On a whim, I sent a brief description of this bug to www.bluesnews.com with a copy to this link. Check the front page for 7/25/04. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
If you wanted publicity, theef, you got it. Welcome to the Blue's News front page.
EDIT: I believe at one time Flayra clearly stated that the bug itself was an issue with the Half-Life engine, and not NS. Everyone proceeded to ignore him (including YOU) and perform this study. It has proven that Flayra was indeed right and there is nothing we can do. I just hope you are happy with that decision now that we have some concrete proof to support it.
Heh, we're in it big time now, at least we found it!! I'd hope that valve fix it, it could create a problem now more people know about it.
Its good news for the release of B5 anyway.
PS, codeman, love the sig <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Bit of a nitpick but if this is true: <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> [04:37] <@TyrNemesis^[GP]> try playing with sv_unlag 0 [04:37] <@TyrNemesis^[GP]> EVERYONE will be bugged [04:37] <@TyrNemesis^[GP]> that should be mentioned [04:37] <@TyrNemesis^[GP]> sv_unlag 0 makes ALL players behave this way <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> then that would imply that what's happening to the last player is the "normal" behavior when antilag is disabled. Although in all probability Valve has ignored the code regarding the behavior when sv_unlag is 0, so the behavior is probably quite buggy and crappy. Also I think that when sv_unlag is 0, clients still behave as if it were 1 unless they specifically disabled it on their end as well (cl_lw 0, cl_lb 0, etc.).
I know a server that uses a slot above the max (slot 17 on a 16-player server) to handle reserved slots and reserved slot autokicks. I'm positive that slot 17 is the problem slot on this server, even though the server advertises itself as a 16-player server in the server browser.
Just seeing so many exterminators and coders monitering this thread... I just thought that they may want to know about it for future reference, or something, even though this seems to be Valve's job now.
<!--QuoteBegin-semi-psychotic+Jul 25 2004, 03:19 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (semi-psychotic @ Jul 25 2004, 03:19 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I know a server that uses a slot above the max (slot 17 on a 16-player server) to handle reserved slots and reserved slot autokicks. I'm positive that slot 17 is the problem slot on this server, even though the server advertises itself as a 16-player server in the server browser.
Just seeing so many exterminators and coders monitering this thread... I just thought that they may want to know about it for future reference, or something, even though this seems to be Valve's job now. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yes, in that setup the 17th slot is bugged, and a player who joins to kick the slot 16 player will get the bugged slot. And afaik none of the currently available workarounds are compatible with a kicking reserve slot system
Kind of makes you feel that all those Admins playing in their Reserved slots at the end of their servers aren't really as good as they think they are, huh? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-semi-psychotic+Jul 25 2004, 03:19 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (semi-psychotic @ Jul 25 2004, 03:19 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I know a server that uses a slot above the max (slot 17 on a 16-player server) to handle reserved slots and reserved slot autokicks. I'm positive that slot 17 is the problem slot on this server, even though the server advertises itself as a 16-player server in the server browser.
Just seeing so many exterminators and coders monitering this thread... I just thought that they may want to know about it for future reference, or something, even though this seems to be Valve's job now. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Hehe, I think I might know what server you're talking about! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> How ya doing man?
Anyhow, congratulations all who helped bring this bug to the surface after so many years of tormenting us, hidden. Thank you, and nice job. It doesn't surprise me that the NS community figured it out!
<!--QuoteBegin-curlydave+Jul 25 2004, 09:52 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (curlydave @ Jul 25 2004, 09:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-semi-psychotic+Jul 25 2004, 03:19 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (semi-psychotic @ Jul 25 2004, 03:19 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I know a server that uses a slot above the max (slot 17 on a 16-player server) to handle reserved slots and reserved slot autokicks. I'm positive that slot 17 is the problem slot on this server, even though the server advertises itself as a 16-player server in the server browser.
Just seeing so many exterminators and coders monitering this thread... I just thought that they may want to know about it for future reference, or something, even though this seems to be Valve's job now. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Hehe, I think I might know what server you're talking about! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> How ya doing man?
Anyhow, congratulations all who helped bring this bug to the surface after so many years of tormenting us, hidden. Thank you, and nice job. It doesn't surprise me that the NS community figured it out! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Same here. I remember that time I had the bugged slot. Semi was bringing this bug up (almost shouting at us) and no one would believe him <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I (like several others I'm sure) am surprised this wasn't noticed before. Good job though!
actually this "bug" you've found is a common glitch in cs. A while back there was an article on gotfrag which fixed this. Explained some of the serverside commands/client commands that could make hitboxes more accurate threw rates, cl_cmdrate, cl_updaterate, ex_interp ect ect..
<!--QuoteBegin-FireStorm+Jul 25 2004, 04:32 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (FireStorm @ Jul 25 2004, 04:32 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> hey, if you place a semicoon after a for like this:
for(int i=0; i <= max; ++i); { // code }
your compilator should generate a WARNING.......... and you shouldn't leave any warnings as usual <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Damn you! <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo--> I just copied the other guys code as an example, didn't realise til later he was giving an example of simple errors in code. D'oh. Still, the theory is still there, bad code or not.
<!--QuoteBegin-Duff-Man+Jul 25 2004, 05:39 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Duff-Man @ Jul 25 2004, 05:39 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Just wanted to let everyone know that Elven's smarts do not run in the clan. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Like anyone thinks otherwise, duff.
I'm surprised no one has mentioned this, but there's been <a href='http://www.modns.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=660' target='_blank'>a plugin that fixes the PSHB</a> out for a couple of weeks now. It's sort of a dirty workaround to prevent anyone from filling the last slot, but that's definitely better than nothing until Valve fixes it for real. Have you guys done any testing with this plugin implemented?
Ok. Posted on amped: <a href='http://ampednews.com/?page=forums&tid=4042#54715' target='_blank'>http://ampednews.com/?page=forums&tid=4042#54715</a> on CS.net's forums: <a href='http://www.forumplanet.com/counterstrike/topic.asp?fid=4954&tid=1430140' target='_blank'>http://www.forumplanet.com/counterstrike/t...954&tid=1430140</a>
and emailed phl.com. Hopefully this will get things going <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Comments
On a whim, I sent a brief description of this bug to www.bluesnews.com with a copy to this link. Check the front page for 7/25/04. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
-Brackhar
EDIT: I believe at one time Flayra clearly stated that the bug itself was an issue with the Half-Life engine, and not NS. Everyone proceeded to ignore him (including YOU) and perform this study. It has proven that Flayra was indeed right and there is nothing we can do. I just hope you are happy with that decision now that we have some concrete proof to support it.
I'd hope that valve fix it, it could create a problem now more people know about it.
Its good news for the release of B5 anyway.
PS, codeman, love the sig <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Nicely done post btw <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->.
'when its fixed'
hopefully the bug isn't carried over to hl2, some reused code.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
[04:37] <@TyrNemesis^[GP]> try playing with sv_unlag 0
[04:37] <@TyrNemesis^[GP]> EVERYONE will be bugged
[04:37] <@TyrNemesis^[GP]> that should be mentioned
[04:37] <@TyrNemesis^[GP]> sv_unlag 0 makes ALL players behave this way
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
then that would imply that what's happening to the last player is the "normal" behavior when antilag is disabled. Although in all probability Valve has ignored the code regarding the behavior when sv_unlag is 0, so the behavior is probably quite buggy and crappy. Also I think that when sv_unlag is 0, clients still behave as if it were 1 unless they specifically disabled it on their end as well (cl_lw 0, cl_lb 0, etc.).
Just seeing so many exterminators and coders monitering this thread... I just thought that they may want to know about it for future reference, or something, even though this seems to be Valve's job now.
Knifing fades for example
This clearly shows that the Natural Selection community is Half-Life's best mod community. You guys (and girls?) that participated: good work!
Just seeing so many exterminators and coders monitering this thread... I just thought that they may want to know about it for future reference, or something, even though this seems to be Valve's job now. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, in that setup the 17th slot is bugged, and a player who joins to kick the slot 16 player will get the bugged slot. And afaik none of the currently available workarounds are compatible with a kicking reserve slot system
Just seeing so many exterminators and coders monitering this thread... I just thought that they may want to know about it for future reference, or something, even though this seems to be Valve's job now. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hehe, I think I might know what server you're talking about! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> How ya doing man?
Anyhow, congratulations all who helped bring this bug to the surface after so many years of tormenting us, hidden. Thank you, and nice job. It doesn't surprise me that the NS community figured it out!
Just seeing so many exterminators and coders monitering this thread... I just thought that they may want to know about it for future reference, or something, even though this seems to be Valve's job now. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hehe, I think I might know what server you're talking about! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> How ya doing man?
Anyhow, congratulations all who helped bring this bug to the surface after so many years of tormenting us, hidden. Thank you, and nice job. It doesn't surprise me that the NS community figured it out! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Same here. I remember that time I had the bugged slot. Semi was bringing this bug up (almost shouting at us) and no one would believe him <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I (like several others I'm sure) am surprised this wasn't noticed before. Good job though!
-Hitman[On|E]
R a v e N`
for(int i=0; i <= max; ++i);
{
// code
}
your compilator should generate a WARNING.......... and you shouldn't leave any warnings as usual <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Damn you! <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I just copied the other guys code as an example, didn't realise til later he was giving an example of simple errors in code. D'oh.
Still, the theory is still there, bad code or not.
So this only works on 5v5 games? All along I should have shot in FRONT of the alien doh...
Nem PLZ SPARE THIS PIC! ITS ONLY 10kbs!
Like anyone thinks otherwise, duff.
Posted on amped: <a href='http://ampednews.com/?page=forums&tid=4042#54715' target='_blank'>http://ampednews.com/?page=forums&tid=4042#54715</a>
on
CS.net's forums: <a href='http://www.forumplanet.com/counterstrike/topic.asp?fid=4954&tid=1430140' target='_blank'>http://www.forumplanet.com/counterstrike/t...954&tid=1430140</a>
and emailed phl.com. Hopefully this will get things going <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
\o/