<!--quoteo(post=1760732:date=Mar 23 2010, 04:52 AM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Mar 23 2010, 04:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1760732"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You could try the best collab method I know, which is to get everyone to submit their modifications to you, and then you try and reconcile them yourself.
Takes effort but you get a bit more cohesion between modifications than just getting anyone to checkout the map any time and submit it whenever.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I have no idea how the current system is supposed to be hard. What difference would it make?..
<!--quoteo(post=1760734:date=Mar 23 2010, 04:55 AM:name=Eddie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Eddie @ Mar 23 2010, 04:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1760734"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You were saying?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Huh?
<!--quoteo(post=1760865:date=Mar 23 2010, 04:31 PM:name=Draco_2k)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Draco_2k @ Mar 23 2010, 04:31 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1760865"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Looking good, but that's a terrible lot of lights. You don't really need to illuminate each glowing texture byte, that sort of defeats the point.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Agreed, you need to try to do more with fewer lights. I wouldn't even bother with the tiny console lights, you could probably do a decent job with a single blue light source if you still want them to illuminate the area. The hallway also seems really dark considering all the light models in the area, try brightening up the whole area a bit, and see how it looks.
Call me silly, but approve of the lighting being added to every single little thing...but then I'm a sucker for exaggerated details :P I'm not a mapper either, so probably the lighting has some performance implications and thus it would be better to go with less..humbug I say! :P ....okay ill go away now *slinks away*
<!--quoteo(post=1760996:date=Mar 24 2010, 09:07 AM:name=DrDopehat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DrDopehat @ Mar 24 2010, 09:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1760996"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Call me silly, but approve of the lighting being added to every single little thing...but then I'm a sucker for exaggerated details :P I'm not a mapper either, so probably the lighting has some performance implications and thus it would be better to go with less..humbug I say! :P ....okay ill go away now *slinks away*<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The problem is that too many light sources kills performance. If you're only going to take a screenshot of the level it doesn't really matter, but making the level playable is something every mapper needs to be concerned with
<!--QuoteBegin-"monopolowa"+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE ("monopolowa")</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The problem is that too many light sources kills performance. If you're only going to take a screenshot of the level it doesn't really matter, but making the level playable is something every mapper needs to be concerned with<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I fully expect the engine to be fully optimized for excessive lighting. If you can get away with tons of lights in Unreal Tournament, I see no reason why they wouldn't be able to do the same with this engine. If its simply not possible, then they need to reconsider their full-on-dynamic-lighting strategy in favor of adding some static options for lights that mostly add decoration. Lighting makes or breaks a map in many cases, IMO.
<!--quoteo(post=1761002:date=Mar 24 2010, 10:13 AM:name=monopolowa)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (monopolowa @ Mar 24 2010, 10:13 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761002"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The problem is that too many light sources kills performance. If you're only going to take a screenshot of the level it doesn't really matter, but making the level playable is something every mapper needs to be concerned with<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I totally agree with this. When it came to HL1, this is always a lag issue. Could this follow into NS2?
<!--quoteo(post=1761006:date=Mar 24 2010, 10:28 AM:name=Dalin Seivewright)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dalin Seivewright @ Mar 24 2010, 10:28 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761006"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I fully expect the engine to be fully optimized for excessive lighting. If you can get away with tons of lights in Unreal Tournament, I see no reason why they wouldn't be able to do the same with this engine. If its simply not possible, then they need to reconsider their full-on-dynamic-lighting strategy in favor of adding some static options for lights that mostly add decoration. Lighting makes or breaks a map in many cases, IMO.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Even if the engine is capable of doing so, we (the mappers,) still need to think about the players who are still aren't on the high bandwidth train.
I'll be playing with the lighting again today :] Unless someone else would like a crack at it.
<!--quoteo(post=1761006:date=Mar 24 2010, 05:28 PM:name=Dalin Seivewright)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dalin Seivewright @ Mar 24 2010, 05:28 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761006"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I fully expect the engine to be fully optimized for excessive lighting. If you can get away with tons of lights in Unreal Tournament, I see no reason why they wouldn't be able to do the same with this engine.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> UT uses pre-computed lighting like most game engines. But yeah, if you look at pre-alpha footage, UW are clearly using tons of lights for their stuff.
<!--quoteo(post=1761012:date=Mar 24 2010, 06:33 PM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Mar 24 2010, 06:33 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761012"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I totally agree with this. When it came to HL1, this is always a lag issue. Could this follow into NS2?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> All lights in NS2 are dynamic, and so every one has a performance hit. This should not be in any way large hit, however, even going by the pre-alpha footage: the engine is designed to be this way.
Right now, however, Spark doesn't handle too many lights all too well. Two dozen or so completely kills performance on my rig.
<!--quoteo(post=1761026:date=Mar 24 2010, 12:35 PM:name=Draco_2k)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Draco_2k @ Mar 24 2010, 12:35 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761026"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Right now, however, Spark doesn't handle too many lights all too well. Two dozen or so completely kills performance on my rig.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Same here. I have a 4gb RAM system, 3.0ghz Quad Core processor, and a few of the lights literally kills my machine.
Here's the file from my last edit. ENJOY!
EDIT: Edited the last file. There were random anomalies that had came up when editing the map. Random lights and light spots were being formed from previous works that weren't deleted.
<!--quoteo(post=1761037:date=Mar 24 2010, 08:13 PM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Mar 24 2010, 08:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761037"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Here's the file from my last edit. ENJOY!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Great work there, it's starting to take some shape now. Any screenshots of the final product?..
I'll wait on calling dibs for a while on the off-chance that someone else cares about this topic.
PS: You had like a hundred lights floating off in the space away from the level.
<!--quoteo(post=1761037:date=Mar 24 2010, 08:13 PM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Mar 24 2010, 08:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761037"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Could a developer please shed some "light" on this issue? We'd like to know if there are any decisions in the making to enhance the editor?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> It's a pre-alpha: there is no optimisation at all in the editor right now. Plus, the editor will always perform worse than the game, because it has to keep data in a different format.
<!--quoteo(post=1761167:date=Mar 25 2010, 07:50 PM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Mar 25 2010, 07:50 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761167"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Draco, it's your turn for dibs if you want :]<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Kinda busy at the moment. Doesn't seem like anyone else's interested, anyway.
Just wanted to say i really like this idea. once the map is done though will someone be givene it (like you Draco) to basically have the last edit and just make sure its all of a theme and works well together.
To blend the map togther into one coherant experience or something.
I might grab it at some point, even if its just to put 1 prop in so when i am playing i can stop from time to time to marvel at the damn best placed prop in the game.
<!--quoteo(post=1761208:date=Mar 26 2010, 12:49 AM:name=KhazModan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KhazModan @ Mar 26 2010, 12:49 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761208"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Just wanted to say i really like this idea. once the map is done though will someone be givene it (like you Draco) to basically have the last edit and just make sure its all of a theme and works well together.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I planned to do this occasionally.
<!--quoteo(post=1761208:date=Mar 26 2010, 12:49 AM:name=KhazModan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KhazModan @ Mar 26 2010, 12:49 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761208"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I might grab it at some point, even if its just to put 1 prop in so when i am playing i can stop from time to time to marvel at the damn best placed prop in the game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Do you really think anything playable will come out of this? :p
UnlceRay: I've downloaded your version just to see and there are things missing, lights in wrong spots, kinda buggy. You might want to not Zip it or use another server because it seems the file isn't correct.
Download it yourself to see if it happens, it might be me (but I doubt it).
Pipi, did you check the layers window? (f7). There's a minor bug where some layers will vanish some of the lights, floors, and other things when they're not supposed to.
Comments
Takes effort but you get a bit more cohesion between modifications than just getting anyone to checkout the map any time and submit it whenever.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have no idea how the current system is supposed to be hard. What difference would it make?..
<!--quoteo(post=1760734:date=Mar 23 2010, 04:55 AM:name=Eddie)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Eddie @ Mar 23 2010, 04:55 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1760734"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You were saying?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Huh?
Besides, you don't want to be on a plane. The air quality there is bad for your health.
<img src="http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/2227/sparksc5hallway.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/6363/sparksc6hallway.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/1296/sparksc7hallway.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Agreed, you need to try to do more with fewer lights. I wouldn't even bother with the tiny console lights, you could probably do a decent job with a single blue light source if you still want them to illuminate the area. The hallway also seems really dark considering all the light models in the area, try brightening up the whole area a bit, and see how it looks.
I'm not a mapper either, so probably the lighting has some performance implications and thus it would be better to go with less..humbug I say! :P ....okay ill go away now *slinks away*
I'm not a mapper either, so probably the lighting has some performance implications and thus it would be better to go with less..humbug I say! :P ....okay ill go away now *slinks away*<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The problem is that too many light sources kills performance. If you're only going to take a screenshot of the level it doesn't really matter, but making the level playable is something every mapper needs to be concerned with
I fully expect the engine to be fully optimized for excessive lighting. If you can get away with tons of lights in Unreal Tournament, I see no reason why they wouldn't be able to do the same with this engine. If its simply not possible, then they need to reconsider their full-on-dynamic-lighting strategy in favor of adding some static options for lights that mostly add decoration. Lighting makes or breaks a map in many cases, IMO.
I totally agree with this. When it came to HL1, this is always a lag issue. Could this follow into NS2?
<!--quoteo(post=1761006:date=Mar 24 2010, 10:28 AM:name=Dalin Seivewright)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dalin Seivewright @ Mar 24 2010, 10:28 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761006"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I fully expect the engine to be fully optimized for excessive lighting. If you can get away with tons of lights in Unreal Tournament, I see no reason why they wouldn't be able to do the same with this engine. If its simply not possible, then they need to reconsider their full-on-dynamic-lighting strategy in favor of adding some static options for lights that mostly add decoration. Lighting makes or breaks a map in many cases, IMO.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Even if the engine is capable of doing so, we (the mappers,) still need to think about the players who are still aren't on the high bandwidth train.
I'll be playing with the lighting again today :] Unless someone else would like a crack at it.
UT uses pre-computed lighting like most game engines. But yeah, if you look at pre-alpha footage, UW are clearly using tons of lights for their stuff.
<!--quoteo(post=1761012:date=Mar 24 2010, 06:33 PM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Mar 24 2010, 06:33 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761012"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I totally agree with this. When it came to HL1, this is always a lag issue. Could this follow into NS2?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
All lights in NS2 are dynamic, and so every one has a performance hit. This should not be in any way large hit, however, even going by the pre-alpha footage: the engine is designed to be this way.
Right now, however, Spark doesn't handle too many lights all too well. Two dozen or so completely kills performance on my rig.
Same here. I have a 4gb RAM system, 3.0ghz Quad Core processor, and a few of the lights literally kills my machine.
Here's the file from my last edit. ENJOY!
EDIT: Edited the last file. There were random anomalies that had came up when editing the map. Random lights and light spots were being formed from previous works that weren't deleted.
<a href="http://www.megaupload.com/?d=KBE66OXE" target="_blank">http://www.megaupload.com/?d=KBE66OXE</a>
Could a developer please shed some "light" on this issue? We'd like to know if there are any decisions in the making to enhance the editor?
Great work there, it's starting to take some shape now. Any screenshots of the final product?..
I'll wait on calling dibs for a while on the off-chance that someone else cares about this topic.
PS: You had like a hundred lights floating off in the space away from the level.
<!--quoteo(post=1761037:date=Mar 24 2010, 08:13 PM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Mar 24 2010, 08:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761037"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Could a developer please shed some "light" on this issue? We'd like to know if there are any decisions in the making to enhance the editor?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's a pre-alpha: there is no optimisation at all in the editor right now. Plus, the editor will always perform worse than the game, because it has to keep data in a different format.
<a href="http://www.megaupload.com/?d=KBE66OXE" target="_blank">http://www.megaupload.com/?d=KBE66OXE</a>
<img src="http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/4855/sparksc8hallway.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/4758/sparksc9hallway.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<img src="http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/2581/sparksc10hallway.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Kinda busy at the moment. Doesn't seem like anyone else's interested, anyway.
To blend the map togther into one coherant experience or something.
I might grab it at some point, even if its just to put 1 prop in so when i am playing i can stop from time to time to marvel at the damn best placed prop in the game.
I planned to do this occasionally.
<!--quoteo(post=1761208:date=Mar 26 2010, 12:49 AM:name=KhazModan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KhazModan @ Mar 26 2010, 12:49 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761208"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I might grab it at some point, even if its just to put 1 prop in so when i am playing i can stop from time to time to marvel at the damn best placed prop in the game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Do you really think anything playable will come out of this? :p
Download it yourself to see if it happens, it might be me (but I doubt it).
Do you mean lights off-set from their source? Yeah, designers do that to get a better effect with the illusion of the light appearing correct.
Open an instance of spark. Then open the directory your level file is in. Drag the level file to the 3D view of Spark to open the file.
Hopefully that helps.