Welder Fighting
elodea
Editlodea Join Date: 2009-06-20 Member: 67877Members, Reinforced - Shadow
Editlodea Join Date: 2009-06-20 Member: 67877Members, Reinforced - Shadow
Do you like dancing?
If so, you should really try some welder fighting. I'm guessing its going to be even more fun in b222 with improved marine movement.
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As usual, making the video to show a point. Welder is too powerful (not necessarily imba) and has the following two issues
1) Too long range
2) Too big of a cone (i kill someone offscreen at one point).
If so, you should really try some welder fighting. I'm guessing its going to be even more fun in b222 with improved marine movement.
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As usual, making the video to show a point. Welder is too powerful (not necessarily imba) and has the following two issues
1) Too long range
2) Too big of a cone (i kill someone offscreen at one point).
Comments
I was wondering what you were up to last night, ######ing around with your welder. Glad I didn't lose my lerk to you at 1:10, though I did miss some of my bites which was embarrassing. And LOL @ epic gorge fort on the catwalk in the background.
Yeah, any experienced skulk has to be careful when a marine has axe or welder out. Welder more so because the range/ROF is crazy and it's guaranteed not to miss.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
I experienced a bug with the welder too. Sometimes as skulk when you engage a marine that is welding from behind you get damage. I think it could be that the skulk model is clipping into the marine one. (Because the collision sphere is smaller than the hitbox.) I think you clip into the marine model and reach the origin of the welder-hit-cone with your hitbox.
A solution could be to move the welder-hit-cone slightly to the front, so the skulk can't clip into it from behind the marine.
3) welder can fire endlessly.
You walk along holding welder on and it will reveal and kill cloaked cysts. No need to crouch or aim.
Range is fine, and could even be increased. Damage to alien lifeforms should be dropped as suggested though.
--Cory
Yeah it's a little OP.
Welder business: I think welder cost should be 3 res. I never feel like buying one if it's not to save a phasegate from being destroyed. I'd never, ever buy a welder for offense to weld my teammates, if it cost 3 res, I might.
What would be the difference between reducing damage or reducing rate of fire but leaving damage the same?
The problem is it hits your entire screen out to like 5ft. The cone is just way way too big making it far to easy to deliver that damage.
I kinda like that its a stream of damage - makes the welder behave differently to the axe imo.
Its still pretty hard to score kills on experienced/decent skulks let alone higher lifeforms period, so its not exactly OP damage wise. Also, cara skulks are actually very hard to kill doing this. It's just that the large range and cone make it very easy to abuse against new players.
Have you come up against a marine wielding a welder? It feels much more deadly than your video shows.
I'm currently trying to work out how to nerf damage output of welders based on steam ID.
Though, i must say the range is indubidably ridiculus and must be reduced by at least half. More challenge for twice the fun!
I'm currently trying to work out how to nerf damage output of welders based on steam ID.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
lol :p. I never managed to kill you because you don't miss bites no matter the ammount of dancing i do. It's also basically impossible to kill higher lifeforms unless they're gifted to you because of bellyslide, flap, blink, hp etc.
Let me try and clarify <b>why range and cone are the problems and not damage</b>
<u><b>Range</b></u>
'Bad' skulking will overshoot past bite range vs marine dodging and struggle to recover. Take the axe which basically has comparable dps to welder, much higher burst damage, but lower range than skulk bite. Axe isn't considered op or abusable in the least because its range still dictates skulk advantage.
<u><b>Cone</b></u>
The LMG costs 0 res and has way more <b>range</b> and <b>dps</b> than the welder. So why is LMG damage considered ok, but welder damage not? The difference is in the hit cone where you only need to point the welder in the skulk's general direction. The result is way more <b>damage uptime</b> for the marine with bad aim as long as he stays just out of bite range.
In the end, poor skulk movement is adding fuel to the fire, but the fundamental issues of range/cone are still there.
*edit* Straight up reducing welder damage is the obvious hotfix however if there isn't some way to keep the damage range/cone separate from the healing armour range/cone. You'll still be able to troll new players with it though.
Perhaps the cone should be quite tight, perhaps 25%, so you really do have to look at what you're doing to have any effect.
That'd probably stop the random welder kills too :-}
Constant flame = no timing required in your strikes, as you have with an axe. The damage should be low to compensate for this low skill requirement.
It is pretty funny though.
<!--quoteo(post=1990810:date=Oct 13 2012, 06:42 AM:name=phoenixbbs)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (phoenixbbs @ Oct 13 2012, 06:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1990810"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Using a welder in "real life" is quite a close and carefully controlled activity - and it seems strange that you can weld / build while only having the object you're doing right on the edge of the screen. Not only that, but it looks a little daft when your builder / welder is pointing at nothing in the middle of the screen.
Perhaps the cone should be quite tight, perhaps 25%, so you really do have to look at what you're doing to have any effect.
That'd probably stop the random welder kills too :-}<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you want to take a page from real life - how about when welding you lose alot of your field of vision, simulating the welding shield that people wear?
So drop from a full view to a tiny slit in the screen.