<!--QuoteBegin--evilops+Apr 11 2003, 01:46 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (evilops @ Apr 11 2003, 01:46 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->... I'm operating on the assumption that a couple of OCs, a heal spraying gorge and some skulks can repel 4 clanners, without upgrades, unsupported by med pack drops.
I think if the marines want to make any sustained deep penetration action they will need med pack support so they will have to research med packs before they head out. In the time it takes for the marines to build all the necessary buildings to research med packs and finish researching it, maybe the aliens new res system will allows them to put up a formidable enough of a hive defence that it wouldn't be worthwhile for the marines to hit the hive early. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Small problem. If the aliens had enough time to put up a formidable hive defense, they'd have enough time to secure few key locations around the map instead. Obviously that would cripple the marines ability to expand, to get res, to upgrade etc.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> ...
How is this a problem?
I'm just make projections as to how this med pack upgrade may affect the opening game strat. I think we all agree this upgrade will be available from the start. From that we assume if has something to do with stopping/delaying early game rushes made more effective by health spamage.
If by the time the marine have the med pack ability and the aliens had chosen to expand instead of defend their main hive the option for the marines to rush the unprotected main hive becomes open.
With that comes the opportunity to harass the hive, draw skulks to defend, and if they fail allow the marines to potentially spawn camp them. If you only pub you may not see this often but it happens in clan matches quite a bit especially when the team has some sharp shooters. (Which most clans do)
See if the aliens chose to expand and secure important points on the map instead of defend hive that would make any marine rush more costly. If the marines fail to pin the aliens to the hive and hunt down the remaining gorge, then every failed hive rush means the aliens are that much closer to another hive.
Currently in v1.04 the aliens become pinned in a way that requires time, res, and the whole team to repel. The gorge has to spend the first few minutes spending the precious little res that is trickling in to build the DCs and OCs to repel an early marine rush. After that the gorge still has to collect for an RT. Even if the marines fail in pinning the aliens to the hive the time and res it cost for the aliens to repel the attack has crippled their ability to get a second hive and the marines are that much closer to JPs/HMG.
Any way you slice it, I think the most effective way to prevent early rushes is to make it not worthwhile to do it. Either it is physically useless (no upgrade marines vs 2-3 OCs and skulks) or economically wasteful (IPs + Armoury + Med Pack Upgrade + Med Spammage = Slowed Expansion as Marines have to wait for more res to expand) I think some of the changes we see are going to play with the "opening game timing" to see what can be done about the early game rushes.
Some have said that they can't see the resource or time cost of the med pack upgrade will be a factor to the marine opening game, I think it will.
It may be less of a factor in pub play but in clan matches I think it will be felt.
Of course this is all speculation... <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Comments
I think if the marines want to make any sustained deep penetration action they will need med pack support so they will have to research med packs before they head out. In the time it takes for the marines to build all the necessary buildings to research med packs and finish researching it, maybe the aliens new res system will allows them to put up a formidable enough of a hive defence that it wouldn't be worthwhile for the marines to hit the hive early. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Small problem. If the aliens had enough time to put up a formidable hive defense, they'd have enough time to secure few key locations around the map instead. Obviously that would cripple the marines ability to expand, to get res, to upgrade etc.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
...
How is this a problem?
I'm just make projections as to how this med pack upgrade may affect the opening game strat. I think we all agree this upgrade will be available from the start. From that we assume if has something to do with stopping/delaying early game rushes made more effective by health spamage.
If by the time the marine have the med pack ability and the aliens had chosen to expand instead of defend their main hive the option for the marines to rush the unprotected main hive becomes open.
With that comes the opportunity to harass the hive, draw skulks to defend, and if they fail allow the marines to potentially spawn camp them. If you only pub you may not see this often but it happens in clan matches quite a bit especially when the team has some sharp shooters. (Which most clans do)
See if the aliens chose to expand and secure important points on the map instead of defend hive that would make any marine rush more costly. If the marines fail to pin the aliens to the hive and hunt down the remaining gorge, then every failed hive rush means the aliens are that much closer to another hive.
Currently in v1.04 the aliens become pinned in a way that requires time, res, and the whole team to repel. The gorge has to spend the first few minutes spending the precious little res that is trickling in to build the DCs and OCs to repel an early marine rush. After that the gorge still has to collect for an RT. Even if the marines fail in pinning the aliens to the hive the time and res it cost for the aliens to repel the attack has crippled their ability to get a second hive and the marines are that much closer to JPs/HMG.
Any way you slice it, I think the most effective way to prevent early rushes is to make it not worthwhile to do it. Either it is physically useless (no upgrade marines vs 2-3 OCs and skulks) or economically wasteful (IPs + Armoury + Med Pack Upgrade + Med Spammage = Slowed Expansion as Marines have to wait for more res to expand) I think some of the changes we see are going to play with the "opening game timing" to see what can be done about the early game rushes.
Some have said that they can't see the resource or time cost of the med pack upgrade will be a factor to the marine opening game, I think it will.
It may be less of a factor in pub play but in clan matches I think it will be felt.
Of course this is all speculation... <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->