I need a controller
lolfighter
Snark, Dire Join Date: 2003-04-20 Member: 15693Members
Snark, Dire Join Date: 2003-04-20 Member: 15693Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Help me choose</div>I need a controller, and like a naughty child I haven't even done my homework before I start asking questions.
Background is that I snagged up Street Fighter 4 today while it was on sale, and while I advocate mouse & keyboard for a lot of gaming, I don't stick my head in the sand and deny facts: Some games are best played with a controller, some games are nigh unplayable on a keyboard, and fighting games tend to belong to both categories.
So I need a controller. A few months ago I talked with a friend who said that the Xbox 360 controller is pretty good. I held one, and it feels fine, and he says the plug & play integration with Windows works beautifully. However, he says the d-pad is ######. Today he said, and I translate: "It's so bad that you'd rather use the joystick. In a fighting game... that's how bad it is."
This is a dealbreaker. I'm not gonna play a 2D fighter with an analogue stick. That's stupid. Also, I might want to use the controller for other games now that I have it. So my controller has to have a good d-pad. This is crucial, this cannot be compromised on. I also want a good analogue stick or two though. I'd be perfectly happy with a Playstation 2 controller actually, those were just fine. But they use a proprietary interface and I'm sure that you can get adaptors but then you have to fiddle around with compatibility and ###### and argh I don't want that. I want a controller that I can plug in and use with minimum fuss. This is 2012, and I deserve it. I deserve everything.
So, to sum it up:<ul><li>MUST have good d-pad.</li><li>Must have at least one analogue stick, preferably two.</li><li>No endless fiddling with setup and configuration!</li><li>Has to cost less than a small country.</li><li>Wireless not a priority.</li></ul>
Think you can help me out?
Edit: Additions to list.
Edit 2: Let me clarify: With a 360 controller a lot of games have default setups for the controller right out of the box. With another controller I'll probably have to go into the settings and set up the keybinds. I don't mind that, that is to be expected.
Background is that I snagged up Street Fighter 4 today while it was on sale, and while I advocate mouse & keyboard for a lot of gaming, I don't stick my head in the sand and deny facts: Some games are best played with a controller, some games are nigh unplayable on a keyboard, and fighting games tend to belong to both categories.
So I need a controller. A few months ago I talked with a friend who said that the Xbox 360 controller is pretty good. I held one, and it feels fine, and he says the plug & play integration with Windows works beautifully. However, he says the d-pad is ######. Today he said, and I translate: "It's so bad that you'd rather use the joystick. In a fighting game... that's how bad it is."
This is a dealbreaker. I'm not gonna play a 2D fighter with an analogue stick. That's stupid. Also, I might want to use the controller for other games now that I have it. So my controller has to have a good d-pad. This is crucial, this cannot be compromised on. I also want a good analogue stick or two though. I'd be perfectly happy with a Playstation 2 controller actually, those were just fine. But they use a proprietary interface and I'm sure that you can get adaptors but then you have to fiddle around with compatibility and ###### and argh I don't want that. I want a controller that I can plug in and use with minimum fuss. This is 2012, and I deserve it. I deserve everything.
So, to sum it up:<ul><li>MUST have good d-pad.</li><li>Must have at least one analogue stick, preferably two.</li><li>No endless fiddling with setup and configuration!</li><li>Has to cost less than a small country.</li><li>Wireless not a priority.</li></ul>
Think you can help me out?
Edit: Additions to list.
Edit 2: Let me clarify: With a 360 controller a lot of games have default setups for the controller right out of the box. With another controller I'll probably have to go into the settings and set up the keybinds. I don't mind that, that is to be expected.
Comments
But, I generally find most all games are playable with the analog stick instead of the d pad.
What about<a href="http://www.logitech.com/nl-nl/gaming/controllers/7361" target="_blank"> this one</a>?
Wireless, normal buttons AND thumbsticks!
In SF4 it seems very imprecise, like I press the stick (because the d-pad is even worse) left as part of a combo, but the on-screen display tells me it's inputting as diagonally up/down.
Might be a matter of calibration, admittedly...
But, I generally find most all games are playable with the analog stick instead of the d pad.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Thanks, but I can only stress this again: A good d-pad is an <b>absolute must.</b> No compromise.
<!--quoteo(post=1951387:date=Jul 13 2012, 10:17 PM:name=Angelusz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Angelusz @ Jul 13 2012, 10:17 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1951387"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What about<a href="http://www.logitech.com/nl-nl/gaming/controllers/7361" target="_blank"> this one</a>?
Wireless, normal buttons AND thumbsticks!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Have you tried it? Is the d-pad any good?
I've had one in my hands and it felt just fine to me. I'm not a gamecontroller expert though, and these things are often a matter of taste.
Perhaps you can try one in a store?
Most of the PlayStation2->USB converter boxes also make the gamepad just show up as that. A gamepad. Standard USB HID device, no drivers to install (well, unless you want rumble functionality, but I've never gotten that to work). They're also usually around $15 for a 2-port unit, meaning multiplayer is completely possible. I'd recommend going that route if you already have a DualShock controller. Cheap, effective, awesome controller design by Sony.
Have you tried it? Is the d-pad any good?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have an older usb wired logitech gamepad very similar to that. I primarily use it to play console emulators (of which I obviously acquired all roms from cartridges and disks I personally own). I use the d-pad almost exclusively, and it works fine, even for MK3.
<a href="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826127207" target="_blank">http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16826127207</a>
<a href="http://www.logitech.com/en-us/gaming/controllers/rumble-gamepad-f510" target="_blank">http://www.logitech.com/en-us/gaming/contr...le-gamepad-f510</a>
I'm pretty sure the second one is the updated version of the first one. And that second one is just the wired version of the wireless one from before.
I've had it for years, still works like a champ. I don't imagine a newer model could be too much worse?
and then asked for a controller
not an arcade stick
a controller
just slap yourself, and start over
go get yourself a USB arcade stick, make sure it's at minimum a 4 gate joystick if you are srs about the street fighter
also I main zangief, if I'm ever in Europe I would love to play
also I too have a logitech stupid controller with dpad et al. I also have a madcatz imported sanwa internaled stfIV comp stick for ps3, and then a slightly smaller xbox 360 which both plug into ye old computer
*slaps TAK*
I said I wanted a controller, not an arcade stick. I don't like arcade sticks. YOU start over.
Drfuzzy, cost is a factor, wireless is not. I am not willing to buy two controllers when I only need one.
Caboose, thanks. Still a mite skeptical about that d-pad, but this is the best option so far.
I have no experience doing it however.
If you've got a PS3 controller and Bluetooth on your PC, why not try it?
Also, was never a Street Fighter fan, more Mortal Kombat inclined, but you'll be Hadokening mutha****a's left and right with that logitech d-pad. Left, right up and down are responsive, and there's a good roll from one to the other. It's one of the reasons why I play MK3 on my PC rather than my SNES; special moves feel more natural.
So far the Logitech controller seems like my best option. The four-switch d-pad in particular looks promising. I'd still prefer a cross-shape instead of that rounded thing, but I can probably learn to adapt. Now to find somewhere to buy it.
Edit: Before you all go "just buy it at X or order it via Y," keep in mind that I'm in Denmark, not the US or UK.
The reason this matters is that trigger buttons really do change up the timing for when you need to press, at least in my experience. they have more travel time and so your ability to reactively do any moves requiring that button will be a bit messed up. Buttons on the side of the d-pad are slightly worse because it means you're trying to do the input motions and press the button with the same hand. I've noticed this causes problems for a good few people.
They're not insurmountable problems and some have learned to get past those issues, just be aware you're setting yourself up for a learning curve you might not have expected. The 'easy' way around these is to either get 6 face-button controller or an arcade stick, but seeing as you've already said you don't want to stick it, I'd suggest a 6 button. There's also some tactics/moves that are inifinitely harder on a pad compare to a stick (e.g. consistently doing tiger-knee'd cannon strikes) so depending on how good you want to be you might be making the road ahead harder for yourself.
If you don't see yourself fighting at high levels of play then it might not be a big deal though :3
The F510 triggers do seem a bit bigger than the PS2 shoulder buttons though, so travel time might actually be an issue.
Eh. The F510 isn't terribly expensive. Should I find that I have a knack for SF4 and get ambitious I can always invest in a dedicated controller for that game. The F510 seems like a good alrounder.
I don't even know what "tiger knee'd cannon strikes" are, but I've heard that full 360s (and especially those ridiculous 720 super combos) are much easier on a stick, but none of my characters use those, so I can deal. As long as I can pull off hooligan combinations consistently I should be fine.
It's basically exploitation of the input system to allow you to do her 'cannon strike' inches off the ground. Cannon strike is the diagonal-downward air kick you do by quarter-circle-back and kick while in the air, while jumping forwards (can't do it going backwards unless you do the EX version). The tiger knee'd version was basically the trick of doing the quarter-circle then hitting forward-up and kick quickly. If you go the timing right you'd basically pull the move off practically on the ground which is great for her pressure game as it gives her some safe chip damage and avoids low attacks in the process.
That said, that particular manoeuvre for Cammy was patched out (her cannon strike now has a minimum height requirement which prevents this old exploit)
I mentioned the 3 button buttons. Point is you'll have to put them somewhere which brings you back to the triggers/d-pad buttons: the movements for pulling off a super are already fiddly, sticking the button you need to hit while doing double quarter circles on a trigger or the buttons on the same hand isn't ideal in the tight situations you often want to use them :3
If you used to play SFA3 though you'll probably be ok, but on the other hand Guilty Gear is a four-button fighter so that doesn't really help with this situation at all :P
I said I wanted a controller, not an arcade stick. I don't like arcade sticks. YOU start over.
Drfuzzy, cost is a factor, wireless is not. I am not willing to buy two controllers when I only need one.
Caboose, thanks. Still a mite skeptical about that d-pad, but this is the best option so far.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I got a game and I prefer to learn the inferior input method because I choose to remain mediocre. Cool! Totally your choice
Just refuse to learn how to bunnyhop in ns_ while you are at it
okay i'm done with the dire snark sorry
Get a logitech USB controller, proceed to be unable to combo when it's tight timing / focus canceling will be a pain
honestly, let me see you ex greenhand focus cancel into forward dash into 720 ultra on pad or let me see you c.lk x4 --> Ex Gh or lets see etc etc etc etc
The one guy who uses a pad always gets stomped on in Evo, and even though I have since trained myself to use a pad (going from arcades to consoles, I guess sorta the the reverse of what you are doing) I still feel hamstrung by it when I need to actually execute at a certain level lets say it's 95% of the time or I wind up giving matches away (missing punishes, being unable to link easy as cake combos, failed/slower execution IE Shun Goku Satsu is just slower to execute on the controller when I can buffer it into the animation of a overhead mp with a stick yada yada yada), same thing with combos that need cancels, also certain top tier maneuvers such as Kara throws , Options selects, wavedashing, charge partitioning, Short jumping with gief in SFIV basically need a stick so they can be folded into your 'toolbox' and used on demand when needed... the layout of a controller hinders these things which are basically required if you would like to be able hang with the folks who tryhard
the logitech controller I have is a "dual action" vv741 p/n 863247-0010 you should find the thread where I posted about using PS3 controllers on PC / Xbox controllers on PC. I can straight plug my official ps3 controller (granted it's a stick sod off) into my pc and it just works as USB. The only proprietary stuff I found that was shady is for xbox controllers there is a hardware verification chip that prevents them from being used in non standard applications (ie anything but an xbawx)
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oh yeah I'm super dense there is a Chinese company that makes small converter boxes (I used the 2 ps2 controllers --> USB) they are releasing one that works for ps3/xbox360 here costs roughly $25 for the adapter I will find the name of the company, it's worth looking into. Mayfly or mayflower or something
who do you main in Alpha3, Do you do custom combo X ism or whatnot? Juni and Juli all day baby, but if it's normal characters we will call it Rolento or Blanka? Do you ever play projectile based games such as the MvC series? Any third strike in the mix???
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The last controller linked in there, the controller pro 3 was one I seriously considered buying a while back. In the end I just stuck to my tournament sticks. If someone doesn't want to play with sticks I give them one of my <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZPZp6-8f04" target="_blank">new 'twisty' transforming 360 controllers</a> It's not the ultimate dpad or anything but it's sure as hell easier to use than the normal 360 dpad (as in, it's actually usable on SF4 :P )
I had some Madcatz fightpads and they were actually genuinely good, but sadly both eventually stopped working. If they'd held up to use better I'd probably still be using them :3
~hug~
<sub><!--coloro:orange--><span style="color:orange"><!--/coloro-->Play nice. -Angelusz<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--></sub>
why does everyone assume a stick is $200 entry level?
A good stick with an all optical joystick and dimpled buttons with good microswitches that has the ability to spoof all 3 types is like 200 bucks
look
you can get a stick that has the same internals as the $14,000 arcade cabinets if you keep your eye out for roughly $35 (well I did, I just got it from someone who obviously cared for it) and you (in casual time) will find it to be a vastly superior input method that will eventually lead to more fun as you get to sous around the mechanics of the game. For any fighter, not just SF
I enjoy playing ThirdStrike on a pad, it's just when I get on a stick I can consistently do the extended air combo stuff that includes mixups and I can also do various other odds and ends that make it so you don't plateau so quickly and then loose interest on your bargain basket find
Having worked at an arcade, and been around specifically the genre of fighting games for a while and having been on both sides of the fence I just think that you are running afoul of my 'expert' opinion on the matter. I mean c'mon you are confirmed cynic I figure you were a big boy and could handle my boisterous barging in sorry if I offended
by all means get a pad have fun! that is the point of playing! I play fighting games for fun, I just got taught by the people who Go to these tournaments, cause they were the scrubs in my local arcade and if I wasn't as good as they were I was literally wasting my money (this was when I was like 10-16 years old playing the college kids, SFIII was out so was Alpha 3 also MvC and Xmen V street fighter)
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and since you are so fixated on a controller (which is fine)
mayflash is the name of the company that makes the adapters, they will enable you to use standard ps2 controllers roughly $7 USD it's pretty nifty for MAME and such
They are releasing very very soon a universal ps2 ps3 xbox360 adapter item number ms001 it should be priced at ~20 USD it's been designed and will be released for retail soon
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lolfighter gets lucky... my old hhd crashed and it had the saved angry little ranty emoticon that was LF's avatar Figured this would be a great time to bring that gem back
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<sub><!--coloro:#FF8C00--><span style="color:#FF8C00"><!--/coloro-->Same goes for you, play nice. Not just the one word, but the general tone as well. -Angelusz<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--></sub>