Buffing railguns from 95% useless to 90% useless

IdlerayIdleray Join Date: 2012-10-04 Member: 161464Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 154 Advanced user
Remove the god-awful hold & release firing mechanism and just make it click to fire.

You could

1. Give the option to bind charge-up to another key, i.e. Press F & click

2. Just plain remove the mandatory discharge so you can hold a fully charged blast at all times. So simply: click & wait & click etc. If you click too soon you get a weaker blast.

3. This would be awesome. Give rails an "overcharge" button that allows you to continually fire fully powered blasts for a short time and then having to cooldown like miniguns do. The dps from firing & cooling down would be lower than just charging up as normal and firing, but would give rails the option of doing burst damage.

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Comments

  • male_fatalitiesmale_fatalities ausns2.org Join Date: 2004-03-06 Member: 27185Members, Constellation Posts: 673 Fully active user
    edited January 2014
    lol... railguns are borderline broken in the hands of an amazing player. It hits everything, even when your not aiming on them. The reason you don't see them in competition is that its so hard to reach exo's without loosing the early/mid game, and they are useless against onos. Not to mention an all-in due to massive PRES sink

    You can't even hide behind hive as they travel through all creatures and alien buildings. They just shoot you while you're trying to heal through the damn thing
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  • CyberKunCyberKun Join Date: 2013-02-02 Member: 182733Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 336 Fully active user
    Being able to oneshots Skulks as soon as one sees them at any range would be stupid. I am not talking about the balance aspect, I am talking about the fun aspect.

    While this could cause the Railguns to have a more clear use, the buff itself would be bad for the gameplay.
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  • amoralamoral Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177250Members Posts: 1,331 Advanced user
    lol... railguns are borderline broken in the hands of an amazing player. It hits everything, even when your not aiming on them. The reason you don't see them in competition is that its so hard to reach exo's without loosing the early/mid game, and they are useless against onos. Not to mention an all-in due to massive PRES sink

    You can't even hide behind hive as they travel through all creatures and alien buildings. They just shoot you while you're trying to heal through the damn thing

    also because jetpacks shotgun is just flat out better sooner. and exos suck at moving. also, dualies are just better.
  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,191 Fully active user
    edited January 2014
    Since the armour and damage (?) nerf a while back, railguns have indeed been mostly useless. They used to be incredible and definitely op (though many people didn't realise), but they were nerfed too hard. It may take a couple of attempts, depending on positioning, but a 5 skulk pack can swarm an exo and take it down if they make a concerted effort. JP/SG is just flat out a better investment.
    I used to love the railgun in combat mod but it's not very good at all any more. :(
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  • meatmachinemeatmachine South England Join Date: 2013-01-06 Member: 177858Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 1,551 Advanced user
    Exos in general are near useless now.
    Too weird to live, yet too rare to die
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  • sotanahtsotanaht Join Date: 2013-01-12 Member: 179215Members Posts: 1,020 Fully active user
    They could at least let you hold the charge for a short period, like 1-2 seconds before autofire. Maybe create a sweet spot mechanic where you release at a certain time for max damage and releasing later reduces the damage the later you release, but at a slower rate than the initial buildup.
  • AsranielAsraniel Join Date: 2002-06-03 Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer Posts: 2,557 mod
    Railgun exos are strong enough at it is. of course if they wander around alone they are useless. but one of them behind the lines will do wonders
    Ollj: "ns_napo, the first good custom map ever" ns_napo
  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,191 Fully active user
    Asraniel wrote: »
    Railgun exos are strong enough at it is. of course if they wander around alone they are useless. but one of them behind the lines will do wonders

    ... in a 24p pub game, maybe. You cannot afford to keep 1 player permanently behind the lines (especially not in a shiny, expensive and extremely vulnerable deathbox) in a competitive game. It's a waste of map control, it's a waste of p.res and also the t.res invested in researching it. It does not allow you to stop resbiting at natural extractors (even though at least the speed of the single railgun is now acceptable), due to its fragility and cost.

    Sure, in a massive derpfest it can be fun to sit in base turtling away with your pew pew exo, but I for one don't think this game should be designed or balanced around 24player public servers.
    For all your gorge busting needs.
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  • SupaDupaNoodleSupaDupaNoodle Join Date: 2003-01-12 Member: 12232Members Posts: 495 Advanced user
    Exos are still pretty useful with a skilled pilot and 1-2 welder marines.
    SupaDupaNoodle
    I'm a signature virus :D Copy me into your signature!
    (Ribo @ Jan 2 2013, 10:43 AM) wrote »
     ##EMPHASIS ADDED##
    Ok, here is the problem. Every game, the aliens,in a pack, harass the marines to slowdown resource captures. The aliens save up for invisible, double armor rhinos. Everyone evolves into an invisible double armor rhino. The marines lose.


    Also, a good rule of thumb is that a rookie is equivalent to an empty player slot on a team.

  • IdlerayIdleray Join Date: 2012-10-04 Member: 161464Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 154 Advanced user
    Perhaps the title was a misleading. I'm not talking about a straight-forward "buff" to rail exos but more of a quality-of-life improvement change.

    The hold n release mechanic is hard on the wrists of many people and for me personally it screws with my aim.
    More than anything related to the actual effectiveness of railguns, it's simply a strain on the hands to use this hold and release mechanic so its plain not fun.
  • RoobubbaRoobubba Who you gonna call? Join Date: 2003-01-06 Member: 11930Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 3,191 Fully active user
    Exos are still pretty useful with a skilled pilot and 1-2 welder marines.

    I refer you to my point above. I agree that in a 20-24p server environment, an exo is a formidable force in good hands and doesn't need further buffing (though I agree with Idleray's request for more user-friendly mechanism of firing the railgun).

    But the exo in 6v6 or 8v8 is a Bad Idea(TM). You need a minimum of 1 welder with it, which massively reduces your ability to maintain map presence. The only means of saving an exo from a rush is by beaconing, due to them not being able to phase, and that action destroys your map presence. You make that exo a target for swarming, which kills that marine's p.res (and if you've been res-biting to make the most of the exo's lack of map coverage, then that p.res destruction is very valuable).

    I specced a comp game recently where a very very good player had an exo in an attempt to finish off the aliens. Now that exo did manage to kill numerous skulks and 2 fades (it was a dual minigun, not a rail), but the marines lost the game very soon afterwards: they could not defend their RTs from harassment while the exo was out, because it was 1 exo and 1 or 2 light marines for welding/protection. They tried to push a hive, and couldn't for fear of losing the exo so had to retreat: then all their res was lost behind the lines, the jetpackers were picked off, the exo was swarmed (eventually), and suddenly marines went from 6 extractors, 4 jetpacks, 1 dual minigun, to 2 extractors, no jetpacks or exo, and they lost all their map control and very soon after they lost the game.
    And that was with probably one of the best aimers in divs 1-3 combined piloting the exo.
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  • MestaritonttuMestaritonttu Join Date: 2004-07-29 Member: 30229Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold Posts: 1,194
    Dual rail should be fixed tho. It's just a super bummer to use. Nobody EVER buys it.

    Just make dual rail shots ½ damage, with 2x rate of fire, and able to load simultaneously. That way no OP full load double rail whammies, but still the delight of doing double rails just for the kicks. Or instead going left-right-left-right. Since you'd have 2 rails with 2x speed that'd be FOUR TIMES MORE RAIL BLASTS, PEWPEWPEWPEWPEW! Now that'd look friggin' awesome.
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  • maD_maX_maD_maX_ Join Date: 2013-04-07 Member: 184678Members Posts: 470 Advanced user
    Once you have dual, you can get a 100% & 75% shot off at the same time.., this will one shot lerks/skulks and that fade better be at full health to get away...

    Add the fact that it highlights aliens through structures, lol I see a fade hiding behind the hive pew! Oh wait I not only killed the fade but 2 random skulks and that shade...
  • CuelCuel Join Date: 2013-01-22 Member: 181295Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 123 Fully active user
    Just revert them back to how they where, useful.
    No one is buying dual rails anyway.
  • Ghosthree3Ghosthree3 Join Date: 2010-02-13 Member: 70557Members, Reinforced - Supporter Posts: 3,432 Advanced user
    edited January 2014
    lol... railguns are borderline broken in the hands of an amazing player. It hits everything, even when your not aiming on them
    Eh, they're good for their surprise damage on that escaping life form. Apart from that, miniguns do way more dps. So if you can aim I'd be going with that anyway.
    76561197996992409.png
  • sotanahtsotanaht Join Date: 2013-01-12 Member: 179215Members Posts: 1,020 Fully active user
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    lol... railguns are borderline broken in the hands of an amazing player. It hits everything, even when your not aiming on them
    Eh, they're good for their surprise damage on that escaping life form. Apart from that, miniguns do way more dps. So if you can aim I'd be going with that anyway.

    More like if you CAN'T aim. Miniguns have a rather large spread.
  • amoralamoral Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177250Members Posts: 1,331 Advanced user
    sotanaht wrote: »
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    lol... railguns are borderline broken in the hands of an amazing player. It hits everything, even when your not aiming on them
    Eh, they're good for their surprise damage on that escaping life form. Apart from that, miniguns do way more dps. So if you can aim I'd be going with that anyway.

    More like if you CAN'T aim. Miniguns have a rather large spread.

    ... "some people think they can outsmart me... maybe, maybe... I have yet to meet one that can outsmart bullet." - heavy.
    Ghosthree3TwigSeb
  • maD_maX_maD_maX_ Join Date: 2013-04-07 Member: 184678Members Posts: 470 Advanced user
    I dont see what more you could do... if you increase DMG then your looking at 1 shotting fades which would be terrible, you cant change armor, they are already fast, and well that leaves changing the rate of fire. I suppose you could increase the rate of fire, but i dont think that would solve any of the problems.

    I guess that leave rail-guns for pub's where "pew-Pew-pew" and pop goes the lerk!
    KungFuJV
  • LocklearLocklear [nexzil]kerrigan Join Date: 2012-05-01 Member: 151403Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 1,335 Advanced user
    edited January 2014
    Super long range high burst damage doesn't really belong in NS2 imo.

    Pistols should be the line.
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  • Ghosthree3Ghosthree3 Join Date: 2010-02-13 Member: 70557Members, Reinforced - Supporter Posts: 3,432 Advanced user
    sotanaht wrote: »
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    lol... railguns are borderline broken in the hands of an amazing player. It hits everything, even when your not aiming on them
    Eh, they're good for their surprise damage on that escaping life form. Apart from that, miniguns do way more dps. So if you can aim I'd be going with that anyway.

    More like if you CAN'T aim. Miniguns have a rather large spread.

    The spread won't affect you that negatively if you aim at the center of the life form. Seen that video of the guy in a duel exo aimbotting? Killing ANYTHING in less than half a second, fades included.
    76561197996992409.png
    Twig
  • TwigTwig Australia Join Date: 2013-11-09 Member: 189225Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, WC 2013 - Shadow Posts: 115 Fully active user
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    sotanaht wrote: »
    Ghosthree3 wrote: »
    lol... railguns are borderline broken in the hands of an amazing player. It hits everything, even when your not aiming on them
    Eh, they're good for their surprise damage on that escaping life form. Apart from that, miniguns do way more dps. So if you can aim I'd be going with that anyway.

    More like if you CAN'T aim. Miniguns have a rather large spread.

    The spread won't affect you that negatively if you aim at the center of the life form. Seen that video of the guy in a duel exo aimbotting? Killing ANYTHING in less than half a second, fades included.

    If you have good aim you can make pretty much any weapon work
  • matsomatso Master of Patches Join Date: 2002-11-05 Member: 7000Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, Reinforced - Shadow, NS2 Community Developer Posts: 1,554 mod
    Benson wrote: »
    I miss the days of super powerfull Exos that couldn't be beaconed. Great gameplay imo.

    Actually, adding an extra purchasable "armor pack" that added 200 armour, slowed you down and made it impossible to beacon you would make that a personal option ... should be easy enough to create a mod that did that, now that you have upgradable Exos already.
    Member of CDT, Senior Spark Engine Hacker
  • meatmachinemeatmachine South England Join Date: 2013-01-06 Member: 177858Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 1,551 Advanced user
    Benson wrote: »
    I miss the days of super powerfull Exos that couldn't be beaconed. Great gameplay imo.

    Agree x 50
    Too weird to live, yet too rare to die
    skulkgato
  • amoralamoral Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177250Members Posts: 1,331 Advanced user
    edited January 2014
    matso wrote: »
    Benson wrote: »
    I miss the days of super powerfull Exos that couldn't be beaconed. Great gameplay imo.

    Actually, adding an extra purchasable "armor pack" that added 200 armour, slowed you down and made it impossible to beacon you would make that a personal option ... should be easy enough to create a mod that did that, now that you have upgradable Exos already.

    ... i think you just described a turret with shitty aim.
    Ghosthree3Jekt
  • dusterduster michigan, US Join Date: 2014-01-19 Member: 193329Members Posts: 55 Fully active user
    edited January 2014
    Railguns are pretty terribad for how late in the game you can get them. They can one shot lerks, which isn't even good because you can get more dps in with an assualt rifle in the time it takes to charge I am pretty sure. They can kill skulks and damage fades, in a worse way than somebody with a shotgun jetpack can. They are harder to heal and take more damage, they cost way more than shotgun jetpacks.

    I am okay with this because they don't take any skill to use other than aim, so they should just be left for gibbing stupid lerks in combat mode.
  • BobRossTheBossBobRossTheBoss Join Date: 2012-12-31 Member: 176824Members Posts: 172 Fully active user
    Locklear wrote: »
    Super long range high burst damage doesn't really belong in NS2 imo.

    Pistols should be the line.

    Especially not when said weapon has a cone of fire

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