<!--quoteo(post=1952166:date=Jul 17 2012, 08:26 PM:name=Tweadle)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweadle @ Jul 17 2012, 08:26 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1952166"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's one more thing on a long list of things that take control away from the player, whether it comes in the form of their functionality, movement or vision. That's why I don't play this game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well then don't play L4D2, or any game with smokes and flashbang or any MMO, even the low on health in some games have a negative effect, so don't play them also.
L4D2 is a very strictly controlled 4-man environment where the humans are alot more powerful than the zombies. Flashbangs are almost always limited-use short-duration effects, as are smoke-grenades. MMOs are different to FPS and don't connect the character to the player in the same way at all. Oh, and NS1 worked beautifully with very few negative abilities.
What's not logical (besides the ironic grammar of your retort) is comparing NS2 and it's multitude of snares/blinds/confusers/stuns/slowdowns/fogs to anything you just mentioned. The prevalence of these kinds of abilities is much higher in NS2 than its counterparts (NS1 being the most obvious example) and much of it isn't even necessary in the first place (think gorge spit splash, the pulsating nano effect and the ridiculous cloud of smoke that jetpackers leave behind).
<!--quoteo(post=1952172:date=Jul 17 2012, 03:07 PM:name=Tweadle)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweadle @ Jul 17 2012, 03:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1952172"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What's not logical (besides the ironic grammar of your retort) is comparing NS2 and it's multitude of snares/blinds/confusers/stuns/slowdowns/fogs to anything you just mentioned. The prevalence of these kinds of abilities is much higher in NS2 than its counterparts (NS1 being the most obvious example) and much of it isn't even necessary in the first place (think gorge spit splash, the pulsating nano effect and the ridiculous cloud of smoke that jetpackers leave behind).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> If you don't play the game, then why are you posting here?
I am confused about your examples above: <ul><li>Gorge spit splash meaning the reduction of sight for the marine? I like that effect - shows that a Gorge is shooting you. Maybe its a little intense, but only a slight amount.</li><li>Nano effect "pulsates"? You mean the armor which protects people? It needs to be visible so that Kharaa can know when theres a shield on their target.</li><li>The smoke behind jetpackers is awesome - it adds mood and feeling to the game. Definitely not a "negative" aspect of the game imo.</li></ul>
@Tweadle, i don't know when you last played / saw this game, but: -gorge spit used to slow you down a lot, i think they removed the slowdown completely by now(not sure though). -nano shield (if this is what you are refering to) used to create this dub-steb-sounding ball. they changed the sound and replaced the ball with a shader. -jetpack smoke was reduced.
as for the limiting-abilities: i think the ns1-devour was popular among several players because of the very unusualy concept. however, stomp seems okay to me as it helps the onos with his role of a tank (instead of being a pure killing machine). otherwise, he would probably be too helpless against groups of marines. the lerk spores are bit annoying sometimes (do you take the damage with little direct gain or do you just sit there and wait?) but it does make sense for his dot-role and actually provides quite some tactical depth. but with vortex i have to agree: why of all life-forms does the assassin have a disable-ability (which is clearly not directly intended for killing, it can even make it easier for marines to get away)?
so i guess i'd agree with the solution that the fade challenges all players caught in the vortex by entering the ether himself. it could be interrupted whenever he runs away too far from the vortex. in the end, this could turn out to be a fitting ability for assassinating a specifc target (e.g. the guy with the flamethrower) and gameplay aside, it might actually be nicely scary for the victims as they are suddenly on their own, possibly with sudden and unexpected help from another marine entering the vortex. this also adds another layer of depth as there are now two realms with possible need for teamplay.
If it was to be put the community to vote on whether the Fade should have Vortex or Acid Rocket I could bet my left testicle that the vote would be overwhelmingly for the return of acid rocket.
<!--quoteo(post=1962465:date=Aug 14 2012, 02:48 AM:name=Laosh'Ra)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Laosh'Ra @ Aug 14 2012, 02:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1962465"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->so i guess I'd agree with the solution that the fade challenges all players caught in the vortex by entering the ether himself. it could be interrupted whenever he runs away too far from the vortex. in the end, this could turn out to be a fitting ability for assassinating a specific target (e.g. the guy with the flamethrower) and game-play aside, it might actually be nicely scary for the victims as they are suddenly on their own, possibly with sudden and unexpected help from another marine entering the vortex. this also adds another layer of depth as there are now two realms with possible need for team-play.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Maybe if they removed the vortex ability didn't affect buildings it would be more balanced, right now you can phase out a CC, IP, Prototype Lab, Arms Lab and even the armory... All very crucial buildings during a base raid. Not to mention that a fade can place a vortex in the middle of a group of buildings and get them all...
I like the 1v1 style assassin idea but it would cause other issues... A fade would go into a base and target the low-hp/armory humping marines instead of the shotgun/JP marines. Meaning a single fade could wipe out the entire team one at a time if done properly. For this to work it would have to have a significant cooldown (1min+). I do like the idea though and it fits in well with the fade = assassin plot.
Also the animation needs to be changed as it looks like the comm is recycling, and Hugh can back me up on this as I've watched him cast at least 3-4 games in which he mistakes the vortex for the comm recycling and calls gg. IMO make it the same effect but change the color.
Comments
Well then don't play L4D2, or any game with smokes and flashbang or any MMO, even the low on health in some games have a negative effect, so don't play them also.
That was a not so logical statement.
What's not logical (besides the ironic grammar of your retort) is comparing NS2 and it's multitude of snares/blinds/confusers/stuns/slowdowns/fogs to anything you just mentioned. The prevalence of these kinds of abilities is much higher in NS2 than its counterparts (NS1 being the most obvious example) and much of it isn't even necessary in the first place (think gorge spit splash, the pulsating nano effect and the ridiculous cloud of smoke that jetpackers leave behind).
If you don't play the game, then why are you posting here?
I am confused about your examples above:
<ul><li>Gorge spit splash meaning the reduction of sight for the marine? I like that effect - shows that a Gorge is shooting you. Maybe its a little intense, but only a slight amount.</li><li>Nano effect "pulsates"? You mean the armor which protects people? It needs to be visible so that Kharaa can know when theres a shield on their target.</li><li>The smoke behind jetpackers is awesome - it adds mood and feeling to the game. Definitely not a "negative" aspect of the game imo.</li></ul>
I sure hope not ;)
-gorge spit used to slow you down a lot, i think they removed the slowdown completely by now(not sure though).
-nano shield (if this is what you are refering to) used to create this dub-steb-sounding ball. they changed the sound and replaced the ball with a shader.
-jetpack smoke was reduced.
as for the limiting-abilities:
i think the ns1-devour was popular among several players because of the very unusualy concept. however, stomp seems okay to me as it helps the onos with his role of a tank (instead of being a pure killing machine). otherwise, he would probably be too helpless against groups of marines.
the lerk spores are bit annoying sometimes (do you take the damage with little direct gain or do you just sit there and wait?) but it does make sense for his dot-role and actually provides quite some tactical depth.
but with vortex i have to agree: why of all life-forms does the assassin have a disable-ability (which is clearly not directly intended for killing, it can even make it easier for marines to get away)?
so i guess i'd agree with the solution that the fade challenges all players caught in the vortex by entering the ether himself. it could be interrupted whenever he runs away too far from the vortex. in the end, this could turn out to be a fitting ability for assassinating a specifc target (e.g. the guy with the flamethrower) and gameplay aside, it might actually be nicely scary for the victims as they are suddenly on their own, possibly with sudden and unexpected help from another marine entering the vortex. this also adds another layer of depth as there are now two realms with possible need for teamplay.
If it was to be put the community to vote on whether the Fade should have Vortex or Acid Rocket I could bet my left testicle that the vote would be overwhelmingly for the return of acid rocket.
Maybe if they removed the vortex ability didn't affect buildings it would be more balanced, right now you can phase out a CC, IP, Prototype Lab, Arms Lab and even the armory... All very crucial buildings during a base raid. Not to mention that a fade can place a vortex in the middle of a group of buildings and get them all...
I like the 1v1 style assassin idea but it would cause other issues... A fade would go into a base and target the low-hp/armory humping marines instead of the shotgun/JP marines. Meaning a single fade could wipe out the entire team one at a time if done properly. For this to work it would have to have a significant cooldown (1min+). I do like the idea though and it fits in well with the fade = assassin plot.
Also the animation needs to be changed as it looks like the comm is recycling, and Hugh can back me up on this as I've watched him cast at least 3-4 games in which he mistakes the vortex for the comm recycling and calls gg.
IMO make it the same effect but change the color.
We need acid rocket instead :>
Please consider changes :)