Experiment: Feedback portal

GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,813 admin
edited December 2017 in NS2 General Discussion
The new development team is all about getting and reacting to the communities feedback.

However so far we don’t really have any good way to gather feedback.

This forum is a great place to discuss and debate but often ideas and suggestion get lost in very long threads and don’t get the attention they deserve.

To make sure that doesn’t happen anymore I think we need to create a place to share ideas and vote on them. So every idea has a fair chance and the really good ones get the attention they deserve.

Yesterday i stumbled over userreport.com. It looks like exactly the kind of service I was looking for.

So let’s start a little “experiment”.

This experiment aims to find out how useful userreport is and how many of you are actually willing to contribute to it.

You can find the new NS2 Feedback page at https://goo.gl/q7FvbR

Server admin can add a “NS2 Feedback” button to the Shine Vote Menu via enabling the “ns2feedback” plugin of the [Shine]Epsilon mod.

I would like to thank all of you for participating in this little experiment.
Post edited by GhoulofGSG9 on
Developer, Modder and Server Admin of Survival of the Fattest - Ingame Nick: Ghoul
BabblerKingNominousFrozenDC_DarklingIeptBarakatIronHorseSaffron_bakerZekSupaFredrantologycoine
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  • DC_DarklingDC_Darkling Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18068Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver Posts: 4,378 Advanced user
    Worth a go.
    I shall enable the plugin on taw
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  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation Posts: 1,450 Advanced user
    You realize that there will never be another post on this website that gets more likes, honest comments, and has more value to the game then the "Fire Hugh" one you deleted. Maybe you should just actually consider it instead of deleting it.
    mattji104
    halfofaheavenCr4zyb4st4rdNotPaLaGi
  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,813 admin
    edited December 2015
    Please keep your ideas in a somewhat civil tone.

    Some have ask me if we would actually consider the ideas posted at this new portal even though it's a "test". To answer you yes we will do so!

    Any idea that get some up-votes will be looked at and shared with the team. You can track the progress yourself as the ideas then will change their status ;)

    There are already some ideas I really like and myself would never thought of. So again thanks to all who contributed to this point and everyone who is willing to share his ideas with us.

    We highly appreciate your effort.

    BTW the portal also includes a separated bug reporter, so don't hesitate to tell us about bugs you think we might not have heard of.

    Edit:
    mattji104 wrote: »
    You realize that there will never be another post on this website that gets more likes, honest comments, and has more value to the game then the "Fire Hugh" one you deleted. Maybe you should just actually consider it instead of deleting it.

    That idea was not deleted but rejected (you can find it under closed ideas). The reason why it was rejected was given as well as comment.
    Developer, Modder and Server Admin of Survival of the Fattest - Ingame Nick: Ghoul
  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributor Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts Posts: 8,163 admin
    PSA :

    Click "Report a Bug" instead of "Post an idea" if you are listing an actual bug. (lookin at you, ATF ;P )
    QUOTE (Techercizer @ Feb 3 2012, 10:47 AM) »
    Every time you ask for troubleshooting without providing system info, ATI adds a rendering bug for an upcoming game.

    When you feel you need to be rude or angry about a game, just read these links and remember what role you are playing:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_disinhibition_effect
    http://www.eldergame.com/2008/06/taming-the-forum-tiger/
  • IeptBarakatIeptBarakat The most difficult name to speak ingame. Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 2,663 Advanced user
    I can only vote things up, I can not down vote ideas that I feel are completely pointless or stupid.

    So this is a completely biased system that only shows one thing how many people approve of an idea, just because 50 people like something doesnt mean another 5000 hate it. Im too lazy to comment and comments are not as obvious as a big thumbs up button.

    Find a system where you can have likes and dislikes or don't bother imo.

    Well liking something only really serves to increase awareness as the choice on the matter is still on the dev team.

    Take my suggestion for example, it isn't likely to get a lot of votes and it's already being picked apart in favor of staying to the current gameplay formula. So it'll stay on the bottom of the list and probably fade to obscurity once new ideas start being voted for, or just be rejected overall.

    Introducing dislikes will probably deter people from using it, which is against the entire point of the system in the first place.
    IronHorseWyzcrak
  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributor Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts Posts: 8,163 admin
    edited December 2015
    this place isnt for the ideas we dont agree with go back to the forums where we just told you we dont read shit!
    That wasn't a relevant idea.

    So yes, keep the extraneous and non relevant stuff (like staffing or schedules or website or forum rules etc) to the forums where they can be discussed.
    This new system is a tool to have your game related ideas heard.. please don't dilute it for others by posting things that belong in here instead.
    Lastly, do you really feel like the CDT or the new dev team don't read the forums?? Really? We respond in here daily.. almost to everything
    QUOTE (Techercizer @ Feb 3 2012, 10:47 AM) »
    Every time you ask for troubleshooting without providing system info, ATI adds a rendering bug for an upcoming game.

    When you feel you need to be rude or angry about a game, just read these links and remember what role you are playing:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_disinhibition_effect
    http://www.eldergame.com/2008/06/taming-the-forum-tiger/
  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,813 admin
    Small update: The in-game display issue of the feedback interface should be fixed now.
    Developer, Modder and Server Admin of Survival of the Fattest - Ingame Nick: Ghoul
    BabblerKing
  • ZekZek Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 7962Members, NS1 Playtester, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,689 Advanced user
    Nice, I like this idea a lot. I'm going to be posting a few ideas for experiments that are big and controversial while hopefully not being impossible in scope, discussion is welcome. I don't expect any of them to shoot to the top of the popularity charts - the most popular suggestions will obviously be the no-brainer ones that are clear improvements over the status quo. Those are great too but all I ask is that the scarier changes also be judged on their merits :)
  • FrozenFrozen New York, NY Join Date: 2010-07-02 Member: 72228Members, Constellation Posts: 1,450 Advanced user
    bump in the confusion. I think this would have stayed by the top if not for the confusion around 278.
    mattji104
    IronHorseSantaClawsIeptBarakat
  • ArchieArchie Antarctica Join Date: 2006-09-19 Member: 58028Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 401 Advanced user
    Seems not enough people know about this, shared some people on my friends list.
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  • GameOverGameOver Germany Join Date: 2003-10-15 Member: 21700Members, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 146 Fully active user
    So is this a kind of trello-board replacement? Will trello be still active and therefore further NS2 development "open"?

    If trello is NOT shut down, can't you implement the feature into trello itself? I think it would be better to have one "tool" to see suggestions and things which are being considered.
  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,813 admin
    edited December 2015
    GameOver wrote: »
    So is this a kind of trello-board replacement? Will trello be still active and therefore further NS2 development "open"?

    If trello is NOT shut down, can't you implement the feature into trello itself? I think it would be better to have one "tool" to see suggestions and things which are being considered.
    We would use trello for this if it would possible to use trello.

    However trello requires us to add users to a board before they can make a note. Also trello has no way to filter/sort notes after votes at the moment.

    You are right that it would be better to have all the tools at one place. But that's due to the limitation of every service so far not possible.

    However we can certainly work on some kind of user interface to merge all these services. But first we have to find out how useful each of those services is.

    And that's what this experiment is about.

    @GameOver The new ns2dev trello board can be found here
    Developer, Modder and Server Admin of Survival of the Fattest - Ingame Nick: Ghoul
  • GameOverGameOver Germany Join Date: 2003-10-15 Member: 21700Members, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 146 Fully active user
    I understand. thanks. Added the new trello to the bookmarks.
  • IronHorseIronHorse Developer, QA Manager, Technical Support & contributor Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71669Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Subnautica Playtester, Subnautica PT Lead, Pistachionauts Posts: 8,163 admin
    elodea wrote: »
    It's also not a very good idea to stamp a suggestion as rejected or not.
    The exception to this is if it not relevant or if it is not remotely practical.
    Knowing what ideas or suggestions are too far out to be possible are parameters that will save reporters time, and prevent dilution of other good ideas through saturation and noise.

    An example: No, NS2 will not be ported to the source engine, everyone should be aware of that.
    elodea wrote: »
    If your goal is growth then you need to start looking at providing a loop for players who don't know anything to begin with. Usually that's steam forums, but there is room for improvement right here in the official ones too.
    Great ideas.. and hopefully we can get this into the game itself upon exiting, as an optional feedback loop directly from players who aren't typically verbally active otherwise.
    QUOTE (Techercizer @ Feb 3 2012, 10:47 AM) »
    Every time you ask for troubleshooting without providing system info, ATI adds a rendering bug for an upcoming game.

    When you feel you need to be rude or angry about a game, just read these links and remember what role you are playing:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_disinhibition_effect
    http://www.eldergame.com/2008/06/taming-the-forum-tiger/
  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, Pistachionauts Posts: 4,199 Advanced user
    I love this. Feels much more actionable than ideas and suggestions forum. Here's mine: https://feedback.userreport.com/19e981d4-394e-46de-997e-8913cc04aff2/#idea/75776
    Nominous
  • ArchieArchie Antarctica Join Date: 2006-09-19 Member: 58028Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 401 Advanced user
    Is there anyway you could direct people in the ideas and suggestions sub-forum to the feedback portal? they seem to be posting more in the ideas and suggestions?
    IPB Image Constellation - a great source of income :> http://www.netplanet.co.nz/ns/
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,594 Advanced user
    edited December 2015
    Give aliens bioluminescence. Example picture in suggestion.
    https://feedback.userreport.com/19e981d4-394e-46de-997e-8913cc04aff2/#idea/75857
    This actually was added to the trello shortly after I made this post. Unrelated but cool. https://trello.com/c/e9gw1usd/50-experiment-with-alien-lighting

    Change the alien upgrade menu order to Gorge, Skulk, Lerk, Fade, Onos
    https://feedback.userreport.com/19e981d4-394e-46de-997e-8913cc04aff2/#idea/75854
    Post edited by Nordic on
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
  • AeglosAeglos Join Date: 2010-04-06 Member: 71189Members Posts: 539 Advanced user
    @Foxy @Nordic

    Really? What made you guys think so? Was it the eight suggestions made within a year and sixteen within two years? Was it the single digit up votes, total of fourteen non author votes within two years? Was it the last accepted idea having been started more than two years ago?

    When this thing is barely two years old? I mean its currently two years and two weeks from Ghoul's topic opener. So most of everything that happened on it happened within the first two weeks.

  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,594 Advanced user
    edited December 2017
    If you are responding to the other thread, Ghoul says he still monitors it. That is why I agreed with Foxy. It is worth a try I guess.
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
  • AeglosAeglos Join Date: 2010-04-06 Member: 71189Members Posts: 539 Advanced user
    To make sure that doesn’t happen anymore I think we need to create a place to share ideas and vote on them.

    This experiment aims to find out how useful userreport is and how many of you are actually willing to contribute to it.
    Nordic wrote: »
    If you are responding to the other thread, Ghoul says he still monitors it. That is why I agreed with Foxy. It is worth a try I guess.


    I didn't think it was supposed to be a wishlist for the devs to read our Dear Santas.


  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,813 admin
    edited December 2017
    Just to clarify I still get and read the weekly status reports from the feedback page. But yeah not many people use it anymore which I think partial comes down to that the development progress couldn't keep up with the amount of ideas that were added in the first weeks. However the advantage of the feedback website is still that the entry level to contribute is lower than for this forum, so we still get feedback from players who would never leave any feedback otherwise. Though lately more Subnautica ideas have been added than NS2 ones. I forward most Subnautica ideas and delete them afterwards.

    Also the website is now as active as the ideas and suggestion section of this forum with about 2-3 ideas added every month. In the end most ppl just stopped posting their ideas and opinions.

    Last but not least I think the "add a switch option for shuffle" thread wasn't closed so much because you are not allowed to post ideas at this forum (in the ideas & suggestions section) but due to it's rather unfriendly tone. Additionally shuffle is a shine feature so I'm not even sure how debating it at this forum would change the situation because you won't necessarily reach the shine developers that way. It's better to open a issue ticket at shine's github repo for that.
    Developer, Modder and Server Admin of Survival of the Fattest - Ingame Nick: Ghoul
  • AeglosAeglos Join Date: 2010-04-06 Member: 71189Members Posts: 539 Advanced user
    Also the website is now as active as the ideas and suggestion section of this forum with about 2-3 ideas added every month. In the end most ppl just stopped posting their ideas and opinions.

    I did a quick count. The leftover relevant ideas averages out to an idea per month and a half (eight each year, as of today).
    Last but not least I think the "add a switch option for shuffle" thread wasn't closed so much because you are not allowed to post ideas at this forum (in the ideas & suggestions section) but due to it's rather unfriendly tone.

    So the decision taken was to bury it where no one sees? Out of sight, out of mind? Even Wyz"PM sent"crak does a better job moderating. But hey, its the same person who liked to do ninja sinks, so I'm really not surprised.
    Additionally shuffle is a shine feature so I'm not even sure how debating it at this forum would change the situation because you won't necessarily reach the shine developers that way. It's better to open a issue ticket at shine's github repo for that.

    Thanks. I think most people consider Shine and NS2+ as basically officially supported. Essentially only that horrid vanilla UWE Rookie server doesn't run them as confirmed by Nintendows. :*
  • GhoulofGSG9GhoulofGSG9 Join Date: 2013-03-31 Member: 184566Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Supporter, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,813 admin
    edited December 2017
    Aeglos wrote: »
    [...]

    Thanks. I think most people consider Shine and NS2+ as basically officially supported.

    I guess there is kinda the issue because Shine is a community mod governed by Person8880 (who is not associated with UWE in any way). UWE bought the rights for NS2+ when Mendasp left to be able to merge certain ns2+ features into vanilla. But it's still also a community mod which is just governed by UWE staff due to the lack of a community maintainer.

    However due to how important both mods are we tend to test them with each new ns2 build and contribute patches to make sure they continue to work. So if you want to report any issues or want to request new features for any of both mods you better use the given GitHub pages.
    Developer, Modder and Server Admin of Survival of the Fattest - Ingame Nick: Ghoul
  • FoxyFoxy United Kingdom Join Date: 2014-08-19 Member: 198032Members, Forum Admins, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow, Forum staff Posts: 457 mod
    If you’re complaining about the other thread being closed, well it should be obvious why that happened.
  • AeglosAeglos Join Date: 2010-04-06 Member: 71189Members Posts: 539 Advanced user
    It was more your pretense that the feedback portal is still active and redirecting us to it. I thought that was fairly clear since I included Nordic who agreed with your post closing the topic.
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,594 Advanced user
    When I had agreed with it the thread had not been closed. I didn't know it was closed until after I responded to you.
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
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