<!--quoteo(post=1960318:date=Aug 10 2012, 02:10 AM:name=Rise)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rise @ Aug 10 2012, 02:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960318"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The gorge was completely out of control in the last build. Anyone who would now argue otherwise, having seen it in action, I question their ability to pass sound judgement on any aspect of this game at all.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Multiple Gorges were out of control, a single Gorge was still boring as all hell with little to no effect on the game. Fixing a Gorge rush issue by breaking the Gorge across your leg may solve the Gorge rush issue, but it also makes the Gorge even more painful of a class to play.
I vote for taking assisted building away from Gorges. Put all building process on the Khamm and have the Gorge deal with only transitive - non-permanent structures. If that's what it takes to make Gorge a actual class instead of behaving like an NPC. Ever since Kharaan structures were given reduced growth times and requirements for using the Gorges, the Gorge has become the complete workhorse of the team - and obviously it keeps getting worse.
<!--coloro:#9ACD32--><span style="color:#9ACD32"><!--/coloro-->Edit: Apparently I misheard a stealth change, ignore what I said before I should have tested it first.
swalkSay hello to my little friend.Join Date: 2011-01-20Member: 78384Members, Squad Five Blue
<b>Good stuff</b> Good job on tweaking alien energy levels, skulks actually have to manage their bites when biting an extractor now. <b>Bad stuff</b> UI is really annoying in 216. Especially when you're building structures as marines. Command station and hive UI's are getting in the way of playing. I'm really frustrated that carapace still haven't changed back to previous values. Got several crashes in a short time. High memory usage. Graphics are not showing up, instead I get a green "chess board". Happened while spawning, and typing in chat. Performance seems to have taken a hit. <b>Overall</b> Seems like this was more of a "make the game look good" patch, than an optimization patch.
<!--quoteo(post=1960401:date=Aug 10 2012, 10:02 PM:name=SkiT)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SkiT @ Aug 10 2012, 10:02 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960401"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->parasite no longer works on buildings? it's a <b>hugh</b> mistake. That was a cool strategy thing to parasite some stuff for your team..<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bloody hugh. Can't trust those Australians with anything.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Graphics are not showing up, instead I get a green "chess board". Happened while spawning, and typing in chat.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sounds like a vram issue, try to put option on medium.
<!--quoteo(post=1960409:date=Aug 10 2012, 05:10 AM:name=Kalrell)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kalrell @ Aug 10 2012, 05:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960409"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No it doesn't.
The red icon only appears if the hive has been seen once by a marine. So stealth still stealth's hives.
If you let them decloak your hive then they will have already yelled over team chat "OMGz tharz a hive hier!!", same purpose of the red icons.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--coloro:#aadd00--><span style="color:#aadd00"><!--/coloro-->So... Basically more hand-holding added with an ugly graphic to boot.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
I didn't want to rush to any judgement about this build without seeing the changelog and now that I have, I feel much better about this build. I like/agree with everything that has been changed or implemented with the exception of a few things that I'm sure many other people have already addressed. Here are the things I don't like or that I find aren't necessary.
Progress Bar. (Percentages do the job perfectly well)
Red glowing Comm Stations and Hives (Hives and Comm Stations are already visible on the map when scans are placed)
Unable to Parasite buildings (I'm not 100% sure about this one, I haven't had the chance to play as alien in this new build yet but thats what a friend told me. If thats the case, it may or may not be a good thing but I think parasiting buildings is a perfectly fine)
Armories healing armor. (I still think this should be exclusive to the advanced armory. As for armories requiring energy, I'm not sure how it'll play out but it seems like a good change, we'll see)
Otherwise, this is a great build! Tons of balance tweaks and optimizations. I can't wait to try out the revamped Mineshaft. Also, MACs repairing armor? Sweet. (AA should repair armor, while regular A shouldn't, imo)
swalkSay hello to my little friend.Join Date: 2011-01-20Member: 78384Members, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo(post=1960408:date=Aug 10 2012, 02:10 PM:name=Yuuki)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Yuuki @ Aug 10 2012, 02:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960408"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Sounds like a vram issue, try to put option on medium.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> It's on low.
<!--quoteo(post=1960378:date=Aug 10 2012, 06:03 AM:name=Livonia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Livonia @ Aug 10 2012, 06:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960378"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Other things to note from my playtime with 216 is that i'm having alot of artifacting problems now.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I get it really bad in docking ready room, I am also getting a lot more hitching then I did in the last patch.
<!--quoteo(post=1960403:date=Aug 10 2012, 07:07 AM:name=swalk)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (swalk @ Aug 10 2012, 07:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960403"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><b>Good stuff</b> Good job on tweaking alien energy levels, skulks actually have to manage their bites when biting an extractor now.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why should aliens have to manage their bites when attacking extractors but marines can hack at havestors all day long?
I say give marines energy use on their melee attack just like aliens have. I mean come on, people get tired swinging an axe constantly.
Very annoying ui changes. Text has some weird glow making it hard to read. Hive/cc wallhacks, what the ######? Screen flashing black when checking map, like the arrow indicating my position going all over the place wasnt enough.... Less is more in this case, i dont want redundant flashy crap blocking my view all the time. Have to mod it all out again just to make the game playable again i guess.
swalkSay hello to my little friend.Join Date: 2011-01-20Member: 78384Members, Squad Five Blue
edited August 2012
<!--quoteo(post=1960436:date=Aug 10 2012, 02:57 PM:name=MiniH0wie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MiniH0wie @ Aug 10 2012, 02:57 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960436"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Why should aliens have to manage their bites when attacking extractors but marines can hack at havestors all day long?
I say give marines energy use on their melee attack just like aliens have. I mean come on, people get tired swinging an axe constantly.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Asymmetry. Marines have ammo instead of energy. The marines are very easily outplayed if they are just carrying their axe. Also, we need a fix for the animation bug, so you can't spam the axe attack. Axe is much better than it should be, because of that. <!--quoteo(post=1960452:date=Aug 10 2012, 03:29 PM:name=elmo9000)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (elmo9000 @ Aug 10 2012, 03:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960452"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Very annoying ui changes. Text has some weird glow making it hard to read. Hive/cc wallhacks, what the ######? Screen flashing black when checking map, like the arrow indicating my position going all over the place wasnt enough.... Less is more in this case, i dont want redundant flashy crap blocking my view all the time. Have to mod it all out again just to make the game playable again i guess.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I agree. The map is even more annoying to use now that it is tinting your screen darker. That should be removed, and the map should be transparent! It will look better, and it will play much better.
AngeluszHarmonic entropistJoin Date: 2003-07-10Member: 18072Members, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester
<!--quoteo(post=1960378:date=Aug 10 2012, 01:03 PM:name=Livonia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Livonia @ Aug 10 2012, 01:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960378"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->•Disabled % text on builder / welder (is shown as progress bar / crosshair text).
Hate this soo much. It was much better before as far as information to the player and looked alot better displayed as a % instead of this ghastly bar.
Other things to note from my playtime with 216 is that i'm having alot of artifacting problems now. I think that is the correct term atleast, a quick alt-tab out and back in seem to fix it but it's the first time i've experienced it in NS2. The screen going red while injured still kills fps down to 5 or less which makes things unplayable. Red hives/cc visable through the map which I assume is a bug? The new blur to the background of the map is horrible but more importantly it kills my frame rate. Just can't use the map at all now.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--quoteo(post=1960431:date=Aug 10 2012, 02:45 PM:name=Sops)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sops @ Aug 10 2012, 02:45 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960431"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I get it really bad in docking ready room, I am also getting a lot more hitching then I did in the last patch.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The UI changes are a work in progress, like Murphy already posted. Stay tuned for Build 217 and on.
The artifacting is something we encountered in the Playtests as well - it seems to occur only for Nvidia users, so far we've seen it in the 400 and 500 series GPU's. Unfortunately it appears to be rather random at the moment, hence we've yet been unable to reproduce it. Any info you can provide on when it occurs might help.
<!--quoteo(post=1960443:date=Aug 10 2012, 03:16 PM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Aug 10 2012, 03:16 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960443"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Now I always am at the bottom of the scoreboard because I can't parasite buildings. Worst update ever.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Parasiting structures didn't add much to the game (Out of personal experience, I did nothing with such information). It should not be <b>the</b> way to get higher on the scoreboard, if that's your goal. Try chomping up some marines, powernodes and RT's. Also, parasiting marines still yields score.
finally have a decent machine to try this on. one quick find. mac got stuck in docking east wing above tram station entrance. unable to move & not visible in first person. it tried to go over a wall and disappeard/got stuck in the geometry.
I found parasiting structures useful to let the rest of the team know a base was being built up... getting no points for it would make no difference to me in that respect, it's to help the team if I can, not seek personal glory.
One thing I would still like to see (barring the suggestion someone made of being kept in the ready room for a length of time after a round ends, and loading a new map), would be the ability to carry on talking / messaging while the new map loads.
A small tweak that might be nice on the new spinning loading logo might be if either the inner or outer bar started "short" and got "longer" as the level loaded, to give people an idea on the progress and how long it's likely to be (not that it matters too much)
<!--quoteo(post=1960455:date=Aug 10 2012, 03:46 PM:name=Angelusz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Angelusz @ Aug 10 2012, 03:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960455"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Parasiting structures didn't add much to the game (Out of personal experience, I did nothing with such information).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I find it rather usefull. If you parasite a forward base that wasn't know before, it will automatically lead reinforcements to the location and even if I die, I don't have to write every 2 mins that there is still a base at position XY. Also I find it a good way to locate sneak phase gates. It is way faster and better to let the team know on the minimap where exactly the pg is than just writing "pg in tram!". Also the comm can plan better if he sees parasited buildings. Then he can adjust the strategies and where the team should focus to attack.
And for the build, I really expected a better performance but it made it almost unplayable for me. I am also astound that they didn't touch cara and sentries. But if I read it correctly, at least the cara will be changed in 217. I really hope that the next build will adress performance and many above mentioned things...
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A small tweak that might be nice on the new spinning loading logo might be if either the inner or outer bar started "short" and got "longer" as the level loaded, to give people an idea on the progress and how long it's likely to be (not that it matters too much).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> -> I don't like the spinning circle, but thats a matter of taste. I like your idea. But I would prefer a nyancat style gorge that jumps from the left side to the right while it loads :D That would be awesome!
<!--quoteo(post=1960455:date=Aug 10 2012, 11:46 PM:name=Angelusz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Angelusz @ Aug 10 2012, 11:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960455"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Parasiting structures didn't add much to the game (Out of personal experience, I did nothing with such information). It should not be <b>the</b> way to get higher on the scoreboard, if that's your goal. Try chomping up some marines, powernodes and RT's. Also, parasiting marines still yields score.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I would strongly disagree with this bad reasoning. Spotting obs, arcs, phasegates, 2nd CC etc., ESPECIALLY RT's, was always something good players did. The information was immensely useful whether or not you personally did anything with it. I hope this is an unintended bug.
<!--QuoteBegin-Phoenixbbs+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Phoenixbbs)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I found parasiting structures useful to let the rest of the team know a base was being built up... getting no points for it would make no difference to me in that respect, it's to help the team if I can, not seek personal glory.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1960472:date=Aug 10 2012, 03:14 PM:name=elodea)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (elodea @ Aug 10 2012, 03:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960472"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would strongly disagree with this bad reasoning. Spotting obs, arcs, phasegates, 2nd CC etc., ESPECIALLY RT's, was always something good players did. The information was immensely useful whether or not you personally did anything with it. I hope this is an unintended bug.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1
This build is a huge step back. Why in god's name did you guys change the hive sight / parasite model. Not only that but it was replaced with a green highlighted marine? Mad dumb. I'm a little butt hurt atm.
Red hives / command chairs = Completely unnecessary and almost an insultingly poor choice that ruins such a great atmosphere.
Progress bars = Obvious placeholders but can't the place holders be just a little less eye-gougingly ugly?
These UI updates are doing nothing but cheapening the entire NS2 experience, NS2 was about minimalistic UI and an atmospheric game, I don't need a random bar to shoot up when I am repairing, a simple indicator on the welder itself, it much better.
Balance updates are good.
Not a fan of being locked out of using more than once defense/shade/shift ability. Also making 4th hives useless.
Not a fan of armorys repairing armor, I liked the teamwork aspect of welder repair only.
I feel that macs are too strong, two macs healing each other is literally impossible for a lerk to kill and takes skulks a very long time to bring down.
I get the impression that any (ANY) nerf to aliens is applauded by some people, regardless of it being warranted or not. Do realize that a nerf in the wrong department will in the end cause an unnecessary nerf in the marine department or a buff again in the alien department.
We went a step backwards, marines were already winning more than 50% of the games in 215 due to them abusing the low infant building hp, slow alien respawn rate and all the egg killing.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited August 2012
<!--quoteo(post=1960385:date=Aug 10 2012, 11:18 AM:name=Koruyo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Koruyo @ Aug 10 2012, 11:18 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960385"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Dunno, i feel like i get some extra graphic glitches this patch...
Having flickering textures in some maps/places was and still is very common, but this patch i get flickering shadows every now and then, also something strange happened to my flashlight in one game. (cant remember if i alt tabbed at any point, guess i wont be able to reproduce it)
Maybe its just the nvidia betadriver (304.79)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Was experienced during PT's as well, and it was fixed for the people in question, I think. I'll pass it on as not fixed. what you have there is black hole "light", not a flashlight. Use with caution! :P
<!--quoteo(post=1960096:date=Aug 10 2012, 03:03 AM:name=Flayra)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Flayra @ Aug 10 2012, 03:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960096"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't want to make a big post about the UI but...we will be removing a LOT of extra junk that's snuck in over time. This includes lots of redundant bars, icons, % readouts, etc.
We will also shrink and prettify the hive/command-station health. Look for this in 217 next week.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think the real issue here is the placement, and not necesarily how "pretty" it is. Right now you have a huge useless bar in the middle of the screen, which in no way seems appropriate in neither function or theme of the game. Before the health of a building was displayed by the rings on the floor and the percentage when looking on it / welding it. Yes, there was 3 indicators, but they worked flawlessly. None of the elements invaded your vision in a way where it made an impact to what you could see, and not see. I don't this road will ever be the right one, if it takes something away from your view area, which is, by far, the most important thing on your screen. That wont change, even if it gets some purdy graphics.
Before the accumulated ways of receiving this info seemed fitting, and I really did not see this change comming, at all. It was uncalled for.
<b>- Balance things Aliens:</b> <!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro--> - Fade: The fade seems a lot more balanced now. I think that the shadow-step cost should probably be decreased slightly and the blink cost should be increased. I think that it was the "flying fade" that was really the big issue before (in both offense and escaping), and that was directly linked to blink. A proper fade would easily get by with the shadow-step with no cost, but now it seems a little too tough to get some good stepping comboes off, whilst still having the energy to hit. All in all though, the fade has taken a step in the right direction<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->- Lerk: I don't like the current state at all. I loved the lerk before, my favorite alien. I loved flying around taking bites at marines, before you had spikes. Sometimes I would still use bite over spikes. I agree that the spikes was slightly OP when being spamable, but this has been addressed in a horrible horrible way. The feel of the lerk, and the power of the lerk, was that it was a fast alien who could fly very rapidly around in circles and still bite people. I was very confident taking on a shotgun marine, or a couple of marines. The nature of the lurk is a lot like a flying skulk, the fast paced action. On top of that, i think lerks had a high skill bar. The way one uses the flaps to evade fire and still fight, was the brilliance of it all. Now, because the flapping costs redicouless amount of energy, it is not at all possible. Let alone without adrenaline. I have literally tried flapping around, and just falling out of the sky because I had no more energy to flap. It is a direct attack on the feel, and play, of the lerk. Yes, spikes needed a nerf, but you need to adress that in a way in which the lerks feel does not get compromised. An increase in spike cost would be the best, maybe even make it do more damage, be more expensive and make it a precision weapon. A short burst will burn your energy, but it will also be deadly if you can hit. Flying aliens who can't fly because they are out of breath, it does not make any sense. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FFA500--><span style="color:#FFA500"><!--/coloro-->- Skulk: I have felt no difference in my play style before, and now, as a skulk. It may be because I was already managing the energy cost (e.g. not keeping bit down), but they still seem to be in a good place. Still one of my favorite aliens to be. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->- Gorge: No change here as well. You can defintely feel that the heal spray is more expensive, but not to a point where it's not doing it's job very well. The only places which has taken a large hit, is when 3 gorges keep a set of hydras up against a million marines. This is positive.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FFA500--><span style="color:#FFA500"><!--/coloro-->- 1 upgrade per direction: I'm a little puzzled over this one. I can see where the nerf comes from. Especially late game. But I never felt the aliens were overpowered early game when playing marine. I hate skulks with carapace, they can still get that. I didn't hate skulks with carapace and regen, because if you don't kill them at let them regen, it was really your own fault. Fades were a little overpowered with said combo, but then again, it was a tradeoff. Most of the time the alien would have to make a decision: Do I get cara/regen or cara/adrenaline? Having all 3 / celerity was a matter of a third hive. And if the aliens secure a third hive, you are already in deep ###### as marines. Lets take the example of a lerk. I would normally go cara/regen, because it supported the play style where you don't have spikes. A lerk who has to get up close and personal, are in all aspects easier to kill, so cara/regen was appropiate. When getting spikes I would always juggle between the 3, usually ending up on cara/adrenaline. (although adrenaline is a MUST for lerks now). I'm not entirely sure as to how to adress this, but it has to be either with a few buffs here and there or back to a system where some life forms can get multiple evos, and others can't.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<b>- Balance things Marines:</b> <!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->- Armory: The charge based regen seems great, I like it a lot. The fact that it now repairs the armor as well is also great.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<b>- Tram:</b> The changes are semi-good. The main issue is in the situation where the marine side holds terminal, and tram, then you can no longer backstab. You <b>have</b> to go through stability monitoring / north point to bite them in their ass. The only other option is through court yard, through terminal, behind east wing and then bite them. We need something equal to the court yard -> tram departures vent.
<b>On a general note:</b> I think we need to be careful not to overnerf the aliens. I Simply think that many of the players playing marine just have a bad aim. Lerks was easily killable before, especially with JP's. Skulks was easily kill able if you knew how to hit them (although sometimes it feels like the shotgun has a terrible hit detection, and skulks can eat amazingly many full on hits). I guess it will be easier to see in the competative matches. <!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->Overall though, the balance seems to be going in the right direction.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->And the 'always visible hive / comm chair'....Get rid of it really...<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->And again, lerks are broken now. They need a fix so bad.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
Comments
Multiple Gorges were out of control, a single Gorge was still boring as all hell with little to no effect on the game. Fixing a Gorge rush issue by breaking the Gorge across your leg may solve the Gorge rush issue, but it also makes the Gorge even more painful of a class to play.
I vote for taking assisted building away from Gorges. Put all building process on the Khamm and have the Gorge deal with only transitive - non-permanent structures. If that's what it takes to make Gorge a actual class instead of behaving like an NPC. Ever since Kharaan structures were given reduced growth times and requirements for using the Gorges, the Gorge has become the complete workhorse of the team - and obviously it keeps getting worse.
Why should I want to play the Gorge anymore?
<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
Good job on tweaking alien energy levels, skulks actually have to manage their bites when biting an extractor now.
<b>Bad stuff</b>
UI is really annoying in 216. Especially when you're building structures as marines.
Command station and hive UI's are getting in the way of playing.
I'm really frustrated that carapace still haven't changed back to previous values.
Got several crashes in a short time. High memory usage.
Graphics are not showing up, instead I get a green "chess board". Happened while spawning, and typing in chat.
Performance seems to have taken a hit.
<b>Overall</b>
Seems like this was more of a "make the game look good" patch, than an optimization patch.
Bloody hugh. Can't trust those Australians with anything.
Sounds like a vram issue, try to put option on medium.
No it doesn't.
The red icon only appears if the hive has been seen once by a marine.
So stealth still stealth's hives.
If you let them decloak your hive then they will have already yelled over team chat "OMGz tharz a hive hier!!", same purpose of the red icons.
The red icon only appears if the hive has been seen once by a marine.
So stealth still stealth's hives.
If you let them decloak your hive then they will have already yelled over team chat "OMGz tharz a hive hier!!", same purpose of the red icons.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--coloro:#aadd00--><span style="color:#aadd00"><!--/coloro-->So... Basically more hand-holding added with an ugly graphic to boot.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<img src="http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/4677/iwillbreakyou.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Removed Hive Sight.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why would I leave alien vision now?
Besides that changes look good.
Edit: Nvm I read the rest of this thread. Sounds like the progress bar is a bit crappy though.
I like/agree with everything that has been changed or implemented with the exception of a few things that I'm sure many other people have already addressed.
Here are the things I don't like or that I find aren't necessary.
Progress Bar. (Percentages do the job perfectly well)
Red glowing Comm Stations and Hives (Hives and Comm Stations are already visible on the map when scans are placed)
Unable to Parasite buildings (I'm not 100% sure about this one, I haven't had the chance to play as alien in this new build yet but thats what a friend told me. If thats the case, it may or may not be a good thing but I think parasiting buildings is a perfectly fine)
Armories healing armor. (I still think this should be exclusive to the advanced armory. As for armories requiring energy, I'm not sure how it'll play out but it seems like a good change, we'll see)
Otherwise, this is a great build!
Tons of balance tweaks and optimizations.
I can't wait to try out the revamped Mineshaft.
Also, MACs repairing armor? Sweet. (AA should repair armor, while regular A shouldn't, imo)
It's on low.
I get it really bad in docking ready room, I am also getting a lot more hitching then I did in the last patch.
Good job on tweaking alien energy levels, skulks actually have to manage their bites when biting an extractor now.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why should aliens have to manage their bites when attacking extractors but marines can hack at havestors all day long?
I say give marines energy use on their melee attack just like aliens have. I mean come on, people get tired swinging an axe constantly.
I say give marines energy use on their melee attack just like aliens have. I mean come on, people get tired swinging an axe constantly.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Asymmetry.
Marines have ammo instead of energy. The marines are very easily outplayed if they are just carrying their axe.
Also, we need a fix for the animation bug, so you can't spam the axe attack. Axe is much better than it should be, because of that.
<!--quoteo(post=1960452:date=Aug 10 2012, 03:29 PM:name=elmo9000)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (elmo9000 @ Aug 10 2012, 03:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960452"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Very annoying ui changes. Text has some weird glow making it hard to read. Hive/cc wallhacks, what the ######? Screen flashing black when checking map, like the arrow indicating my position going all over the place wasnt enough.... Less is more in this case, i dont want redundant flashy crap blocking my view all the time. Have to mod it all out again just to make the game playable again i guess.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree.
The map is even more annoying to use now that it is tinting your screen darker.
That should be removed, and the map should be transparent!
It will look better, and it will play much better.
Hate this soo much. It was much better before as far as information to the player and looked alot better displayed as a % instead of this ghastly bar.
Other things to note from my playtime with 216 is that i'm having alot of artifacting problems now. I think that is the correct term atleast, a quick alt-tab out and back in seem to fix it but it's the first time i've experienced it in NS2. The screen going red while injured still kills fps down to 5 or less which makes things unplayable. Red hives/cc visable through the map which I assume is a bug? The new blur to the background of the map is horrible but more importantly it kills my frame rate. Just can't use the map at all now.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1960431:date=Aug 10 2012, 02:45 PM:name=Sops)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sops @ Aug 10 2012, 02:45 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960431"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I get it really bad in docking ready room, I am also getting a lot more hitching then I did in the last patch.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The UI changes are a work in progress, like Murphy already posted. Stay tuned for Build 217 and on.
The artifacting is something we encountered in the Playtests as well - it seems to occur only for Nvidia users, so far we've seen it in the 400 and 500 series GPU's. Unfortunately it appears to be rather random at the moment, hence we've yet been unable to reproduce it. Any info you can provide on when it occurs might help.
<!--quoteo(post=1960443:date=Aug 10 2012, 03:16 PM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Aug 10 2012, 03:16 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1960443"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Now I always am at the bottom of the scoreboard because I can't parasite buildings. Worst update ever.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Parasiting structures didn't add much to the game (Out of personal experience, I did nothing with such information). It should not be <b>the</b> way to get higher on the scoreboard, if that's your goal. Try chomping up some marines, powernodes and RT's. Also, parasiting marines still yields score.
will actually game later this weekend.
One thing I would still like to see (barring the suggestion someone made of being kept in the ready room for a length of time after a round ends, and loading a new map), would be the ability to carry on talking / messaging while the new map loads.
A small tweak that might be nice on the new spinning loading logo might be if either the inner or outer bar started "short" and got "longer" as the level loaded, to give people an idea on the progress and how long it's likely to be (not that it matters too much)
I find it rather usefull. If you parasite a forward base that wasn't know before, it will automatically lead reinforcements to the location and even if I die, I don't have to write every 2 mins that there is still a base at position XY. Also I find it a good way to locate sneak phase gates. It is way faster and better to let the team know on the minimap where exactly the pg is than just writing "pg in tram!". Also the comm can plan better if he sees parasited buildings. Then he can adjust the strategies and where the team should focus to attack.
And for the build, I really expected a better performance but it made it almost unplayable for me. I am also astound that they didn't touch cara and sentries. But if I read it correctly, at least the cara will be changed in 217. I really hope that the next build will adress performance and many above mentioned things...
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A small tweak that might be nice on the new spinning loading logo might be if either the inner or outer bar started "short" and got "longer" as the level loaded, to give people an idea on the progress and how long it's likely to be (not that it matters too much).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> -> I don't like the spinning circle, but thats a matter of taste. I like your idea. But I would prefer a nyancat style gorge that jumps from the left side to the right while it loads :D That would be awesome!
I would strongly disagree with this bad reasoning. Spotting obs, arcs, phasegates, 2nd CC etc., ESPECIALLY RT's, was always something good players did. The information was immensely useful whether or not you personally did anything with it. I hope this is an unintended bug.
<!--QuoteBegin-Phoenixbbs+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Phoenixbbs)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I found parasiting structures useful to let the rest of the team know a base was being built up... getting no points for it would make no difference to me in that respect, it's to help the team if I can, not seek personal glory.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1
This build is a huge step back. Why in god's name did you guys change the hive sight / parasite model. Not only that but it was replaced with a green highlighted marine? Mad dumb. I'm a little butt hurt atm.
Progress bars = Obvious placeholders but can't the place holders be just a little less eye-gougingly ugly?
These UI updates are doing nothing but cheapening the entire NS2 experience, NS2 was about minimalistic UI and an atmospheric game, I don't need a random bar to shoot up when I am repairing, a simple indicator on the welder itself, it much better.
Balance updates are good.
Not a fan of being locked out of using more than once defense/shade/shift ability. Also making 4th hives useless.
Not a fan of armorys repairing armor, I liked the teamwork aspect of welder repair only.
I feel that macs are too strong, two macs healing each other is literally impossible for a lerk to kill and takes skulks a very long time to bring down.
Macs should not be repairing players.
Not a fan of the new parasite system.
We went a step backwards, marines were already winning more than 50% of the games in 215 due to them abusing the low infant building hp, slow alien respawn rate and all the egg killing.
Thus,
-1
Having flickering textures in some maps/places was and still is very common, but this patch i get flickering shadows every now and then, also something strange happened to my flashlight in one game. (cant remember if i alt tabbed at any point, guess i wont be able to reproduce it)
Maybe its just the nvidia betadriver (304.79)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Was experienced during PT's as well, and it was fixed for the people in question, I think. I'll pass it on as not fixed. what you have there is black hole "light", not a flashlight. Use with caution! :P
We will also shrink and prettify the hive/command-station health. Look for this in 217 next week.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think the real issue here is the placement, and not necesarily how "pretty" it is. Right now you have a huge useless bar in the middle of the screen, which in no way seems appropriate in neither function or theme of the game. Before the health of a building was displayed by the rings on the floor and the percentage when looking on it / welding it. Yes, there was 3 indicators, but they worked flawlessly. None of the elements invaded your vision in a way where it made an impact to what you could see, and not see. I don't this road will ever be the right one, if it takes something away from your view area, which is, by far, the most important thing on your screen. That wont change, even if it gets some purdy graphics.
Before the accumulated ways of receiving this info seemed fitting, and I really did not see this change comming, at all. It was uncalled for.
<b>- Balance things Aliens:</b>
<!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro--> - Fade: The fade seems a lot more balanced now. I think that the shadow-step cost should probably be decreased slightly and the blink cost should be increased. I think that it was the "flying fade" that was really the big issue before (in both offense and escaping), and that was directly linked to blink. A proper fade would easily get by with the shadow-step with no cost, but now it seems a little too tough to get some good stepping comboes off, whilst still having the energy to hit. All in all though, the fade has taken a step in the right direction<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->- Lerk: I don't like the current state at all. I loved the lerk before, my favorite alien. I loved flying around taking bites at marines, before you had spikes. Sometimes I would still use bite over spikes. I agree that the spikes was slightly OP when being spamable, but this has been addressed in a horrible horrible way. The feel of the lerk, and the power of the lerk, was that it was a fast alien who could fly very rapidly around in circles and still bite people. I was very confident taking on a shotgun marine, or a couple of marines. The nature of the lurk is a lot like a flying skulk, the fast paced action. On top of that, i think lerks had a high skill bar. The way one uses the flaps to evade fire and still fight, was the brilliance of it all. Now, because the flapping costs redicouless amount of energy, it is not at all possible. Let alone without adrenaline. I have literally tried flapping around, and just falling out of the sky because I had no more energy to flap. It is a direct attack on the feel, and play, of the lerk. Yes, spikes needed a nerf, but you need to adress that in a way in which the lerks feel does not get compromised. An increase in spike cost would be the best, maybe even make it do more damage, be more expensive and make it a precision weapon. A short burst will burn your energy, but it will also be deadly if you can hit. Flying aliens who can't fly because they are out of breath, it does not make any sense. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FFA500--><span style="color:#FFA500"><!--/coloro-->- Skulk: I have felt no difference in my play style before, and now, as a skulk. It may be because I was already managing the energy cost (e.g. not keeping bit down), but they still seem to be in a good place. Still one of my favorite aliens to be. <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->- Gorge: No change here as well. You can defintely feel that the heal spray is more expensive, but not to a point where it's not doing it's job very well. The only places which has taken a large hit, is when 3 gorges keep a set of hydras up against a million marines. This is positive.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FFA500--><span style="color:#FFA500"><!--/coloro-->- 1 upgrade per direction: I'm a little puzzled over this one. I can see where the nerf comes from. Especially late game. But I never felt the aliens were overpowered early game when playing marine. I hate skulks with carapace, they can still get that. I didn't hate skulks with carapace and regen, because if you don't kill them at let them regen, it was really your own fault. Fades were a little overpowered with said combo, but then again, it was a tradeoff. Most of the time the alien would have to make a decision: Do I get cara/regen or cara/adrenaline? Having all 3 / celerity was a matter of a third hive. And if the aliens secure a third hive, you are already in deep ###### as marines. Lets take the example of a lerk. I would normally go cara/regen, because it supported the play style where you don't have spikes. A lerk who has to get up close and personal, are in all aspects easier to kill, so cara/regen was appropiate. When getting spikes I would always juggle between the 3, usually ending up on cara/adrenaline. (although adrenaline is a MUST for lerks now). I'm not entirely sure as to how to adress this, but it has to be either with a few buffs here and there or back to a system where some life forms can get multiple evos, and others can't.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<b>- Balance things Marines:</b>
<!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->- Armory: The charge based regen seems great, I like it a lot. The fact that it now repairs the armor as well is also great.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<b>- Tram:</b>
The changes are semi-good. The main issue is in the situation where the marine side holds terminal, and tram, then you can no longer backstab. You <b>have</b> to go through stability monitoring / north point to bite them in their ass. The only other option is through court yard, through terminal, behind east wing and then bite them. We need something equal to the court yard -> tram departures vent.
<b>On a general note:</b>
I think we need to be careful not to overnerf the aliens. I Simply think that many of the players playing marine just have a bad aim. Lerks was easily killable before, especially with JP's. Skulks was easily kill able if you knew how to hit them (although sometimes it feels like the shotgun has a terrible hit detection, and skulks can eat amazingly many full on hits). I guess it will be easier to see in the competative matches. <!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->Overall though, the balance seems to be going in the right direction.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->And the 'always visible hive / comm chair'....Get rid of it really...<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->And again, lerks are broken now. They need a fix so bad.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->