For example the Squad leader can be clipped therefore allowing him to block marines in his squad. Marines taking hit damage cannot clip through other marines for x seconds after last damage received.
For Purposes of stacking if it is a valid tactic wanted by the devs, then clipping from above still works.
For example the Squad leader can be clipped therefore allowing him to block marines in his squad. Marines taking hit damage cannot clip through other marines for x seconds after last damage received.
For Purposes of stacking if it is a valid tactic wanted by the devs, then clipping from above still works.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory had a solution that worked well. You can push people around when you press 'USE' button. Just bumping into teammates won't push them away. I really liked that solution.
Another idea would be to make Onos hitbox start a bit above the ground, so skulks can actually run between their legs. Onos teamkilling skulks by default wouldn't be bad, either, considering skulk is a disposable lifeform and Onos is not. Skulks would quickly learn to keep their distance.
<!--quoteo(post=1711404:date=Jun 9 2009, 09:45 AM:name=borsuk)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (borsuk @ Jun 9 2009, 09:45 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1711404"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->How about a minor refinement, though - make the hitbox "diamond-shaped" rather than "square-shaped" ? The same size, the same shape actually, just rotated 45 degrees. Presumably it would make two players who hit each other slide away. Skulks and other aliens would still be able to use marines as living shields.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm pretty sure collision boxes in NS1 are cylinder shaped, not square shaped. The idea behind that is that it doesn't make a difference which way you are facing, so you can't wedge yourself into a space where you can't turn freely.
That said, I'm not exactly sure why 2 cylinders running into each other don't slide past each other already. They must be velcro-cylinders or something.
<!--quoteo(post=1711595:date=Jun 10 2009, 05:09 PM:name=Kwil)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kwil @ Jun 10 2009, 05:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1711595"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It often is, but this issue isn't one of them. One key thing to remember that differentiates NS from other games is that the battles often find themselves happening in cramped and tight quarters, often in areas which are specifically designed so that people cannot pass each other. So if you're a gorge running from fire, you cant' just breeze past the skulks coming the other way and let them take the fire/fall while saving your res. Or if a marine train is chugging through the vent, you just need to attack one knowing that the others can't do a thing until the first one goes down.
Being able to simply slide by your teammates ruins that immersion and feeling of oppressiveness. Ultimately, it makes the experience less of scare/thrill than it could be, and hence less NS.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> You make some valid points there Kwil.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm pretty sure collision boxes in NS1 are cylinder shaped, not square shaped. The idea behind that is that it doesn't make a difference which way you are facing, so you can't wedge yourself into a space where you can't turn freely.
That said, I'm not exactly sure why 2 cylinders running into each other don't slide past each other already. They must be velcro-cylinders or something.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> No, it's rectangles, but the Hitbox clips through Walls. The Model does not. Most of it at least. Didn't ever had Lerkwings or Skulkmaws clip through a Door or something?
<!--quoteo(post=1711765:date=Jun 11 2009, 03:20 AM:name=RobB)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RobB @ Jun 11 2009, 03:20 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1711765"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No, it's rectangles, but the Hitbox clips through Walls. The Model does not. Most of it at least. Didn't ever had Lerkwings or Skulkmaws clip through a Door or something?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're confusing "hitboxes" with "collision boxes". The Hitbox is used to calculate whether or not a bullet hurts you, and the collision box is used to calculate whether or not you can sucessfully walk forward into that next space.
The hitbox can in theory be any shape that the developers want to make it. In the early versions of NS it was the same as the collision box, but later it was improved to actually line up with the model, at least mostly.
The collision box is much more limited -- the Halflife Engine demands that all collision boxes be in the shape of cylinders, and you can only define about three different sizes of collision box (theres one for skulks / crouching marines, one for standing marines / crouching Onos, and one for standing Onos. The last one is zero-sized and used for engine things that I don't understand.)
When your collision box runs into a wall, you can often slide along the wall at an angle. When your collision box runs into the collision box of another player, you come to a dead stop. I'm not sure exactly why the two scenarios are different though. Hopefully the NS2 engine will let collision boxes slide past each other, assuming they didn't run into each other head-on. I would be surprised if they stopped using cylinders though, cylinders make a lot of things much easier.
Comments
For example the Squad leader can be clipped therefore allowing him to block marines in his squad. Marines taking hit damage cannot clip through other marines for x seconds after last damage received.
For Purposes of stacking if it is a valid tactic wanted by the devs, then clipping from above still works.
For example the Squad leader can be clipped therefore allowing him to block marines in his squad. Marines taking hit damage cannot clip through other marines for x seconds after last damage received.
For Purposes of stacking if it is a valid tactic wanted by the devs, then clipping from above still works.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory had a solution that worked well. You can push people around when you press 'USE' button. Just bumping into teammates won't push them away. I really liked that solution.
Another idea would be to make Onos hitbox start a bit above the ground, so skulks can actually run between their legs. Onos teamkilling skulks by default wouldn't be bad, either, considering skulk is a disposable lifeform and Onos is not. Skulks would quickly learn to keep their distance.
I'm pretty sure collision boxes in NS1 are cylinder shaped, not square shaped. The idea behind that is that it doesn't make a difference which way you are facing, so you can't wedge yourself into a space where you can't turn freely.
That said, I'm not exactly sure why 2 cylinders running into each other don't slide past each other already. They must be velcro-cylinders or something.
One key thing to remember that differentiates NS from other games is that the battles often find themselves happening in cramped and tight quarters, often in areas which are specifically designed so that people cannot pass each other. So if you're a gorge running from fire, you cant' just breeze past the skulks coming the other way and let them take the fire/fall while saving your res. Or if a marine train is chugging through the vent, you just need to attack one knowing that the others can't do a thing until the first one goes down.
Being able to simply slide by your teammates ruins that immersion and feeling of oppressiveness. Ultimately, it makes the experience less of scare/thrill than it could be, and hence less NS.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You make some valid points there Kwil.
That said, I'm not exactly sure why 2 cylinders running into each other don't slide past each other already. They must be velcro-cylinders or something.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No, it's rectangles, but the Hitbox clips through Walls. The Model does not. Most of it at least.
Didn't ever had Lerkwings or Skulkmaws clip through a Door or something?
Didn't ever had Lerkwings or Skulkmaws clip through a Door or something?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're confusing "hitboxes" with "collision boxes". The Hitbox is used to calculate whether or not a bullet hurts you, and the collision box is used to calculate whether or not you can sucessfully walk forward into that next space.
The hitbox can in theory be any shape that the developers want to make it. In the early versions of NS it was the same as the collision box, but later it was improved to actually line up with the model, at least mostly.
The collision box is much more limited -- the Halflife Engine demands that all collision boxes be in the shape of cylinders, and you can only define about three different sizes of collision box (theres one for skulks / crouching marines, one for standing marines / crouching Onos, and one for standing Onos. The last one is zero-sized and used for engine things that I don't understand.)
When your collision box runs into a wall, you can often slide along the wall at an angle. When your collision box runs into the collision box of another player, you come to a dead stop. I'm not sure exactly why the two scenarios are different though. Hopefully the NS2 engine will let collision boxes slide past each other, assuming they didn't run into each other head-on. I would be surprised if they stopped using cylinders though, cylinders make a lot of things much easier.