<!--quoteo(post=1913506:date=Mar 15 2012, 04:27 PM:name=paradoxum)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (paradoxum @ Mar 15 2012, 04:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913506"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->why...why.. does anyone even play at that resolution? upgrade your damn computer! this isnt 2005 anymore.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> cuase some people don't have the money to just go out and by a brand new state of they art computer try to be considerate.
•So by removing the Lerk spikes aliens now lack on a heavy DMG atack, Lerk SG could have been so important to deal with exos, dealing a nice DMG against heavy armored units.
•Spaming Shadowstep when you burn results in almost no DMG lost
•Lerk spore effectivnes is increased by 100%
•To high energy costs of bilebomb compared to the DMG output
•Lerk is superb in controling and I love the wing sounds
•Catalyse on hives is OP! Hive shouldn't be caralysable at all, but it's great to prevent that to many players are gestating at the same time when hive 2 rolls out.
•Finally we have some headcrabs in the NS2 universe (shell)
•All marines got Usain Bolt DNA injected, wow thats fast sprinting!
Thank you, UWE, for providing <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/" target="_blank">all the fixes</a> and gameplay additions. I think we need to remember that this game is in beta. Significant gameplay changes are surely being monitored and redesigned if needed.
Concerning the gorge, moving bile bomb to the lerk is a good decision since it used to be more than a support utility. In conjunction with heal spray, being able to run away safely after sniping structures was too low-risk. It was also a game breaker when used on certain marine starts (ex. shipping/server room vents on tram). Now lerks must fly over structures in order to bile bomb and take a risk if marines are in the vicinity.
You guys also forgot about goo wall, which is being worked on in order to make the gorge fit more of a defensive role for his team; it is a true support ability when compared to bile bomb. The new low-hp indicators reinforce the team's decision to make the gorge more defense-oriented. For now, gorges are limited to healing, spitting, building, and increasing construction rate. I think these are more than enough abilities until goo wall is implemented.
-RTs look unbuilt even when they are built (but don't say 'unbuilt' when looking at them) - always -Cysts look unconnected even when connected (and say unconnected, but will not die) - sometimes
Gameplay bugs:
-Before a mini-cyst is dropped it looks like it's connected, but after it is dropped it sais unconnected and dies - sometimes -Holding 'f' sometimes does not do disco-flashlight. It should do it always ;)
Performance:
Same as in 199 for me (around 30-40 fps in early game and spectator mode in general, around 5-15 fps in late game; drops in fights)
EDIT: The whole game starts to feel really great. A fun teamplay shooter and nice commanding with great atmospherics (well, not the one in thirdperson-flashlight ^^).
<!--quoteo(post=1913586:date=Mar 15 2012, 09:30 PM:name=Karnaj)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Karnaj @ Mar 15 2012, 09:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913586"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Concerning the gorge, moving bile bomb to the lerk is a good decision since it used to be more than a support utility. In conjunction with heal spray, being able to run away safely after sniping structures was too low-risk. It was also a game breaker when used on certain marine starts (ex. shipping/server room vents on tram). Now lerks must fly over structures in order to bile bomb and take a risk if marines are in the vicinity.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think it's true that gorge bile-bombing was low risk. It's not hard to chase and kill them, if you ignore all other factors. Once you throw in the gorge's teammates, and counterbalance that with his limited energy supply, things get interesting and the players get to make lots of choices.
With bile bomb on the slow, fragile lerk, the only choices to make are "Bile bomb only when no one is around to shoot me" and "Shoot and easily kill any lerks foolish enough to bile bomb near a marine." That's what people mean when they say these changes are 'watering down' the game.
If lots of gorges were single-handedly winning games in public servers (and we were) because of bile bomb, then it's up to the players to get better at fighting gorges. I don't think adequate time was given to the playerbase for that to happen (especially with new people arriving all the time and learning the game from scratch). This speaks to a larger problem - with mechanics still being tossed aside and replaced every month, how can we expect the game to truly<b> have been tested</b> at release in the summer? It's starting to look like a regular video game beta, where 5 superfriends are actually 'testing' and everyone else is just acting as sources of marketing hype on reddit/twitter/whatever.
Yeah, I don't like the alien commander, either. It just feels wrong.
Bile bombing with the Lerk is morphologically wrong. It's not a bomber, it's a fighter...small and maneuverable. Lerk isn't big enough to carry bile bombs. Give the gorge wings and you'll have a bile bomber.
How bout if the strength of the chamber's effects is determined by the number of hives? Hey, now there's an idea!
Alien flashlight is too much contrast. Something in between would work better.
Was allowing Catalyst to work on hives intentional? When you have 3-4 hives up 10 minutes into the game, the marines are going to have serious problems. I can get a hive up in about 60 seconds by Catalysting it, and there's no "sneaky" about it; that ###### is going up fast, and it's going up wherever I want it to, even under fire (generates HP faster than a marine or two trying to kill it).
<!--quoteo(post=1913615:date=Mar 15 2012, 10:16 PM:name=Shrike3O)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shrike3O @ Mar 15 2012, 10:16 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913615"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Was allowing Catalyst to work on hives intentional? When you have 3-4 hives up 10 minutes into the game, the marines are going to have serious problems. I can get a hive up in about 60 seconds by Catalysting it, and there's no "sneaky" about it; that ###### is going up fast, and it's going up wherever I want it to, even under fire (generates HP faster than a marine or two trying to kill it).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is the kind of stuff that the playtesting group should find before it gets released to thousands of players who are expected to promote the game.
<!--quoteo(post=1913615:date=Mar 16 2012, 03:16 AM:name=Shrike3O)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shrike3O @ Mar 16 2012, 03:16 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913615"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Was allowing Catalyst to work on hives intentional? When you have 3-4 hives up 10 minutes into the game, the marines are going to have serious problems. I can get a hive up in about 60 seconds by Catalysting it, and there's no "sneaky" about it; that ###### is going up fast, and it's going up wherever I want it to, even under fire (generates HP faster than a marine or two trying to kill it).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
A marine or two shouldn't be able to kill a hive anyway. And you still need 75 res for a hive, this is a lot.
<!--quoteo(post=1913618:date=Mar 15 2012, 10:20 PM:name=countbasie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (countbasie @ Mar 15 2012, 10:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913618"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A marine or two shouldn't be able to kill a hive anyway. And you still need 75 res for a hive, this is a lot.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
and aliens got 2nd hives up before this patch too, except now they get them faster and it fundamentally breaks the game because of how powerful fades are
<!--quoteo(post=1913623:date=Mar 15 2012, 10:25 PM:name=internetexplorer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (internetexplorer @ Mar 15 2012, 10:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913623"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->so you haven't played build 199 much huh? because that's when they changed them.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1913615:date=Mar 15 2012, 06:16 PM:name=Shrike3O)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shrike3O @ Mar 15 2012, 06:16 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913615"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Was allowing Catalyst to work on hives intentional? When you have 3-4 hives up 10 minutes into the game, the marines are going to have serious problems. I can get a hive up in about 60 seconds by Catalysting it, and there's no "sneaky" about it; that ###### is going up fast, and it's going up wherever I want it to, even under fire (generates HP faster than a marine or two trying to kill it).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Just played a game where we got 3 hives really quick. However, they built 2 arcs before we got onos up and just walked them into hive. Without bile bomb, it was near impossible to bdestroy the ARCs.
<!--quoteo(post=1913627:date=Mar 15 2012, 10:28 PM:name=Ryne)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ryne @ Mar 15 2012, 10:28 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913627"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Just played a game where we got 3 hives really quick. However, they built 2 arcs before we got onos up and just walked them into hive. Without bile bomb, it was near impossible to bdestroy the ARCs.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
But you still had bile bomb! What were your lerks doing?
<!--quoteo(post=1913594:date=Mar 15 2012, 09:42 PM:name=IeptBarakat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (IeptBarakat @ Mar 15 2012, 09:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913594"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The number fonts, for ammo counters and such. Looks a bit silly now. Too smooth and friendly for the gritty sci-fi world.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
i prefer the previous font also. instead of being able to see the numbers in the corner of my eye i gotta directly look at it now. yeah big whoop but that 1 second is all it takes sometimes.
<!--quoteo(post=1913630:date=Mar 15 2012, 06:29 PM:name=internetexplorer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (internetexplorer @ Mar 15 2012, 06:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913630"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->But you still had bile bomb! What were your lerks doing?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> We "have bile bomb." The current incarnation of bile bomb does less damage per second than spiking the target.
Performance, the only thing that matters, got markedly worse. Sub 30 FPS in combat on a freshly restarted 16p inversion server with an i7 2600k OC'd to 4.4GHz, 8gigs of ram, and a 570 with updated drivers. Combined with constant stuttering and combat jitters. Performance is the sole reason I couldn't play more than 30 minutes of this build. :/
New skulk movement is neat. I've figured out how to build up speed and launch, but it's combat utility seems next to nothing. It takes a few seconds of bouncing around walls to get up any kind of speed and that few seconds gets you killed in combat. There is also no point in using the skill jumps to move faster around the map as most of the time it will slow you down zig zagging from wall to wall, even at 9 or 10 speed. The only use I see for it is in pre-secondhive initial rush at a marine.
Skulk movement still needs a lot of work, though. Right now it revolves so much around leaping from wall to wall, yet the skulk->wall movement is borderline broken. So many times I jump into a wall and just slide down it instead of sticking to it. Mid leap, I can jump with 12 speed from wall to wall to wall just to hit the 4th wall, not stick, and lose all my momentum.
And, my god, what is the deal with fps drops every patch. :(
Server performance is atrocious too. Around 15 ticks during mid-game with constant dips into the single digit region. End-game was even worse. And that is on the powerful servers like Inversion.
Was something changed with the spawn timers? Played as an alien and it felt like I was waiting 30-60 seconds to respawn. 5 of our players died and I literally waited several minutes to spawn.
It seemed a little longer on the marine side too, but I haven't played them as much this build.
<!--quoteo(post=1913506:date=Mar 16 2012, 01:27 AM:name=paradoxum)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (paradoxum @ Mar 16 2012, 01:27 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913506"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->why...why.. does anyone even play at that resolution? upgrade your damn computer! this isnt 2005 anymore.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Even an i7 at 5.0ghz gives sub 20-30 fps. it must be 2025.
<!--quoteo(post=1913661:date=Mar 15 2012, 11:13 PM:name=Codeine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Codeine @ Mar 15 2012, 11:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913661"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Even an i7 at 5.0ghz gives sub 20-30 fps. it must be 2025.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
at that point, it really has to be another aspect of your machine. we've confirmed the CPU is good - what else are you running?
<!--quoteo(post=1913656:date=Mar 15 2012, 07:04 PM:name=BVKnight)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BVKnight @ Mar 15 2012, 07:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913656"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Was something changed with the spawn timers? Played as an alien and it felt like I was waiting 30-60 seconds to respawn. 5 of our players died and I literally waited several minutes to spawn.
It seemed a little longer on the marine side too, but I haven't played them as much this build.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Reduced the time at which subsequent eggs spawn in bigger player-number games to try to fix the close spawn problem<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
seems like if anything you should be spawning faster? maybe a bug?
<!--quoteo(post=1913661:date=Mar 15 2012, 07:13 PM:name=Codeine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Codeine @ Mar 15 2012, 07:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913661"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Even an i7 at 5.0ghz gives sub 20-30 fps. it must be 2025.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
oh, I agree the game runs badly, but running at 720x580 resolution is just silly, why even bother at that point?
I'm still having problems just getting into a game.
-I can load the client fine. -I can bring up the server list fine. -I select a server and I get the loading screen images fine. -I join the server fine... initially
So I find myself in the ready room, I'm connected to the server, I can hit tab and see scores, and the kills display in the top right, everything seems fine. I can even join a team if I do so right away.
My problem is that within 30 seconds of joining the server the screen locks up and I get "Connection problems detected..."
It should be noted the client is still responsive, and I can open console and type 'disconnect' to boot be off the server and back to the main menu.
It should also be noted that this does NOT happen every time. I can sometimes get into a game, but it's only 1 out of every 10-20 attempts.
It didn't used to be this way. In the beginning I used to be able to play, but not anymore. I have my firewall set to allow all the necessary ports to pass through, and I have even disabled my firewall (briefly) to test and see if that made a difference. It did not. I did the same with anti-virus, disabling it (briefly) and finding no change. Nor does changing video settings impact things either.
This was reported in the bug database and the problem is listed as 'open'. There are a pile of us who still can't even join games.
Joined a server, the loading screen went by, saw Beta 199 in the top corner everything else black and that was it no further loading :(
Never happened in other recent builds.
Having more problems than usual with cysts not being connected or not giving the right information.
It's a nice touch to give marines with a welder directions to anything needing repairs. Not sure if you meant for it to direct them to their team mates cos the icon sticks to them poorly, very laggy looking effect as they run around
<!--quoteo(post=1913680:date=Mar 15 2012, 08:43 PM:name=peregrinus)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (peregrinus @ Mar 15 2012, 08:43 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1913680"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It's a nice touch to give marines with a welder directions to anything needing repairs. Not sure if you meant for it to direct them to their team mates cos the icon sticks to them poorly, very laggy looking effect as they run around<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It was probably intended since the same thing happens with gorges and healing other aliens, I like it so long as the effect can be fixed. Most new people don't even realize you can repair player armour with welders.
Comments
cuase some people don't have the money to just go out and by a brand new state of they art computer try to be considerate.
This is going to drive me nuts.
•Spaming Shadowstep when you burn results in almost no DMG lost
•Lerk spore effectivnes is increased by 100%
•To high energy costs of bilebomb compared to the DMG output
•Lerk is superb in controling and I love the wing sounds
•Catalyse on hives is OP! Hive shouldn't be caralysable at all, but it's great to prevent that to many players are gestating at the same time when hive 2 rolls out.
•Finally we have some headcrabs in the NS2 universe (shell)
•All marines got Usain Bolt DNA injected, wow thats fast sprinting!
•Gorge is free again! Bellyslide FTW!
•Duckjump!!! It works!
Great patch so far!
Concerning the gorge, moving bile bomb to the lerk is a good decision since it used to be more than a support utility. In conjunction with heal spray, being able to run away safely after sniping structures was too low-risk. It was also a game breaker when used on certain marine starts (ex. shipping/server room vents on tram). Now lerks must fly over structures in order to bile bomb and take a risk if marines are in the vicinity.
You guys also forgot about goo wall, which is being worked on in order to make the gorge fit more of a defensive role for his team; it is a true support ability when compared to bile bomb. The new low-hp indicators reinforce the team's decision to make the gorge more defense-oriented. For now, gorges are limited to healing, spitting, building, and increasing construction rate. I think these are more than enough abilities until goo wall is implemented.
-RTs look unbuilt even when they are built (but don't say 'unbuilt' when looking at them) - always
-Cysts look unconnected even when connected (and say unconnected, but will not die) - sometimes
Gameplay bugs:
-Before a mini-cyst is dropped it looks like it's connected, but after it is dropped it sais unconnected and dies - sometimes
-Holding 'f' sometimes does not do disco-flashlight. It should do it always ;)
Performance:
Same as in 199 for me (around 30-40 fps in early game and spectator mode in general, around 5-15 fps in late game; drops in fights)
EDIT: The whole game starts to feel really great. A fun teamplay shooter and nice commanding with great atmospherics (well, not the one in thirdperson-flashlight ^^).
I don't think it's true that gorge bile-bombing was low risk. It's not hard to chase and kill them, if you ignore all other factors. Once you throw in the gorge's teammates, and counterbalance that with his limited energy supply, things get interesting and the players get to make lots of choices.
With bile bomb on the slow, fragile lerk, the only choices to make are "Bile bomb only when no one is around to shoot me" and "Shoot and easily kill any lerks foolish enough to bile bomb near a marine." That's what people mean when they say these changes are 'watering down' the game.
If lots of gorges were single-handedly winning games in public servers (and we were) because of bile bomb, then it's up to the players to get better at fighting gorges. I don't think adequate time was given to the playerbase for that to happen (especially with new people arriving all the time and learning the game from scratch). This speaks to a larger problem - with mechanics still being tossed aside and replaced every month, how can we expect the game to truly<b> have been tested</b> at release in the summer? It's starting to look like a regular video game beta, where 5 superfriends are actually 'testing' and everyone else is just acting as sources of marketing hype on reddit/twitter/whatever.
Bile bombing with the Lerk is morphologically wrong. It's not a bomber, it's a fighter...small and maneuverable. Lerk isn't big enough to carry bile bombs. Give the gorge wings and you'll have a bile bomber.
How bout if the strength of the chamber's effects is determined by the number of hives? Hey, now there's an idea!
Alien flashlight is too much contrast. Something in between would work better.
This is the kind of stuff that the playtesting group should find before it gets released to thousands of players who are expected to promote the game.
A marine or two shouldn't be able to kill a hive anyway.
And you still need 75 res for a hive, this is a lot.
And you still need 75 res for a hive, this is a lot.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
and aliens got 2nd hives up before this patch too, except now they get them faster and it fundamentally breaks the game because of how powerful fades are
so you haven't played build 199 much huh? because that's when they changed them.
i didn't command much in 199, no
Just played a game where we got 3 hives really quick. However, they built 2 arcs before we got onos up and just walked them into hive. Without bile bomb, it was near impossible to bdestroy the ARCs.
But you still had bile bomb! What were your lerks doing?
i prefer the previous font also. instead of being able to see the numbers in the corner of my eye i gotta directly look at it now. yeah big whoop but that 1 second is all it takes sometimes.
We "have bile bomb." The current incarnation of bile bomb does less damage per second than spiking the target.
Lerk spike seems to play the impact animation twice, though this could have been my lag.
Lerk alternate fire HUD image is still the shotgun spike, very misleading at first.
Definite frame rate decrease. 30 FPS normal, 10-15 in combat on an i7 quad, GTX 460.
New skulk movement is neat. I've figured out how to build up speed and launch, but it's combat utility seems next to nothing. It takes a few seconds of bouncing around walls to get up any kind of speed and that few seconds gets you killed in combat. There is also no point in using the skill jumps to move faster around the map as most of the time it will slow you down zig zagging from wall to wall, even at 9 or 10 speed. The only use I see for it is in pre-secondhive initial rush at a marine.
Skulk movement still needs a lot of work, though. Right now it revolves so much around leaping from wall to wall, yet the skulk->wall movement is borderline broken. So many times I jump into a wall and just slide down it instead of sticking to it. Mid leap, I can jump with 12 speed from wall to wall to wall just to hit the 4th wall, not stick, and lose all my momentum.
And, my god, what is the deal with fps drops every patch. :(
It seemed a little longer on the marine side too, but I haven't played them as much this build.
Even an i7 at 5.0ghz gives sub 20-30 fps. it must be 2025.
at that point, it really has to be another aspect of your machine. we've confirmed the CPU is good - what else are you running?
It seemed a little longer on the marine side too, but I haven't played them as much this build.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Reduced the time at which subsequent eggs spawn in bigger player-number games to try to fix the close spawn problem<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
seems like if anything you should be spawning faster? maybe a bug?
oh, I agree the game runs badly, but running at 720x580 resolution is just silly, why even bother at that point?
Edit: apologies for the double post
-I can load the client fine.
-I can bring up the server list fine.
-I select a server and I get the loading screen images fine.
-I join the server fine... initially
So I find myself in the ready room, I'm connected to the server, I can hit tab and see scores, and the kills display in the top right, everything seems fine. I can even join a team if I do so right away.
My problem is that within 30 seconds of joining the server the screen locks up and I get "Connection problems detected..."
It should be noted the client is still responsive, and I can open console and type 'disconnect' to boot be off the server and back to the main menu.
It should also be noted that this does NOT happen every time. I can sometimes get into a game, but it's only 1 out of every 10-20 attempts.
It didn't used to be this way. In the beginning I used to be able to play, but not anymore. I have my firewall set to allow all the necessary ports to pass through, and I have even disabled my firewall (briefly) to test and see if that made a difference. It did not. I did the same with anti-virus, disabling it (briefly) and finding no change. Nor does changing video settings impact things either.
This was reported in the bug database and the problem is listed as 'open'. There are a pile of us who still can't even join games.
Never happened in other recent builds.
Having more problems than usual with cysts not being connected or not giving the right information.
It's a nice touch to give marines with a welder directions to anything needing repairs. Not sure if you meant for it to direct them to their team mates cos the icon sticks to them poorly, very laggy looking effect as they run around
It was probably intended since the same thing happens with gorges and healing other aliens, I like it so long as the effect can be fixed. Most new people don't even realize you can repair player armour with welders.