I go like screw it, it's taken long enough it goes on the damn techpoint, the most obvious place.
This might be "balanced" for some reason, but it's also boring.
Btw, what was wrong with hive/mc teleportation and building chambers in vents? You can't place any support building but hydras in a vent now, is that not punishment enough? Gorge Tunnels are inferior to use compared to hive teleportation and phasegates, yet you can't even hide them, because of the reasons in the OP and the fact that you can't cloak infestation anymore. Shades won't do the trick if the tunnel/infestation has to be near a frequently used corridor. It is also a highway for upgrade hunting marines. It takes ages to react and reach a tunnel exit under attack and if you go out you are most likely directly in the fire line. If I wouldn't have played ns1 for years, it might not even bother me now, but I can't help but compare ns2 with ns1. And if ns1 was an oasis in the desert, ns2 is a rock with scorpions under it in the same desert. Sure, you can eat the scorpions, but you would rather want to reach the oasis.
Adding to that: if it can be shot from a distance with an LMG (doing full damage) without necessarily getting to it. Also, it shouldn't involve any overly complicated climbing (e.g. to the raised platform above Cargo) to get into a position to reach the tunnel or shoot it down.
Wouldnt it make more sense to shift first and echo the shade?
He means that you can make sneaky tunnels way better with phantom.
Oh good point, didnt consider that he meant from Base to Base, excluding Base to somewhere else.. but still.. it would apply non the less, considering the marine would still be able to get back to the alien base in either example??
@sotanaht
@neoquaker1
did you both disagree with my post based on that one non sequitor comment of mine, or was it because you feel gorge tunnels should not be researchable?
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GIEF. Would be so ridiculously funny. So many nooks and crannies in the roof it'd make hiding a tunnel so much easier. Not to mention having aliens pour on your face from the roof would be cool as hell.
But you can't echo the tunnel
If marines cant reach the tunnel, some lifeforms also can't. Its a trade off. Besides, ever tried reaching a tunnel fast which is placed somewhere high up as a skulk?
Make it researchable for all I care but I am definitely in the tunnels everywhere group. There are plenty other ways for marines to solve the 'I cant reach it' problem.
apologies if this has been answered. He means a shade hive for getting Phantom to heal spray with no noise.
Shade / Crag / Shift / or Early tunnels for map control.