Maybe the nearby hivesite should be changed to in-sight. If a marine is in sight of a sensory chamber, he is shown up on hivesight. If he is right next to it, but behind a wall, he is not shown.
Here's an idea of how to make the SC more interesting.
The problem with SC is that you need too many to get cloaking throughout the map. How about this:
You can "use" the SC (like an MC) and it gives you a temporary cloaking (even while running, as per chamber, not ability) and maybe silence, too. These stop working after attacking/being attacked, or when say 20 seconds have elapsed (that would need to be fine tuned).
That way, an SC at a choke point is enough to hold that point early on, AND to give skulks the ability to venture outwards to destroy an obs, for instance.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Honestly, I dont really see sensories as ever really being a viable first chamber. The problem is rather simple: Living longer will always win out. Especially for aliens, who need to live long enough to get within range to kill a marine. When it comes right down to it, all these other things are neat and wonderful, but if you're dead they're useless.
The problem is that sensory is a passive technology. To really be effective you're just sitting around waiting for a marine to come by so you can surprise him and kill him. When the marines throw up a phase gate outside your hive, drop a TF in and threaten to seige your hive, sensory isn't going to do you any good.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Whilst true that the sensory chamber is a passive tech, the same can be said of MCs and DCs: both are stationary and provide advantages to aliens and structures nearby. Your point about sensory not being an aggressive chamber is very true though. The focus idea in this thread is exactly how to provide the chamber with an offensive and defensive benefit. Negating armour and weapon upgrades would help an alien tremendously (on the same par as regen or adren) and allow sensory aliens to actually mount an offensive. It's also a unique way of looking at things: reducing and increasing damage by negating upgrades fits the sensory chamber perfectly.
the only trouble with focus negating maries attack upgrades, is that this kind of stacks with carapace, imagine a carapace + focus onos... in umbra.
perhaps if focus only negated armour upgrades? (although I would certainly miss those early one bite kills)
well, thats not strictly the only trouble, as it stands this upgrade would become the standard first upgrade, marines would be investing and litterally burning res on upgrades, it all seems a little unfair.
perhaps we should think of a percentage of the suggested? each level progressivly decreases the value of marines upgrades, perhaps capped at Lvl 3 focus being somthing like 66%
<!--QuoteBegin-Plaguebearer+Feb 25 2004, 10:21 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Plaguebearer @ Feb 25 2004, 10:21 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I miss when Sensories parasited marines for you. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeah, how useful was that...
Actually, if sensory would para marines now while remaining a cloaking chamber, that would make it slightly more useful. How many marines got parasited by a big chamber in their face? Exactly. How many would blunder into it if it was cloaked? Just one more idea to make sensory suck a little less. Add a combination of the best ideas in this thread to sensory chambers, and you break the DMS cycle forever.
<!--QuoteBegin-Forlorn+Feb 25 2004, 05:28 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Forlorn @ Feb 25 2004, 05:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I wouldn't go out to say that sensory chambers suck completely now in 3.0.
Focus is perhaps the most powerful ability in the game for aliens and I wouldn't underestimate it just yet. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Aye. Players who know how to make up for the lower RoF are very deadly with focus. Today I've seen a skulk demolish a whole base full of marines with only Celerity, Carapace and Focus. To top it off, most marines were teching up their weapons, meaning they were fried when that skulk came in.
Of course, a little bit of spawncamping to deter off any defenders and we won.
Reading some of the suggestions here to improve sensory and while making them cheaper and adding hive sight back would be nice, I'm not sure they'll make the sensory chamber viable for a first hive chamber. The problem with the sensory chamber is that it's limited in scope. It's only REALLY good early game and quickly falls off becoming almost useless midgame as fights are more straight up. Defense is useful from early game to end game, and movement really begins to shine when you get a 2nd hive and some higher lifeforms.
The idea of making focus scale by the marine upgrades does seem to give sensory more mid-endgame viability, but I can't help thinking that reducing damage taken and increasing damage given will either be overpowered or not noticeable at all. That and it doesn't really seem to give an advantage or a disadvantage.
I'd probably keep sensory chambers at 10 per, but I'd add the hive-sight radius it used to give in 1.04 (moderately larger than the cloaking radius it currently gives). I'd also change one of the sensory abilities to give it more durability as a mid-endgame ability
<b>Focus</b> - Make it a piercing hit which is semi-random. If a target has 0 armor an alien with focus will land a piercing hit 80% of the time. However, for every 15 points of armor the target has, a piercing hit will have a 10% less chance of landing a piercing hit to a minimum of 10%. Obviously this makes heavies vulnerable too, however only 9/10 bites on average will actually be considered piercing hits. As for damage, if the target has no armor a piercing hit will instakill as Focus currently does. It won't be as effective as it currently is because only 4/5 shots will insta-kill. If the target HAS armor, a piercing hit will do REGULAR damage, but that damage will bypass armor and be done directly to the health.
What this does is it still retains the ability of focus to be a powerful early game ability with the chance to kill marines in one shot. It also potentially gives it some versitility lategame with the potential to damage armor upgraded marines directly to their health. While percentages and stuff will have to be scaled for balance, it may have potential?
<!--QuoteBegin-RaVe+Feb 25 2004, 10:49 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (RaVe @ Feb 25 2004, 10:49 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Today I've seen a skulk demolish a whole base full of marines with only Celerity, Carapace and Focus. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Had the same thing happen here last night, one celerity skulk did a run through marine spawn for about 10 seconds with 7 marines shooting at him, he only killed 3 of us but just wouldn't die... <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Somehow I don't see how a slight NERF to focus will somehow make sensory more viable. The only way you can make sensory more useful is to assure instakill on ALL light marines once level 3 sensory is up. Then you'll see more people choosing sensory, and as such skulks will be that much easier to kill since none of them will have carapace or celerity.
Nerfing focus won't encourage the use of sensory chambers. Only beefing it will.
<!--QuoteBegin-Savant+Feb 27 2004, 07:20 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Savant @ Feb 27 2004, 07:20 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Somehow I don't see how a slight NERF to focus will somehow make sensory more viable. The only way you can make sensory more useful is to assure instakill on ALL light marines once level 3 sensory is up. Then you'll see more people choosing sensory, and as such skulks will be that much easier to kill since none of them will have carapace or celerity.
Nerfing focus won't encourage the use of sensory chambers. Only beefing it will.
Regards,
Savant <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> That would be so incredibly overpowered savant people would quit the game and sensory would be chosen first every game.
If you got an Alien upgrade that negated all marine upgrades, you might as well make it negate all aliens upgrades (except attacks.) Then it becomes a vanilla fight on both Sides. and its pretty much just faster killing which is usually what aliens want.
Comments
The problem with SC is that you need too many to get cloaking throughout the map. How about this:
You can "use" the SC (like an MC) and it gives you a temporary cloaking (even while running, as per chamber, not ability) and maybe silence, too. These stop working after attacking/being attacked, or when say 20 seconds have elapsed (that would need to be fine tuned).
That way, an SC at a choke point is enough to hold that point early on, AND to give skulks the ability to venture outwards to destroy an obs, for instance.
The problem is that sensory is a passive technology. To really be effective you're just sitting around waiting for a marine to come by so you can surprise him and kill him. When the marines throw up a phase gate outside your hive, drop a TF in and threaten to seige your hive, sensory isn't going to do you any good.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Whilst true that the sensory chamber is a passive tech, the same can be said of MCs and DCs: both are stationary and provide advantages to aliens and structures nearby. Your point about sensory not being an aggressive chamber is very true though. The focus idea in this thread is exactly how to provide the chamber with an offensive and defensive benefit. Negating armour and weapon upgrades would help an alien tremendously (on the same par as regen or adren) and allow sensory aliens to actually mount an offensive. It's also a unique way of looking at things: reducing and increasing damage by negating upgrades fits the sensory chamber perfectly.
perhaps if focus only negated armour upgrades? (although I would certainly miss those early one bite kills)
well, thats not strictly the only trouble, as it stands this upgrade would become the standard first upgrade, marines would be investing and litterally burning res on upgrades, it all seems a little unfair.
perhaps we should think of a percentage of the suggested?
each level progressivly decreases the value of marines upgrades, perhaps capped at Lvl 3 focus being somthing like 66%
Yeah, how useful was that...
Focus is perhaps the most powerful ability in the game for aliens and I wouldn't underestimate it just yet.
Focus is perhaps the most powerful ability in the game for aliens and I wouldn't underestimate it just yet. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Aye. Players who know how to make up for the lower RoF are very deadly with focus. Today I've seen a skulk demolish a whole base full of marines with only Celerity, Carapace and Focus. To top it off, most marines were teching up their weapons, meaning they were fried when that skulk came in.
Of course, a little bit of spawncamping to deter off any defenders and we won.
The idea of making focus scale by the marine upgrades does seem to give sensory more mid-endgame viability, but I can't help thinking that reducing damage taken and increasing damage given will either be overpowered or not noticeable at all. That and it doesn't really seem to give an advantage or a disadvantage.
I'd probably keep sensory chambers at 10 per, but I'd add the hive-sight radius it used to give in 1.04 (moderately larger than the cloaking radius it currently gives). I'd also change one of the sensory abilities to give it more durability as a mid-endgame ability
<b>Focus</b> - Make it a piercing hit which is semi-random. If a target has 0 armor an alien with focus will land a piercing hit 80% of the time. However, for every 15 points of armor the target has, a piercing hit will have a 10% less chance of landing a piercing hit to a minimum of 10%. Obviously this makes heavies vulnerable too, however only 9/10 bites on average will actually be considered piercing hits. As for damage, if the target has no armor a piercing hit will instakill as Focus currently does. It won't be as effective as it currently is because only 4/5 shots will insta-kill. If the target HAS armor, a piercing hit will do REGULAR damage, but that damage will bypass armor and be done directly to the health.
What this does is it still retains the ability of focus to be a powerful early game ability with the chance to kill marines in one shot. It also potentially gives it some versitility lategame with the potential to damage armor upgraded marines directly to their health. While percentages and stuff will have to be scaled for balance, it may have potential?
Had the same thing happen here last night, one celerity skulk did a run through marine spawn for about 10 seconds with 7 marines shooting at him, he only killed 3 of us but just wouldn't die... <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Nerfing focus won't encourage the use of sensory chambers. Only beefing it will.
Regards,
Savant
Nerfing focus won't encourage the use of sensory chambers. Only beefing it will.
Regards,
Savant <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That would be so incredibly overpowered savant people would quit the game and sensory would be chosen first every game.
Huh?
2.0 sens: cloak, pheromones, scent of fear.
3.0 sens: cloak, focus, scent of fear.
Oh oh, maybe you meant sof? No way! My precious wallhack must not be replaced...