Actually what we really need for this baby is not a cost reduction, it's an expensive full auto upgrade, courtesy of the prototype lab. That or decreased pump time.
hmm
no upgrades = 160 1 upgrade = 170 (or 180 if rounded up) 2 upgrades = 200 3 upgrades = 210 (or 220 if rounded up) which means onos w carapace needs
(60% reduction, yick)
1 shot = 16-(16*60%) = 4 damage to life, 12 absorbed by armor which translates to 40 damage to life and 120 to armor in a point blank shot from an regular shotgun. or maybe 50 life and 110 armor damage, depeding if it rounds up or down. by the second shot, the onos will take... 12 * 7 = 84 damage to armor ( the last 4 will go to life) which damages life by 52+28 (7 absorbed pellets)= 70 leaving the <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> with 390 life. that's 3 more full shotgun hits.
fully upgraded, that will give 21-(21*60%) gives 8 damage to life and 13 absorbed by armor <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> 1 shot 80 life and 130 armor <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> 2 shots 92 + 48 (6 absorbed pellets) life and 70 armor gives 280 life remaining. 2 shogun shots. that makes 4, not 3 to kill <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> .
Why did I post this? I had nothing better to do. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
all this "Damage calculation" is all based on assuming EVERY pellet hits. but the effective range of this gun seems to be =/<3 feet.
I started a topic asking how to actually kill things with the shotty, since this whole thread is full of people saying "jetpack + shooty pwn j00!" and "16x10-2+24-infinityxPi = shotty rules", or "I'm not a n00b so one time I killed 3 fades in one shotz0r!", or "this person is really good with shotgun. so it must be YOU, not the gun". I personally have NEVER been able to kill a fade with shotgun, and I've tried many many times.
Ive shot a fade at 2 metres range with a shotgun 3 times and he lived.....(it was a test......i created a server and got my friend to join....then we tested the shotgun on a stationery fade which was him)
Explain THAT.
Edit : I forgot to mention it took 4 shotgun blasts at a distance of 0 metres to kill an EGG.An EGG.FFS.
Unfortunately, by the time I figure out who on my team knows which end of the gun the bullets come out of, I already have HMGs. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Shotguns don't need to be changed. They aren't a waste early game because, as long as the shotty-marine isn't alone, someone can pick it up if he dies. It can be easily recycled and last forever, and it can be done on a pub server. They aren't a waste late-game because, in the hands of a jetpack-marine, they are an awesome alien-killer. Fades can't touch them when they float just out of reach really fast and pump shotgun shells into their chests and backs. And onos can't even hit them. True, it takes skill, but that's the point. It's an actual option for a skilled player, unlike being a slow-moving turret (hmg/heavy armor).
I killed a fade with 4 shots from a shotgun so I always swear by it. I've also gotten owned with it as a skulk and I don't like it when that happens. Its a great close up weapon if you know how to use it. You all should practice with it every chance you get. You'd be doing your commander a favor since its much cheaper than a hmg and in some cases just as effective.
u are talking to a shot gun master man!! im not going to teach u how to use a shot gun it is going to take for ever to teach u because shot gun is good for one thing 1 shot one kill!!!. heard in sniper and like that but my is shotgun. one shell does 125 i belive in the biginning and it god dam power ful!!!. skull come use ur pistol for a few round out then switch to shot gun and <b>boom</b> dead!!! so dont say that shotgun sucks <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo-->
btw, shotgun vs lerk = skeet shoot. fade vs jetpack = same thing. Never forget that an acid rocket as splash damage. and since the enemy is flying, aim for the ceilings, walls or whatever surface near the marine. sometimes you get lucky and hit the jetpest in the kisser.
matsoMaster of PatchesJoin Date: 2002-11-05Member: 7000Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, Reinforced - Shadow, NS2 Community Developer
<!--QuoteBegin--coil+Nov 16 2002, 08:24 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (coil @ Nov 16 2002, 08:24 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Shotgun is without a doubt the perfect commander weapon for last-ditch defenses. It's also deadly in the hands of a marine who knows how to use it (like [FoR]Storm or Humbaba). I, personally, don't know how to use one well - I don't have the twitch reflexes. But the fact remains that a direct hit WILL kill a skulk or lerk, EVEN IF THEY HAVE CARAPACE LEVEL 3!!! (I think.) That's power.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Mmm... no, a lvl 3 carap skulk will survive a point-blank shotgun. Takes 200 pts of damage to kill one.
Unless you have three weapons upgrades, of course. In which case, it does 210 damage and _does_ kill it.
humbabaThat Exciting Tales From the Frontline GuyJoin Date: 2002-01-25Member: 86Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
A shotgun topic which I missed out on for so long?!?! Well. Let me step in.
The shotgun just is used Differently from any other marine weapon. Putting yourself in a few hypothetical situations, I'll compare the good course of action with a shotty to the good course of action with any other marine weapon.
1. Its early in the game. You hear a skulk coming from around the corner. Carrying any other Marine weapon, the best course of action is to back away as far as possible so you can have the greatest amount of time to shoot the enemy before he reaches you. As a shotgunner, this is not so. Get RIGHT up against that corner. Get twitchy and nervous. Wait. Wait. Wait until you see that alien looking directly into your eyes. Click! BOOM! The end.
2. You hear a fade coming. Your in a corridor. Traditionally, you would crouch, aim at the end of the corridor, and then wait for him to show himself. With a shotgun, the best course of action is to ambush. Duck behind a pillar or support. Play skulk-style. Remember that a shotgunner can kill a fade at point blank in about 3 seconds. As soon as he passes, run right at him and click like mad. I Guarantee that the fade will die. Enemy loses 44 rps right there.
3. A fade is unloading acid rockets at you from a distance. Traditionally, you would aim and fire while strafing. With a shotgun, it is best to run right at him, dodging. Once you get within a few feet, begin unloading shells. I once killed 2 fades in a row strafing alien turret fire with a shotgun.
Bottom line. The shotgun has to be used in an almost alien manner. Regardless, DO NOT fight without other marine weapons as backup. Its like bite. Use ambushign wherever possible. Stay low. And be as twitchy and aimy as possible.
And if you still think Shotguns are useless, we can arrange a match between Storm, Grendel, and me against a bunch of you guys as aliens. I Guarantee you will have Newfound respect for the shotty.
I've heard people saying stuff like, "A carapace upgraded Fade can take 5 or 6 shotgun shots to kill!". I always said this was not true, but as my shotgun aim is not the best, I couldnt prove it by beign a shotgunner.
One day, I was wandering around as Carapace/Adrenal Fade, and saw two Marines. Heedlessly, I blinked next to them and started slashing. One of the marines had a LMG, and only got a few shots on me before I slashed him to death. I started slashing at the other one, but then BLAM BLAM. A few LMG bullets and two shotgun blasts, and I was down.
That's all it takes - two well-aimed shots at point blank range.
I have also personally been a level 3 carapace skulk and died in a SINGLE shotgun shot. No pistols or lmgs adding extra damage. Just BLAM - dead.
At close range, shotguns are easily the 2nd most deadly weapon in the game - only an Onos charge is better. (and the onos can't hit someone who's flying around - in contrast, one shot will down a carapace upgraded Lerk)
Not to mention the fact that once Aliens have fades shotgunners won't have a chance if they work together......
Let's see here...
3 Shotgun Squad vs 2 Fades and a Lerk.... what happens?
Shotgun squad runs foward, Lerk drops an umbera, and litterly turns the shotgun into CRAP. You people forget that Aliens can blow right through a marine squad once they have Fades.... all you need is to load up on Acid Rockets + Umbera and there's nothing that's gonna hit you for that full 160 damage at first... trust me... alot of shotgun pellets will miss...
Comments
hmm
no upgrades = 160
1 upgrade = 170 (or 180 if rounded up)
2 upgrades = 200
3 upgrades = 210 (or 220 if rounded up) which means onos w carapace needs
(60% reduction, yick)
1 shot = 16-(16*60%) = 4 damage to life, 12 absorbed by armor which translates to 40 damage to life and 120 to armor in a point blank shot from an regular shotgun. or maybe 50 life and 110 armor damage, depeding if it rounds up or down.
by the second shot, the onos will take...
12 * 7 = 84 damage to armor ( the last 4 will go to life) which damages life by
52+28 (7 absorbed pellets)= 70
leaving the <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> with 390 life. that's 3 more full shotgun hits.
fully upgraded, that will give 21-(21*60%) gives 8 damage to life and 13 absorbed by armor
<!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> 1 shot 80 life and 130 armor
<!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> 2 shots 92 + 48 (6 absorbed pellets) life and 70 armor
gives 280 life remaining. 2 shogun shots. that makes 4, not 3 to kill <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> .
Why did I post this? I had nothing better to do. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
I started a topic asking how to actually kill things with the shotty, since this whole thread is full of people saying "jetpack + shooty pwn j00!" and "16x10-2+24-infinityxPi = shotty rules", or "I'm not a n00b so one time I killed 3 fades in one shotz0r!", or "this person is really good with shotgun. so it must be YOU, not the gun". I personally have NEVER been able to kill a fade with shotgun, and I've tried many many times.
Explain THAT.
Edit : I forgot to mention it took 4 shotgun blasts at a distance of 0 metres to kill an EGG.An EGG.FFS.
because shot gun is good for one thing 1 shot one kill!!!. heard in sniper and like that but my is shotgun. one shell does 125 i belive in the biginning and it god dam power ful!!!. skull come use ur pistol for a few round out then switch to shot gun and <b>boom</b> dead!!! so dont say that shotgun sucks <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo-->
fade vs jetpack = same thing. Never forget that an acid rocket as splash damage. and since the enemy is flying, aim for the ceilings, walls or whatever surface near the marine. sometimes you get lucky and hit the jetpest in the kisser.
Mmm... no, a lvl 3 carap skulk will survive a point-blank shotgun. Takes 200 pts of damage to kill one.
Unless you have three weapons upgrades, of course. In which case, it does 210 damage and _does_ kill it.
The shotgun just is used Differently from any other marine weapon. Putting yourself in a few hypothetical situations, I'll compare the good course of action with a shotty to the good course of action with any other marine weapon.
1. Its early in the game. You hear a skulk coming from around the corner. Carrying any other Marine weapon, the best course of action is to back away as far as possible so you can have the greatest amount of time to shoot the enemy before he reaches you. As a shotgunner, this is not so.
Get RIGHT up against that corner. Get twitchy and nervous. Wait. Wait. Wait until you see that alien looking directly into your eyes. Click! BOOM! The end.
2. You hear a fade coming. Your in a corridor. Traditionally, you would crouch, aim at the end of the corridor, and then wait for him to show himself. With a shotgun, the best course of action is to ambush. Duck behind a pillar or support. Play skulk-style. Remember that a shotgunner can kill a fade at point blank in about 3 seconds. As soon as he passes, run right at him and click like mad. I Guarantee that the fade will die. Enemy loses 44 rps right there.
3. A fade is unloading acid rockets at you from a distance. Traditionally, you would aim and fire while strafing. With a shotgun, it is best to run right at him, dodging. Once you get within a few feet, begin unloading shells. I once killed 2 fades in a row strafing alien turret fire with a shotgun.
Bottom line. The shotgun has to be used in an almost alien manner. Regardless, DO NOT fight without other marine weapons as backup. Its like bite. Use ambushign wherever possible. Stay low. And be as twitchy and aimy as possible.
And if you still think Shotguns are useless, we can arrange a match between Storm, Grendel, and me against a bunch of you guys as aliens. I Guarantee you will have Newfound respect for the shotty.
One day, I was wandering around as Carapace/Adrenal Fade, and saw two Marines. Heedlessly, I blinked next to them and started slashing. One of the marines had a LMG, and only got a few shots on me before I slashed him to death. I started slashing at the other one, but then BLAM BLAM. A few LMG bullets and two shotgun blasts, and I was down.
That's all it takes - two well-aimed shots at point blank range.
I have also personally been a level 3 carapace skulk and died in a SINGLE shotgun shot. No pistols or lmgs adding extra damage. Just BLAM - dead.
At close range, shotguns are easily the 2nd most deadly weapon in the game - only an Onos charge is better. (and the onos can't hit someone who's flying around - in contrast, one shot will down a carapace upgraded Lerk)
Let's see here...
3 Shotgun Squad vs 2 Fades and a Lerk.... what happens?
Shotgun squad runs foward, Lerk drops an umbera, and litterly turns the shotgun into CRAP. You people forget that Aliens can blow right through a marine squad once they have Fades.... all you need is to load up on Acid Rockets + Umbera and there's nothing that's gonna hit you for that full 160 damage at first... trust me... alot of shotgun pellets will miss...