<!--QuoteBegin-MrBen+Jun 24 2005, 04:46 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MrBen @ Jun 24 2005, 04:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Nostalgia clouds your views <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yea, that's why I regularly set up 1.04 LAN games with my friends.
i played 1.04 but was dispaointed when 2.0 came out. I just started playing again a week ago and i can't believe how different it is.
I really do miss the length of the games, thats the main thing. I LIKED sitting on the same map for hours. It reminded me of starcraft.
just my 2 cents
EDIT: oh yeah, whats up with the onos? When i played last week for the first time in this build, i ran into the marine base expecting to ravage the place and get negligable damage. Instead im torn apart by a SINGLE hmg marine?!
S'damn well said Haze. But your missing one thing I thought you should of kept, I remember you saying it a long time ago, Compare the Onos to the fat women at McDonalds! C'mon, say it again you magnificant b*****d!!
We should see if Flay will rerelease one of the old, old versions. We, the old guys miss the 3 day long match in Tanith.
The fact that people that played aliens got stuck with skulks might be a bad thing, but one thing was for sure.
It sure crafted them into really deadly yet fragile skulks. Skulks wih Carapace were feared in the hands of a seasoned player (even with the bugged hitboxes)
Nowadays people just run around as a skulk and kill stuff JUST to become a Fade or some other lifeform. Nobody wants to stay as a skulk anymore. It's usually the 'I hate it but I have to do it' ideal when they spawn as one.
I miss old skulks <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
@Nex2 : The marine probably knew where to aim for your hitboxes. Usually people would shake up and mess up their aim as a 10 tonne beast is barelling down the hallway. But as time passed people figured out their dark, dark sekrat....
<!--QuoteBegin-kill4thrills+Jun 24 2005, 08:24 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kill4thrills @ Jun 24 2005, 08:24 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> 1.04 was horribly unbalanced and needed to die. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--QuoteBegin-SentrySteve+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SentrySteve)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Aside from the bugs / balance issues that were worked out in time(which everyone feels the need to point out, <b>like they were 1.X's fault)</b><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Some people here either haven't played 1.0x before or have totally forgotten details about it.
Vermillion <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Turrets/Oc's Dont get it wrong oc's,a and turrets back in 1.0x were badass not the little pices of crap that cant even kill a cara fade. Turrets and oc's were feared. i think that 3 turrets could severly damage an onoi. and a HA was the prized posetion of the marines. HA for marines was like the ultimate thing. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wrong. Turrets still did 10/11/12/13, cost 19 res, took 1 second to start firing at a target (meaning a skulk could strafe around a turret and it would never fire). OCs cost 14 res and had HORRIBLE accuracy. I can't remember the damage though, but it wasn't high.
Haze <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->the lifeforms, such as the fade, were much harder to take down <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. The hitbox is almost the same as now. The fade now has 300/150, whereas the 1.0x fade had 200/100. That means it can take LESS damage. However, if you just dance the fade back and forth hiding from behind a wall, and just spam acid rockets, very few bullets will hit you, leading to perceived longevity. If you were to play the blink/slash style you'd be utterly massacred even in 1.04x. Chalk it up to the weapon rather than the fade.
Haze <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->onos? Nothing like the paper doll it is now.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes and no. The onos now is 700/600, but the hitboxes make it easy to hit. The old onos had 500/150. If you happened to run into 2 normal marines who knew where the hitbox is, you'd be dead to 2 LMGs, and they wouldn't even have finished their clips. It just wasn't intuitive, so it was changed. I agree with the change made, but it still needs work. Read somewhere the devs are still trying to find a way for the onos, but we'll see.
Theslan <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Furthermore, the gameplay of 1.04 was that marine went in groups, resulting massive group ambush with a few scouts here and there<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The first 2.5 minutes of 1.0x are exactly as it is now, with solo marines wandering the map and MASSACRING skulks that died in 7/8? LMG bullets. It was actually easier to hit since the hitbox was taller. It wasn't uncommon to see good players solo 3 skulks at a time with 1 LMG clip. After that, marines go in groups. Why? Because 3 DCs come up, bringing the skulk from 8 bullets to 21 bullets with carapace.
Unless you're a god or have aimbot, no solo marine is going to be able to survive that skulk.
As mentioned, I believe that much of the good feeling of 1.0x is nolstagia. If we were to play 1.0x now, but with JP/HMG fixed and bugs quashed, within a month we'd have lost interest again. Repetitive gameplay, little hope of countering hive2. NS had just come out then, so many people did not know how to play the game. All of us know how to play NS now, and throw us into 1.0x, it'd be very different from what you remembered.
I personally prefer 3.0 over 1.0x, bugs aside. However, I do agree with game length. The current 10 minutes that games are decided in is too short, and doesn't allow many mistakes to be made. 1.0x permitted that.
thanks for pointiong out some of our errors. Yeah we need long games <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
what i remember most about the 1.0x series was the severe disappointment i had when they removed the f4'ing places res into pool again glitch.
a team of 6-8 aliens, 2 go gorge and the rest f4 and return placing all 100-150 res in the pool and giving the gorgies a crap ton of res.... then they removed it soon afterwards.
plus i also remember getting my patootie reamed when i went gorgie... and there were already 2 on my team. i think i still have the scars
<!--QuoteBegin-stallioN+Jun 25 2005, 12:51 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (stallioN @ Jun 25 2005, 12:51 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The offense chambers we have now are the most accurate they've been. I may be wrong, but it was a vast improvement over 1.04. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> they were nerfed though.
i remember the games that would last from 9:00 PM to like 5:30 AM for 1 round <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
and the sensory chambers that didnt cloak, and parasited marines. and all of the chambers and turrets were monster sized :O. OC's also did 50 damage back then instead of 20.
also the 33 res per hive, so if you had 6 hives, you had a max res of 200. there was also that map called ns_15hives so when you built all 15 hives, you had some stupidly high amount of max res (i think 495)
<!--QuoteBegin-moultano+Jun 23 2005, 05:09 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (moultano @ Jun 23 2005, 05:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> My memories of fades were a little different. Personally, I like the current fade a lot better. The fade back then would just peak out from behind corners and lob acid rockets. It was pure pot-shotting with little real excitement. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> those were llamafades
the old blink ROCKED
You'd be walking downt he hallway with your SG, and you'd hear a bzzz and think "OhShit!" *FWAP* You spin around, and fire an SG shot to where it's head would be, but it's now blinked THRU you to the other side, so you whirl around and fill it with lead. At the last second itd blink away, only to return instantly and finish you off. THERE WAS NO HIDING as a fade! And this "Shot Mid Blink" BS didn't happen
<!--QuoteBegin-MistenTH+Jun 24 2005, 11:03 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MistenTH @ Jun 24 2005, 11:03 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Haze <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->the lifeforms, such as the fade, were much harder to take down <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. The hitbox is almost the same as now. The fade now has 300/150, whereas the 1.0x fade had 200/100. That means it can take LESS damage. However, if you just dance the fade back and forth hiding from behind a wall, and just spam acid rockets, very few bullets will hit you, leading to perceived longevity. If you were to play the blink/slash style you'd be utterly massacred even in 1.04x. Chalk it up to the weapon rather than the fade. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> The weapon is most certainly part of the fade. The way the weapons were arranged made the play style of the fade different than it is now, making them much tougher to take down. If you give a marine an LMG hes harder to take down than a marine with only a knife.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Haze <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->onos? Nothing like the paper doll it is now.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes and no. The onos now is 700/600, but the hitboxes make it easy to hit. The old onos had 500/150. If you happened to run into 2 normal marines who knew where the hitbox is, you'd be dead to 2 LMGs, and they wouldn't even have finished their clips. It just wasn't intuitive, so it was changed. I agree with the change made, but it still needs work. Read somewhere the devs are still trying to find a way for the onos, but we'll see.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Was the damage for the gore the still same? I want to check on that (if anyone can) but was it not 120? Or 80. Either way the hitbox still factors in for me. The onos was rarely seen and the hitbox was not memorized in many minds because of that. I'm speaking both for the hardcore statistics, gameplay variables <i>and</i> some memories. By all of that the onos was indeed more powerful than it is now.
<!--QuoteBegin-xtcmen+Jun 25 2005, 01:01 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (xtcmen @ Jun 25 2005, 01:01 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> imo 1.04 was the best version because it was <b>fun</b>. Not balanced <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Thats one of the biggest reasons I'm bringing up these ideas. They contribute hardly anything to balance but definantly make the game more fun. Now that NS is passed the balancing stage they need to concentrate on things that bore players and make them more exciting. The 15 minute games to me are horridly overrushed and not fun at all because of how much content NS has. It cant all be done and displayed properly as it was in 1.04 because the time restraints prevent it from being so.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the devs state that since 3.0 is the final version, any more patches will be strictly bugfixes and minor tweaks? I believe they are working on their next project now, though I'm pretty sure NS:Source is getting a separate team of its own.
unless its so stupidly one sided that you expect 99.9% of the time for one side to win.
ns 1.x wasnt that way, and was actually fun. now many versions and patches later its just like counter-strike. there is no fun, just a bunch of noobs and hackers, and gameplay is dropping off the charts.
<!--QuoteBegin-Haze+Jun 23 2005, 09:58 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Haze @ Jun 23 2005, 09:58 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <ul><li>Map Limits</li></ul>The limits in the mapping guidelines limiting how many entitys and such you can have on one map were not in place during 1.0x. Maps could have nearly as much as they wanted and were much more interesting (in my opinon) than they were now. Although major kudos to the mappers working with this limitation now and having the beautiful maps that they do.
<b><u>Pros</b></u> -Much more active and beautiful maps. The overall look was better and mappers didnt have to be stingy with the details.
<b><u>Cons</b></u> -Slow down. Players with lower end rigs would have a rougher time running the game (one of Charlie's main concerns was letting players that have low end machines be able to run the game) as well as servers occasionally bogging down from all the activity, although that was partly due to a bug as well (which has been nipped in the booty). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> That's inaccurate.
Entities are handled server-side, and Half-Life makes regular checks for the status of these entities and sends them back to the player.
More entities = More CPU usage on the server = More lag.
while entities were cut down after 1.04 im starting to wonder whether the entity limit to keep server cpu down low is still warranted. back when 1.04 is out we had consdierably slower cpus. Now most decent server hosts use cpus >2.5ghz (or equivilent) with a gigabyte of ram.
Would these extra entities really pose such a massive drain on these cpus? My answer is an almsot definite no. Why? As many of you know i run 1.04 steam weekends and while server cpu usage is higher it is not that much higher like 5-10% on my xeon based system. Certainly nothing taxing. Yes however i do admit this is a high end server but, i am beginning to think with increasing cpu speeds and performance as to whether the current ns entitiy limit should not be revised
<!--QuoteBegin-Mendasp+Jun 26 2005, 05:53 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mendasp @ Jun 26 2005, 05:53 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Haze+Jun 23 2005, 09:58 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Haze @ Jun 23 2005, 09:58 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <ul> </li><li>Map Limits </li></ul>The limits in the mapping guidelines limiting how many entitys and such you can have on one map were not in place during 1.0x. Maps could have nearly as much as they wanted and were much more interesting (in my opinon) than they were now. Although major kudos to the mappers working with this limitation now and having the beautiful maps that they do.
<b><u>Pros</b></u> -Much more active and beautiful maps. The overall look was better and mappers didnt have to be stingy with the details.
<b><u>Cons</b></u> -Slow down. Players with lower end rigs would have a rougher time running the game (one of Charlie's main concerns was letting players that have low end machines be able to run the game) as well as servers occasionally bogging down from all the activity, although that was partly due to a bug as well (which has been nipped in the booty). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's inaccurate.
Entities are handled server-side, and Half-Life makes regular checks for the status of these entities and sends them back to the player.
More entities = More CPU usage on the server = More lag. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Eeps, my bad. I'll change. I knew it caused more lag but I wasnt sure if it was to the player or server.
all these people saying fun > balance... you do realize than when the game is unbalanced, you having "fun" means the other team is NOT having fun. therein lies the problem with 1.0x games.
i admit from 2.0 onwards the game was more of a grind, cause the attempts at balancing it made it less possible to completely dominate the other team, and that's probably why your fun factor lessened because cheese strats don't work anymore and you actually have to use skills and teamwork.
i'm sorry but i (mostly) like the direction that NS has taken
<!--QuoteBegin-kill4thrills+Jun 27 2005, 01:28 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kill4thrills @ Jun 27 2005, 01:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> all these people saying fun > balance... you do realize than when the game is unbalanced, you having "fun" means the other team is NOT having fun. therein lies the problem with 1.0x games.
i admit from 2.0 onwards the game was more of a grind, cause the attempts at balancing it made it less possible to completely dominate the other team, and that's probably why your fun factor lessened because cheese strats don't work anymore and you actually have to use skills and teamwork.
i'm sorry but i (mostly) like the direction that NS has taken <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> not entirely true.
In 1.0x after every long game both teams sat in the rr for like 10 minutes (even the losing team) about how fun the battle was. about how so and so tryed this and blah.
Both teams had fun then now i dont want to play ns cause. one little mistake thats it ur teams done.
ZunniThe best thing to happen to I&S in a long whileJoin Date: 2002-11-26Member: 10016Members
Vermillion, while that may hold some water in competitive play, I see games EVERY DAY where the first fade doesn't show up until 8 minutes and the second hive isn't dropped for 4 more, and yet the aliens manage to pull out a win..
Why?? Because in pub play both sides make many mistakes....
yes that is quite true. i still play ns everyday what i see is the team that makes the most mistakes loses. they have little chance of recovery. cuase by 8 minutes theres only another 15 minutes left no time to fix the mistakes especially if ur res is moving slower than a snail.
<!--QuoteBegin-kill4thrills+Jun 27 2005, 01:28 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kill4thrills @ Jun 27 2005, 01:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> all these people saying fun > balance... you do realize than when the game is unbalanced, you having "fun" means the other team is NOT having fun. therein lies the problem with 1.0x games. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I dont think having an overpowered onos at hive 2 wouldnt be fun. The fact that something is roving around the map that can make mince meat of your entire squad -- and its another player, is absolutely awesome.
However, as stated before, balance does not mean even. A skulk is not even with a shotty marine down a long corridor and a lot of "balance" relies on variables. 1.0x wasnt balanced, but wasnt horridly skewed to one side. (ASIDE FROM JP/HMG. Yeesh. <i>I</i> found a good server)
I read this whole topic (took me maybe 45 minutes) and although I just recently started playing the earlier version sounds 3 times as fun as the current NS...right now its barely fun enough for me to keep coming back...is there a way to play the old NS? as in is are there servers that still run version 1.x?
<!--QuoteBegin-DC Darkling+Jun 26 2005, 07:14 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (DC Darkling @ Jun 26 2005, 07:14 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I can say I loved 1.4 (only 1.x I played) cause it was epic and fun. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I sure hope you enjoyed that version, especially since it never existed!
Comments
Yea, that's why I regularly set up 1.04 LAN games with my friends.
I really do miss the length of the games, thats the main thing. I LIKED sitting on the same map for hours. It reminded me of starcraft.
just my 2 cents
EDIT: oh yeah, whats up with the onos? When i played last week for the first time in this build, i ran into the marine base expecting to ravage the place and get negligable damage. Instead im torn apart by a SINGLE hmg marine?!
We should see if Flay will rerelease one of the old, old versions. We, the old guys miss the 3 day long match in Tanith.
The fact that people that played aliens got stuck with skulks might be a bad thing, but one thing was for sure.
It sure crafted them into really deadly yet fragile skulks. Skulks wih Carapace were feared in the hands of a seasoned player (even with the bugged hitboxes)
Nowadays people just run around as a skulk and kill stuff JUST to become a Fade or some other lifeform. Nobody wants to stay as a skulk anymore. It's usually the 'I hate it but I have to do it' ideal when they spawn as one.
I miss old skulks <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
@Nex2 : The marine probably knew where to aim for your hitboxes. Usually people would shake up and mess up their aim as a 10 tonne beast is barelling down the hallway.
But as time passed people figured out their dark, dark sekrat....
<!--QuoteBegin-SentrySteve+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SentrySteve)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Aside from the bugs / balance issues that were worked out in time(which everyone feels the need to point out, <b>like they were 1.X's fault)</b><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Vermillion
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Turrets/Oc's
Dont get it wrong oc's,a and turrets back in 1.0x were badass not the little pices of crap that cant even kill a cara fade. Turrets and oc's were feared. i think that 3 turrets could severly damage an onoi. and a HA was the prized posetion of the marines. HA for marines was like the ultimate thing.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wrong. Turrets still did 10/11/12/13, cost 19 res, took 1 second to start firing at a target (meaning a skulk could strafe around a turret and it would never fire). OCs cost 14 res and had HORRIBLE accuracy. I can't remember the damage though, but it wasn't high.
Haze
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->the lifeforms, such as the fade, were much harder to take down <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. The hitbox is almost the same as now. The fade now has 300/150, whereas the 1.0x fade had 200/100. That means it can take LESS damage. However, if you just dance the fade back and forth hiding from behind a wall, and just spam acid rockets, very few bullets will hit you, leading to perceived longevity. If you were to play the blink/slash style you'd be utterly massacred even in 1.04x. Chalk it up to the weapon rather than the fade.
Haze
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->onos? Nothing like the paper doll it is now.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes and no. The onos now is 700/600, but the hitboxes make it easy to hit. The old onos had 500/150. If you happened to run into 2 normal marines who knew where the hitbox is, you'd be dead to 2 LMGs, and they wouldn't even have finished their clips. It just wasn't intuitive, so it was changed. I agree with the change made, but it still needs work. Read somewhere the devs are still trying to find a way for the onos, but we'll see.
Theslan
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Furthermore, the gameplay of 1.04 was that marine went in groups, resulting massive group ambush with a few scouts here and there<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The first 2.5 minutes of 1.0x are exactly as it is now, with solo marines wandering the map and MASSACRING skulks that died in 7/8? LMG bullets. It was actually easier to hit since the hitbox was taller. It wasn't uncommon to see good players solo 3 skulks at a time with 1 LMG clip. After that, marines go in groups. Why? Because 3 DCs come up, bringing the skulk from 8 bullets to 21 bullets with carapace.
Unless you're a god or have aimbot, no solo marine is going to be able to survive that skulk.
As mentioned, I believe that much of the good feeling of 1.0x is nolstagia. If we were to play 1.0x now, but with JP/HMG fixed and bugs quashed, within a month we'd have lost interest again. Repetitive gameplay, little hope of countering hive2. NS had just come out then, so many people did not know how to play the game. All of us know how to play NS now, and throw us into 1.0x, it'd be very different from what you remembered.
I personally prefer 3.0 over 1.0x, bugs aside. However, I do agree with game length. The current 10 minutes that games are decided in is too short, and doesn't allow many mistakes to be made. 1.0x permitted that.
Yeah we need long games <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
a team of 6-8 aliens, 2 go gorge and the rest f4 and return placing all 100-150 res in the pool and giving the gorgies a crap ton of res.... then they removed it soon afterwards.
plus i also remember getting my patootie reamed when i went gorgie... and there were already 2 on my team. i think i still have the scars
they were nerfed though.
and the sensory chambers that didnt cloak, and parasited marines. and all of the chambers and turrets were monster sized :O. OC's also did 50 damage back then instead of 20.
also the 33 res per hive, so if you had 6 hives, you had a max res of 200. there was also that map called ns_15hives so when you built all 15 hives, you had some stupidly high amount of max res (i think 495)
those were llamafades
the old blink ROCKED
You'd be walking downt he hallway with your SG, and you'd hear a bzzz and think "OhShit!"
*FWAP*
You spin around, and fire an SG shot to where it's head would be, but it's now blinked THRU you to the other side, so you whirl around and fill it with lead. At the last second itd blink away, only to return instantly and finish you off. THERE WAS NO HIDING as a fade! And this "Shot Mid Blink" BS didn't happen
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->the lifeforms, such as the fade, were much harder to take down <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. The hitbox is almost the same as now. The fade now has 300/150, whereas the 1.0x fade had 200/100. That means it can take LESS damage. However, if you just dance the fade back and forth hiding from behind a wall, and just spam acid rockets, very few bullets will hit you, leading to perceived longevity. If you were to play the blink/slash style you'd be utterly massacred even in 1.04x. Chalk it up to the weapon rather than the fade. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The weapon is most certainly part of the fade. The way the weapons were arranged made the play style of the fade different than it is now, making them much tougher to take down. If you give a marine an LMG hes harder to take down than a marine with only a knife.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Haze
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->onos? Nothing like the paper doll it is now.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes and no. The onos now is 700/600, but the hitboxes make it easy to hit. The old onos had 500/150. If you happened to run into 2 normal marines who knew where the hitbox is, you'd be dead to 2 LMGs, and they wouldn't even have finished their clips. It just wasn't intuitive, so it was changed. I agree with the change made, but it still needs work. Read somewhere the devs are still trying to find a way for the onos, but we'll see.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Was the damage for the gore the still same? I want to check on that (if anyone can) but was it not 120? Or 80. Either way the hitbox still factors in for me. The onos was rarely seen and the hitbox was not memorized in many minds because of that. I'm speaking both for the hardcore statistics, gameplay variables <i>and</i> some memories. By all of that the onos was indeed more powerful than it is now.
Thats one of the biggest reasons I'm bringing up these ideas. They contribute hardly anything to balance but definantly make the game more fun. Now that NS is passed the balancing stage they need to concentrate on things that bore players and make them more exciting. The 15 minute games to me are horridly overrushed and not fun at all because of how much content NS has. It cant all be done and displayed properly as it was in 1.04 because the time restraints prevent it from being so.
unless its so stupidly one sided that you expect 99.9% of the time for one side to win.
ns 1.x wasnt that way, and was actually fun. now many versions and patches later its just like counter-strike. there is no fun, just a bunch of noobs and hackers, and gameplay is dropping off the charts.
OMG THE WORLD IS FLAT!
<b><u>Pros</b></u>
-Much more active and beautiful maps. The overall look was better and mappers didnt have to be stingy with the details.
<b><u>Cons</b></u>
-Slow down. Players with lower end rigs would have a rougher time running the game (one of Charlie's main concerns was letting players that have low end machines be able to run the game) as well as servers occasionally bogging down from all the activity, although that was partly due to a bug as well (which has been nipped in the booty). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's inaccurate.
Entities are handled server-side, and Half-Life makes regular checks for the status of these entities and sends them back to the player.
More entities = More CPU usage on the server = More lag.
back when 1.04 is out we had consdierably slower cpus. Now most decent server hosts use cpus >2.5ghz (or equivilent) with a gigabyte of ram.
Would these extra entities really pose such a massive drain on these cpus? My answer is an almsot definite no.
Why?
As many of you know i run 1.04 steam weekends and while server cpu usage is higher it is not that much higher like 5-10% on my xeon based system. Certainly nothing taxing. Yes however i do admit this is a high end server but, i am beginning to think with increasing cpu speeds and performance as to whether the current ns entitiy limit should not be revised
</li><li>Map Limits
</li></ul>The limits in the mapping guidelines limiting how many entitys and such you can have on one map were not in place during 1.0x. Maps could have nearly as much as they wanted and were much more interesting (in my opinon) than they were now. Although major kudos to the mappers working with this limitation now and having the beautiful maps that they do.
<b><u>Pros</b></u>
-Much more active and beautiful maps. The overall look was better and mappers didnt have to be stingy with the details.
<b><u>Cons</b></u>
-Slow down. Players with lower end rigs would have a rougher time running the game (one of Charlie's main concerns was letting players that have low end machines be able to run the game) as well as servers occasionally bogging down from all the activity, although that was partly due to a bug as well (which has been nipped in the booty). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's inaccurate.
Entities are handled server-side, and Half-Life makes regular checks for the status of these entities and sends them back to the player.
More entities = More CPU usage on the server = More lag. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Eeps, my bad. I'll change. I knew it caused more lag but I wasnt sure if it was to the player or server.
Sure, it had huge flaws.. JPrush, multiple exploits.. etc.
But I think if we would put some features of 1.4 in the 3.x NS, it would pwn greatly
i admit from 2.0 onwards the game was more of a grind, cause the attempts at balancing it made it less possible to completely dominate the other team, and that's probably why your fun factor lessened because cheese strats don't work anymore and you actually have to use skills and teamwork.
i'm sorry but i (mostly) like the direction that NS has taken
i admit from 2.0 onwards the game was more of a grind, cause the attempts at balancing it made it less possible to completely dominate the other team, and that's probably why your fun factor lessened because cheese strats don't work anymore and you actually have to use skills and teamwork.
i'm sorry but i (mostly) like the direction that NS has taken <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
not entirely true.
In 1.0x after every long game both teams sat in the rr for like 10 minutes (even the losing team) about how fun the battle was. about how so and so tryed this and blah.
Both teams had fun then now i dont want to play ns cause. one little mistake thats it ur teams done.
Why?? Because in pub play both sides make many mistakes....
i still play ns everyday what i see is the team that makes the most mistakes loses. they have little chance of recovery. cuase by 8 minutes theres only another 15 minutes left no time to fix the mistakes especially if ur res is moving slower than a snail.
I dont think having an overpowered onos at hive 2 wouldnt be fun. The fact that something is roving around the map that can make mince meat of your entire squad -- and its another player, is absolutely awesome.
However, as stated before, balance does not mean even. A skulk is not even with a shotty marine down a long corridor and a lot of "balance" relies on variables. 1.0x wasnt balanced, but wasnt horridly skewed to one side. (ASIDE FROM JP/HMG. Yeesh. <i>I</i> found a good server)
I sure hope you enjoyed that version, especially since it never existed!