<!--quoteo(post=1742619:date=Dec 6 2009, 12:54 AM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Dec 6 2009, 12:54 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742619"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This does bring up a valid point, and something I was thinking about the other day. Certainly for the purposes of trying out the editor and just "messing around" in general, its ok for community mappers to be influenced by concept art from other games. But just remember, and this is directed to everyone, any maps you may want to be considered for official inclusion can not be created based off of existing concept art from other games/movies or other copyright protected sources. We will have our hands full judging the visual quality and gameplay quality of community made maps, and it won't always be easy for us to tell if a part of a map has been generated based off of external concept art.
I know this pretty much common sense, but still is worth mentioning.
Thanks.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
LOL Who needs other concepts. Spark is much more creative then everything altough it has only refinery objects. This tool can be also used as a inspiration tool for SciFi films.
I used that concept-art picture as an inspiration... It's only normal that if you are going to make something that is worthy of being official, that you make it something of your own and not copy whole pieces of others work. I didn't expect that kind of reactions... I was rather curious as wether peeps might like such a clean style... i guess not. I was looking for some feedback of some other sort I guess.
Vents... I love vents! :) ... I already have a lot of them in my map but these two are the best looking ones obviously; I love the roterated one (4th and and 5th screen) - makes you think 'where the heck am I?'
<!--quoteo(post=1742573:date=Dec 5 2009, 12:18 PM:name=Squeal_Like_A_Pig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Squeal_Like_A_Pig @ Dec 5 2009, 12:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742573"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think someone already kind of answered this for me, but for NS2 we are focused on creating fully fleshed out specific art sets, which are very visually distinct from one another. We hope to be able to get a good amount of official maps out of each set. Given our limited resources we've only been able to focus on environment assets for the Refinery themed art set, which is a very low tech, industrial, grungy look, revolving around large facilities which mine materials, refine them, and package and ship them off world. Once we are done with Refinery, we'll probably move onto Biodome, then a spaceship/station themed idea we'd had, and other themes.
The rest of the art sets should move much faster, however, as a good chunk of the time spent on the Refinery theme went towards creating a pretty good base of generic textures and props that can carry over to any set (floors, grating, catwalks, pipes, lights, etc.), and it will mostly be a matter of creating a handful of new wall sets and textures, some theme specific props, and in some cases just a simple texture swap on existing models.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, I guess you're saying that ns_bast will never be ported to NS2; that map is essentially a recreation of the ship "Nostromo" from the movie "Alien", including textures, shapes, and props...
<!--quoteo(post=1742690:date=Dec 6 2009, 05:15 PM:name=Guspaz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Guspaz @ Dec 6 2009, 05:15 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742690"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So, I guess you're saying that ns_bast will never be ported to NS2; that map is essentially a recreation of the ship "Nostromo" from the movie "Alien", including textures, shapes, and props...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yup. It was a cool map, but I'm not happy that it was such a close recreation. I didn't have much say in that at the time, and I don't think Charlie realized how close it was to the Nostromo until much later. I also didn't really care for how many textures were used in that map that weren't from the NS texture set, either, which made it look quite a bit different. That sort of thing won't be repeated this time around.
<!--quoteo(post=1742690:date=Dec 6 2009, 12:15 PM:name=Guspaz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Guspaz @ Dec 6 2009, 12:15 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742690"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So, I guess you're saying that ns_bast will never be ported to NS2; that map is essentially a recreation of the ship "Nostromo" from the movie "Alien", including textures, shapes, and props...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, not <b>officially</b>...
;)
<!--quoteo(post=1742652:date=Dec 6 2009, 04:11 AM:name=Xtof)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Xtof @ Dec 6 2009, 04:11 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742652"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I used that concept-art picture as an inspiration... It's only normal that if you are going to make something that is worthy of being official, that you make it something of your own and not copy whole pieces of others work. I didn't expect that kind of reactions... I was rather curious as wether peeps might like such a clean style... i guess not. I was looking for some feedback of some other sort I guess.
Hogwash. At this stage I'm finding it quite useful to use something for reference whist learning the editor.
Besides, while it is important to be aware of copyright, using a support structure for a wall buttress can hardly be considered stealing. If your recreating a level from another game, yeah thats bad, but there is only so many different ways to make a space-station sci-fi corridor that doesn't resemble something somewhere else.
Inspiration of form is fine, direct copy, not so much.
First I would like to say I'm really glad something got released! I am so excited and cannot wait till another alpha or beta for the game! Anyways I have messed a little bit with Hammer, but I am no expert and gave up. I decided to try again with Spark, and here is what I came up with. Remember, I am no expert and it can be considered my 'first' map ever...
Well guys here is my attempt: BTW; images are big.
<!--quoteo(post=1742744:date=Dec 6 2009, 06:10 PM:name=Bulletcatcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Bulletcatcher @ Dec 6 2009, 06:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742744"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->First I would like to say I'm really glad something got released! I am so excited and cannot wait till another alpha or beta for the game! Anyways I have messed a little bit with Hammer, but I am no expert and gave up. I decided to try again with Spark, and here is what I came up with. Remember, I am no expert and it can be considered my 'first' map ever...
Well guys here is my attempt: BTW; images are big.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Great start, but needs some work. In my opinion, there are too many props and the hallways/corridors are too rectangular in shape. You should add some more complex geometric shapes.
<!--quoteo(post=1742747:date=Dec 6 2009, 07:23 PM:name=edkrst)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(edkrst @ Dec 6 2009, 07:23 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742747"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Great start, but needs some work. In my opinion, there are too many props and the hallways/corridors are too rectangular in shape. You should add some more complex geometric shapes.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thanks for the feedback, I understand and agree with your opinion(s). I will see what I can do.
Can someone explain to me this square tool and how to use it when trying to make doors or indentations?
It likes to create squares on the completely wrong side that I want it... For example, on this picture below, I was trying to make a square where you see the white lines, instead it made that grey box in the corner. Help me please, I cannot figure out what I am doing wrong!
Select the face you extruded, do a ctrl+c, then a ctrl+v, and move the face to cover the area you wish - it should be the exact dimensions as the area you're trying to use the rectangle tool over. It's a quick little trick that lets you bypass using the rectangle tool completely.
<!--quoteo(post=1742763:date=Dec 6 2009, 09:46 PM:name=doeseph)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(doeseph @ Dec 6 2009, 09:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742763"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Select the face you extruded, do a ctrl+c, then a ctrl+v, and move the face to cover the area you wish - it should be the exact dimensions as the area you're trying to use the rectangle tool over. It's a quick little trick that lets you bypass using the rectangle tool completely.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah but sometimes it moves all faces connected to that copied face as well, causing the problem to start from square 1. I would like to learn how to properly use this square tool anyways.
This is my first attempt at anything really. A corridor that I made without reference. The lighting is odd I know, it is still a work in progress. I think it looks okay for a first attempt, I am trying to understand the balance between just throwing in props and actually making your desired look through texturing and careful manipulation. I confess that this is really the former, any advice on how you can best use props for maximum effect would be appreciated.
<!--quoteo(post=1742768:date=Dec 6 2009, 08:21 PM:name=Bulletcatcher)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bulletcatcher @ Dec 6 2009, 08:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742768"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah but sometimes it moves all faces connected to that copied face as well, causing the problem to start from square 1. I would like to learn how to properly use this square tool anyways.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There isn't anything to "learn" yet, the engine is in alpha.
The_Real_QuasarHas the I.Q. of 12,000 P.E. TeachersJoin Date: 2002-11-26Member: 9998Members
I'm sure a few people have, but it's generally ill-advised to do so. We haven't yet been given any mapping guidelines, and there's currently no way to actually walk through our maps and see how well they function. The current release of spark is very buggy and unfinished, meant more for learning the editor, not actual level design.
<!--quoteo(post=1742770:date=Dec 6 2009, 10:35 PM:name=TempesT487)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TempesT487 @ Dec 6 2009, 10:35 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742770"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This is my first attempt at anything really. A corridor that I made without reference. The lighting is odd I know, it is still a work in progress. I think it looks okay for a first attempt, I am trying to understand the balance between just throwing in props and actually making your desired look through texturing and careful manipulation. I confess that this is really the former, any advice on how you can best use props for maximum effect would be appreciated.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
TempesT, I think it looks great (including the lighting).
<!--quoteo(post=1742787:date=Dec 7 2009, 04:06 PM:name=Warmonger)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Warmonger @ Dec 7 2009, 04:06 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742787"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->TempesT, I think it looks great (including the lighting).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The_Real_QuasarHas the I.Q. of 12,000 P.E. TeachersJoin Date: 2002-11-26Member: 9998Members
Very nice Shakewell, I like that it looks like a real place, rather than a videogame level. You can imagine those pipes stretching under all the other floor panels, for example. How long did it take you, out of interest?
<!--quoteo(post=1742782:date=Dec 7 2009, 12:39 AM:name=Harimau)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Harimau @ Dec 7 2009, 12:39 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742782"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So has anyone actually started on an actual map with an actual layout for the game?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm sure some people have, but at this moment it's largely pointless to do so. We don't have enough information on how the game will play and the editor is missing alot of art resources so beyond doing some rough pencil/paper outlines, you'd be wasting your time getting something down in Spark at the moment as things can (and probably will) change drastically from now till release.
The purpose of the Alpha release is to find bugs and make improvements. Full map construction will come later.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited December 2009
I'm just using Spark as a sketch program atm. We don't even know yet how many lights and resources per scene we can use, so it doesn't lag. We could build rooms for a map and lateron get a layout going with hallways (yes hallways :P). But other then that, it is kind of pointless yeah...
Getting NS1 textures to work in spark is a fun thing to do as well... Much more effective then the oldschool wad files and I like the material file script more then the source engine texture scripts...
Comments
I know this pretty much common sense, but still is worth mentioning.
Thanks.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
LOL Who needs other concepts.
Spark is much more creative then everything altough it has only refinery objects.
This tool can be also used as a inspiration tool for SciFi films.
Thanx for the power of lights.
I didn't expect that kind of reactions... I was rather curious as wether peeps might like such a clean style... i guess not. I was looking for some feedback of some other sort I guess.
Greetings,
Xtof
Nice to see map ideas that are not overpopulated with props.
Nice work.
Two screenshots of the same 'catwalk'room from different perspectives:
<a href="http://s12.directupload.net/file/u/10147/eq5etgdn_jpg.htm" target="_blank"> <img src="http://s12.directupload.net/images/user/091206/temp/eq5etgdn.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
<a href="http://s1.directupload.net/file/u/10147/rpcevlta_jpg.htm" target="_blank"> <img src="http://s1.directupload.net/images/user/091206/temp/rpcevlta.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
Vents... I love vents! :) ... I already have a lot of them in my map but these two are the best looking ones obviously; I love the roterated one (4th and and 5th screen) - makes you think 'where the heck am I?'
<a href="http://s1.directupload.net/file/u/10147/zg2k5di8_jpg.htm" target="_blank"> <img src="http://s1.directupload.net/images/user/091206/temp/zg2k5di8.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
<a href="http://s4.directupload.net/file/u/10147/c5pkfc4d_jpg.htm" target="_blank"> <img src="http://s4.directupload.net/images/user/091206/temp/c5pkfc4d.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
2nd vent from the outside:
<a href="http://s2.directupload.net/file/u/10147/4sdejeu2_jpg.htm" target="_blank"> <img src="http://s2.directupload.net/images/user/091206/temp/4sdejeu2.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
Overview of what I have so far - the 1st hive room is not done yet since theres pretty much no alien art so far... just one texture:
<a href="http://s4.directupload.net/file/u/10147/mikq97ht_jpg.htm" target="_blank"> <img src="http://s4.directupload.net/images/user/091206/temp/mikq97ht.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
<a href="http://s1.directupload.net/file/u/10147/agrbgzyn_jpg.htm" target="_blank"> <img src="http://s1.directupload.net/images/user/091206/temp/agrbgzyn.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
Feedback wanted! - I need it since I just started mapping with spark :)
greets
<img src="http://www.teleservice-koper.de/temp/sparktest_ns2f01.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
The rest of the art sets should move much faster, however, as a good chunk of the time spent on the Refinery theme went towards creating a pretty good base of generic textures and props that can carry over to any set (floors, grating, catwalks, pipes, lights, etc.), and it will mostly be a matter of creating a handful of new wall sets and textures, some theme specific props, and in some cases just a simple texture swap on existing models.
--Cory<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, I guess you're saying that ns_bast will never be ported to NS2; that map is essentially a recreation of the ship "Nostromo" from the movie "Alien", including textures, shapes, and props...
Yup. It was a cool map, but I'm not happy that it was such a close recreation. I didn't have much say in that at the time, and I don't think Charlie realized how close it was to the Nostromo until much later. I also didn't really care for how many textures were used in that map that weren't from the NS texture set, either, which made it look quite a bit different. That sort of thing won't be repeated this time around.
--Cory
Well, not <b>officially</b>...
;)
<!--quoteo(post=1742652:date=Dec 6 2009, 04:11 AM:name=Xtof)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Xtof @ Dec 6 2009, 04:11 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1742652"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I used that concept-art picture as an inspiration... It's only normal that if you are going to make something that is worthy of being official, that you make it something of your own and not copy whole pieces of others work.
I didn't expect that kind of reactions... I was rather curious as wether peeps might like such a clean style... i guess not. I was looking for some feedback of some other sort I guess.
Greetings,
Xtof<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hogwash. At this stage I'm finding it quite useful to use something for reference whist learning the editor.
Besides, while it is important to be aware of copyright, using a support structure for a wall buttress can hardly be considered stealing. If your recreating a level from another game, yeah thats bad, but there is only so many different ways to make a space-station sci-fi corridor that doesn't resemble something somewhere else.
Inspiration of form is fine, direct copy, not so much.
Anyways I have messed a little bit with Hammer, but I am no expert and gave up. I decided to try again with Spark, and here is what I came up with.
Remember, I am no expert and it can be considered my 'first' map ever...
Well guys here is my attempt:
BTW; images are big.
<a href="http://img196.imageshack.us/i/ns225.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/7792/ns225.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
<a href="http://img194.imageshack.us/i/ns224.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/3797/ns224.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
<a href="http://img137.imageshack.us/i/ns223.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/4991/ns223.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
<a href="http://img22.imageshack.us/i/ns222.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/191/ns222.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
<a href="http://img682.imageshack.us/i/ns221.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/4489/ns221.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
I'd like some feedback, bad or positive, because that is the only way anyone can learn.
Thanks!
Anyways I have messed a little bit with Hammer, but I am no expert and gave up. I decided to try again with Spark, and here is what I came up with.
Remember, I am no expert and it can be considered my 'first' map ever...
Well guys here is my attempt:
BTW; images are big.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Great start, but needs some work. In my opinion, there are too many props and the hallways/corridors are too rectangular in shape. You should add some more complex geometric shapes.
Thanks for the feedback, I understand and agree with your opinion(s). I will see what I can do.
Spark:
<img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/ns_spark/spark-001.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
goldSRC (<a href="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/co_2benamed/co_2benamed.zip" target="_blank">bsp download</a>):
<img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/bored/hallway2.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
2 more shot:
<img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/ns_spark/spark-002.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/ns_spark/spark-003.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
It likes to create squares on the completely wrong side that I want it... For example, on this picture below, I was trying to make a square where you see the white lines, instead it made that grey box in the corner. Help me please, I cannot figure out what I am doing wrong!
<a href="http://img694.imageshack.us/i/ns22help.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/3417/ns22help.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
Yeah but sometimes it moves all faces connected to that copied face as well, causing the problem to start from square 1. I would like to learn how to properly use this square tool anyways.
This is my first attempt at anything really. A corridor that I made without reference. The lighting is odd I know, it is still a work in progress. I think it looks okay for a first attempt, I am trying to understand the balance between just throwing in props and actually making your desired look through texturing and careful manipulation. I confess that this is really the former, any advice on how you can best use props for maximum effect would be appreciated.
Also how do you hide the lines/vertices etc.
There isn't anything to "learn" yet, the engine is in alpha.
TempesT, I think it looks great (including the lighting).
Thanks :D!
<a href="http://h.imagehost.org/0576/kekes2.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://h.imagehost.org/0451/kekes2_s.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
That is amazing, good work!
<a href="http://h.imagehost.org/0576/kekes2.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://h.imagehost.org/0451/kekes2_s.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
For a second, I thought that was concept art. Amazing work especially on the lighting.
I'm sure some people have, but at this moment it's largely pointless to do so. We don't have enough information on how the game will play and the editor is missing alot of art resources so beyond doing some rough pencil/paper outlines, you'd be wasting your time getting something down in Spark at the moment as things can (and probably will) change drastically from now till release.
The purpose of the Alpha release is to find bugs and make improvements. Full map construction will come later.
Getting NS1 textures to work in spark is a fun thing to do as well... Much more effective then the oldschool wad files and I like the material file script more then the source engine texture scripts...