I'm curious about the replay functionality. It does seem like an absolute necessity for comp play - and unless the in-game recording system has changed since ENSL S2, it was dodgy at best. It seems to me that the best place for any replay recording to take place would be at the server level, as the server coordinates every player's actions: what if the server saved every input that happened every tick, kind of like a log file, which could be then downloaded and re-played in the NS2 client in spectator mode? This would be much more useful than 12 different POV recordings...
While I doubt this will happen, this would be similar to HLTV demos in NS1. And yes, it would be more useful than what we have, which in practice is nothing.
Next step is also being able to "market" the game and teams.
I don't know why (but i have an idea) but one frag video is always a good advertising vector.
I'm asking for a replay system for more than a year, that's a feature i would actually donate for. Instead of splashing hive animations..
But it won't come, too much work needed and not important to UWE.
Do you believe it's too much work or a technical impossibility?
I still believe a good replay system could've saved UWE from massive headaches and helped the game in tremendous ways:
The game is inaccessible?
Fine, we can actually create proper, purposeful and well edited video tutorials with demo system.
The game is hard to balance?
Fine, we can play and rewind rounds from multiple viewpoints to understand what exactly happens during a round, what makes a difference between a good and a bad round and so on.
Retaining players is hard and advertising the game to new players takes a lot of work?
Fine, the high quality community generated content both advertises the game and massively helps retaining the existing community. We can have people talking about the depth of the gameplay, we can have people writing actual deep match reports, we can have frag movies that make people want to run NS2 and try to replicate their favourite frags, we can have people finding their favourite comp players and teams with unique style and so on.
---
I don't know how UWE plans to handle NS2 in the future and I don't know if a replay system at this point is going to spark things up anymore, but I believe it's one of the few things that have any kind of possibility to make a difference if UWE wants to see NS2 survive or thrive in the longer run.
Obviously there's not much to be done if the system is an impossibility, but 'too much work' sounds like a very debatable thing considering how much time, effort and money UWE has put into other things that could be helped with the system.
Let's be realistic here, this isn't a thread trying to tell UWE what to do, or a demand for anything. If any one of these things gets worked on, that's a proper bonus. What I want to do is try to cement an idea of what may be possible, to gauge the will of UWE to work in any of these areas, and to provide a place for feedback in both directions about goals and progress.
Look, even if it's ONLY keybindings that is changed in any way before March, that will be a step in the right direction and something to aim for. We'd all LOVE a replay system that works nicely, and of course any performance improvements to make the game play better, but beggars can't be choosers.
I've contacted UWE, we shall see what, if anything happens. You don't ask, you don't get: don't knock me for at least trying
I'm asking for a replay system for more than a year, that's a feature i would actually donate for. Instead of splashing hive animations..
But it won't come, too much work needed and not important to UWE.
I wonder if it could be implemented as a mod.
Way back in beta there was this guy called @Player on the forums who was in the progress of making a demo system. Same guy who made Overmind, the only way server operators could have any admin control of their own server way back when. Unfortunately he bailed on the project(s) as the beta never got any better.
It is likely that some degree of improvement will be made to competitive aspects of the game before the NS2WC, should it go ahead. This thread would likely prove useful in allowing us to prioritise those improvements. Please continue it, it will be read.
However, the number of changes that can be made before the qualifier rounds begin is realistically very small. Changes will mainly affect the finals series in Cologne, as there is a much greater lead time on them than the qualifiers.
Despite overwhelming love for fan art competitions among viewers and the NS2 community, there will be a ban on them during the NS2WC. The excitement and love they induced in competitive players was too much, and distracted them from enjoying the actual NS2 play. I'm not sure I can handle another forum outpouring of love for fan art competitions. The same goes for face-painting.
On camera wrestling will, however, still be permitted.
You can currently bypass the consistency check with ease.. most people dont realize it or dont care to abuse it, but its not nearly what it could/should be... However its not probably worth trying to fix as its slightly limited with what you can accomplish...
Replay support would be massive, do you not see what kind of interest Dota2 games can pull? Being able to join up to any inprogress game and just watch, either from a directed POV or just free looking around is amazing.. OFC that does require significant infrastructure to support I imagine, but even some basic HLTV recording would be an improvement.
Replays: due to the number of people who stream the game these days, someone is bound to record that moment you want replayed. And it wouldn't really be possible to implement into the game/would require a LOT of work.
If you really believe that you don't realize the difference between the quality possible in a good demo system compared to 3500kb/s live stream.
There are so many moments where I have gotten some decent frags and unable to have them recorded because recording live -> low performance and it's in poor quality compared to what could be achieved with HL demo system.
Plus the points Dragon made, and also check out www.gamereplays.org.
The quality in this video: http://www.twitch.tv/l2pns2/c/2111922 (pub frags and some comp fade at the end in combat mod - nothing worth noting as a frag video)
Is very terrible encoding and resolution wise to what could be done with the HL1 demo system..
I'm asking for a replay system for more than a year, that's a feature i would actually donate for. Instead of splashing hive animations..
But it won't come, too much work needed and not important to UWE.
@Hugh
What would be a realistic price to get the demo system, like HLTV or DOTA 2's system, outsourced? Can we do a kick starter-ish thing for it? We shouldn't have to pay for already promised features, but if it gets it done I would be willing.
AiorosJoin Date: 2003-03-24Member: 14850Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
edited November 2013
@Hugh
what about stuff like SamusDroid mod with bug fixes. (yeah bug fixes creat new bugs, but it seems he got it working quit fast with the current version without creating new bugs).
even small bug fixes would help. We got bugs in ns2 since Beta. Like i already posted in another thread, its the little thinks which add up after time.
That nanoshield bug for commanders was like one of the most annoying things and just got recently fixed, after 2 years. 2 years .....
And what about hotkey system? Why can people create mods for everything, but UWE doesnt copy them or take them into the game ...
For example:
- lowlight mod from mendasp as option in the menu (improvement for many casual gamers)
- fast load menu mod (option in the menu and that would take rly no time to add)
- ultra low detail mod (yeah ppl say its not improving much, but its still helping some players and PCs specs e.g. swalk)
- ns2 mod (why not add tournament mode into the game to ready, instead of the 20 seconds vote system to start ... you already got shown how to do it, why not add it?!)
- pause system from dragon
- hotkey mod
@Hugh
Replay system and properly functioning FPV is hugely godahm important. I remember making an anti-cheat thread about this very same issue in which you demonstrated a total lack of understanding. This isn't even a change that is specific to NS2, but should have beneficial flow on for the spangly new secret game. Are you not going to use spark for your next game? Are you not planning to have a replay system there as well?
You're totally happy to raise 30k for a WCS, as well as give out reinforcement badges to people supporting a supposedly community driven project (I guess any project that isn't Australian is ok for UWE to support). But basic functionality that 110% aligns with the company vision of 'connecting the world through play' seems to sit fine right over there on the 10 year back burner.
Honestly I say this in the most constructive way possible. I suggest you get your finger on the pulse of this game quick in preparation for the success and exposure you expect the WCS to bring to ns2. Because for the longest time you have seemed to not have the slightest clue. It also irks me to hear you talk about a limitation to 'how much improvement' we can expect when you don't even know what needs to be improved to begin with.
Let me help outline for you a simple timeline of what seems to be expected From now untill the December playoffs
- Implement simple number tweaks to address glaringly obvious gameplay issues (most of which are well highlighted for even a dummy to see).
- Fight the urge to splurge money on fancy new 'features'.
From December untill March
- Implement basic functionality such as demo/replay, key rebinding. Some of these functions are already done by the community as per Aioros' post.
- Improve core technical issues such as surround sound, collision, and rendering performance.
Replays: due to the number of people who stream the game these days, someone is bound to record that moment you want replayed. And it wouldn't really be possible to implement into the game/would require a LOT of work.
If you had experience with quake 3/live's demo system + wolfcam you'd know how much it sucks not to have one.
EDIT: It also makes bug repros much easier as you just demo every game then go to where the bug happened and narrow down the causes.
@Hugh Thanks for dropping in and responding, it's very much appreciated.
I recognise that the list at the top of this thread is a huge amount of work and I don't think anyone here thinks it would be reasonable to expect all of that. What this thread wad intended for was to refocus discussion about the most critical things so that you guys can see which topic is most important to the comp community. I've deliberately not tried to guide discussions for a while as there are better and more experienced players than me whose opinions frankly matter more than mine. What these guys seem to be saying is that keybindings and bug fixes that have already been fixed in mods should be added officially, and that demos ala hltv are the most important to secure ongoing success from these champs.
I encourage everyone reading this thread to keep things positive. We are where we are now, there is limited time until the live finals, and this is a fantastic opportunity to make ns2 even better.
Let's make the most of this!
It is likely that some degree of improvement will be made to competitive aspects of the game before the NS2WC, should it go ahead. This thread would likely prove useful in allowing us to prioritise those improvements. Please continue it, it will be read.
However, the number of changes that can be made before the qualifier rounds begin is realistically very small. Changes will mainly affect the finals series in Cologne, as there is a much greater lead time on them than the qualifiers.
In all seriousness xDragon's post has 24 agrees and 2 awesomes at this moment. It has two disagrees, both from strongly UWE related posters (Former playtester lead and you). Long story short there's a pretty big gap between what the community thinks and what the UWE shows to the outside. I highly doubt any of this is going to end well if you're sticking to the present course.
If you really want the tournament to happen and benefit the community, the way to do it is to start co-operating in more concrete ways than "some improvements will be made". Start having an open and honest dialogue on what possibly can be done, what the community feels necessary and what UWE needs out of the tournament. No flattering words or grandiose storylines, just open and direct communication straight to the point.
I know the views of various parts of the community and UWE will never meet all the way, but the dialogue still sets up a healthy base for forming an actual understanding and respect between UWE and the community. Meanwhile the present way the nVidia/Intel announcement thread is going reminds me of some North Korean politics simulation. It is definitely not representing a company that offers a steady foundation for building a healthy and self-sustaining fan community.
In all seriousness xDragon's post has 24 agrees and 2 awesomes at this moment. It has two disagrees, both from strongly UWE related posters (Former playtester lead and you). Long story short there's a pretty big gap between what the community thinks and what the UWE shows to the outside. I highly doubt any of this is going to end well if you're sticking to the present course.
It's not former playtester lead, it's current.
But I like the fact that we can see those votes, it really shows why the game is in the state it is right now
Anticheat: Not necessary, if someone is hacking, it's pretty easy to find out by just watching in spec for a minute or two, plus the super anal consistency checking means nothing will pass it, so no chance of running custom mods.
-snip-
Weird, could have sworn that was the goal of using lua for the engine... which is the sole responsibility holder in the game performing so badly that the entire population (mostly competitive players) left the game shortly after launch
edit: Not intended to be an attack, it's just I can't even use custom alien vision anymore which I used because I use to get dizzy so having the map greyscale with everything one solid color helped make everything clear.. and the whole point of using this kind of engine was to make modding easier! (also performance is my main problem with the game, since I enjoy playing in native resolution and max field of view for motion sickness reasons) which in the end backfires on me as it causes degrading performance to the point where I can't even look at the game in a competitive state because I'm handicapping myself and my actual skill level (which is quite high/brag)
Also I find it interesting how a dev team which is much more involved with their game/community -even if everyone points out all the issues/mistakes and this and that- compared to valve/hpe which are currently running CSGO which is in a terrible state, I mean non-stop the competitive players list everything wrong with csgo and what is literally needed for the game to improve to the point where both 1.6 and source players can combine and enjoy the game, I try so hard to enjoy it but all of its flaws and terrible additions just make me tear
And only a few complain there, valve does nothing, their game updates are atrocious and only doing things that give them revenue, they've ignored issues since the games private beta stages (nov 2011) which I was apart of and listed tons of issues still not fixed to this date.. and this is a billion dollar corp we're talking about, with tons of developers and tons of outside contractors (hidden path) who could probably work on the game night and day
worst part is, most of the fucking issues derive from server side console commands and terrible graphic effects/additions, the rest is simple shit like recoil patterns or screen shakes
comparing to uwe which actually replies to the forums, changes some things/fixes lots of issues and all that, and allows players-devs (mainly sewlek/mappers) to communicate and help improve the state of the game -- yet are attacked so hardly.. weird but justified in a sense
///ontopic
Hope to see peoples problems/issues get sorted out before this tournament... not sure how the outcome will look, but we'll see!
AiorosJoin Date: 2003-03-24Member: 14850Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
From that list nothing will be done.
atm its mostly sewlek working on ns2 and wild guess, he trys to fix the PVE game.
And when hes working on the balance he cant work on anything of that list, since hes the only dev left !
But I like the fact that we can see those votes, it really shows why the game is in the state it is right now
I like how you seem to be implying I, or any of the PTs have a big say in balancing the game. When in fact, our voices are on the lower end of the pole, below the Devs, below Sewlek, below the Map Testers and below the Balance Team.
But I like the fact that we can see those votes, it really shows why the game is in the state it is right now
I like how you seem to be implying I, or any of the PTs have a big say in balancing the game. When in fact, our voices are on the lower end of the pole, below the Devs, below Sewlek, below the Map Testers and below the Balance Team.
Didn't mention PTs at all :P
So, what's wrong with the post to click "Disagree"? I mean, I'd love for this tournament to happen, obviously, but you can't deny that the game has a lot of issues and is lacking features required for an esport to grow, and it's not like people haven't tried to help or suggested stuff...
AiorosJoin Date: 2003-03-24Member: 14850Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
this game never supported esports on a developing level. everyone who says something diffrent is lying.
otherwise the game would look diffrent and we wouldnt had so much useless features in it now.
without mendasp and dragon helping with their mods, more teams would have left much earlier.
cant thank these guys enough what they did .... thinks which UWE could have done so "easy".
just look @ the jumping marin who is crouching in the air and gets pulled down.
Anticheat: Not necessary, if someone is hacking, it's pretty easy to find out by just watching in spec for a minute or two, plus the super anal consistency checking means nothing will pass it, so no chance of running custom mods.
-snip-
Weird, could have sworn that was the goal of using lua for the engine... which is the sole responsibility holder in the game performing so badly that the entire population (mostly competitive players) left the game shortly after launch
edit: Not intended to be an attack, it's just I can't even use custom alien vision anymore which I used because I use to get dizzy so having the map greyscale with everything one solid color helped make everything clear.. and the whole point of using this kind of engine was to make modding easier! (also performance is my main problem with the game, since I enjoy playing in native resolution and max field of view for motion sickness reasons) which in the end backfires on me as it causes degrading performance to the point where I can't even look at the game in a competitive state because I'm handicapping myself and my actual skill level (which is quite high/brag)
Blame hackers, cheaters, and other people who feel the need to abuse the system.
Nah. If you're going allow people to change anything and everything without giving half a seconds thought to anti cheat in any form (remember, it took quite a long time for even consistency check to make it in) I feel you're not exactly have a solid plan.
Okay this is going off course a bit. I will update the top post when I get a chance to reflect the main (constructive on-topic) themes that are coming out of this thread.
The bottom line is this:
Network performance parameters (client moverate is 20?!) needs to be configurable, not hard coded.
Replay/HLTV system would be amazing for the live world champs. If there is ANY way of getting that into NS2, it'll really help to make the most of the WC finals but also have great knock-on effects for casting, and for people creating their own video/promo content. Got to be good for UWE. Plus it would surely be a feature for the next game on Spark, right?
Samusdroid's QOL fixes need to make it into vanilla ASAP!
@Hugh, @Sewlek is that a list that either of you could comment on?
Finally, a reminder to all: please keep this thread civil and productive. There have been a good number of very useful and helpful posts, so thank you to all who've taken the time to pass on their expertise and experience!
If all issues are fixed next month then I'll gladly admit my horrible mistake and prejudice. The track record is not good. And you forgot to address the other part of the post.
Also Hugh is not a PT, he's PR, don't think "Disagree" without arguments is good image, but that's my opinion.
Comments
Next step is also being able to "market" the game and teams.
I don't know why (but i have an idea) but one frag video is always a good advertising vector.
But it won't come, too much work needed and not important to UWE.
I still believe a good replay system could've saved UWE from massive headaches and helped the game in tremendous ways:
The game is inaccessible?
Fine, we can actually create proper, purposeful and well edited video tutorials with demo system.
The game is hard to balance?
Fine, we can play and rewind rounds from multiple viewpoints to understand what exactly happens during a round, what makes a difference between a good and a bad round and so on.
Retaining players is hard and advertising the game to new players takes a lot of work?
Fine, the high quality community generated content both advertises the game and massively helps retaining the existing community. We can have people talking about the depth of the gameplay, we can have people writing actual deep match reports, we can have frag movies that make people want to run NS2 and try to replicate their favourite frags, we can have people finding their favourite comp players and teams with unique style and so on.
---
I don't know how UWE plans to handle NS2 in the future and I don't know if a replay system at this point is going to spark things up anymore, but I believe it's one of the few things that have any kind of possibility to make a difference if UWE wants to see NS2 survive or thrive in the longer run.
Obviously there's not much to be done if the system is an impossibility, but 'too much work' sounds like a very debatable thing considering how much time, effort and money UWE has put into other things that could be helped with the system.
Look, even if it's ONLY keybindings that is changed in any way before March, that will be a step in the right direction and something to aim for. We'd all LOVE a replay system that works nicely, and of course any performance improvements to make the game play better, but beggars can't be choosers.
I've contacted UWE, we shall see what, if anything happens. You don't ask, you don't get: don't knock me for at least trying
I wonder if it could be implemented as a mod.
Way back in beta there was this guy called @Player on the forums who was in the progress of making a demo system. Same guy who made Overmind, the only way server operators could have any admin control of their own server way back when. Unfortunately he bailed on the project(s) as the beta never got any better.
However, the number of changes that can be made before the qualifier rounds begin is realistically very small. Changes will mainly affect the finals series in Cologne, as there is a much greater lead time on them than the qualifiers.
Of course, the pressing and immediate concern is making the remaining $7,000 happen! http://www.gofundme.com/ns2worldchampionship
Despite overwhelming love for fan art competitions among viewers and the NS2 community, there will be a ban on them during the NS2WC. The excitement and love they induced in competitive players was too much, and distracted them from enjoying the actual NS2 play. I'm not sure I can handle another forum outpouring of love for fan art competitions. The same goes for face-painting.
On camera wrestling will, however, still be permitted.
@Hugh
What would be a realistic price to get the demo system, like HLTV or DOTA 2's system, outsourced? Can we do a kick starter-ish thing for it? We shouldn't have to pay for already promised features, but if it gets it done I would be willing.
what about stuff like SamusDroid mod with bug fixes. (yeah bug fixes creat new bugs, but it seems he got it working quit fast with the current version without creating new bugs).
even small bug fixes would help. We got bugs in ns2 since Beta. Like i already posted in another thread, its the little thinks which add up after time.
That nanoshield bug for commanders was like one of the most annoying things and just got recently fixed, after 2 years. 2 years .....
And what about hotkey system? Why can people create mods for everything, but UWE doesnt copy them or take them into the game ...
For example:
- lowlight mod from mendasp as option in the menu (improvement for many casual gamers)
- fast load menu mod (option in the menu and that would take rly no time to add)
- ultra low detail mod (yeah ppl say its not improving much, but its still helping some players and PCs specs e.g. swalk)
- ns2 mod (why not add tournament mode into the game to ready, instead of the 20 seconds vote system to start ... you already got shown how to do it, why not add it?!)
- pause system from dragon
- hotkey mod
and i didnt check mods for quit some time.
Replay system and properly functioning FPV is hugely godahm important. I remember making an anti-cheat thread about this very same issue in which you demonstrated a total lack of understanding. This isn't even a change that is specific to NS2, but should have beneficial flow on for the spangly new secret game. Are you not going to use spark for your next game? Are you not planning to have a replay system there as well?
You're totally happy to raise 30k for a WCS, as well as give out reinforcement badges to people supporting a supposedly community driven project (I guess any project that isn't Australian is ok for UWE to support). But basic functionality that 110% aligns with the company vision of 'connecting the world through play' seems to sit fine right over there on the 10 year back burner.
Honestly I say this in the most constructive way possible. I suggest you get your finger on the pulse of this game quick in preparation for the success and exposure you expect the WCS to bring to ns2. Because for the longest time you have seemed to not have the slightest clue. It also irks me to hear you talk about a limitation to 'how much improvement' we can expect when you don't even know what needs to be improved to begin with.
Let me help outline for you a simple timeline of what seems to be expected
From now untill the December playoffs
- Implement simple number tweaks to address glaringly obvious gameplay issues (most of which are well highlighted for even a dummy to see).
- Fight the urge to splurge money on fancy new 'features'.
From December untill March
- Implement basic functionality such as demo/replay, key rebinding. Some of these functions are already done by the community as per Aioros' post.
- Improve core technical issues such as surround sound, collision, and rendering performance.
If you had experience with quake 3/live's demo system + wolfcam you'd know how much it sucks not to have one.
EDIT: It also makes bug repros much easier as you just demo every game then go to where the bug happened and narrow down the causes.
I recognise that the list at the top of this thread is a huge amount of work and I don't think anyone here thinks it would be reasonable to expect all of that. What this thread wad intended for was to refocus discussion about the most critical things so that you guys can see which topic is most important to the comp community. I've deliberately not tried to guide discussions for a while as there are better and more experienced players than me whose opinions frankly matter more than mine. What these guys seem to be saying is that keybindings and bug fixes that have already been fixed in mods should be added officially, and that demos ala hltv are the most important to secure ongoing success from these champs.
I encourage everyone reading this thread to keep things positive. We are where we are now, there is limited time until the live finals, and this is a fantastic opportunity to make ns2 even better.
Let's make the most of this!
In all seriousness xDragon's post has 24 agrees and 2 awesomes at this moment. It has two disagrees, both from strongly UWE related posters (Former playtester lead and you). Long story short there's a pretty big gap between what the community thinks and what the UWE shows to the outside. I highly doubt any of this is going to end well if you're sticking to the present course.
If you really want the tournament to happen and benefit the community, the way to do it is to start co-operating in more concrete ways than "some improvements will be made". Start having an open and honest dialogue on what possibly can be done, what the community feels necessary and what UWE needs out of the tournament. No flattering words or grandiose storylines, just open and direct communication straight to the point.
I know the views of various parts of the community and UWE will never meet all the way, but the dialogue still sets up a healthy base for forming an actual understanding and respect between UWE and the community. Meanwhile the present way the nVidia/Intel announcement thread is going reminds me of some North Korean politics simulation. It is definitely not representing a company that offers a steady foundation for building a healthy and self-sustaining fan community.
But I like the fact that we can see those votes, it really shows why the game is in the state it is right now
Besides that, any engine improvement to the limitation of update rates and interpolation is very welcome
Weird, could have sworn that was the goal of using lua for the engine... which is the sole responsibility holder in the game performing so badly that the entire population (mostly competitive players) left the game shortly after launch
edit: Not intended to be an attack, it's just I can't even use custom alien vision anymore which I used because I use to get dizzy so having the map greyscale with everything one solid color helped make everything clear.. and the whole point of using this kind of engine was to make modding easier! (also performance is my main problem with the game, since I enjoy playing in native resolution and max field of view for motion sickness reasons) which in the end backfires on me as it causes degrading performance to the point where I can't even look at the game in a competitive state because I'm handicapping myself and my actual skill level (which is quite high/brag)
And only a few complain there, valve does nothing, their game updates are atrocious and only doing things that give them revenue, they've ignored issues since the games private beta stages (nov 2011) which I was apart of and listed tons of issues still not fixed to this date.. and this is a billion dollar corp we're talking about, with tons of developers and tons of outside contractors (hidden path) who could probably work on the game night and day
worst part is, most of the fucking issues derive from server side console commands and terrible graphic effects/additions, the rest is simple shit like recoil patterns or screen shakes
comparing to uwe which actually replies to the forums, changes some things/fixes lots of issues and all that, and allows players-devs (mainly sewlek/mappers) to communicate and help improve the state of the game -- yet are attacked so hardly.. weird but justified in a sense
///ontopic
Hope to see peoples problems/issues get sorted out before this tournament... not sure how the outcome will look, but we'll see!
atm its mostly sewlek working on ns2 and wild guess, he trys to fix the PVE game.
And when hes working on the balance he cant work on anything of that list, since hes the only dev left
I like how you seem to be implying I, or any of the PTs have a big say in balancing the game. When in fact, our voices are on the lower end of the pole, below the Devs, below Sewlek, below the Map Testers and below the Balance Team.
So, what's wrong with the post to click "Disagree"? I mean, I'd love for this tournament to happen, obviously, but you can't deny that the game has a lot of issues and is lacking features required for an esport to grow, and it's not like people haven't tried to help or suggested stuff...
otherwise the game would look diffrent and we wouldnt had so much useless features in it now.
without mendasp and dragon helping with their mods, more teams would have left much earlier.
cant thank these guys enough what they did .... thinks which UWE could have done so "easy".
just look @ the jumping marin who is crouching in the air and gets pulled down.
Oh Mendasp. How little you know. Bless you child.
Blame hackers, cheaters, and other people who feel the need to abuse the system.
The bottom line is this:
@Hugh, @Sewlek is that a list that either of you could comment on?
Finally, a reminder to all: please keep this thread civil and productive. There have been a good number of very useful and helpful posts, so thank you to all who've taken the time to pass on their expertise and experience!
If all issues are fixed next month then I'll gladly admit my horrible mistake and prejudice. The track record is not good. And you forgot to address the other part of the post.
Also Hugh is not a PT, he's PR, don't think "Disagree" without arguments is good image, but that's my opinion.