People Angry For Spawn Kills
Mantrid
Lockpick Join Date: 2003-12-07 Member: 24109Members
Lockpick Join Date: 2003-12-07 Member: 24109Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Why?</div> I have to wonder, why does everyone get angry at spawn-kills?
Many will say "'cause its cheap". Well, think about this, if you're attacking their base and destroying their stuff, what are you supposed to do when they spawn? Let them kill you?
My misplaced and misguided 2 cents.
Many will say "'cause its cheap". Well, think about this, if you're attacking their base and destroying their stuff, what are you supposed to do when they spawn? Let them kill you?
My misplaced and misguided 2 cents.
Comments
[edit] nm
try reading the post next time <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
spawn killing is cheap if someone is spawn <i>camping</i> and not attacking the structures
[EDIT:] damn, beat me to it im lost
Don't worry, you beat me to another response to explain what h20 was confused about (I think he read the first post and just didn't understand it). Anyway, I don't think there is a good solution to spawn-camping besides good admins and/or F4.
Ya anyways I saw spawn killing is not **** (and in no way supports **** marriage!)
I think its a fair strategical tactic and its up to the team whether or not they want to employ it. If they have their entire team at the hive/ip and are just spawn killing for fun its a lack of decency, but if they only have 2 or 3 people and are spawn killing to conserve their ammo until back up arrives, is that not a considerably wise strategy rather than firing off rounds into a structure which you know wont be killed by only 2 or 3 people?
So in the end your absolutely right, it should not be flammed and/or called **** or cheap because good strategies are neither **** or cheap.
What are you supposed to do? Let them spawn and kill you?
Or are you supposed to just much on buildings and ignore the spawning players that are shooting at you?
If you're in a position where you can be spawn killed remember this one thing:
<b>It's your (or your team's) fault!</b>
It's part of the game, and even necessary, but the devs need to understand that balanced or not, being spawn killed is simply no fun and change the game as necessary to make it fun AND balanced.
EDIT: Necessary to win, not necessary to design.
Even if a few players are spawn-killing when it's blindingly obvious they can kill the objective, the victimized team can just F4.
Unfortunatly getting killed as you spawn is no fun, as it stands it is the only way to win combat rounds. If you don't like it, don't play combat. What can I say?
How about instead we keep the same premise but adjust it slightly:
If everyone is dead at the same time a counter starts and is paused while someone is alive. When the counter reaches zero, the round ends. The counter could start at about 60 seconds, or whatever number works best.
This should help out in the situations where one team is capable of killing the respawners but unable to take down the cc/hive.
[edit] reposted in S&I: <a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=5&t=63805' target='_blank'>http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...=ST&f=5&t=63805</a>
spawn camping for the sake of boosting your kills and self confidence is bad.
On the other hand, if I'm alone in the MS, I'll take down marines currently there but then I'll hit the CC and react to any spawns as they happen. Just sitting there in a spot waiting for marines to spawn without going for the CC objective is annoying. In other words, I can justify it if we're currently taking down the CC, but I can't personally justify it to wait for backup.
Why didn't it work?
Why didn't it work? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because there used to be more than one spawnee at a time, and it lead to major stalemates, particularly at higher levels.
It might work now with the current spawn system.
Though it is part of the game and if the aliens cannot defend their hive then they only have themsleves to blame.
People just moan cos it's no fun and games are ment to be fun.
The reason base-breaking abilities (e.g. Onos gore) are so powerful is that once you get in a situation where one team is hammering on the other's base, it ought to be over *fast*. Minimize the time required to actually finish off a team that has already lost the game, to minimize the amount of time spawn-killing occurs.
No, it's no fun to be stuck in a respawn queue. Frankly, that's what F4 is good for; it's like conceding a match in a normal RTS. At some point, you realize you can't win, and you say "GG, let's go again." But if you do tough it out to the end, it shouldn't be unnecessarily painful.
Does ec still have a server Coil?
In combat however, having the objective, and the spawns, in the same room, is very, very, very <b>bad</b> map design. The reason there is so much spawn killing <i>and</i> camping in CO is because the objective is inside the enemys spawn. It is poor design that leads to all spawn kills in CO.
A simple seperate room(s) for the spawn and hive/cc will end <b>all</b> spawn camping and killing problems. I have a half dozen screens that illustrate my point with one team complety dead and no way to fight back because as soon as they spawn, they are ambushed by 10 marines or aliens. The game should just end when the entire team dies, because there is no way to fight back, no matter what your skill level.
Of course, no one will listen. They will end up saying "its your fault" because I am unable to kill a collection of Onos/Fades in my spawn by my self. And then they will say "Oh, you lost, so they should get to kill you." Moronic. If I lost, then I should be in the Ready Room, not taking screen shots of when my team is complety dead. And even if my team is losing, not lost, then I should at least have the ability to rush out and attack head on, prehapse turning the tide of battle.
True, map design isn't the only major contribitor to the total and complete unbalaced state of CO. The respawn system (terrible) along with the remove of invurnablity at spawn (which allowed you to fire for a little bit w/o getting ambushed) has lead to boaring gameplay of "Camping Often".
In classic, I don't see it as a problem -- commander could have put down more IPs, can put down defenses to make it hard to get to them, etc.
In combat however, it's a different story. What would be a better solution would be if combat maps had many more spawn points, either that or just spawned in a random location within a certain radius of the CC
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->---------------------------------------------
| | | |
| \ | | / |
| \ | / |
| | | | | | |
| O | S | | S | O |
| | | | | | |
| / | \ |
| / | | \ |
| | | |
---------------------------------------------<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
S = Spawn
O = Objective
Now this is a relatively simple design, but should illustrate that you would have to break through the spawn to get to the objective... meaning the the spawn is an obstacle to be overcome and passed. Note that this is also on a relatively small scale and symmetric, meaning that development is still left to creativity to a degree. The point is though, that the spawn is not sitting with the objective... it would still take a little bit of a trek to get to the objective for the defending team. Also, it means staying alive is more important because if you die while defending the objective it will be some time before you can return as backup (rather than spawning in as backup).
What do you guys think?
Does ec still have a server Coil? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. There's another Nano, but it's not....EC official, as such.
- a groupie
i dont think its cheap if im spawn killed... i only get **** off if there are a few enemys in my hive/ms, and they arnt even trying to kill the hive or buildings