<!--QuoteBegin-Swiftspear+Jun 7 2005, 06:28 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Swiftspear @ Jun 7 2005, 06:28 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-Boris+Jun 6 2005, 06:22 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Boris @ Jun 6 2005, 06:22 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> ----BS = ON (we like to play VANILLA as much as possible and yes people can get around certain things, but we like to try to get them to play vanilla - it's the way we want the game to be played. So crying about this falls on deaf ears) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> The game can't be played the way it is set up by default. NS's default config is equivalent to a CS config with no +moveforward, it is literally layed out that poorly.
Basicly scripting is one of two options. Option A is totally rebuild your config so the game is playable (mousewheel as +jump and/or +attack, fastswitch on, and a tighter weapon selection base) or script to make the default config work to do all those things for you with the same proper set of keys.
A good player's config will never be set up default, so if you intend to inforce vanillaism, just ban any good player and you are set. Scripting doesn't allow pretty much ANYTHING adventagious that cannot be done without scripts. I know, because I've done my recearch, and I still don't script.
Really the main thing BS1 does is chase skilled players away from your server. It's bad publicity and little else.
Do you prefer to attract noobie players with little or no comunity voice or play experiance as your regulars, or do you prefer to attract skilled players who will bring alot more to your table by playing there? because from a PR standpoint that is the choice you are making between BS1 and BS0. Realize that by putting BS1 on you are basicly freezing any scripter's config as soon as they join your server. They can not hotkey join a team, they cannot attack, they cannot jump, they have to rebind everything just to play a game there. Most of them just go somewhere else rather then fool around with it, and certainly don't decide to regular your server after that experiance. A big price to pay considering pretty much every american clanner scripts, and even the one's that don't probably won't regular your server if you chase away all thier buddies.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> So...in this line here: <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Scripting doesn't allow pretty much ANYTHING adventagious that cannot be done without scripts. I know, because I've done my recearch, and I still don't script.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> You are saying that scripts DO allow some advantages (maybe only 1, but that's still 1 more than should be allowed) and that any of the things scripts do can be done without them? So why do we need scripts again? And why are the SKILLED players all using scripts if they're so good they wouldn't need them?
This is always an arguement that just boils down to what your personal opinion/belief is on whether or not scripts are "cheating and helping beyond what you could humanly do yourself" or they are "perfectly legitimate and all should use them".
I don't understand the arguement about all the buttons and default configs and being blocked by BS=1. I can move, jump, shoot, fastswitch, taunt, jointeams with hotkeys, and all the stuff you mention by pressing keys on my keyboard and using my mouse...
<b>What things do you find appealing?</b> Friendly players.
<b>What things do you hate?</b> Abusive admins, unfriendly players, being told to switch teams half way through a game and kicked/banned if I don't, being kicked and banned for a minor/no reason, addons that destroy gameplay.
<b>Do you like FF?</b> Occasionally, but I wouldn't play with it much.
<b>Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?</b> I like serverside ones like HLGuard, they help.
<b>Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?</b> Off.
<b>Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?</b> I don't care, but I do occasionally swear when I screw up really bad, so I hope that's tolerated...
<b>Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things</b> Yeah, rules. Censors aren't exactly great.
What things do you find appealing? I like servers that stick to either Combat or Classic, most of the time people are joining to play either or, not both. Having both in the cycle tends to empty out servers in no time.
What things do you hate? I really dislike alot of the new maps, I've been around for a while, and I like to stick to the older maps like Hera, Tanith, Nothing etc. Please no Eon, Metal etc. : )
Do you like FF? Sometimes I like it, sometimes I don't. Good answer eh? But seriously, it depends on the weapon, I don't mind FF with a LMG or GLs, but with shotguns, it can almost be game breaking, you'd like to try and watch your fire, but you it can be difficult to exercise discretion in aiming with a shotgun, since you're almost limited to shooting very rarely in large groups.
Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)? Blah. No. They stop new players from joining your server, and makes you entirely reliant on your regulars.
Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF? No opinion.
Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)? I don't have a problem with undirected swearing, but it's directed swearing that is a problem. Players should never be maliciously swearing at other players, it easily creates hostility and bad attitudes that ruins the game for the entire team.
Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things? etc. etc. I like to think that most players have the ability to regulate themselves, and that an excess of rules will ultimately lead to a detrimental experience, as certain rules tend to reach beyond their intended goals. I would attempt to get as many trustworthy, level headed admins as possible so that you have at least one admin on at all times and let them deal with particular situation as is most <b>reasonable</b>.
I play on NSA a lot, and I like their community because it is very diverse, and extremely tight. I also enjoy playing on Bry's.
What things do you find appealing? You should have either ALL NS or ALL CO. It's extremely annoying to have fun playing with great players on an ns map, then going to a co map and having the server empty out. A variety of servers are very nice.
What things do you hate? I really hate mic spam. Teamspeak or Vent is a nice place to have. Admins that are anal about every damn rule, and act arrogant, like I R HAVE LEET POWER BOW BE4 ME OMG LOL really **** me off.
Do you like FF? I don't care either way. however, ff off is preferred, since no tking is another rule you have to enforce, and ATAC isn't really on NS yet. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)? Client side hack scanners are freaking horrid and buggy, and annoying to run. I enjoy server side hacks scanners, such as SteamBans and HLGUARD. However, NS has the least hackers, ever, you don't really need them.
Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF? MP_BS 0 is nice, but I don't mind 1.
Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)? Well, I hate places where you join the game, and all you hear is ****ING **** **** **** ******* I WILL RAPE YOU IN THE ****. NSA doesn't really have a rule on this, but it's not bad.
Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things? etc. etc. I like servers that have no racism, period, if that is what you're asking. I really don't need to hear a million racial slurs in my game of NS.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->You are saying that scripts DO allow some advantages (maybe only 1, but that's still 1 more than should be allowed) and that any of the things scripts do can be done without them? So why do we need scripts again? And why are the SKILLED players all using scripts if they're so good they wouldn't need them?
This is always an arguement that just boils down to what your personal opinion/belief is on whether or not scripts are "cheating and helping beyond what you could humanly do yourself" or they are "perfectly legitimate and all should use them".
I don't understand the arguement about all the buttons and default configs and being blocked by BS=1. I can move, jump, shoot, fastswitch, taunt, jointeams with hotkeys, and all the stuff you mention by pressing keys on my keyboard and using my mouse... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not going to dig up the Flayra quote again, but bunnyhopping is part of NS.
Now, people who can bunnyhop have 2 choices. Either they bind jump to mousewheel, which is something that a LOT of people find very annoying to use, or they use a script to make bunnyhopping feasible with a keyboard button.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->They can not hotkey join a team, they cannot attack, they cannot jump, they have to rebind everything just to play a game there.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is entirely true. I have scripts set to F1 and F2 to run a marine and alien config when I join a team. It's not an advantage, it's customizing my game because I like different controls for different teams. This is not possible with BS 1.
I cannot jump becuase I use a 3jump script.
Hell, I rebind my toggleconsole key because of my bad habit of hitting it when going for my gun, so when I join a BS1 I was unable to even fix my config for a long time because it would totally freeze the console key I had rebound.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I can move, jump, shoot, fastswitch, taunt, jointeams with hotkeys, and all the stuff you mention by pressing keys on my keyboard and using my mouse...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Show me a bunnyhop with a default config, without using mwheel.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And why are the SKILLED players all using scripts if they're so good they wouldn't need them?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As a clanner who actually bothered to make switchscripts to play on both, I see myself and other clanners join servers and do extremely well all the time. It doesn't make us better, it makes the game more convienient.
As some added irony, clanners will probably marine better on a bs1 becuase the aliens won't bhop and so will be extremely easy to hit.
A non-hopping alien against a good marine = dead. It's part of the game balance. BS 1 hurts this.
I usually play on 187 Combat, all four Aero servers, NS arms labs 1 and 2, and sometimes the Snake Den. Edit, Oh yeah, I played ALL the time on Weasels Revolution when it was up <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
What things do you find appealing?
Combat, /menu command, /buildmenu command, admins that dont abuse their power to a large extent, competant players (little shaky on the NS arms labs sometimes...), frequent playing admins, rules that are enforced.
What things do you hate?
hackers, scripters, limits on jetpacks when I come into the game late, high onos limits, webs, the ineffectiveness of the welder against webs, the fact that the hand grenade is useless in combat... Ok I got off topic.
Do you like FF?
Not really when I am trying to win. When theres only a couple people on the server and you are goofing off with no real intent to win, sure.
Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?
If admins frequent the servers enough, there is no need.
Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?
On
Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?
No
Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things?
Yes
I know this cant just be put on a server by the maker, but I also like teams who talk to each other, and try to coordinate attacks... or at least do what I say when I coordinate an attack <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
My favorite server is: CAL NS Match hosted by: Critical eXtinction.
Good registration, decent ping, and no blockscripts. The admins kind of suck, but you can't have everything right?
Oh, wait.
<b>What things do you find appealing?</b>
A good performance server that isn't running 50 instances of HLDS. Good playerbase, active admining by people who aren't idiots. bs 0 is always nice too.
<b>What things do you hate?</b>
Crappy servers that must be getting 30 fps, and have the hit reg to prove it. Idiot admins who ban good players for 'cheating'.
<b>FF?</b>
Love it. I play like it is on regardless, though.
<b>Anti hack stuff?</b>
Smart admins are the only thing that can stop hackers. The CAL plugin is nice to stop people from running low rates, but that is about it.
<b>bs?</b>
I prefer it on, but I'll play with it off. I'll whine like a little girl on vent about having to rebind my keys and aim my pistol differently, though.
<b>swearing?</b>
I don't care, as I try not to read mm1 too much. Though it is nice if they don't enforce it, so I can cuss freely when comming.
<b>Racism?</b>
Once again, hearing someone use racial slurs isn't going to make me cry. I don't care either way, unless they are being annoying and spamming it or using it all the time to try and seem cool and 'edgy'.
<!--QuoteBegin-Swiftspear+Jun 6 2005, 11:26 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Swiftspear @ Jun 6 2005, 11:26 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <b>What things do you find appealing?</b> I just want to know what the hell I'm playing before I join a server... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> HLSW, FTW! <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-Raz+Jun 8 2005, 11:44 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Raz @ Jun 8 2005, 11:44 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I can move, jump, shoot, fastswitch, taunt, jointeams with hotkeys, and all the stuff you mention by pressing keys on my keyboard and using my mouse...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Show me a bunnyhop with a default config, without using mwheel.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And why are the SKILLED players all using scripts if they're so good they wouldn't need them?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As a clanner who actually bothered to make switchscripts to play on both, I see myself and other clanners join servers and do extremely well all the time. It doesn't make us better, it makes the game more convienient.
As some added irony, clanners will probably marine better on a bs1 becuase the aliens won't bhop and so will be extremely easy to hit.
A non-hopping alien against a good marine = dead. It's part of the game balance. BS 1 hurts this. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Sorry but on BS=1 servers you do get to see alot of players who can bunnyhop without scripts and do better than a few supposidly "GOOD" clanners who use scripts.....
You just cba to learn how thats all just admit it... players who play on BS=1 and can bunnyhop and do things "ONLY SCRIPTS CAN DO" know that you scripters who need a script to bunnyhop just cba to spend a few days getting used to it without scripts.....
On quite a few BS=1 servers you see bunnyhopping all the time, you just gotta pick ones with players who know how thats all...
Also another reason that you have to script to do your bunnyhop is the fact that you or your team will cry if you didn't and screwed ya bunnyhop up... <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I am fine with using a script to load an alien config or marine config... but using a script your gameplay or to help you bunnyhop is just pure lazyness...
I class people who use scripts to improve their gameplay as not being able to play properly... i don't care what CAL's rules are or whatever.. anything you make like scripts to improve your gameplay just shows it....
IMHO you might aswell be cheating if you use scripts to improve your gameplay....
And now i will wait for super flame-age because your not allowed an opinion these days <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
obuhNot Quite Smart at NSJoin Date: 2003-03-31Member: 15072Members, Constellation
<!--QuoteBegin-TheJim+Jun 8 2005, 10:48 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TheJim @ Jun 8 2005, 10:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> You just cba to learn how thats all just admit it... players who play on BS=1 and can bunnyhop and do things "ONLY SCRIPTS CAN DO" know that you scripters who need a script to bunnyhop just cba to spend a few days getting used to it without scripts.....
Also another reason that you have to script to do your bunnyhop is the fact that you or your team will cry if you didn't and screwed ya bunnyhop up... <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I am fine with using a script to load an alien config or marine config... but using a script your gameplay or to help you bunnyhop is just pure lazyness...
[...]
IMHO you might aswell be cheating if you use scripts to improve your gameplay....
And now i will wait for super flame-age because your not allowed an opinion these days <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Do you know how bhop works ? Using a +3jump script to bhop is not different from bhoping with the mousewheel. Either you know how to bhop or you don't, only the jump method changes here.
Comparing scripting to cheating is very intelligent and innovative, congratulations.
You are allowed to have an opinion, but if you base it on incorrect information and use it to attack people then it is not welcome.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I class people who use scripts to improve their gameplay as not being able to play properly... i don't care what CAL's rules are or whatever.. anything you make like scripts to improve your gameplay just shows it....<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I class people such as yourself as not being able to keep their mouth shut when they don't know what they're talking about.
<!--QuoteBegin-obuh+Jun 8 2005, 04:24 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (obuh @ Jun 8 2005, 04:24 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-TheJim+Jun 8 2005, 10:48 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TheJim @ Jun 8 2005, 10:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> You just cba to learn how thats all just admit it... players who play on BS=1 and can bunnyhop and do things "ONLY SCRIPTS CAN DO" know that you scripters who need a script to bunnyhop just cba to spend a few days getting used to it without scripts.....
Also another reason that you have to script to do your bunnyhop is the fact that you or your team will cry if you didn't and screwed ya bunnyhop up... <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I am fine with using a script to load an alien config or marine config... but using a script your gameplay or to help you bunnyhop is just pure lazyness...
[...]
IMHO you might aswell be cheating if you use scripts to improve your gameplay....
And now i will wait for super flame-age because your not allowed an opinion these days <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Do you know how bhop works ? Using a +3jump script to bhop is not different from bhoping with the mousewheel. Either you know how to bhop or you don't, only the jump method changes here.
Comparing scripting to cheating is very intelligent and innovative, congratulations.
You are allowed to have an opinion, but if you base it on incorrect information and use it to attack people then it is not welcome.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I class people who use scripts to improve their gameplay as not being able to play properly... i don't care what CAL's rules are or whatever.. anything you make like scripts to improve your gameplay just shows it....<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I class people such as yourself as not being able to keep their mouth shut when they don't know what they're talking about. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Lol i guess you couldn't think of anything better... how expected.... hehe <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I honestly did expect better but obviously its beyond your capacity <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
TheJim supports everything I stand for, and I don't understand why this is so HARD for the scripters to understand.
Take away your +3jump script AND your cheap mousewheel bind, and bunnyhop for me.
If you can't do this easily, what's the arguement here? The mousewheel is another CHEAP form of accomplishing something you're too lazy to learn without the help of an "aid". Press a jump key (mouse BUTTON or keyboard BUTTON) to accomplish a bhop.
I'm sure bunnyhopping is part of the game and Flayra himself does it, but I'd like to see people do all this stuff without assistance. The mousewheel is borderline in my opinion, because of the ability to "hit a key" more than once with a single movement. To me, the only things are click ON, release OFF keys (minus the aiming of the mouse of course).
And as I am not familiar with what exactly is blocked by BS=1 (I don't ever have a problem), you say that there is no way to have seperate binds for marine/alien with having BS=1? Can you "exec marine.cfg" as a single command? or will it stop you? I'd like to be better informed as to how BS=1 blocks legitimate key rebinds. I still want it to block garbage like bhop scripts. But there's gotta be a way to be able to set new binds for marine or alien.
EDIT: I'd like to have BS=0 on my server, but I don't like the idea of people using cheap scripts because they suck at the game. I don't mind scripts that rebind keys for marine/alien, those are just smart and creative. But +3jump scripts...lame
I hated Mr. Server. One of the guys there i absolutely hated because he had a very annoying voice and was a total a-hole.
Pino? I think was one of his names... eradicator i think was his normal one.
lame server... lunixmonster has a lot more teamwork and generally better quality of games. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Ya, I agree, Lunixmonster FTW. In addition to good things like blockscripts, minimal cussing, and llama-ing, there is a great community behind the server all of whom are great people to play with and work together, etc. If the teams are uneven, people will switch from the winning team to the losing one to make it more fair and fun, and you don't see that often on any server. You just can't beat Lunixmonster. It's gonna take over the world... Seriously.
<!--QuoteBegin-TheJim+Jun 8 2005, 10:48 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TheJim @ Jun 8 2005, 10:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> And now i will wait for super flame-age because your not allowed an opinion these days <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Oh, you can have the opinion that scripting is somehow cheating. However, if you're looking at things from a factual standpoint then scripting isn't cheating, it just makes life more convenient. Having said that, of all the people that i've seen in this game that have made such claims, I haven't seen any that knew anything about scripting, how it works, what scripts can accomplish, etc. I fail to see how a player can make statements about something that they know nothing about. That is probably the reason obuh gave you that response.
Anyway, this is kind of off topic and it's going to turn a thread about something loosely related to scripting into a thread entirely about scripting, so i'll shut up now.
<!--QuoteBegin-Boris+Jun 6 2005, 06:30 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Boris @ Jun 6 2005, 06:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Because I believe so strongly against any form of making the game easier to exploit or being able to improve yourself beyond what is humanly possible, I really like the idea of BS.
I know tons of people use scripts, and as I understand, CAL allows it. I don't know if this will get changed or not on our server. A lot of the guys like the vanilla style, and having that BS = 1 gives them a little peace of mind that some of the really helpful scripts are not being used.
mp_blockscripts; ON. If you can use talent, don't resort to scripts for your movement/jumping/bhopping. I have nothing against people who can legitimately do the above successfully, but I can't stand people who use a script for it/to help with it (for the record, I can't bunnyhop, and will not use any scripts...)
*all* repeat *all* scripts which were considered exploitative by the NS dev team (_special, wigglewalks etc) have been blocked. That is to say they DO NOT WORK AT ALL WITH THE CURRENT VERSION OF NS.
2)
Scripts do NOT directly make you play better. They do not:
Aim for you. Bhop for you. Let you see through walls. Kill skulks with 1 bullet.
They are a CUSTOMIZATION which some people use because of PERSONAL PREFERENCE. There is NO advantage in using a 3jump over mousewheel for bhopping, not a pistol script over a normal mouse button / mousewheel.
The ONLY reason some people play better with scripts was summed up a while ago by Forlorn, I can't find the exact quote but it is because these people have streamlined their controls more, which is a completely different concept.
3)
Pistol scripts (arguably the only 'exploitatious' script) are nowhere near as good as people think.
Let's go with your standard 2shot script, fires 1 shot when you click, 1 shot when you release. If you click too fast, it only fires 1 shot. That means that you're actually firing as if you do NOT use a script. You actually have to regulate the speed that you click your mouse in order to get the best rate of fire. Also, it does NOT break the RoF cap on the pistol. Yet another reason why it is not exploitatious.
Now, I will list the number of alternatives you have to using a pistol script which can give the EXACT SAME RESULT (faster pistol shooting) :
Clicking your mouse faster (i know loads of people who do this and shoot faster than I do with a 3shot script) Using an external key macro Using your mousewheel Using more than 1 mouse button bound to fire and bashing all of them at once.
To conclude : All exploitatious scripts have been removed from the game
Any player who plays better with scripts than without, does so because he has CUSTOMIZED and STREAMLINED his controls - and therefore is more comfortable with them.
To reiterate: THERE ARE NO EXPLOITATIOUS SCRIPTS IN THE GAME.,
Go Figure.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>What things do you find appealing?</b> First thing that catches my attention is the server's ping. Although you can be a useful player even if you have a "high" ping (being Gorge, build stuff as a marine and let the others cover, etc.), it's always better to have the low ping on your side!
Then I check if the players' attitudes are compatible with mine. I can't really answer yes or no to that point just after a single visit, because there might not be any regulars around. Meanwhile I try to see how admins behave : Do they tend to abuse? Do they listen to the players and do they respect the rules themselves?
<b>What things do you hate?</b> I don't really like most custom maps (some of them are a real pain for my old computer!), but if the server has a fast download host thing, then I may stay and play that map. Also, no stuff like "Headshot/Killing Spree/Double Kill", and I prefer when my screen isn't full of multicolor text, heh. Oh, and try not to put too many plugins, please <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<b>Do you like FF?</b> yes, I love it! I can't really play without it now, I'm always holding my fire when someone gets in front of me in FF off server..
<b>Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?</b> I don't think they are well-suited for NS... Besides, admins are more useful!
<b>Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?</b> Ahh, the point that has been discussed so many times, and yet people are still derailing this thread because of it! I'd say that I like BS being ON, since my favourite server (MR server) has it ON and there do not seem to have any problem with it! There are some really skilled player there too, and I don't think putting BS=1 means the death of a server.
<b>Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?</b> I don't really mind swearing, as long as it's not abused. I don't really like it when I play without headphones and those angry little kids fill my house with f-words and such...
<b>Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things?</b> Yes, I really like when it's enforced. I can't really stand racism of any kind, it's just plain stupid.
---
<!--QuoteBegin-"Swiftspear"+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ("Swiftspear")</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Basicly scripting is one of two options. Option A is totally rebuild your config so the game is playable (mousewheel as +jump and/or +attack, fastswitch on, and a tighter weapon selection base) or script to make the default config work to do all those things for you with the same proper set of keys. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Personally I find the game perfectly playable without using the mousewheel for such purposes. In fact, I have mousewheelup bound to Reload and mousewheeldown to Flashlight (from my old habit of palying with the arrow keys). I'm not a fan of bhop, and it doesn't really stop me from killing stuff...
<!--QuoteBegin-"Raz"+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ("Raz")</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I'm not going to dig up the Flayra quote again, but bunnyhopping is part of NS. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Sure, Flayra said he has no intention of removing bhop for the aliens, but that doesn't mean he says "Gogogo everyone, let's all make scripts!!" If the dev team introduced blockscript, it certainly not just to add a new command line, there was a problem somewhere, but instead of imposing script-blocking to everyone, they decided to give people the choice.
Anyways, whatever someone would say about BS=0/1, people would never admit they are wrong about something. We all know there's no real answer about all this since if all depends of the player, so why don't we just say "I'm for BS=0 / 1" and stop there, not attacking attack every player that thinks the opposite of us? Both sides have their reasons, and we all heard them many times already, how about we stop arguing about it in every single thread that contains the word "blockscript"?
I think some people take games a little bit too seriously sometimes...
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The mousewheel is another CHEAP form of accomplishing something you're too lazy to learn without the help of an "aid". Press a jump key (mouse BUTTON or keyboard BUTTON) to accomplish a bhop.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Alright bro, let's see you do it.
The bottom line is that the HL engine wasn't designed with bhop in mind, and so the basic jump key is EXTREMELY hard to use without modification.
You can probably count the number of people who actually bhop WELL with +jump on the fingers of one hand.
So...I ask you this. Why should something the game is DESIGNED AROUND for BALANCE be limited to the 3 people who can actually do it with a single key?
<!--QuoteBegin-Raz+Jun 8 2005, 01:16 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Raz @ Jun 8 2005, 01:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> So...I ask you this. Why should something the game is DESIGNED AROUND for BALANCE be limited to the 3 people who can actually do it with a single key? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> And the corollary of that question, why is something the game is balanced around require the player resort to scripts or a specific bind to perform with any reasonable chance?
obuhNot Quite Smart at NSJoin Date: 2003-03-31Member: 15072Members, Constellation
<!--QuoteBegin-Kwil+Jun 8 2005, 03:16 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Kwil @ Jun 8 2005, 03:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> And the corollary of that question, why is something the game is balanced around require the player resort to scripts or a specific bind to perform with any reasonable chance? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I don't know, but alterations to the jump system, in order to remove the need of scripts or specific binds to bhop, have been suggested numerous times. Something like a queued jump command would do that, making the skill in question more accessible to everyone.
It seems it hasn't been a priority. According to Zunni's dev corners (<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=93978' target='_blank'>X</a>), there will be some movement technique changes for the skulk. Maybe it's something to make bhop more accessible, which would be a good thing.
<!--QuoteBegin-Kwil+Jun 8 2005, 03:16 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Kwil @ Jun 8 2005, 03:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Raz+Jun 8 2005, 01:16 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Raz @ Jun 8 2005, 01:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> So...I ask you this. Why should something the game is DESIGNED AROUND for BALANCE be limited to the 3 people who can actually do it with a single key? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> And the corollary of that question, why is something the game is balanced around require the player resort to scripts or a specific bind to perform with any reasonable chance? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Because Flayra deemed it so.
Bhop is an advanced skill that those new to the game won't learn immediately anyway.
It's something you choose to learn, and getting a proper bind for it is just one aspect of it.
You need someone to teach you bhop, and they'll teach you the proper binds while they're at it, so that's hardly a problem.
The CAL forums are discussing making a 'starter package' with a lot of what the competitive community uses, to quickly get into the game.
The problem isn't with the binds. The problem is with BS 1 blocking them.
<!--QuoteBegin-Raz+Jun 8 2005, 02:24 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Raz @ Jun 8 2005, 02:24 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Because Flayra deemed it so.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Really? That's interesting.. can you show me where?
I know he deemed it's a part of NS. I've never heard anything suggesting him saying "And it's intended you script to do it.." in fact, the inclusion of BS=1 blocking that seems to suggest just the opposite.
<b>What things do you find appealing?</b> A mature community that tries to keep a balanced atmosphere of enjoyability and skill, showing friendly administration and helpful regs.
<b>What things do you hate?</b> Abusive administrators, cocky player base that "knows" exactly how the game should be played, or a bunch of 12 year olds trying to measure their ewangs.
Map vote systems EVERY map.
Too many custom maps int he cycle.
Fun maps of any kind.
Combat levels +10
Stats plugins.
<b>Do you like FF?</b> yes.
<b>Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?</b> No.
<b>Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?</b> On.
<b>Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?</b> Yes, keeps it professional and mature IMHO.
<b>Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things? etc. etc.</b> Yes. Swear filters and actions taken against racial/ethnic/religion are very much approved of.
<b>If you've visited the server before, your feedback is greatly appreciated (both positive or negative). If you've never played there before, it would be nice to know what you guys like about the servers you DO play on.</b>
I was on this server the other day, and commanded a few games. The team listened very well, and we won most of the games. There were no nay sayers and other negative attitudes, overall good games. The skill level wasn't the highest, but I enjoyed playing there. I am a reg on FR31NS and LM, and I find that the atmosphere of who you are playing with is as important as how good they are. the vet server is great for a challenge (and to get slaughtered if you're me), but it's not very enjoyable b/c of the rotten attitudes of some of the players. Although there are a great number of vets whom I know and respect, the few that let their attitudes/insults fly ruin the entire experience for me at times. That's why I believe a healthy gaming atmosphere is important.
I'll definitely be checking out your server more in the future, and I hope to see you play sometime. Also, feel free to hop on FR31NS or LM and I think you'll see the environments that I enjoy, and may see some similarities to yours.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Really? That's interesting.. can you show me where?
I know he deemed it's a part of NS. I've never heard anything suggesting him saying "And it's intended you script to do it.." in fact, the inclusion of BS=1 blocking that seems to suggest just the opposite. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because game developers don't force you into having to use a particular button (mousewheel) to jump.
Scripting to use a key doesn't give you any advantage whatsoever, but for some reason you're against letting people use anything but mousewheel to hop? And why? To stop pistol scripters?
<!--QuoteBegin-Real PUA+Jun 8 2005, 05:41 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Real PUA @ Jun 8 2005, 05:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> bs_1 does not stop the two most common/useful scripts: bhopping and rapid fire pistols <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Hmm?
Bhop: <!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1--> alias hop "+jump;wait;-jump" alias 3jump "hop;hop;hop" <!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2--> Uses +jump, blocked by mp_bs 1.
Pscript: <!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1--> not sure as I don't have one <!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2--> Uses +attack for sure, blocked by mp_bs 1.
So, yeah, mp_bs 1 <b>does block</b> 2 of the most popular scripts. Unless I misunderstood what you mean?
<!--QuoteBegin-RBS+Jun 8 2005, 06:05 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (RBS @ Jun 8 2005, 06:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-TheJim+Jun 8 2005, 10:48 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TheJim @ Jun 8 2005, 10:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> And now i will wait for super flame-age because your not allowed an opinion these days <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Oh, you can have the opinion that scripting is somehow cheating. However, if you're looking at things from a factual standpoint then scripting isn't cheating, it just makes life more convenient. Having said that, of all the people that i've seen in this game that have made such claims, I haven't seen any that knew anything about scripting, how it works, what scripts can accomplish, etc. I fail to see how a player can make statements about something that they know nothing about. That is probably the reason obuh gave you that response.
Anyway, this is kind of off topic and it's going to turn a thread about something loosely related to scripting into a thread entirely about scripting, so i'll shut up now. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> The 2 who have accused me of not knowing what scripting is i have quotes of you 2 to add to my records wooow that makes 150 remarks now <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I know exactly what scripting is. You say its makes "life easier" well making "life easier" by making a script to do 3 jumps at the press of 1 key is borderline on cheating tbh as it is not possible for a human to make 3 jumps by pressing a key once without using something that they cannot legitimately do on their own...
Can you see what we are getting at now?
If not here it is in plain old fanshioned english.
By scripting for e.g. bunnyhopping:
Scripting to be able to bunnyhop as we all know is easiest by writing a script to do 3 jumps when you press a set key. By having a key set to do 3 jumps you are doing something which is impossible for a human to do legitimately. No human can legitimately do 3 jumps at the push of 1 key in this game without a script.
Now that can be classed as cheating in all honesty. Now if you say it can't then your just proving that you are in-capable of playing a game without scripts and that if you were forced to play without your beloved cheap scripts which do certain amount of things at the push of 1 key which no human can do without these scripts, you would play crap....
Sorry for going off topic but the PROZOR scripters don't get that what they do is technically cheating...
Tell me i am wrong and that a human can do what some scripts that u scripters use can do 100% legitimately without the scripts!
At times i do feel like going on a rampage in the scriting section about this. BUT! I aint that stupid to do it as it would most likely get me banned off the forums!
*Waits for more scripters to flame* <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
And now back to topic..
What things do you find appealing? A fun atmosphere
What things do you hate? Abusive admins, know it all players, "I'm Pr0 i cant die" players
Do you like FF? Don't mind
Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)? No
Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF? BS=1 a must have, if you can't do it with out the help of a script don't do it at all
Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)? Yeh keeps it friendly and clean
Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things? etc. etc. Yes Racism should = ban on any server
If you've visited the server before, your feedback is greatly appreciated (both positive or negative). If you've never played there before, it would be nice to know what you guys like about the servers you DO play on. Fun friendly atmosphere, not bitter ness, not many "I'm Pr0 u cant touch me" players, can have a laugh
There's been a fair amount of feedback. Thanks guys. I don't even want to add to the BS sidetalk anymore...should have hid that question better... <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Keep the feedback up if you can, and if anyone has any other aspects that they feel important in the discussion of running and maintaining a successful NS server (both competent skill attraction and FUN/respectful atmousphere), please post a question to the people and let them respond.
So far it seems like most people feel the way I feel about how servers should be run. Just trying to improve on an already seemingly successful NS server we started. I love giving people a place to play and a clean/fun/respectful one at that if I can...
Keep it up guys, and thanks again for your responses!
<!--QuoteBegin-Boris+Jun 9 2005, 12:03 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Boris @ Jun 9 2005, 12:03 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I love giving people a place to play and a clean/fun/respectful one at that if I can... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Same here dude this is what my server is based on <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Comments
The game can't be played the way it is set up by default. NS's default config is equivalent to a CS config with no +moveforward, it is literally layed out that poorly.
Basicly scripting is one of two options. Option A is totally rebuild your config so the game is playable (mousewheel as +jump and/or +attack, fastswitch on, and a tighter weapon selection base) or script to make the default config work to do all those things for you with the same proper set of keys.
A good player's config will never be set up default, so if you intend to inforce vanillaism, just ban any good player and you are set. Scripting doesn't allow pretty much ANYTHING adventagious that cannot be done without scripts. I know, because I've done my recearch, and I still don't script.
Really the main thing BS1 does is chase skilled players away from your server. It's bad publicity and little else.
Do you prefer to attract noobie players with little or no comunity voice or play experiance as your regulars, or do you prefer to attract skilled players who will bring alot more to your table by playing there? because from a PR standpoint that is the choice you are making between BS1 and BS0. Realize that by putting BS1 on you are basicly freezing any scripter's config as soon as they join your server. They can not hotkey join a team, they cannot attack, they cannot jump, they have to rebind everything just to play a game there. Most of them just go somewhere else rather then fool around with it, and certainly don't decide to regular your server after that experiance. A big price to pay considering pretty much every american clanner scripts, and even the one's that don't probably won't regular your server if you chase away all thier buddies.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So...in this line here:
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Scripting doesn't allow pretty much ANYTHING adventagious that cannot be done without scripts. I know, because I've done my recearch, and I still don't script.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You are saying that scripts DO allow some advantages (maybe only 1, but that's still 1 more than should be allowed) and that any of the things scripts do can be done without them? So why do we need scripts again? And why are the SKILLED players all using scripts if they're so good they wouldn't need them?
This is always an arguement that just boils down to what your personal opinion/belief is on whether or not scripts are "cheating and helping beyond what you could humanly do yourself" or they are "perfectly legitimate and all should use them".
I don't understand the arguement about all the buttons and default configs and being blocked by BS=1. I can move, jump, shoot, fastswitch, taunt, jointeams with hotkeys, and all the stuff you mention by pressing keys on my keyboard and using my mouse...
Friendly players.
<b>What things do you hate?</b>
Abusive admins, unfriendly players, being told to switch teams half way through a game and kicked/banned if I don't, being kicked and banned for a minor/no reason, addons that destroy gameplay.
<b>Do you like FF?</b>
Occasionally, but I wouldn't play with it much.
<b>Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?</b>
I like serverside ones like HLGuard, they help.
<b>Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?</b>
Off.
<b>Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?</b>
I don't care, but I do occasionally swear when I screw up really bad, so I hope that's tolerated...
<b>Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things</b>
Yeah, rules. Censors aren't exactly great.
I like servers that stick to either Combat or Classic, most of the time people are joining to play either or, not both. Having both in the cycle tends to empty out servers in no time.
What things do you hate?
I really dislike alot of the new maps, I've been around for a while, and I like to stick to the older maps like Hera, Tanith, Nothing etc. Please no Eon, Metal etc. : )
Do you like FF?
Sometimes I like it, sometimes I don't. Good answer eh? But seriously, it depends on the weapon, I don't mind FF with a LMG or GLs, but with shotguns, it can almost be game breaking, you'd like to try and watch your fire, but you it can be difficult to exercise discretion in aiming with a shotgun, since you're almost limited to shooting very rarely in large groups.
Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?
Blah. No. They stop new players from joining your server, and makes you entirely reliant on your regulars.
Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?
No opinion.
Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?
I don't have a problem with undirected swearing, but it's directed swearing that is a problem. Players should never be maliciously swearing at other players, it easily creates hostility and bad attitudes that ruins the game for the entire team.
Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things?
etc. etc.
I like to think that most players have the ability to regulate themselves, and that an excess of rules will ultimately lead to a detrimental experience, as certain rules tend to reach beyond their intended goals. I would attempt to get as many trustworthy, level headed admins as possible so that you have at least one admin on at all times and let them deal with particular situation as is most <b>reasonable</b>.
What things do you find appealing?
You should have either ALL NS or ALL CO. It's extremely annoying to have fun playing with great players on an ns map, then going to a co map and having the server empty out. A variety of servers are very nice.
What things do you hate?
I really hate mic spam. Teamspeak or Vent is a nice place to have. Admins that are anal about every damn rule, and act arrogant, like I R HAVE LEET POWER BOW BE4 ME OMG LOL really **** me off.
Do you like FF?
I don't care either way. however, ff off is preferred, since no tking is another rule you have to enforce, and ATAC isn't really on NS yet. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?
Client side hack scanners are freaking horrid and buggy, and annoying to run. I enjoy server side hacks scanners, such as SteamBans and HLGUARD. However, NS has the least hackers, ever, you don't really need them.
Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?
MP_BS 0 is nice, but I don't mind 1.
Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?
Well, I hate places where you join the game, and all you hear is ****ING **** **** **** ******* I WILL RAPE YOU IN THE ****.
NSA doesn't really have a rule on this, but it's not bad.
Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things?
etc. etc.
I like servers that have no racism, period, if that is what you're asking. I really don't need to hear a million racial slurs in my game of NS.
This is always an arguement that just boils down to what your personal opinion/belief is on whether or not scripts are "cheating and helping beyond what you could humanly do yourself" or they are "perfectly legitimate and all should use them".
I don't understand the arguement about all the buttons and default configs and being blocked by BS=1. I can move, jump, shoot, fastswitch, taunt, jointeams with hotkeys, and all the stuff you mention by pressing keys on my keyboard and using my mouse...
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not going to dig up the Flayra quote again, but bunnyhopping is part of NS.
Now, people who can bunnyhop have 2 choices. Either they bind jump to mousewheel, which is something that a LOT of people find very annoying to use, or they use a script to make bunnyhopping feasible with a keyboard button.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->They can not hotkey join a team, they cannot attack, they cannot jump, they have to rebind everything just to play a game there.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is entirely true. I have scripts set to F1 and F2 to run a marine and alien config when I join a team. It's not an advantage, it's customizing my game because I like different controls for different teams. This is not possible with BS 1.
I cannot jump becuase I use a 3jump script.
Hell, I rebind my toggleconsole key because of my bad habit of hitting it when going for my gun, so when I join a BS1 I was unable to even fix my config for a long time because it would totally freeze the console key I had rebound.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I can move, jump, shoot, fastswitch, taunt, jointeams with hotkeys, and all the stuff you mention by pressing keys on my keyboard and using my mouse...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Show me a bunnyhop with a default config, without using mwheel.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And why are the SKILLED players all using scripts if they're so good they wouldn't need them?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As a clanner who actually bothered to make switchscripts to play on both, I see myself and other clanners join servers and do extremely well all the time. It doesn't make us better, it makes the game more convienient.
As some added irony, clanners will probably marine better on a bs1 becuase the aliens won't bhop and so will be extremely easy to hit.
A non-hopping alien against a good marine = dead. It's part of the game balance. BS 1 hurts this.
What things do you find appealing?
Combat, /menu command, /buildmenu command, admins that dont abuse their power to a large extent, competant players (little shaky on the NS arms labs sometimes...), frequent playing admins, rules that are enforced.
What things do you hate?
hackers, scripters, limits on jetpacks when I come into the game late, high onos limits, webs, the ineffectiveness of the welder against webs, the fact that the hand grenade is useless in combat... Ok I got off topic.
Do you like FF?
Not really when I am trying to win. When theres only a couple people on the server and you are goofing off with no real intent to win, sure.
Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?
If admins frequent the servers enough, there is no need.
Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?
On
Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?
No
Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things?
Yes
I know this cant just be put on a server by the maker, but I also like teams who talk to each other, and try to coordinate attacks... or at least do what I say when I coordinate an attack <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&::tsa::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tsa.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tsa.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Good registration, decent ping, and no blockscripts. The admins kind of suck, but you can't have everything right?
Oh, wait.
<b>What things do you find appealing?</b>
A good performance server that isn't running 50 instances of HLDS. Good playerbase, active admining by people who aren't idiots. bs 0 is always nice too.
<b>What things do you hate?</b>
Crappy servers that must be getting 30 fps, and have the hit reg to prove it. Idiot admins who ban good players for 'cheating'.
<b>FF?</b>
Love it. I play like it is on regardless, though.
<b>Anti hack stuff?</b>
Smart admins are the only thing that can stop hackers. The CAL plugin is nice to stop people from running low rates, but that is about it.
<b>bs?</b>
I prefer it on, but I'll play with it off. I'll whine like a little girl on vent about having to rebind my keys and aim my pistol differently, though.
<b>swearing?</b>
I don't care, as I try not to read mm1 too much. Though it is nice if they don't enforce it, so I can cuss freely when comming.
<b>Racism?</b>
Once again, hearing someone use racial slurs isn't going to make me cry. I don't care either way, unless they are being annoying and spamming it or using it all the time to try and seem cool and 'edgy'.
good hitreg
less newbs that have no idea at all how to play
no n00b admins banning everyone because they get owned
FF on
CD off
BS off
allow swearing
no racism
*cough*NSA*cough*
I just want to know what the hell I'm playing before I join a server... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
HLSW, FTW! <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Show me a bunnyhop with a default config, without using mwheel.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->And why are the SKILLED players all using scripts if they're so good they wouldn't need them?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As a clanner who actually bothered to make switchscripts to play on both, I see myself and other clanners join servers and do extremely well all the time. It doesn't make us better, it makes the game more convienient.
As some added irony, clanners will probably marine better on a bs1 becuase the aliens won't bhop and so will be extremely easy to hit.
A non-hopping alien against a good marine = dead. It's part of the game balance. BS 1 hurts this. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sorry but on BS=1 servers you do get to see alot of players who can bunnyhop without scripts and do better than a few supposidly "GOOD" clanners who use scripts.....
You just cba to learn how thats all just admit it... players who play on BS=1 and can bunnyhop and do things "ONLY SCRIPTS CAN DO" know that you scripters who need a script to bunnyhop just cba to spend a few days getting used to it without scripts.....
On quite a few BS=1 servers you see bunnyhopping all the time, you just gotta pick ones with players who know how thats all...
Also another reason that you have to script to do your bunnyhop is the fact that you or your team will cry if you didn't and screwed ya bunnyhop up... <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I am fine with using a script to load an alien config or marine config... but using a script your gameplay or to help you bunnyhop is just pure lazyness...
I class people who use scripts to improve their gameplay as not being able to play properly... i don't care what CAL's rules are or whatever.. anything you make like scripts to improve your gameplay just shows it....
IMHO you might aswell be cheating if you use scripts to improve your gameplay....
And now i will wait for super flame-age because your not allowed an opinion these days <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Also another reason that you have to script to do your bunnyhop is the fact that you or your team will cry if you didn't and screwed ya bunnyhop up... <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I am fine with using a script to load an alien config or marine config... but using a script your gameplay or to help you bunnyhop is just pure lazyness...
[...]
IMHO you might aswell be cheating if you use scripts to improve your gameplay....
And now i will wait for super flame-age because your not allowed an opinion these days <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Do you know how bhop works ? Using a +3jump script to bhop is not different from bhoping with the mousewheel. Either you know how to bhop or you don't, only the jump method changes here.
Comparing scripting to cheating is very intelligent and innovative, congratulations.
You are allowed to have an opinion, but if you base it on incorrect information and use it to attack people then it is not welcome.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I class people who use scripts to improve their gameplay as not being able to play properly... i don't care what CAL's rules are or whatever.. anything you make like scripts to improve your gameplay just shows it....<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I class people such as yourself as not being able to keep their mouth shut when they don't know what they're talking about.
Also another reason that you have to script to do your bunnyhop is the fact that you or your team will cry if you didn't and screwed ya bunnyhop up... <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I am fine with using a script to load an alien config or marine config... but using a script your gameplay or to help you bunnyhop is just pure lazyness...
[...]
IMHO you might aswell be cheating if you use scripts to improve your gameplay....
And now i will wait for super flame-age because your not allowed an opinion these days <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Do you know how bhop works ? Using a +3jump script to bhop is not different from bhoping with the mousewheel. Either you know how to bhop or you don't, only the jump method changes here.
Comparing scripting to cheating is very intelligent and innovative, congratulations.
You are allowed to have an opinion, but if you base it on incorrect information and use it to attack people then it is not welcome.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I class people who use scripts to improve their gameplay as not being able to play properly... i don't care what CAL's rules are or whatever.. anything you make like scripts to improve your gameplay just shows it....<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I class people such as yourself as not being able to keep their mouth shut when they don't know what they're talking about. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lol i guess you couldn't think of anything better... how expected.... hehe <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I honestly did expect better but obviously its beyond your capacity <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Take away your +3jump script AND your cheap mousewheel bind, and bunnyhop for me.
If you can't do this easily, what's the arguement here? The mousewheel is another CHEAP form of accomplishing something you're too lazy to learn without the help of an "aid". Press a jump key (mouse BUTTON or keyboard BUTTON) to accomplish a bhop.
I'm sure bunnyhopping is part of the game and Flayra himself does it, but I'd like to see people do all this stuff without assistance. The mousewheel is borderline in my opinion, because of the ability to "hit a key" more than once with a single movement. To me, the only things are click ON, release OFF keys (minus the aiming of the mouse of course).
And as I am not familiar with what exactly is blocked by BS=1 (I don't ever have a problem), you say that there is no way to have seperate binds for marine/alien with having BS=1? Can you "exec marine.cfg" as a single command? or will it stop you? I'd like to be better informed as to how BS=1 blocks legitimate key rebinds. I still want it to block garbage like bhop scripts. But there's gotta be a way to be able to set new binds for marine or alien.
EDIT: I'd like to have BS=0 on my server, but I don't like the idea of people using cheap scripts because they suck at the game. I don't mind scripts that rebind keys for marine/alien, those are just smart and creative. But +3jump scripts...lame
I hated Mr. Server. One of the guys there i absolutely hated because he had a very annoying voice and was a total a-hole.
Pino? I think was one of his names... eradicator i think was his normal one.
lame server... lunixmonster has a lot more teamwork and generally better quality of games. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ya, I agree, Lunixmonster FTW. In addition to good things like blockscripts, minimal cussing, and llama-ing, there is a great community behind the server all of whom are great people to play with and work together, etc. If the teams are uneven, people will switch from the winning team to the losing one to make it more fair and fun, and you don't see that often on any server. You just can't beat Lunixmonster. It's gonna take over the world... Seriously.
~VL
Oh, you can have the opinion that scripting is somehow cheating. However, if you're looking at things from a factual standpoint then scripting isn't cheating, it just makes life more convenient. Having said that, of all the people that i've seen in this game that have made such claims, I haven't seen any that knew anything about scripting, how it works, what scripts can accomplish, etc. I fail to see how a player can make statements about something that they know nothing about. That is probably the reason obuh gave you that response.
Anyway, this is kind of off topic and it's going to turn a thread about something loosely related to scripting into a thread entirely about scripting, so i'll shut up now.
Because I believe so strongly against any form of making the game easier to exploit or being able to improve yourself beyond what is humanly possible, I really like the idea of BS.
I know tons of people use scripts, and as I understand, CAL allows it. I don't know if this will get changed or not on our server. A lot of the guys like the vanilla style, and having that BS = 1 gives them a little peace of mind that some of the really helpful scripts are not being used.
mp_blockscripts;
ON. If you can use talent, don't resort to scripts for your movement/jumping/bhopping. I have nothing against people who can legitimately do the above successfully, but I can't stand people who use a script for it/to help with it (for the record, I can't bunnyhop, and will not use any scripts...)
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin-SpaceJesus+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SpaceJesus)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
1)
*all* repeat *all* scripts which were considered exploitative by the NS dev team (_special, wigglewalks etc) have been blocked. That is to say they DO NOT WORK AT ALL WITH THE CURRENT VERSION OF NS.
2)
Scripts do NOT directly make you play better. They do not:
Aim for you.
Bhop for you.
Let you see through walls.
Kill skulks with 1 bullet.
They are a CUSTOMIZATION which some people use because of PERSONAL PREFERENCE.
There is NO advantage in using a 3jump over mousewheel for bhopping, not a pistol script over a normal mouse button / mousewheel.
The ONLY reason some people play better with scripts was summed up a while ago by Forlorn, I can't find the exact quote but it is because these people have streamlined their controls more, which is a completely different concept.
3)
Pistol scripts (arguably the only 'exploitatious' script) are nowhere near as good as people think.
Let's go with your standard 2shot script, fires 1 shot when you click, 1 shot when you release.
If you click too fast, it only fires 1 shot. That means that you're actually firing as if you do NOT use a script. You actually have to regulate the speed that you click your mouse in order to get the best rate of fire.
Also, it does NOT break the RoF cap on the pistol. Yet another reason why it is not exploitatious.
Now, I will list the number of alternatives you have to using a pistol script which can give the EXACT SAME RESULT (faster pistol shooting) :
Clicking your mouse faster (i know loads of people who do this and shoot faster than I do with a 3shot script)
Using an external key macro
Using your mousewheel
Using more than 1 mouse button bound to fire and bashing all of them at once.
To conclude :
All exploitatious scripts have been removed from the game
Any player who plays better with scripts than without, does so because he has CUSTOMIZED and STREAMLINED his controls - and therefore is more comfortable with them.
To reiterate: THERE ARE NO EXPLOITATIOUS SCRIPTS IN THE GAME.,
Go Figure.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
First thing that catches my attention is the server's ping. Although you can be a useful player even if you have a "high" ping (being Gorge, build stuff as a marine and let the others cover, etc.), it's always better to have the low ping on your side!
Then I check if the players' attitudes are compatible with mine. I can't really answer yes or no to that point just after a single visit, because there might not be any regulars around. Meanwhile I try to see how admins behave : Do they tend to abuse? Do they listen to the players and do they respect the rules themselves?
<b>What things do you hate?</b>
I don't really like most custom maps (some of them are a real pain for my old computer!), but if the server has a fast download host thing, then I may stay and play that map. Also, no stuff like "Headshot/Killing Spree/Double Kill", and I prefer when my screen isn't full of multicolor text, heh. Oh, and try not to put too many plugins, please <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<b>Do you like FF?</b>
yes, I love it! I can't really play without it now, I'm always holding my fire when someone gets in front of me in FF off server..
<b>Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?</b>
I don't think they are well-suited for NS... Besides, admins are more useful!
<b>Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?</b>
Ahh, the point that has been discussed so many times, and yet people are still derailing this thread because of it! I'd say that I like BS being ON, since my favourite server (MR server) has it ON and there do not seem to have any problem with it! There are some really skilled player there too, and I don't think putting BS=1 means the death of a server.
<b>Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?</b>
I don't really mind swearing, as long as it's not abused. I don't really like it when I play without headphones and those angry little kids fill my house with f-words and such...
<b>Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things?</b>
Yes, I really like when it's enforced. I can't really stand racism of any kind, it's just plain stupid.
---
<!--QuoteBegin-"Swiftspear"+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ("Swiftspear")</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Basicly scripting is one of two options. Option A is totally rebuild your config so the game is playable (mousewheel as +jump and/or +attack, fastswitch on, and a tighter weapon selection base) or script to make the default config work to do all those things for you with the same proper set of keys.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Personally I find the game perfectly playable without using the mousewheel for such purposes. In fact, I have mousewheelup bound to Reload and mousewheeldown to Flashlight (from my old habit of palying with the arrow keys). I'm not a fan of bhop, and it doesn't really stop me from killing stuff...
<!--QuoteBegin-"Raz"+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ("Raz")</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
I'm not going to dig up the Flayra quote again, but bunnyhopping is part of NS.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sure, Flayra said he has no intention of removing bhop for the aliens, but that doesn't mean he says "Gogogo everyone, let's all make scripts!!" If the dev team introduced blockscript, it certainly not just to add a new command line, there was a problem somewhere, but instead of imposing script-blocking to everyone, they decided to give people the choice.
Anyways, whatever someone would say about BS=0/1, people would never admit they are wrong about something. We all know there's no real answer about all this since if all depends of the player, so why don't we just say "I'm for BS=0 / 1" and stop there, not attacking attack every player that thinks the opposite of us? Both sides have their reasons, and we all heard them many times already, how about we stop arguing about it in every single thread that contains the word "blockscript"?
I think some people take games a little bit too seriously sometimes...
Alright bro, let's see you do it.
The bottom line is that the HL engine wasn't designed with bhop in mind, and so the basic jump key is EXTREMELY hard to use without modification.
You can probably count the number of people who actually bhop WELL with +jump on the fingers of one hand.
So...I ask you this. Why should something the game is DESIGNED AROUND for BALANCE be limited to the 3 people who can actually do it with a single key?
And the corollary of that question, why is something the game is balanced around require the player resort to scripts or a specific bind to perform with any reasonable chance?
I don't know, but alterations to the jump system, in order to remove the need of scripts or specific binds to bhop, have been suggested numerous times. Something like a queued jump command would do that, making the skill in question more accessible to everyone.
It seems it hasn't been a priority. According to Zunni's dev corners (<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=93978' target='_blank'>X</a>), there will be some movement technique changes for the skulk. Maybe it's something to make bhop more accessible, which would be a good thing.
And the corollary of that question, why is something the game is balanced around require the player resort to scripts or a specific bind to perform with any reasonable chance? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because Flayra deemed it so.
Bhop is an advanced skill that those new to the game won't learn immediately anyway.
It's something you choose to learn, and getting a proper bind for it is just one aspect of it.
You need someone to teach you bhop, and they'll teach you the proper binds while they're at it, so that's hardly a problem.
The CAL forums are discussing making a 'starter package' with a lot of what the competitive community uses, to quickly get into the game.
The problem isn't with the binds. The problem is with BS 1 blocking them.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Really? That's interesting.. can you show me where?
I know he deemed it's a part of NS. I've never heard anything suggesting him saying "And it's intended you script to do it.." in fact, the inclusion of BS=1 blocking that seems to suggest just the opposite.
A mature community that tries to keep a balanced atmosphere of enjoyability and skill, showing friendly administration and helpful regs.
<b>What things do you hate?</b>
Abusive administrators, cocky player base that "knows" exactly how the game should be played, or a bunch of 12 year olds trying to measure their ewangs.
Map vote systems EVERY map.
Too many custom maps int he cycle.
Fun maps of any kind.
Combat levels +10
Stats plugins.
<b>Do you like FF?</b>
yes.
<b>Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?</b>
No.
<b>Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?</b>
On.
<b>Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?</b>
Yes, keeps it professional and mature IMHO.
<b>Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things?
etc. etc.</b>
Yes. Swear filters and actions taken against racial/ethnic/religion are very much approved of.
<b>If you've visited the server before, your feedback is greatly appreciated (both positive or negative). If you've never played there before, it would be nice to know what you guys like about the servers you DO play on.</b>
I was on this server the other day, and commanded a few games. The team listened very well, and we won most of the games. There were no nay sayers and other negative attitudes, overall good games. The skill level wasn't the highest, but I enjoyed playing there. I am a reg on FR31NS and LM, and I find that the atmosphere of who you are playing with is as important as how good they are. the vet server is great for a challenge (and to get slaughtered if you're me), but it's not very enjoyable b/c of the rotten attitudes of some of the players. Although there are a great number of vets whom I know and respect, the few that let their attitudes/insults fly ruin the entire experience for me at times. That's why I believe a healthy gaming atmosphere is important.
I'll definitely be checking out your server more in the future, and I hope to see you play sometime. Also, feel free to hop on FR31NS or LM and I think you'll see the environments that I enjoy, and may see some similarities to yours.
First off, Boris, this is YOUR server so you can do anything you want and don't have to justify yourself to anyone.
That said, I use just a few scripts. A pistol script and medpack/ammo scripts for marines, thats it.
I find bs_1 inconvientient because I have to rebind my slot 1 and slot 2 keys, mouse 1, and my medpack and ammo keys every time I join a bs_1 server.
Now here are a few facts:
The skilled players (in the USA atleast) play on bs_0 servers most of the time.
bs_1 does not stop the two most common/useful scripts: bhopping and rapid fire pistols
So really what is the poing of bs_1? The _special command, which allowed loops, has been disabled.
You dont even know the details of how bs_1 works, as you admitted. You are uninformed about the issue.
Obuh is now my hero.
<3 scripting forevar!
Really? That's interesting.. can you show me where?
I know he deemed it's a part of NS. I've never heard anything suggesting him saying "And it's intended you script to do it.." in fact, the inclusion of BS=1 blocking that seems to suggest just the opposite.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because game developers don't force you into having to use a particular button (mousewheel) to jump.
Scripting to use a key doesn't give you any advantage whatsoever, but for some reason you're against letting people use anything but mousewheel to hop? And why? To stop pistol scripters?
Hmm?
Bhop:
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->
alias hop "+jump;wait;-jump"
alias 3jump "hop;hop;hop"
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
Uses +jump, blocked by mp_bs 1.
Pscript:
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->
not sure as I don't have one
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
Uses +attack for sure, blocked by mp_bs 1.
So, yeah, mp_bs 1 <b>does block</b> 2 of the most popular scripts.
Unless I misunderstood what you mean?
Oh, you can have the opinion that scripting is somehow cheating. However, if you're looking at things from a factual standpoint then scripting isn't cheating, it just makes life more convenient. Having said that, of all the people that i've seen in this game that have made such claims, I haven't seen any that knew anything about scripting, how it works, what scripts can accomplish, etc. I fail to see how a player can make statements about something that they know nothing about. That is probably the reason obuh gave you that response.
Anyway, this is kind of off topic and it's going to turn a thread about something loosely related to scripting into a thread entirely about scripting, so i'll shut up now. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The 2 who have accused me of not knowing what scripting is i have quotes of you 2 to add to my records wooow that makes 150 remarks now <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I know exactly what scripting is. You say its makes "life easier" well making "life easier" by making a script to do 3 jumps at the press of 1 key is borderline on cheating tbh as it is not possible for a human to make 3 jumps by pressing a key once without using something that they cannot legitimately do on their own...
Can you see what we are getting at now?
If not here it is in plain old fanshioned english.
By scripting for e.g. bunnyhopping:
Scripting to be able to bunnyhop as we all know is easiest by writing a script to do 3 jumps when you press a set key. By having a key set to do 3 jumps you are doing something which is impossible for a human to do legitimately. No human can legitimately do 3 jumps at the push of 1 key in this game without a script.
Now that can be classed as cheating in all honesty. Now if you say it can't then your just proving that you are in-capable of playing a game without scripts and that if you were forced to play without your beloved cheap scripts which do certain amount of things at the push of 1 key which no human can do without these scripts, you would play crap....
Sorry for going off topic but the PROZOR scripters don't get that what they do is technically cheating...
Tell me i am wrong and that a human can do what some scripts that u scripters use can do 100% legitimately without the scripts!
At times i do feel like going on a rampage in the scriting section about this. BUT! I aint that stupid to do it as it would most likely get me banned off the forums!
*Waits for more scripters to flame* <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
And now back to topic..
What things do you find appealing?
A fun atmosphere
What things do you hate?
Abusive admins, know it all players, "I'm Pr0 i cant die" players
Do you like FF?
Don't mind
Do you like anti-hack programs like CD (do you think they help)?
No
Do you like Blockscripts ON or OFF?
BS=1 a must have, if you can't do it with out the help of a script don't do it at all
Do you like places with rules that enforce no swearing (keep the swearing to a minimum)?
Yeh keeps it friendly and clean
Do you like servers that enforce NO racism rules/censor things?
etc. etc.
Yes Racism should = ban on any server
If you've visited the server before, your feedback is greatly appreciated (both positive or negative). If you've never played there before, it would be nice to know what you guys like about the servers you DO play on.
Fun friendly atmosphere, not bitter ness, not many "I'm Pr0 u cant touch me" players, can have a laugh
Keep the feedback up if you can, and if anyone has any other aspects that they feel important in the discussion of running and maintaining a successful NS server (both competent skill attraction and FUN/respectful atmousphere), please post a question to the people and let them respond.
So far it seems like most people feel the way I feel about how servers should be run. Just trying to improve on an already seemingly successful NS server we started. I love giving people a place to play and a clean/fun/respectful one at that if I can...
Keep it up guys, and thanks again for your responses!
Same here dude this is what my server is based on <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->