<!--quoteo(post=1999536:date=Oct 29 2012, 08:10 AM:name=unkind)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (unkind @ Oct 29 2012, 08:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999536"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->no just a normal lmg, and it happens often if you are standing still, literally die before you even know you're being shot at<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think its something like 0.8 seconds or so of sustained LMG fire to kill a skulk isn't it?
<!--quoteo(post=1999497:date=Oct 29 2012, 12:11 AM:name=.ADHd)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (.ADHd @ Oct 29 2012, 12:11 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999497"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I have also done testing on skulks sitting completely still. You will not notice a confirmation of the kill until you have expended 20 rounds of LMG fire. This is actually an extremely big deal for an FPS game. Counting shots should be viable, and you shouldn't have to waste extra rounds per skulk. On average you will be wasting 20 rounds on every 2 skulks you encounter, which can tip the scales into losing engagements. 40% your magazines are being wasted in 225 when engaging skulks. I get this number by considering you should be able to kill 2 skulks per mag and with the terrible lag compensation and registry delay you are wasting ammo which = marine nerf. In theory you should be able to kill more though....<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I tried this with cheats on and 'give skulk', and the skulks took 15 shots to kill.
But using bot skulks or other players staying still and cheats off, 9 LMG shots at w0 killed them just as it should. No delays.
The skulks from 'give skulk' must have unusual health/armor values.
<!--quoteo(post=1999560:date=Oct 29 2012, 09:10 AM:name=shader)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (shader @ Oct 29 2012, 09:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999560"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I tried this with cheats on and 'give skulk', and the skulks took 15 shots to kill.
But using bot skulks or other players staying still and cheats off, 9 LMG shots at w0 killed them just as it should. No delays.
The skulks from 'give skulk' must have unusual health/armor values.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
All units "given" while cheats 1 is on have increased health, or at least take more damage to down. Marines take 5 bites for example. Testing like this is not valid.
<!--quoteo(post=1999560:date=Oct 29 2012, 02:10 AM:name=shader)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (shader @ Oct 29 2012, 02:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999560"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I tried this with cheats on and 'give skulk', and the skulks took 15 shots to kill.
But using bot skulks or other players staying still and cheats off, 9 LMG shots at w0 killed them just as it should. No delays.
The skulks from 'give skulk' must have unusual health/armor values.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Testing it locally wont give you accurate results since you're in a 0 latency environment.
Test it by shooting an afk skulk while in an online server, or just hit a straight lining skulk with every bullet. You will notice you have 30 rounds in your gun by the time you get the kill.
I'm not trying to bash on UWE and I know they work their asses off to improve the game. The fact of the matter is that release is in a few days, and this is unacceptable for a finished product. I would rather take unoptimized netcode hindering overall client performance over non-existent hit registration.
Build 223 was much more enjoyable and playable for me... I have faith the registration will be fixed... but I hope it's sooner than later. It's more important than performance... for me.
:/ the tracer rounds are extremely misleading. This is a hitscan game. Bullets don't take time to get anywhere, and it seems like misrepresentation of feedback is something I have been seeing in many other builds... whether it was de-synced LMG sounds, slow hit markers or etc.
The changed weapons sound for weapons 1, 2, and 3 is another example of terrible representation of feedback. I say terrible because it is. Things need to be accurate to what the game engine is actually calculating.
Besides... it sounds like someone took 20 seconds in pro-tools and resampled the audio and called it done for weapons 2. Honestly?
reg is bad but im still getting the pistol reload bug. at times its worse than 224 because itll reload 2-3 times like its jammed or something. if i can record it next time i play i will but its supremely annoying.
<!--quoteo(post=1999497:date=Oct 28 2012, 10:11 PM:name=.ADHd)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (.ADHd @ Oct 28 2012, 10:11 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999497"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I really hope the developers aren't trying to sweep this one under the stove and hope it goes by unnoticed. It would be soothing to hear an official response about work being done on hitreg and a timeframe for possible fixes. It is making the game not enjoyable for players who have high expectations, and rely on precise game response.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yes! I wish a developer would read this thread and post a response saying they are investigating it.
<!--quoteo(post=1999691:date=Oct 29 2012, 07:22 AM:name=Max)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Max @ Oct 29 2012, 07:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999691"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yes! I wish a developer would read this thread and post a response saying they are investigating it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> yea, where are they
<!--quoteo(post=1999691:date=Oct 29 2012, 03:22 PM:name=Max)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Max @ Oct 29 2012, 03:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999691"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yes! I wish a developer would read this thread and post a response saying they are investigating it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
AsranielJoin Date: 2002-06-03Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
edited October 2012
That all beeing said, if anybody has more videos showing it or any information on how to reproduce that would help.
When you see hitreg problems, is there blood or not? If there is blood, it means the server and client dont predict the same thing. If not it means something fundamental in hitreg is broken and client and server do the same wrong hitreg calculation.
If you see hitreg problems, is multithreaded rendering activated?
Does it happen with all guns/attacks?
Is the ping affecting the problem or not?
edit: when i talk about blood or not i mean this:
in the ideal world you see blood on a hit + the damage indicator (crosshair + damage number). The blood is calculated client side, the hit indicator and damage number server side. So if you see blood and no damage number, then the client and the server dont agree on what happend. From what i have seen until now i begin to suspect to think that the server and client very much agree on what is happening, but that they are both wrong. But the problem has not beeing identified yet and the evidence is not clear enough to say that there is clearly a problem (but my gut says there is, we just have to find out what).
Sometimes you get blood but not damage numbers with lmg, but this has been a rare case for me atleast. Its mostly that the bullets seem to go straight on through the aliens. Theres also quite severe firing and eventual registration delay which contributes to it a lot.
All these problems happen with server running stable @ 30 server rate, 20 updates recieved per second, 40 ping, 8 players total at the time.
<!--quoteo(post=1999728:date=Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM:name=Asraniel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Asraniel @ Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999728"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That all beeing said, if anybody has more videos showing it or any information on how to reproduce that would help.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I've been doing my best to forward any examples I can find to the emails given to me. what exactly are you looking for? just any example of the hitbox not aligning with the model? I had a clip of me shooting the air behind a skulk and the air produced blood, is that of any use?
<!--quoteo(post=1999728:date=Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM:name=Asraniel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Asraniel @ Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999728"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If you see hitreg problems, is multithreaded rendering activated?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> what impact does this setting have on the game? I was told that this feature was not implemented yet, so I've been leaving it off.
<!--quoteo(post=1999728:date=Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM:name=Asraniel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Asraniel @ Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999728"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Does it happen with all guns/attacks?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> it appears to be most noticeable with shotgun because it's a single target weapon that <i>should</i> instantly kill but oftentimes doesn't. but again, the shotgun's random nature could definitely be contributing to the issue, making this quite frustrating overall.
It also occurs with skulks to be honest, not just marine weaponry. Though with the new bite cone you often get at least 25 or 50 dmg, when you should have landed 75.
<!--quoteo(post=1999763:date=Oct 30 2012, 12:24 AM:name=Xarius)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Xarius @ Oct 30 2012, 12:24 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999763"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It also occurs with skulks to be honest, not just marine weaponry. Though with the new bite cone you often get at least 25 or 50 dmg, when you should have landed 75.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> As you can see in my video a couple pages ago
If you're going to test with cheats and do "give skulk"
You can't be on marines as the skulk entity will spawn being associated with the marine team, and your damage will be calculated using friendly fire damage. If anyone is trying to do that.
<!--quoteo(post=1999691:date=Oct 29 2012, 06:22 AM:name=Max)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Max @ Oct 29 2012, 06:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999691"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yes! I wish a developer would read this thread and post a response saying they are investigating it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In the office coding at 5:22am? I hope you guys have good amounts of coffee there for these last 2 days.
This is just so encouraging. a problem this big popping up days before release! Im scared, even more scared because I live in south america and im looking at at least 200ms minumum...
<!--quoteo(post=1999754:date=Oct 29 2012, 01:43 PM:name=Princess_of_Power)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Princess_of_Power @ Oct 29 2012, 01:43 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999754"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've been doing my best to forward any examples I can find to the emails given to me. what exactly are you looking for? just any example of the hitbox not aligning with the model? I had a clip of me shooting the air behind a skulk and the air produced blood, is that of any use?
what impact does this setting have on the game? I was told that this feature was not implemented yet, so I've been leaving it off.
it appears to be most noticeable with shotgun because it's a single target weapon that <i>should</i> instantly kill but oftentimes doesn't. but again, the shotgun's random nature could definitely be contributing to the issue, making this quite frustrating overall.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As I understand it Matso's optimisation should make this option drastically improve your fps.
<!--quoteo(post=1999754:date=Oct 29 2012, 06:43 AM:name=Princess_of_Power)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Princess_of_Power @ Oct 29 2012, 06:43 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999754"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->what impact does this setting have on the game? I was told that this feature was not implemented yet, so I've been leaving it off.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Multi-core rendering makes the rendering code run in parallel with the game code. Generally this should give you a higher frame rate. This feature has been in the game and working for quite a long time. This will cause the rendering to be 1 frame delayed, similar to how it works in Starcraft 2 and the Source engine.
<!--quoteo(post=1999691:date=Oct 29 2012, 08:22 AM:name=Max)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Max @ Oct 29 2012, 08:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999691"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yes! I wish a developer would read this thread and post a response saying they are investigating it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
max confirmed for banned from all UWE tournaments and dropped from PT group
Comments
no just a normal lmg, and it happens often if you are standing still, literally die before you even know you're being shot at
I think its something like 0.8 seconds or so of sustained LMG fire to kill a skulk isn't it?
I tried this with cheats on and 'give skulk', and the skulks took 15 shots to kill.
But using bot skulks or other players staying still and cheats off, 9 LMG shots at w0 killed them just as it should. No delays.
The skulks from 'give skulk' must have unusual health/armor values.
But using bot skulks or other players staying still and cheats off, 9 LMG shots at w0 killed them just as it should. No delays.
The skulks from 'give skulk' must have unusual health/armor values.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
All units "given" while cheats 1 is on have increased health, or at least take more damage to down. Marines take 5 bites for example. Testing like this is not valid.
But using bot skulks or other players staying still and cheats off, 9 LMG shots at w0 killed them just as it should. No delays.
The skulks from 'give skulk' must have unusual health/armor values.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Testing it locally wont give you accurate results since you're in a 0 latency environment.
Test it by shooting an afk skulk while in an online server, or just hit a straight lining skulk with every bullet. You will notice you have 30 rounds in your gun by the time you get the kill.
I'm not trying to bash on UWE and I know they work their asses off to improve the game. The fact of the matter is that release is in a few days, and this is unacceptable for a finished product. I would rather take unoptimized netcode hindering overall client performance over non-existent hit registration.
Build 223 was much more enjoyable and playable for me... I have faith the registration will be fixed... but I hope it's sooner than later. It's more important than performance... for me.
:/ the tracer rounds are extremely misleading. This is a hitscan game. Bullets don't take time to get anywhere, and it seems like misrepresentation of feedback is something I have been seeing in many other builds... whether it was de-synced LMG sounds, slow hit markers or etc.
The changed weapons sound for weapons 1, 2, and 3 is another example of terrible representation of feedback. I say terrible because it is. Things need to be accurate to what the game engine is actually calculating.
Besides... it sounds like someone took 20 seconds in pro-tools and resampled the audio and called it done for weapons 2. Honestly?
Yes! I wish a developer would read this thread and post a response saying they are investigating it.
yea, where are they
I suddenly need a Like-button! ;)
When you see hitreg problems, is there blood or not? If there is blood, it means the server and client dont predict the same thing. If not it means something fundamental in hitreg is broken and client and server do the same wrong hitreg calculation.
If you see hitreg problems, is multithreaded rendering activated?
Does it happen with all guns/attacks?
Is the ping affecting the problem or not?
edit: when i talk about blood or not i mean this:
in the ideal world you see blood on a hit + the damage indicator (crosshair + damage number). The blood is calculated client side, the hit indicator and damage number server side. So if you see blood and no damage number, then the client and the server dont agree on what happend. From what i have seen until now i begin to suspect to think that the server and client very much agree on what is happening, but that they are both wrong. But the problem has not beeing identified yet and the evidence is not clear enough to say that there is clearly a problem (but my gut says there is, we just have to find out what).
All these problems happen with server running stable @ 30 server rate, 20 updates recieved per second, 40 ping, 8 players total at the time.
I've been doing my best to forward any examples I can find to the emails given to me. what exactly are you looking for? just any example of the hitbox not aligning with the model? I had a clip of me shooting the air behind a skulk and the air produced blood, is that of any use?
<!--quoteo(post=1999728:date=Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM:name=Asraniel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Asraniel @ Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999728"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If you see hitreg problems, is multithreaded rendering activated?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
what impact does this setting have on the game? I was told that this feature was not implemented yet, so I've been leaving it off.
<!--quoteo(post=1999728:date=Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM:name=Asraniel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Asraniel @ Oct 29 2012, 05:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1999728"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Does it happen with all guns/attacks?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
it appears to be most noticeable with shotgun because it's a single target weapon that <i>should</i> instantly kill but oftentimes doesn't. but again, the shotgun's random nature could definitely be contributing to the issue, making this quite frustrating overall.
As you can see in my video a couple pages ago
You can't be on marines as the skulk entity will spawn being associated with the marine team, and your damage will be calculated using friendly fire damage. If anyone is trying to do that.
In the office coding at 5:22am? I hope you guys have good amounts of coffee there for these last 2 days.
226 today? Or just 1.0 tomorrow? :-P
what impact does this setting have on the game? I was told that this feature was not implemented yet, so I've been leaving it off.
it appears to be most noticeable with shotgun because it's a single target weapon that <i>should</i> instantly kill but oftentimes doesn't. but again, the shotgun's random nature could definitely be contributing to the issue, making this quite frustrating overall.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As I understand it Matso's optimisation should make this option drastically improve your fps.
Multi-core rendering makes the rendering code run in parallel with the game code. Generally this should give you a higher frame rate. This feature has been in the game and working for quite a long time. This will cause the rendering to be 1 frame delayed, similar to how it works in Starcraft 2 and the Source engine.
max confirmed for banned from all UWE tournaments and dropped from PT group