Since we're speaking of Summit, it also has a dead zone behind the door which is barely used. Perfect spot for Tunnels or PG's to assault Crossroads or Data, heck even Sub can feel the wrath of a base there. This is super effective when the enemy team is lacking on the scouting bit.
All of the routes on summit are main routes leading into main rooms (techpoints), apart from that little hallway behind the door :P I don't mind those "dead zones" one bit, as long as they are kept to a minimum and are viable for those little outposts or outflanking manoeuvres.
Now descent basically has two main dead zones, Water Treatment and Receiving/Shipping. Both are mostly used as hallways, but Water Treatment has at the very least a viable option to function as a forward base to assault Hydro (crag or armory station). Receiving is a bit of an oddball, it can be observed by a single obs in Hydro, but still is a nice outflanking hallway... The issue is though, there are better spots on the map to function as such (ie: Energy Flow)
The downside to the Descent dead zones is that they don't lead directly into Hydro on even ground, both are an uphill battle in tight corridors, creating a bottleneck. And the team on higher ground usually has the upper hand, where Bile Bomb arcing and general lines of sight are concerned, especially with these tight bottlenecks. Making Hydro a good location to hold of an assault. This is unlike Summit's Crossroads, which has wider entrances with cover. And the little hallway on Summit on the other hand does lead directly into Crossroads and has direct access to Pipe Junction/Maintenance Access (Ventilation).
As such the Descent dead zones are less deadly/effective as forward bases, so to speak. But they still function perfectly as outflanking hallways. Also, people really need to explore the ventilation systems more on Descent, they are awesome as aliens (or jetty marines :P)
I hate the vents in descent. too narrow to lerk down effectively. overly complex for complexities sake... which kind of sums up the map itself. why staircases? they make it harder to navigate, club is long enough without also being circuitous. energy flow is a joke. I don't really know why I don't like it... it just feels like crap to play.
Yep, the vents are indeed a bit too complex and narrow in some places. We unintentionally got Gorge Master Chops killed once, when he was Gorging/Bile Bombing in the vent from Shipping to South Corridor. Four Skulks were behind him, trying to get past him. But it seems some vents on Descent violate the most important rule of vent construction in the book:
#1 You shall construct your ventilation system so Biteys, Fatties and Spikeys are able to pass each other without the use of WD40.
But you can't not love the fact that you can still surprise marines coming from angles they don't know about :P
Apr 11 19:11:00 <+snb> descent is killing ns2
Apr 11 19:12:05 <+snb> new people want to play it because it's pretty and they end up thinking the game is bad or imbalanced because the map plays like shit
Apr 11 19:12:47 <+Nade> its a like of summit :DDD must be good
Apr 11 19:12:50 <+snb> and 'vets' leave when it comes on
LOL, that part was my fravorite. So basicly your profe of why people dont like it is text of you bitching about if on diffrent days and diffrent people? Okay, So tell me, How does that work then?
Just because you don't like it doesn't make it a bad map, they you seem to be trying to preach to people to think like you and think it's a bad map. If people like it let them like it, stop being all whiney and let people get on with is. Wow you're such a negative nora!
That was just me ranting on IRC every time it was mentioned. It's not really to be taken seriously. I explained why I think it's a bad map elaborately on the 2nd page. And if you want to know how many people dislike a map, join any community server with regulars on and ask. My experience is that a lot of people hate Descent with a passion and only very few like it.
I run through water treatment every game to get to obs and energy flow rts. And I run through club often to get to plaza and receiving for hydro arcs.
They are essentially hallways, how are they useless? Or not elegant?
Do you know what elegant even means? They're the exact antithesis of that... an elegant solution to cross map travel would be a simple and effective hallway that doesn't take up any more space than it needs to. By removing club and water treatment, you could condense the overall size of the map as well, and probably move the Hydroanalysis tech point to a position of slightly less importance.
Think about the way the same problem is handled on Summit. Water treatment is essentially pipe junction. Summit reception would be club. They're both high traffic areas, and they are both places where engagements happen fairly often.
But of course you can't remove club, cause then you'd remove some of the "omgz shiney shiney pole dance" factor that everyone seems to love so much.
Since we're speaking of Summit, it also has a dead zone behind the door which is barely used. Perfect spot for Tunnels or PG's to assault Crossroads or Data, heck even Sub can feel the wrath of a base there. This is super effective when the enemy team is lacking on the scouting bit.
I would hesitate to call that a dead zone... If you have atrium/sub as the spawn locations, that door gets used all the time. Especially for aliens, but also for marines. It's basically the fastest way from sub access to reactor core. The vent that's next to the door is also incredibly useful for cross map travel, for going from flight control to ventilation without cutting through the big open area in the middle of crossroads.
Vladimir Van VodkaSexy BeastJoin Date: 2010-07-30Member: 73364Members, Reinforced - Shadow
I play on every map at an equal pace, and Ive personally never heard anybody complain about descent, or noticed people leave because of it.
I personally like it because of it's art style and all of it's elevated areas, accessible by both aliens and marines.
I just run around shooting/biting stuff, and thoroughly enjoy myself.
but I'm the one who likes all the maps, I used to hate refinery, but it kind of grew on me. You just eventually figure out what works and what doesn't. I'm not taking into account balance in these statements.
the only complaint about all maps I could say is that when I go gorge in a vent, and spawn babblers inside of it, and try to flush them out of my vent with pheromones to attack an unsuspecting marine below they kind of just... sit there... even if I leave...
my little plan was effectively destroyed, and i was left with mild disappointment.
I'm guessing there are no navigation nodes or w/e they are called in any vents for npc's.
I know it's just nit-picking in general, but that single experience is still memorable, are we going to have navigation for npc's in vents implemented?
You repeated it several times, and it was absurd each time.
Was it really though? I feel like most other maps have a "story" to tell and at least some believability to them. Descent is a random collection of rooms.
Everyone cherry picking an obviously debatable argument and ignoring valid critique just proves that none of you yay-sayers have anything worthwile to contribute as soon as anyone dares question something you like. Keep laughing off everything too negative as blind anger or preachiness and let's keep this forum a happy place!
Comments
Yep, the vents are indeed a bit too complex and narrow in some places. We unintentionally got Gorge Master Chops killed once, when he was Gorging/Bile Bombing in the vent from Shipping to South Corridor. Four Skulks were behind him, trying to get past him. But it seems some vents on Descent violate the most important rule of vent construction in the book:
#1 You shall construct your ventilation system so Biteys, Fatties and Spikeys are able to pass each other without the use of WD40.
But you can't not love the fact that you can still surprise marines coming from angles they don't know about :P
Do you know what elegant even means? They're the exact antithesis of that... an elegant solution to cross map travel would be a simple and effective hallway that doesn't take up any more space than it needs to. By removing club and water treatment, you could condense the overall size of the map as well, and probably move the Hydroanalysis tech point to a position of slightly less importance.
Think about the way the same problem is handled on Summit. Water treatment is essentially pipe junction. Summit reception would be club. They're both high traffic areas, and they are both places where engagements happen fairly often.
But of course you can't remove club, cause then you'd remove some of the "omgz shiney shiney pole dance" factor that everyone seems to love so much.
I would hesitate to call that a dead zone... If you have atrium/sub as the spawn locations, that door gets used all the time. Especially for aliens, but also for marines. It's basically the fastest way from sub access to reactor core. The vent that's next to the door is also incredibly useful for cross map travel, for going from flight control to ventilation without cutting through the big open area in the middle of crossroads.
I personally like it because of it's art style and all of it's elevated areas, accessible by both aliens and marines.
I just run around shooting/biting stuff, and thoroughly enjoy myself.
but I'm the one who likes all the maps, I used to hate refinery, but it kind of grew on me. You just eventually figure out what works and what doesn't. I'm not taking into account balance in these statements.
the only complaint about all maps I could say is that when I go gorge in a vent, and spawn babblers inside of it, and try to flush them out of my vent with pheromones to attack an unsuspecting marine below they kind of just... sit there... even if I leave...
my little plan was effectively destroyed, and i was left with mild disappointment.
I'm guessing there are no navigation nodes or w/e they are called in any vents for npc's.
I know it's just nit-picking in general, but that single experience is still memorable, are we going to have navigation for npc's in vents implemented?
You repeated it several times, and it was absurd each time.
Yea the babblers not doing well in vents is reported and being worked on
Everyone cherry picking an obviously debatable argument and ignoring valid critique just proves that none of you yay-sayers have anything worthwile to contribute as soon as anyone dares question something you like. Keep laughing off everything too negative as blind anger or preachiness and let's keep this forum a happy place!
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_9QVXHdq7xwk/TF2eenyF7jI/AAAAAAAAAiY/IthuU6jNYkY/s1600/rainbowland2.jpg
*Edited post to show link instead of large image. -Ironhorse*
gg wp
Closed.