Summit - Fully exploitable

Skumball

I've just come away from playing a game as aliens on Summit. Unfortunately the marine team had people exploiting the map layout by building turrets in the hive rooms but just outside the scenery. These turrets could fire on the hive and any alien entity but the aliens could not reach the turrets.

The positions were always up high and within the curve where the wall meets the ceiling. For example one position that they chose was directly left from alien start hive, across the bridge and up high where the dome starts to curve. Another place was in Surface Access hive, inside the wall up high immediately to the left of the hive.

Please get this fixed as it ruins the game for everyone.

Tig

<!--quoteo(post=1851325:date=Jun 9 2011, 05:51 PM:name=Skumball)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Skumball @ Jun 9 2011, 05:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851325"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've just come away from playing a game as aliens on Summit. Unfortunately the marine team had people exploiting the map layout by building turrets in the hive rooms but just outside the scenery. These turrets could fire on the hive and any alien entity but the aliens could not reach the turrets.

The positions were always up high and within the curve where the wall meets the ceiling. For example one position that they chose was directly left from alien start hive, across the bridge and up high where the dome starts to curve. Another place was in Surface Access hive, inside the wall up high immediately to the left of the hive.

Please get this fixed as it ruins the game for everyone.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

summit needs more commanderinvisible work for sure, i'm sure psyko is working on it.

McGlaspie

You know...I kind of wish you hadn't posted that here. We'll probably start seeing it show up more now.

Then again, maybe I'm pessimistic.

zastels

ya ###### happens

Deadzone

I've also seen some kind of bug that allowed a marine to be... SOMEWHERE invisible in the geometry while he chopped the hive to death with an axe. I don't know if it's related or not, but it drove us mad hearing that axe attacking over and over while we tried to find the guy.

Kouji_San

<!--quoteo(post=1851342:date=Jun 9 2011, 11:44 PM:name=Deadzone)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Deadzone @ Jun 9 2011, 11:44 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851342"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I've also seen some kind of bug that allowed a marine to be... SOMEWHERE invisible in the geometry while he chopped the hive to death with an axe. I don't know if it's related or not, but it drove us mad hearing that axe attacking over and over while we tried to find the guy.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
perhaps there are holes somewhere where you can go outside the map, I mean with geometry this complex there's bound to be some problems...

VeNeM

that hive on the far right is bugged, items drop to the very bottom lol.

Deadzone

<!--quoteo(post=1851348:date=Jun 9 2011, 06:48 PM:name=VeNeM)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VeNeM @ Jun 9 2011, 06:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851348"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->that hive on the far right is bugged, items drop to the very bottom lol.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

The one with a broken tech point... "cover," right? I do believe that was the one.

basti1337

On summit there is also an exploit where you can get pushed out of the map as skulk... Then you can transform into lerk and fire on every marine building from above through the map ceiling. I've already sent psykoman a PM. I don't know if this can be fixed by him. Maybe its a bug that should be fixed by the devs...

Deadzone

That's something the mapper should be able to fix. Just make the walls complete or a little "thicker" so you can't get popped all the way out. (and just get shoved back inside)

wulf

One thing I told myself, is the success of NS2 will be measured by how much grief there is. Looks like the game is getting better.

Games that aren't fun makes griefing pointless.

ScardyBob

My biggest issue is that matches on summit are unbearably long. I don't think I've seen one at less than an hour, most are a couple of hours.

Helmholz

I think it's a good thing that you've posted it here. Maybe if people start doing it more, the problem will get solved quicker.

IeptBarakat

<!--quoteo(post=1851379:date=Jun 9 2011, 10:13 PM:name=Helmholz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Helmholz @ Jun 9 2011, 10:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851379"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think it's a good thing that you've posted it here. Maybe if people start doing it more, the problem will get solved quicker.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Please don't exploit for the sake of 'getting their attention.'

Koruyo

Prepare your hey forks, and torches!

It was me (sorry :B) - the game went for so long that we had around 100 sentrys placed, every possible research(at times 800 res) but aliens didnt want(were not able to) to finish it. (and my team was nearly empty)
So after i realized that arcs can pretty much go trough walls and on top of the map(siegemode => hive down) nearly everywhere(but they all fell out of the map at some point, and moving them was a pain in the ... so i stoped this) i tried if sentrys and powernodes work too - most ppl of my team left already because of the bad server performance - a lot ghosts remained.(exept 1-2 i think)

I guess ill mark the spots for psyko and send him a pm. (It works on every hive spot, main hive doesnt even need an powernode)

But its pretty hard to do in a real game, you need macs(pres is SO RARE even with 5 rts, i want the rt upgrades back!), then ninja them around the whole map, outmove/and confuse every alien that spots it until it doesnt follow it anymore (+ no hydras on its way, since you cant really dodge shots anymore as it seems) + every spot except one cant bug the mac outside so it stays vulnerable(aliens hear the welding sound, and can attack it) for the 5minutes it takes to build a sentry and a powernode trough the wall.

It took around 15-20min to kill a hive(1 sentry), since aliens placed over 9000 crags (1 single gorge healspraying every 5min would have healed the hives up, but no...) - they still didnt manage to finish us :(

(all you needed to do is 1 fade and 1-2 gorges + kill the mainbase powernode. (or at least gather and go all in, instead you only attacked our base one by one)


The only other possible outcome would have been a never ending game, or a server crash - since i had lots of res left to build 9000 more sentrys in our base. :D


PS: at the middle of the game a single fade managed to destroy the powernode, but he didnt tell did he? all marines down exept me, and not a single alien incomming. (repairing a powernode alone is not fast)

pSyk0mAn

Thanks for the reports.
I'm not sure how much stuff I have to hide for commanders.
Of course, the most important thing is that it works flawlessly, but I assume newer players should be able to recognize the map locations from top-down and thus need as much geometry as possible that adds to visuals without distracting from gameplay.
Plus there is probably a lot that can be done with the engine to fix these issues. nobuild-flags for props, for example, if you have props that don't disturb commander actions, but should not interact with commanders (refuses buildings and spells).

Anyway, hiding more geometry is a rather quick thing to do, so I'll do that until a better solution is found.

SN.Wolf

About the guy chopping away at the hive from within the walls. With clever placement of the PG you can get through the walls on any map and he was most likely chopping on the bits that suspend the hive. The PG was even exploitable in NS1.

Techpunk

Not related to Turrets, though sometime's when evolving to lerk you get stuck outside the map, and can exploit the same situation where you dont get hit outside but can attack players/structures inside the actual map.

Twiggeh

Could you guys please stop helping people to exploit the map? If you have an issue send a PM to Psykoman so he can fix it, there's no need for the rest of the world to know.

Kouji_San

Ah the good old days when we had clipbrushing ay, put in place of outside map areas and it will make any structure either sink, or it's simply not possible to place at all..

More clipbrush types are incoming, but the waiting game is starting once more :P


[edit]
Oh and of course the nobuild brush

BarerRudeROC

Still isn't as bad as the hydra forests found in the earlier builds IMO.

Koruyo

The spots:

<a href="http://imgur.com/a/JCw4U" target="_blank">http://imgur.com/a/JCw4U</a>

At alien start, the marked one doesnt even need a powernode, but cant shoot the hive.

TravCarp

Damn...

Thaldarin

<!--quoteo(post=1851345:date=Jun 9 2011, 11:47 PM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Jun 9 2011, 11:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1851345"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->perhaps there are holes somewhere where you can go outside the map, I mean with geometry this complex there's bound to be some problems...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

The geometry isn't complex. The problem is, the landscaping outside and the way the engine handles and renders it, requires a certain way for it to be built, which causes the problems.