Yes the bad thing is the new textures, that tell the compiler/game how to do some of the (I call it so) special features are quite buggy. first realized it with dod. How I came over this: I simply used the original textures from hl. buuuuh! I know <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> but its quite effective. off course I have to copy it for the new maps wad files but this is done in no time <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Sorry, I don't understand why you are using the HL textures instead of yours? And how do you get your own textures into the map then? replace the original textures in half-life.wad?
<!--QuoteBegin--anty+May 23 2003, 02:41 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (anty @ May 23 2003, 02:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Anyone know why this compile cuts the leaves in this way, so I get these lines: <image> I've tried to place a skip and hint brush before it, to force the compiler to make a leaf-cut as <b>I</b> want it, but nothing happens. still the same. I could save a lot of polys by reducing this faces. These brushes are 192 x 208. so also if the compiler cuts the face into 224x224 (224 is the max. leaf width I think) it wouldn't fit into the screenshot. so what can I do?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> <a href='http://maps.redeemedsoft.com/portfolio/tut02.html' target='_blank'>This</a> sort of explains what the compiler is doing but it says that any surface under 240 units counts as one face so I'm not sure.
no Im NOT using the hl textures like you understand it.
because there where some problems with the new textures I used following hl textures instead: - aaa (for triggers, still help to find out which solid is an trigger and which is not) - origin (rotating objects) - white - black (because the translucent texture from ns doesnt fit all purposes and causes errors when used wrong) - sky (there is no for ns so I used this) - clip (!)
btw I dont think that the hint brush does any good job. In my opinion its much more efficient to map as much architecture as possible as worldarchitecture not as entities. only entities in my style: doors, player starts, moveable objects and a few (!) gimicks. so I dont need the hint brush <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> and if you reached the 4mb texture limit you have done something wrong <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> exspecially the ns maps dont need too much textures to look cool an fewer textures also mean better overall style.
I also use these textures, as every mapper (I think). I'm currently working at a new room. But because of my texture limit I can't give you every detail I want <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> I've a question to other NS mappers: Is it allowed to use custom models? Because I want to use a few models to give it the correct feeling <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
And another update: Here is the original room: <img src='http://www.hakke.at/anty/forum/ns_wip14.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'> If you push the different keyboards, something will happen. On the left side 2 flatscreens are comming up. at the right side 2 podests are comming up and 2 "beds" are comming down form the wall. I've tried to animate it nice <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> <img src='http://www.hakke.at/anty/forum/ns_wip15.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
If it's allowed the alien in the cage will not be removed, but I will add a new model instead of it. But I don't want to say which one, so you don't get the wrong idea of it *g*
Edit: I just noticed, that u can't see the roof and the podest where the "beds" are placed on <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> <img src='http://www.hakke.at/anty/forum/ns_wip16.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
it is DEFINETELLY allowed to use custom models (I think niahahahahahahaha) should work with custom models, otherwise I would wish natural selection to hell! I only use texture sets that are shipped with the mods to keep the style of them. I think the hl textures are sowhat low resolution... I wont use them because ns has enough textures. except of the special feature textures like stated above. the problem is: if you only use few textures from other mods it might look odd ingame. when using custom textures allways use a complete set. texture limit: I admit that 2mb is a joke for serious mapping. you surely use zoners with its 4mb limit. although Im the limitsurfer (dod map: 3.97mb, ns map: 3.95mb) I think this is enough to create a proper map. try to think in a smaller "texture scale" and use some textures more often to create the same effekt. you wont need 30 trim textures if 3 of them and sonme of the fullscale textures placed well would also do the job.
A long time ago, I was full of plans, what custom models I will add. Now I've finished my map, and I couldn't add all the models I was going to create because of all this damn limits.
But here we go: <a href='http://nsworld.ns-central.co.uk/Map.php?UniqueID=310' target='_blank'>http://nsworld.ns-central.co.uk/Map.php?UniqueID=310</a>
Some screens of the final version.
Together with "SmokeDef", I created the name <b>ns_SciFailure</b>. It's name is based on my backround story included in the zip.
Here we go: <a href='http://www.seads.eclipse.co.uk/ns/ns_scifailure.zip' target='_blank'>- download -</a>
i can remember this map <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> i like the pink hallways VEWY much <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> but now.. i dont like the texturing all over the map .. its bad so is the detail.. its VEWY poor
but still ,gj on completing A map <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
you are right, the details are not the best. thats because of the damn limits, I want to know how other mappers add so much details in it, I've the latest compile tools, and still have these errors.
To the textures: I like most of the parts in my map, I've tried to make everything looking good and I've worked on giving every room a unique look. I could have added more textures, maybe I will on v2.0, but again: The Mapping Guideline says I shouldn't have more than ~4MB maximum texture memory usage...
<!--QuoteBegin--Lt.Gravity+May 28 2003, 11:28 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Lt.Gravity @ May 28 2003, 11:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> btw I dont think that the hint brush does any good job. In my opinion its much more efficient to map as much architecture as possible as worldarchitecture not as entities. only entities in my style: doors, player starts, moveable objects and a few (!) gimicks. so I dont need the hint brush <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Could you (and/or anty) explain in your own words what the job of the hint brush should be? After reading this thread I don't think people understand how it operates, and I want to know what the possible misconceptions are.
hint brush should be used to reduce r_speeds by manually setting your own leafs. I used it in ns_scifailure to reduce the r_speeds in the purple area. You place on a brush the SKIP texture, then you cover one side with the NULL texture. this side will force the compiler to cut every leaf. I'll post a screenshot here in some minutes to show you how I used it, and how you can see the effect ingame <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Here we go (sorry for you modemusers <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> ): <img src='http://ahp.clan-server.at/galerie/maps/leaf_lowres.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'> So we see the selected brush in the hammer editor. (right: selected, left: deselected for better view) It's important that you place it this way, because you have to touch the corner to take best effect. You <b>can't</b> see this in the 3D window, only in 2D on the right side.
The pictures at the bottom show the effect after the compile ingame: you see, if you stand there, where you can't see anything around the corner, nothing is rendered. But if you wouldn't have set this leaf, you would see the same, as I have shown on the right picture: you can't see around the corner, but it is rendered. I didn't recompile my whole map, due to it would take ~2.5 hours, but I went two steps forward to show you the effekt. You can imagin seeing the same effekt standing on the left position...
The <span style='color:red'><b>red</b></span> lines show you my leafcut ingame. as you might see, the hint textured polygones have been ignored <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Hope you could understand what I was explaining, because english isn't my native language <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--anty+Oct 10 2003, 05:16 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (anty @ Oct 10 2003, 05:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Hope you could understand what I was explaining, because english isn't my native language <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yep, I understood it well, but I have another question...
I noticed that the diagonal face on your hint brush is using the SKIP texture instead of the HINT texture. You know the difference between HINT and SKIP, right?
SKIP is ignored by the compiler, and is purple with a yellow 'S'.
HINT is used to make leaf cuts, and is blue with a white 'H'.
When making hint brushes, use HINT for places you want cut and SKIP for places you don't want cut.
huh, you are right, but as you can see, it works... but why?
So I'm using the wrong texture. I should replace the SKIP with the HINT texture.
But two questions: 1. why does the skip texture do the work? I've used the wrong texture about 3 times, and every single case does the work for me... 2. whats the difference between NULL and SKIP?
I could find a description in the instructions.html: the NULL texture is removed, but still blocks vis. I can <i>guess</i> that SKIP doesn't block vis, but don't know if this is right. For everyone who don't want to look at there own, this is from the instructions.html:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The NULL texture is one that is removed from the map during compilation, so that it won't exist when you play the compiled .bsp file in Half-Life. You should be able to apply it to any entity or world brush within your map.
The main point of this texture is to use it on faces that the player would under normal circumstances never see, so that those faces will not add to the w_poly count and lower the fps (frames per second) rate. (That doesn't mean you can't use it for whatever you want, although.) You can also use the SKY texture for this exact same purpose, although there have been recent debates about whether this is actually beneficial. While it does lower the w_poly count, it apparently also lowers the fps rate, thereby defeating its original purpose.
Note, that:
- NULL textured brushes still block VIS. - If you have a NULL surface on a HULL brush (ie. a brush acting as the outer layer of your map, sealing it from the void), then in Half-Life the absence of any textured polygon(s) being rendered in that space will cause a Hall of Mirrors effect. This is intended behaviour, and should be accounted for by the mapper. - NULL textures will still block the player in Half-Life (and anything else that should collide with a wall), even though they are not rendered. This is to preserve the collision detection of the entire brush. If you want to disable this, then just make the brush a func_illusionary. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
BTW: I edited the post above, I've used to say HINT instead of NULL...
so this would be the right picture: <img src='http://ahp.clan-server.at/galerie/maps/leaf_lowres_correction.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
And I've controlled my other hint-brushes. I've not used the SKIP texture, just in this case, accidently. But why does it work? <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
What I've just noticed by reading the quote above: my NULL texture <b>doesn't</b> block the player... Think thats the difference between NULL and SKIP... or: should be <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
I'm using your compiler tools, XP-Cagey <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
Another editing: So <b>this</b> would be the hint-brush as you would build it, right XP-Cagey? <img src='http://ahp.clan-server.at/galerie/maps/leaf_lowres_correction_correction.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
<!--QuoteBegin--anty+Oct 10 2003, 06:23 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (anty @ Oct 10 2003, 06:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> So <b>this</b> would be the hint-brush as you would build it, right XP-Cagey? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yep, the 2nd picture is the way it's meant to be used <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--anty+Oct 11 2003, 01:56 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (anty @ Oct 11 2003, 01:56 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->are you shure that SKIP clips the player?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I am sure that SKIP does <b>not</b> clip the player. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
NULL won't block the player when used with a HINT brush because the brush itself is turned nonsolid, but like all uses of NULL, it still makes a low priority leaf cut before the NULL face is removed. SKIP doesn't make a leaf cut at all (it is skipped by the tree building algorithm in HLBSP, which is why it's named SKIP).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->[...] but like all uses of NULL, it still makes a low priority leaf cut before the NULL face is removed.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That would be an answer for my question: The NULL Texture on the top and bottom are creating these leaf-cuts, not the skip texture... It's only luck, that it has not been overitten. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
after month of no new pics or comments, I have to say one thing: I've lost the source of my map, so beta 3 is the latest (final) version.
Here is the downloadlink: <a href='http://www.anty.at/downloads/maps/natural-selection/ns_scifailure_b3.zip' target='_blank'>http://www.anty.at/downloads/maps/natural-...ifailure_b3.zip</a>
Comments
How I came over this: I simply used the original textures from hl. buuuuh! I know <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
but its quite effective. off course I have to copy it for the new maps wad files but this is done in no time <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
And how do you get your own textures into the map then? replace the original textures in half-life.wad?
<image>
I've tried to place a skip and hint brush before it, to force the compiler to make a leaf-cut as <b>I</b> want it, but nothing happens. still the same. I could save a lot of polys by reducing this faces. These brushes are 192 x 208. so also if the compiler cuts the face into 224x224 (224 is the max. leaf width I think) it wouldn't fit into the screenshot. so what can I do?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<a href='http://maps.redeemedsoft.com/portfolio/tut02.html' target='_blank'>This</a> sort of explains what the compiler is doing but it says that any surface under 240 units counts as one face so I'm not sure.
because there where some problems with the new textures I used following hl textures instead:
- aaa (for triggers, still help to find out which solid is an trigger and which is not)
- origin (rotating objects)
- white
- black (because the translucent texture from ns doesnt fit all purposes and causes errors when used wrong)
- sky (there is no for ns so I used this)
- clip (!)
btw I dont think that the hint brush does any good job. In my opinion its much more efficient to map as much architecture as possible as worldarchitecture not as entities.
only entities in my style: doors, player starts, moveable objects and a few (!) gimicks.
so I dont need the hint brush <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
and if you reached the 4mb texture limit you have done something wrong <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> exspecially the ns maps dont need too much textures to look cool an fewer textures also mean better overall style.
I'm currently working at a new room. But because of my texture limit I can't give you every detail I want <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I've a question to other NS mappers: Is it allowed to use custom models? Because I want to use a few models to give it the correct feeling <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
And another update:
Here is the original room:
<img src='http://www.hakke.at/anty/forum/ns_wip14.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
If you push the different keyboards, something will happen. On the left side 2 flatscreens are comming up. at the right side 2 podests are comming up and 2 "beds" are comming down form the wall. I've tried to animate it nice <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<img src='http://www.hakke.at/anty/forum/ns_wip15.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
If it's allowed the alien in the cage will not be removed, but I will add a new model instead of it. But I don't want to say which one, so you don't get the wrong idea of it *g*
Edit: I just noticed, that u can't see the roof and the podest where the "beds" are placed on <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<img src='http://www.hakke.at/anty/forum/ns_wip16.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
should work with custom models, otherwise I would wish natural selection to hell!
I only use texture sets that are shipped with the mods to keep the style of them. I think the hl textures are sowhat low resolution... I wont use them because ns has enough textures. except of the special feature textures like stated above.
the problem is: if you only use few textures from other mods it might look odd ingame. when using custom textures allways use a complete set.
texture limit: I admit that 2mb is a joke for serious mapping. you surely use zoners with its 4mb limit. although Im the limitsurfer (dod map: 3.97mb, ns map: 3.95mb) I think this is enough to create a proper map. try to think in a smaller "texture scale" and use some textures more often to create the same effekt. you wont need 30 trim textures if 3 of them and sonme of the fullscale textures placed well would also do the job.
But here we go: <a href='http://nsworld.ns-central.co.uk/Map.php?UniqueID=310' target='_blank'>http://nsworld.ns-central.co.uk/Map.php?UniqueID=310</a>
Some screens of the final version.
Together with "SmokeDef", I created the name <b>ns_SciFailure</b>. It's name is based on my backround story included in the zip.
Here we go:
<a href='http://www.seads.eclipse.co.uk/ns/ns_scifailure.zip' target='_blank'>- download -</a>
i can remember this map <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> i like the pink hallways VEWY much <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
but now.. i dont like the texturing all over the map .. its bad
so is the detail.. its VEWY poor
but still ,gj on completing A map <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
To the textures: I like most of the parts in my map, I've tried to make everything looking good and I've worked on giving every room a unique look. I could have added more textures, maybe I will on v2.0, but again: The Mapping Guideline says I shouldn't have more than ~4MB maximum texture memory usage...
only entities in my style: doors, player starts, moveable objects and a few (!) gimicks.
so I dont need the hint brush <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Could you (and/or anty) explain in your own words what the job of the hint brush should be? After reading this thread I don't think people understand how it operates, and I want to know what the possible misconceptions are.
You place on a brush the SKIP texture, then you cover one side with the NULL texture. this side will force the compiler to cut every leaf. I'll post a screenshot here in some minutes to show you how I used it, and how you can see the effect ingame <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Here we go (sorry for you modemusers <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> ):
<img src='http://ahp.clan-server.at/galerie/maps/leaf_lowres.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
So we see the selected brush in the hammer editor. (right: selected, left: deselected for better view)
It's important that you place it this way, because you have to touch the corner to take best effect. You <b>can't</b> see this in the 3D window, only in 2D on the right side.
The pictures at the bottom show the effect after the compile ingame: you see, if you stand there, where you can't see anything around the corner, nothing is rendered.
But if you wouldn't have set this leaf, you would see the same, as I have shown on the right picture: you can't see around the corner, but it is rendered.
I didn't recompile my whole map, due to it would take ~2.5 hours, but I went two steps forward to show you the effekt.
You can imagin seeing the same effekt standing on the left position...
The <span style='color:red'><b>red</b></span> lines show you my leafcut ingame. as you might see, the hint textured polygones have been ignored <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Hope you could understand what I was explaining, because english isn't my native language <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Yep, I understood it well, but I have another question...
I noticed that the diagonal face on your hint brush is using the SKIP texture instead of the HINT texture. You know the difference between HINT and SKIP, right?
SKIP is ignored by the compiler, and is purple with a yellow 'S'.
HINT is used to make leaf cuts, and is blue with a white 'H'.
When making hint brushes, use HINT for places you want cut and SKIP for places you don't want cut.
So I'm using the wrong texture. I should replace the SKIP with the HINT texture.
But two questions:
1. why does the skip texture do the work? I've used the wrong texture about 3 times, and every single case does the work for me...
2. whats the difference between NULL and SKIP?
I could find a description in the instructions.html: the NULL texture is removed, but still blocks vis.
I can <i>guess</i> that SKIP doesn't block vis, but don't know if this is right. For everyone who don't want to look at there own, this is from the instructions.html:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The NULL texture is one that is removed from the map during compilation, so that it won't exist when you play the compiled .bsp file in Half-Life. You should be able to apply it to any entity or world brush within your map.
The main point of this texture is to use it on faces that the player would under normal circumstances never see, so that those faces will not add to the w_poly count and lower the fps (frames per second) rate. (That doesn't mean you can't use it for whatever you want, although.) You can also use the SKY texture for this exact same purpose, although there have been recent debates about whether this is actually beneficial. While it does lower the w_poly count, it apparently also lowers the fps rate, thereby defeating its original purpose.
Note, that:
- NULL textured brushes still block VIS.
- If you have a NULL surface on a HULL brush (ie. a brush acting as the outer layer of your map, sealing it from the void), then in Half-Life the absence of any textured polygon(s) being rendered in that space will cause a Hall of Mirrors effect. This is intended behaviour, and should be accounted for by the mapper.
- NULL textures will still block the player in Half-Life (and anything else that should collide with a wall), even though they are not rendered. This is to preserve the collision detection of the entire brush. If you want to disable this, then just make the brush a func_illusionary. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
BTW: I edited the post above, I've used to say HINT instead of NULL...
<img src='http://ahp.clan-server.at/galerie/maps/leaf_lowres_correction.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
And I've controlled my other hint-brushes. I've not used the SKIP texture, just in this case, accidently.
But why does it work? <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
What I've just noticed by reading the quote above: my NULL texture <b>doesn't</b> block the player...
Think thats the difference between NULL and SKIP... or: should be <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
I'm using your compiler tools, XP-Cagey <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
Another editing:
So <b>this</b> would be the hint-brush as you would build it, right XP-Cagey?
<img src='http://ahp.clan-server.at/galerie/maps/leaf_lowres_correction_correction.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image'>
Yep, the 2nd picture is the way it's meant to be used <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
/me changes to skip texture <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Thanks
-Tom
I am sure that SKIP does <b>not</b> clip the player. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
NULL won't block the player when used with a HINT brush because the brush itself is turned nonsolid, but like all uses of NULL, it still makes a low priority leaf cut before the NULL face is removed. SKIP doesn't make a leaf cut at all (it is skipped by the tree building algorithm in HLBSP, which is why it's named SKIP).
That would be an answer for my question: The NULL Texture on the top and bottom are creating these leaf-cuts, not the skip texture... It's only luck, that it has not been overitten. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I've lost the source of my map, so beta 3 is the latest (final) version.
Here is the downloadlink: <a href='http://www.anty.at/downloads/maps/natural-selection/ns_scifailure_b3.zip' target='_blank'>http://www.anty.at/downloads/maps/natural-...ifailure_b3.zip</a>