Art Style of NS2's TSA versus Halo3 Marine Corps
the_x5
the Xzianthian Join Date: 2004-03-02 Member: 27041Members, Constellation
the Xzianthian Join Date: 2004-03-02 Member: 27041Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">How are they going to differ?</div>Given all the trailers we've been seeing and Halo: Arms Race depiction of those space marines, I'm curious how NS2 is going to differentiate its TSA marines besides a TSA logo. This is something we should think through during this phase of concept art creation because to be honest, more people will have heard of Halo 3 than NS2. (at least just at first I hope, then we can take over the world <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> )
Comments
--Scythe--
So you all are saying the NS space marines are unique because of TSA symbols and robocop-like helmets? <_<
No, they are not different enough JJJ1. I'm suprised you don't see that... <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
So you all are saying the NS space marines are unique because of TSA symbols and robocop-like helmets? <_<
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Or perhaps it is just you that thinks they're so alike.
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I would make sure that their armor is easily identifiable more than just a helmet. For example, the Stormtroopers in Star Wars. Even when they did the recreated "early" Stormtroopers in Episodes II and III it was visually identifiable.
Animations go a long way. The marines in Gears of War are identifiable by their almost grotesque body builds and their maneuverability actions with solid feeling animations (roadie run, shifting from pillar to pillar, chainsawing a guy in half, etc)
Another way still to make your marines unique would be to give them character and variation. Allow users to customize their appearance with different models. This was already brought up in my topic about the female player base in NS. It's kind of hard to create a plot with characters without a single player but it can be done.
Yes perhaps it's just me KFDM, but I don't think it is just me for one and secondly why not?
<!--quoteo(post=1639633:date=Jul 19 2007, 11:40 AM:name=Pikminwars)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pikminwars @ Jul 19 2007, 11:40 AM) [snapback]1639633[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This topic needs comparison pics.
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Yes, I'll post some later.
Another way still to make your marines unique would be to give them character and variation. Allow users to customize their appearance with different models. This was already brought up in my topic about the female player base in NS. It's kind of hard to create a plot with characters without a single player but it can be done.
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you had me vaguely nodding till about then ... this isn't the sims and "custom" player models is just useless frills on a frilly dress <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
<img src="http://media.teamxbox.com/dailyposts/halo2bios/05marines.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" /><img src="http://media.teamxbox.com/dailyposts/halo2bios/04odsts.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
from: <a href="http://features.teamxbox.com/xbox/899/Halo-2-Bios-Blowout/p2/" target="_blank">http://features.teamxbox.com/xbox/899/Halo...ios-Blowout/p2/</a>
vs.
<img src="http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/7027/111654214e1df47aa3ig9.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
I don't think you have a strong case tbh
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None of the people who have replied thus far do. JJJ1 in particular not agreeing means nothing will be done. That's fine, just when those few people think the NS marines are blasé space marines I'll make sure to point out who the people were that made it that way.
All I'm asking for is something artistically or animation wise to make them have an identifiable visual motif, something that if somebody was describing a model's animation of an ability or a silhouette on a T-Shirt it'd be easy to identify as, "Hey, that's a TSA marine from Natural-Selection 2!"
I think they are fine and dandy the way they are <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
None of the people who have replied thus far do. JJJ1 in particular not agreeing means nothing will be done. That's fine, just when those few people think the NS marines are blasé space marines I'll make sure to point out who the people were that made it that way.
All I'm asking for is something artistically or animation wise to make them have an identifiable visual motif, something that if somebody was describing a model's animation of an ability or a silhouette on a T-Shirt it'd be easy to identify as, "Hey, that's a TSA marine from Natural-Selection 2!"
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Then take another look at the picture and pick one.
The TSA logo on their helmet, the bright blue visor, the larger and bulkier chest plate with a light on it, the considerably smaller number of bags and lack of camoflage patterning. The weapons are also part of marine design and are particularly distinct from other weapons in similar games.
All of these things make them perfectly distinguishable.
None of the people who have replied thus far do. JJJ1 in particular not agreeing means nothing will be done. That's fine, just when those few people think the NS marines are blas space marines I'll make sure to point out who the people were that made it that way.
All I'm asking for is something artistically or animation wise to make them have an identifiable visual motif, something that if somebody was describing a model's animation of an ability or a silhouette on a T-Shirt it'd be easy to identify as, "Hey, that's a TSA marine from Natural-Selection 2!"
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We are updating the designs, but not radically, and not with as much focus on how iconic they will look as how they will compliment the gameplay.
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Fair enough, but if I may ask for two things:
1. Share with the community and get feedback to help improve and refine the design for those "updates". Community feedback helps so immensely yet I can't understand the developer's arrogance that makes developers choose to ignore feedback. An good artist knows feedback and constructive criticism will help you improve your art. Why can't we consider game development in all of its aspects an art? Even the source coding is an artform in my definition.
2. Expand the movement abilities and their animations to make it have the best of the gaming world in one package
(boosting other marines, climbing ladders, sliding on a knee around that corner, peeking around corners, aiming down the sights of the gun, sprinting, diving, fying, throwing a ****ing tuba-- Whatever it is, give us some new moves and fluid, <i>quality</i> animations. I already outlined my angst with immersion killer with the crappy-looking lack of ladder animations in another thread)
I do have to disagree with the need for allowing them to throw tubas. While the idea has merit I can't imagine the outcome being worth the amount of time (not to mention complexity) it would add to finishing the game.
Just creating a different way of walking around might be enough to make it obvious that whatever they are the Frontiersman aren't your typical Soldier Marines.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I do have to disagree with the need for allowing them to throw tubas. While the idea has merit I can't imagine the outcome being worth the amount of time (not to mention complexity) it would add to finishing the game. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Heh, that was humor there my friend. I'm mostly serious, but I can have a bit of a sarcastic edge at times. I do have a sense of humor and get people to laugh even though I rarely ever show that side of me on forums and even less in the I&S, so I can understand the confusion. No I would never seriousy condone the immersion breaking aspect of throwing brass instruments at skulks and gorges no matter how hysterical it may be to see. Actually, that line about the "****ing tuba" was an allegory to a short film Kevin Pereira made before he landed a big contract with G4 called "Quake in Real Life". It was my way of making an <a href="http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/epigram" target="_blank">epigram</a> to express "if you still hate these possible suggestions please for the love of kittens just give us something"
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Though now I have fears of a tuba throwing mod being written even as you read this.
1. Share with the community and get feedback to help improve and refine the design for those "updates". Community feedback helps so immensely yet I can't understand the developer's arrogance that makes developers choose to ignore feedback. An good artist knows feedback and constructive criticism will help you improve your art. Why can't we consider game development in all of its aspects an art? Even the source coding is an artform in my definition.
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Frankly, given the quality of feedback that developers can expect to receive from people like you, there's a reason they don't consult with the masses on every single decision they make. I know it's <i>really</i> easy to point out all the silly mistakes that everyone else is making, but it's not arrogance that's making them choose their judgement over yours. They're game developers. They know what they're doing. If you had even the slightest ability to do any of this stuff you're so keen to request partial control over, your place would be actually doing it, not signing off and offering your own opinions without having to back them up with actual work. Artists get constructive criticism from other artists, not from the gaggle of fans hanging out on the message boards blabbering about "entropy" in maps and complaining that two space marine designs, which compared to the conventions of every other sci-fi character design over the years are far more divergent than they could be and still be considered perfectly fine, and that's not a case of "arrogance" or an effort to ignore the fans. It's just how it works. Make a game some day, and try just for a second to even consider half the crap people think is helpful that they post in the discussion forums. It's impossible.
In terms of looks I really dont see the similarity. I agree with what you mean about having unique animations, but x5, have some faith in the devs.
Animations are something the source engine can handle well, even if the .qc process for character animations can have you pulling your hair out at times. I'm sure the devs will take advatange of it, and give us animations that feel natural to the NS atmosphere.