I'm only about halfway through the book, but I can't say I'm too fond of the main character. He's a bit too cocksure for me. Although, I do really like the a lot of things about the book. And I have a feeling something'll happen at the end and I'll forget I ever disliked something about the book. But, just figured I'd share.
<!--quoteo(post=1662316:date=Nov 29 2007, 06:27 PM:name=Crono5)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Crono5 @ Nov 29 2007, 06:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1662316"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm only about halfway through the book, but I can't say I'm too fond of the main character. He's a bit too cocksure for me. Although, I do really like the a lot of things about the book. And I have a feeling something'll happen at the end and I'll forget I ever disliked something about the book. But, just figured I'd share.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
He's cocksure in the "present," or he was cocksure in his youth? If it's the second, well, yeah, that's the idea. Teenagers are all cocksure. If you're talking about him in the present, well, I'd disagree.
Well I am just annoyed when the main character seems to do be able to do everything so perfectly. It feels like the books a bit melodramatic or cheesy in spots, and the main character seems to have very few flaws, and no major ones (because his arrogance hasn't really caused him to make a serious mistake yet).
However, I do like a lot of aspects of the book, especially character's names and the names of the coins of their money and such. I also like a lot of the secondary characters. I think I like Bast, but I don't really know enough about him to be sure. But at any rate, at Kvothe's personality at this point in the book is really grating (I'm still in his past, where he narrates the story).
It's important to distinguish between past and present, because when he's narrating the past, he's not being objective and everything. He's telling it like he remembers it, which is a mix of being hard on himself and being pretty sure of himself back then. He's definitely incredibly talented, but I'd disagree that he doesn't have any big flaws. His aptitude at lots of stuff is a big part of the story, and I at least felt like it wasn't a big old "oh he's awesome at everything" cop out like it could have been.
Well, I just finished it, and while I maintain that the book could tend to get somewhat obnoxious in the beginning/middle, it really picked up at the end and I really enjoyed it, overall.
That, and I guess I'm just proud of myself for finishing it finally, and I want the world to know. Go me.
My girlfriend bought me this book for my birthday after I told her about it (thanks to this thread).
So far, I've only gotten to the bit where <span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>the main character starts narrating his past</span> but I'm really enjoying it so far.
I bought it, read it in under a week, want the sequel in my hands this exact moment. I haven't been so engrossed in a book (or any entertainment...) since I first read Snow Crash. Amazing, great characters, and the tension towards the end with the scene between Bast and Chronicler was so unexpected and violent that you could almost feel it through the pages.
I really, really, really hope this turns into a long series.
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
So this a bit of a necro but I remembered this question: <!--quoteo(post=1659730:date=Nov 7 2007, 12:28 PM:name=digz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(digz @ Nov 7 2007, 12:28 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1659730"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->From the description of the book, seems like a rip of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthsea" target="_blank">EarthSea</a> by Ursula K. Le Guin. What is it about his writing that sets him apart from other authors?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> And Ursula K. Le Guin recently aswered the question herself so I thought I'd share. <!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=Ursula K. Le Guin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ursula K. Le Guin)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->"It is a rare and great pleasure to find a fantasist writing not only with the kind of accuracy of language absolutely essential to fantasy-making, but with real music in the words as well. Wherever Pat Rothfuss goes with the big story that begins with The Name of the Wind he'll carry us with his as a good singer carries us through a song."<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
She actually doesn't mention what sets Rothfuss apart from her, but hey, that's an awesome quote from an awesome author <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" /> I just started reading <i>The Lathe of Heaven</i> by her and it's pretty neat.
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
Well the question was "What is it about his writing that sets him apart from other authors?" and her quote is "It is a rare and great pleasure to find a fantasist writing not only with the kind of accuracy of language..." implying that he is rare and differentiated from other authors. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
<!--quoteo(post=1660601:date=Nov 14 2007, 08:46 PM:name=TychoCelchuuu)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TychoCelchuuu @ Nov 14 2007, 08:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1660601"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The author sometimes has trouble making his rent, and writes an absolutely amazing book, and for his trouble gets nothing from you? Cute. At least check it out of the library.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Oh FFS. As if getting something for free online is different than getting it for free from a building. Realistically. Things like libraries wouldn't even exist right now if the copyright laws applied to them the way they apply to the internet.
I think everyone in sociaty already innately understands this, but it's fundamentally wrong to take something like a book, which can be copied for free, and charge per copy overhead on it. This isn't to say that artists and authors don't deserve credit and payment for their work, but the reality of the situation is that the rules of sociaty are failing us, and they are failing them. That's not the fault of the consumer who can't afford the book they want to read.
<!--quoteo(post=1671675:date=Feb 29 2008, 12:01 AM:name=Swiftspear)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Swiftspear @ Feb 29 2008, 12:01 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1671675"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh FFS. As if getting something for free online is different than getting it for free from a building. Realistically. Things like libraries wouldn't even exist right now if the copyright laws applied to them the way they apply to the internet.
I think everyone in sociaty already innately understands this, but it's fundamentally wrong to take something like a book, which can be copied for free, and charge per copy overhead on it. This isn't to say that artists and authors don't deserve credit and payment for their work, but the reality of the situation is that the rules of sociaty are failing us, and they are failing them. That's not the fault of the consumer who can't afford the book they want to read.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Libraries pay for the books, though. When you check them out, they note the increased interest in it and consider purchasing more copies. Getting it online doesn't do any of this.
If no 'per copy overhead' was charged then every author would have to somehow make enough money instantly and never make any more money from sales. That's completely unworkable. An author should be paid based on how many copies of the book sell, as should the publisher and the bookstore. You can't have a magic world where veryone gets paid no matter how many copies are sold.
<!--quoteo(post=1671676:date=Feb 29 2008, 01:20 AM:name=TychoCelchuuu)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TychoCelchuuu @ Feb 29 2008, 01:20 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1671676"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Libraries pay for the books, though. When you check them out, they note the increased interest in it and consider purchasing more copies. Getting it online doesn't do any of this.
If no 'per copy overhead' was charged then every author would have to somehow make enough money instantly and never make any more money from sales. That's completely unworkable. An author should be paid based on how many copies of the book sell, as should the publisher and the bookstore. You can't have a magic world where veryone gets paid no matter how many copies are sold.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Someone paid for the book that got copied and put online too. Why should the publisher and bookstore get paid money to make paper copies of books that are not needed? It's not like the internet is an entirely unprofitable venture either, how can a company like Google, who never charges any user a dime for anything be worth over a billion dollars if that's not the case? Copyright cases have just sort of arbitrarily decided on a value that makes internet distribution, even if it's attempted in such a way that DOES ultimately pay the content creator (see the failure of internet radio). Frankly, once again, it's not the consumers fault if sociaty fails them and the artist.
I can appreciate that it's often uncomfortable to shift paradigms in cases like this where many jobs legitimately depend on the old system, but ultimately, in this case it is flat out morally wrong to keep the old system and ditch the new one. The new system offers SOOOOO much more to the growth and development of sociaty as a whole. That can't take president to an archaic capitalistic distribution system that has no value to the world any more aside from the 2-3% of people who make money off of it.
Libraries were started to distribute the economically and morally wrong per copy cost system in ancient literature and prevent a new technology from only being available to the hands of the rich. Same with TV. And radio. Now we have a new system, and rest assure, ultimately the new system will win, it's just a matter of weather sociaty has to overthrow corrupt governments in order to make it happen or not.
Even if it costs 2 million dollars to make something the first time, if it can be copied and distributed an infinite number of times for free, ultimately there is no moral argument for requiring a payment for every acquisition. Of course systems need to be put in place to credit creators of such content fairly for their work (advertising systems are a good way for example, but there area lots of other options as well).
This suddenly got me thinking about World of Warcraft, which has a case parallel to this. In World of Warcraft, the mage class has the ability to conjure food and water for a modest cost in mana. This food and water is essential to many classes in order to play properly, and is therefore coveted by many. Vendors in the game sell comparable items, but for a fee.
While he is leveling up, the mage acquires more powerful ranks of the spells that allow him to conjure food and water, allowing him to conjure food and water that restores more health and mana. Once he reaches level 70, however, the final rank of each spell can only be acquired from tomes, items that are consumed in the process. These tomes must either be acquired from a dungeon as random drops of loot or bought from the in-game auction house. Prices fluctuate wildly, but prices of ten times (or more) the cost of the previous rank of the spell (which can be taught by a trainer at any time for a rather small fee) are the norm on most servers, a fee that many mages begrudge considering that the people who sell these tomes will often turn right around and expect free food and water to be handed out.
What we have are two perspectives: That of the person who wants the food and water (we'll call him the consumer) and that of the mage.
To the consumer, the food and water represents a short time investment from the mage, combined with a quick trade window.
To the mage, the food and water represents 70 levels gained and scores of gold coins spent on acquiring the tomes. The money was a one-time investment, his production costs afterwards are zero. The mage could spend the rest of his life conjuring food and water for random passers-by and never spend another copper coin. However, the mage may think that his time and effort merit a small fee. The mage may think that since all his "clients" benefit from the expense he incurred in purchasing the tome(s), they are obligated to help offset his costs by paying small amounts of money for the food and water he provides.
So we end up with two very different perceptions of the value of conjured food and water. The consumer cites the production cost of zero, and therefore expects the service to be equally free. The mage cites the time and money invested to acquire that production capability, and charges a fee (which is still a fraction of what the NPC vendors charge - and if it's not, the vendors' stocks are unlimited and always accessible). Who's right?
<!--quoteo(post=1665124:date=Dec 25 2007, 04:52 AM:name=Testament)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Testament @ Dec 25 2007, 04:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1665124"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I bought it, read it in under a week, want the sequel in my hands this exact moment. I haven't been so engrossed in a book (or any entertainment...) since I first read Snow Crash. Amazing, great characters, and the tension towards the end with the scene between Bast and Chronicler was so unexpected and violent that you could almost feel it through the pages.
I really, really, really hope this turns into a long series.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1671692:date=Feb 29 2008, 09:51 AM:name=Testament)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Testament @ Feb 29 2008, 09:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1671692"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Read this a few months ago. Good book, but was short.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1671691:date=Feb 29 2008, 04:29 AM:name=lolfighter)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(lolfighter @ Feb 29 2008, 04:29 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1671691"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This suddenly got me thinking about World of Warcraft, which has a case parallel to this. In World of Warcraft, the mage class has the ability to conjure food and water for a modest cost in mana. This food and water is essential to many classes in order to play properly, and is therefore coveted by many. Vendors in the game sell comparable items, but for a fee.
While he is leveling up, the mage acquires more powerful ranks of the spells that allow him to conjure food and water, allowing him to conjure food and water that restores more health and mana. Once he reaches level 70, however, the final rank of each spell can only be acquired from tomes, items that are consumed in the process. These tomes must either be acquired from a dungeon as random drops of loot or bought from the in-game auction house. Prices fluctuate wildly, but prices of ten times (or more) the cost of the previous rank of the spell (which can be taught by a trainer at any time for a rather small fee) are the norm on most servers, a fee that many mages begrudge considering that the people who sell these tomes will often turn right around and expect free food and water to be handed out. What we have are two perspectives: That of the person who wants the food and water (we'll call him the consumer) and that of the mage.
To the consumer, the food and water represents a short time investment from the mage, combined with a quick trade window.
To the mage, the food and water represents 70 levels gained and scores of gold coins spent on acquiring the tomes. The money was a one-time investment, his production costs afterwards are zero. The mage could spend the rest of his life conjuring food and water for random passers-by and never spend another copper coin. However, the mage may think that his time and effort merit a small fee. The mage may think that since all his "clients" benefit from the expense he incurred in purchasing the tome(s), they are obligated to help offset his costs by paying small amounts of money for the food and water he provides.
So we end up with two very different perceptions of the value of conjured food and water. The consumer cites the production cost of zero, and therefore expects the service to be equally free. The mage cites the time and money invested to acquire that production capability, and charges a fee (which is still a fraction of what the NPC vendors charge - and if it's not, the vendors' stocks are unlimited and always accessible). Who's right?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Every WoW player should be taxed a trivial amount and that tax should be distributed amongst the mages that are the most effective producers of conjured foodstuffs. Of course people in low income brackets would be immune to the tax, and also the mage is free to make money by having other WoW merchants pay him in order to advertise their markets with his free food distributions.
Like I said, the free digital market is what's best for sociaty. Now, that doesn't mean that we should stop paying artists/programmers/authors/creators for their work, it means we need to find a way to do both.
ThansalThe New ScumJoin Date: 2002-08-22Member: 1215Members, Constellation
edited February 2008
<!--quoteo(post=1671701:date=Feb 29 2008, 07:19 AM:name=Swiftspear)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Swiftspear @ Feb 29 2008, 07:19 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1671701"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Every WoW player should be taxed a trivial amount and that tax should be distributed amongst the mages that are the most effective producers of conjured foodstuffs. Of course people in low income brackets would be immune to the tax, and also the mage is free to make money by having other WoW merchants pay him in order to advertise their markets with his free food distributions.
Like I said, the free digital market is what's best for sociaty. Now, that doesn't mean that we should stop paying artists/programmers/authors/creators for their work, it means we need to find a way to do both.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> See, the problem here is that you are arguing that downloading an illegal copy of a book is perfectly ok, even if it does screw over the author.
And yes, there is a difference between libraries and illegal DD. Libraries have payed for the copies that are distributed, an illegal DD has not. So if an author takes off in popularity, the library goes out and buys more copies, the torrent just gets more lechers. In one of those cases the author gets more money, the other? Nope!
I agree, DD is a great thing, and I DO make use of it.
I read Tales of Mu (an advertisement and donation driven web fiction). I read Lots of webcomics (again, all advertisement and donation driven). I download comics from WOWIO (They distribute advertisement laden PDFs of books/graphic novels and then share the ad profits with the authors).
None of us are anti DD, we just take issue with you stating random stuff that just isn't true, and then ignoring any one who points out that you're wrong.
Have a nice day <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
Side note: I don't use libraries b/c their selections tend to suck. I prefer to not use things like WOWIO in favor of buying a hard copy for 2 reasons: 1) I like having a well put together hard copy 2) I don't like adverts. I would rather pay $5 for a book then have adverts on it.
Oh, btw, your idea is basically socialism, and a bad version at that.
Only the top producers get payed? everyone is taxed for it? Bite me!
In an ideal world, nobody will ever have to pay for anything they need. Hungry? You go to a shop and pull food off the shelf, pausing at the register only so they can take note of what you took so they'll know what to order more of. They won't have to worry about financing this, because their suppliers won't charge them either. If you're bored, you go to a bookstore or games shop, or you patronise a local bar, none of which charge you for the products or services they provide. On the other hand, you're not getting paid for your day job. Why would you? Nobody charges money for their services or products, so money is useless anyway. Of course, you are also a responsible person. You understand that this is a delicate system that only works as long as everyone believes in it and doesn't abuse it. You don't take more than you need, you keep up to date with products that are in short supply and try to cut down your use of them and you work thirty hours a week (or more, or less) even though you are not paid and are strictly speaking not required to.
But that's the ideal world. I hope we can, as a species, one day become mature enough to make that model work (although Star Trek is probably hopelessly naive about it). In the meantime, choosing not to pay for a service or product for which payment is requested equals theft.
ThansalThe New ScumJoin Date: 2002-08-22Member: 1215Members, Constellation
well, it just happened, so it has to be posted.
Here, go read all of <a href="http://browseinside.harpercollins.com/index.aspx?isbn13=9780060558123&WT.mc_id=author_AmerGods_FullAccess_022208" target="_blank">American Gods</a> By Niel Gaimon (mods, that is Harper Collins' website)
Last line == win combined with this tread also <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
The Name of the Wind is tied for the 10th bestselling fiction book on the New York Times bestsellers list and it has <a href="http://www.patrickrothfuss.com/blog/uploaded_images/NYT-full-page-ad-735987.JPG" target="_blank">a neato full page ad</a> in the Times.
If that's not enough to put you over the edge I don't know what is.
Not that's it's not a good back (Yeah, it's a page turner all right, keep me reading till 3am), but the ending just feel abrupt. Yeah, yeah, it was Star War'ed, being cut into the trilogy. But I felt kinda unfulfilled.
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
Drsuedeath, that makes me sad.
I'm halfway through and loving it. Can't wait to get the other two books. I feel like I'll be crying waiting for them. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
remiremedy [blu.knight]Join Date: 2003-11-18Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester
I just finished it. I don't think it was *that* abrupt. Most of the real things were tied up, and it was a very elegant way to end a story when you're only a third of the way through.
Comments
He's cocksure in the "present," or he was cocksure in his youth? If it's the second, well, yeah, that's the idea. Teenagers are all cocksure. If you're talking about him in the present, well, I'd disagree.
However, I do like a lot of aspects of the book, especially character's names and the names of the coins of their money and such. I also like a lot of the secondary characters. I think I like Bast, but I don't really know enough about him to be sure. But at any rate, at Kvothe's personality at this point in the book is really grating (I'm still in his past, where he narrates the story).
That, and I guess I'm just proud of myself for finishing it finally, and I want the world to know. Go me.
So far, I've only gotten to the bit where <span style='color:#000000;background:#000000'>the main character starts narrating his past</span> but I'm really enjoying it so far.
So, yeah, thanks Tycho.
I really, really, really hope this turns into a long series.
<!--quoteo(post=1659730:date=Nov 7 2007, 12:28 PM:name=digz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(digz @ Nov 7 2007, 12:28 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1659730"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->From the description of the book, seems like a rip of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthsea" target="_blank">EarthSea</a> by Ursula K. Le Guin. What is it about his writing that sets him apart from other authors?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And Ursula K. Le Guin recently aswered the question herself so I thought I'd share.
<!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=Ursula K. Le Guin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ursula K. Le Guin)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->"It is a rare and great pleasure to find a fantasist writing not only with the kind of accuracy of language absolutely essential to fantasy-making, but with real music in the words as well. Wherever Pat Rothfuss goes with the big story that begins with The Name of the Wind he'll carry us with his as a good singer carries us through a song."<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh FFS. As if getting something for free online is different than getting it for free from a building. Realistically. Things like libraries wouldn't even exist right now if the copyright laws applied to them the way they apply to the internet.
I think everyone in sociaty already innately understands this, but it's fundamentally wrong to take something like a book, which can be copied for free, and charge per copy overhead on it. This isn't to say that artists and authors don't deserve credit and payment for their work, but the reality of the situation is that the rules of sociaty are failing us, and they are failing them. That's not the fault of the consumer who can't afford the book they want to read.
I think everyone in sociaty already innately understands this, but it's fundamentally wrong to take something like a book, which can be copied for free, and charge per copy overhead on it. This isn't to say that artists and authors don't deserve credit and payment for their work, but the reality of the situation is that the rules of sociaty are failing us, and they are failing them. That's not the fault of the consumer who can't afford the book they want to read.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Libraries pay for the books, though. When you check them out, they note the increased interest in it and consider purchasing more copies. Getting it online doesn't do any of this.
If no 'per copy overhead' was charged then every author would have to somehow make enough money instantly and never make any more money from sales. That's completely unworkable. An author should be paid based on how many copies of the book sell, as should the publisher and the bookstore. You can't have a magic world where veryone gets paid no matter how many copies are sold.
If no 'per copy overhead' was charged then every author would have to somehow make enough money instantly and never make any more money from sales. That's completely unworkable. An author should be paid based on how many copies of the book sell, as should the publisher and the bookstore. You can't have a magic world where veryone gets paid no matter how many copies are sold.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Someone paid for the book that got copied and put online too. Why should the publisher and bookstore get paid money to make paper copies of books that are not needed? It's not like the internet is an entirely unprofitable venture either, how can a company like Google, who never charges any user a dime for anything be worth over a billion dollars if that's not the case? Copyright cases have just sort of arbitrarily decided on a value that makes internet distribution, even if it's attempted in such a way that DOES ultimately pay the content creator (see the failure of internet radio). Frankly, once again, it's not the consumers fault if sociaty fails them and the artist.
I can appreciate that it's often uncomfortable to shift paradigms in cases like this where many jobs legitimately depend on the old system, but ultimately, in this case it is flat out morally wrong to keep the old system and ditch the new one. The new system offers SOOOOO much more to the growth and development of sociaty as a whole. That can't take president to an archaic capitalistic distribution system that has no value to the world any more aside from the 2-3% of people who make money off of it.
Libraries were started to distribute the economically and morally wrong per copy cost system in ancient literature and prevent a new technology from only being available to the hands of the rich. Same with TV. And radio. Now we have a new system, and rest assure, ultimately the new system will win, it's just a matter of weather sociaty has to overthrow corrupt governments in order to make it happen or not.
Even if it costs 2 million dollars to make something the first time, if it can be copied and distributed an infinite number of times for free, ultimately there is no moral argument for requiring a payment for every acquisition. Of course systems need to be put in place to credit creators of such content fairly for their work (advertising systems are a good way for example, but there area lots of other options as well).
In World of Warcraft, the mage class has the ability to conjure food and water for a modest cost in mana. This food and water is essential to many classes in order to play properly, and is therefore coveted by many. Vendors in the game sell comparable items, but for a fee.
While he is leveling up, the mage acquires more powerful ranks of the spells that allow him to conjure food and water, allowing him to conjure food and water that restores more health and mana. Once he reaches level 70, however, the final rank of each spell can only be acquired from tomes, items that are consumed in the process. These tomes must either be acquired from a dungeon as random drops of loot or bought from the in-game auction house. Prices fluctuate wildly, but prices of ten times (or more) the cost of the previous rank of the spell (which can be taught by a trainer at any time for a rather small fee) are the norm on most servers, a fee that many mages begrudge considering that the people who sell these tomes will often turn right around and expect free food and water to be handed out.
What we have are two perspectives: That of the person who wants the food and water (we'll call him the consumer) and that of the mage.
To the consumer, the food and water represents a short time investment from the mage, combined with a quick trade window.
To the mage, the food and water represents 70 levels gained and scores of gold coins spent on acquiring the tomes. The money was a one-time investment, his production costs afterwards are zero. The mage could spend the rest of his life conjuring food and water for random passers-by and never spend another copper coin.
However, the mage may think that his time and effort merit a small fee. The mage may think that since all his "clients" benefit from the expense he incurred in purchasing the tome(s), they are obligated to help offset his costs by paying small amounts of money for the food and water he provides.
So we end up with two very different perceptions of the value of conjured food and water. The consumer cites the production cost of zero, and therefore expects the service to be equally free. The mage cites the time and money invested to acquire that production capability, and charges a fee (which is still a fraction of what the NPC vendors charge - and if it's not, the vendors' stocks are unlimited and always accessible). Who's right?
I really, really, really hope this turns into a long series.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1671692:date=Feb 29 2008, 09:51 AM:name=Testament)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Testament @ Feb 29 2008, 09:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1671692"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Read this a few months ago. Good book, but was short.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In World of Warcraft, the mage class has the ability to conjure food and water for a modest cost in mana. This food and water is essential to many classes in order to play properly, and is therefore coveted by many. Vendors in the game sell comparable items, but for a fee.
While he is leveling up, the mage acquires more powerful ranks of the spells that allow him to conjure food and water, allowing him to conjure food and water that restores more health and mana. Once he reaches level 70, however, the final rank of each spell can only be acquired from tomes, items that are consumed in the process. These tomes must either be acquired from a dungeon as random drops of loot or bought from the in-game auction house. Prices fluctuate wildly, but prices of ten times (or more) the cost of the previous rank of the spell (which can be taught by a trainer at any time for a rather small fee) are the norm on most servers, a fee that many mages begrudge considering that the people who sell these tomes will often turn right around and expect free food and water to be handed out.
What we have are two perspectives: That of the person who wants the food and water (we'll call him the consumer) and that of the mage.
To the consumer, the food and water represents a short time investment from the mage, combined with a quick trade window.
To the mage, the food and water represents 70 levels gained and scores of gold coins spent on acquiring the tomes. The money was a one-time investment, his production costs afterwards are zero. The mage could spend the rest of his life conjuring food and water for random passers-by and never spend another copper coin.
However, the mage may think that his time and effort merit a small fee. The mage may think that since all his "clients" benefit from the expense he incurred in purchasing the tome(s), they are obligated to help offset his costs by paying small amounts of money for the food and water he provides.
So we end up with two very different perceptions of the value of conjured food and water. The consumer cites the production cost of zero, and therefore expects the service to be equally free. The mage cites the time and money invested to acquire that production capability, and charges a fee (which is still a fraction of what the NPC vendors charge - and if it's not, the vendors' stocks are unlimited and always accessible). Who's right?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Every WoW player should be taxed a trivial amount and that tax should be distributed amongst the mages that are the most effective producers of conjured foodstuffs. Of course people in low income brackets would be immune to the tax, and also the mage is free to make money by having other WoW merchants pay him in order to advertise their markets with his free food distributions.
Like I said, the free digital market is what's best for sociaty. Now, that doesn't mean that we should stop paying artists/programmers/authors/creators for their work, it means we need to find a way to do both.
Like I said, the free digital market is what's best for sociaty. Now, that doesn't mean that we should stop paying artists/programmers/authors/creators for their work, it means we need to find a way to do both.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
See, the problem here is that you are arguing that downloading an illegal copy of a book is perfectly ok, even if it does screw over the author.
And yes, there is a difference between libraries and illegal DD. Libraries have payed for the copies that are distributed, an illegal DD has not. So if an author takes off in popularity, the library goes out and buys more copies, the torrent just gets more lechers. In one of those cases the author gets more money, the other? Nope!
I agree, DD is a great thing, and I DO make use of it.
I read Tales of Mu (an advertisement and donation driven web fiction).
I read Lots of webcomics (again, all advertisement and donation driven).
I download comics from WOWIO (They distribute advertisement laden PDFs of books/graphic novels and then share the ad profits with the authors).
None of us are anti DD, we just take issue with you stating random stuff that just isn't true, and then ignoring any one who points out that you're wrong.
Have a nice day <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
Side note:
I don't use libraries b/c their selections tend to suck.
I prefer to not use things like WOWIO in favor of buying a hard copy for 2 reasons:
1) I like having a well put together hard copy
2) I don't like adverts. I would rather pay $5 for a book then have adverts on it.
Oh, btw, your idea is basically socialism, and a bad version at that.
Only the top producers get payed? everyone is taxed for it? Bite me!
Of course, you are also a responsible person. You understand that this is a delicate system that only works as long as everyone believes in it and doesn't abuse it. You don't take more than you need, you keep up to date with products that are in short supply and try to cut down your use of them and you work thirty hours a week (or more, or less) even though you are not paid and are strictly speaking not required to.
But that's the ideal world. I hope we can, as a species, one day become mature enough to make that model work (although Star Trek is probably hopelessly naive about it). In the meantime, choosing not to pay for a service or product for which payment is requested equals theft.
Here, go read all of <a href="http://browseinside.harpercollins.com/index.aspx?isbn13=9780060558123&WT.mc_id=author_AmerGods_FullAccess_022208" target="_blank">American Gods</a> By Niel Gaimon (mods, that is Harper Collins' website)
<a href="http://goblinscomic.com/d/20080422.html" target="_blank">Goblins!</a>
(apparently the 2 authors are friends)
ohh, missed that, double post and BUMP ftw.
Last line == win combined with this tread also <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
If that's not enough to put you over the edge I don't know what is.
Not that's it's not a good back (Yeah, it's a page turner all right, keep me reading till 3am), but the ending just feel abrupt. Yeah, yeah, it was Star War'ed, being cut into the trilogy. But I felt kinda unfulfilled.
I'm halfway through and loving it. Can't wait to get the other two books. I feel like I'll be crying waiting for them. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
I don't understand who Bast is though.