<!--QuoteBegin--TriPhase+Jan 11 2004, 02:24 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TriPhase @ Jan 11 2004, 02:24 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> When your losing on the marines its like a everyday thing.. but when your losing as Aliens, you get the REAL feel of actually getting a sweet defeat.. and you should take that and eat it.. and of course when marines make you wait 20 minutes cause they want to build 40 sieges outside of your allready dead hive.. they probably only do it for a few reasons... 1). Because there idiots, and 2). Because they dont get to enjoy the feel complete powah that the aliens do almost in 80% of the games.. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> All of the servers that I play on that hold some sort of statistics ALL show that marines win about 70% of the games played except for on one where it is about 55%. One of these servers has people that I consider VERY good. Now it just so happens that they tend to stack marines more often then not for some reason, but the point is: Marines win over Aliens more than vice versa.
By reading your post, I am assuming that you play as a marine most of the time for one reason or another. I won't speculate as to why, that's each players prerogative. Now it MAY be your experience that you lose as marines more often because of a few reasons:
1. Really BAD luck of getting a sucky team and/or sucky commander. 2. The servers you frequent have elite players always stacking aliens. 3. As a marine, you tend to cause a detriment to the team in some fashion, creating a weak link that gives the aliens a slight upper hand. Almost to the point of considering you as worthwile as an afk player. (Don't take this personally, this is my case when I play marines marines most of the time. Only on occasion do I throw down as a marine.) 4. The servers you frequent have a constant inflow of newbies, which more often than not join marines as they are easier to learn with.
Again don't take #3 personally, I'm only listing possibilities because to be honest your observations about marines losing all the time really threw me for a spin.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->inclined to believe you're lying to make yourself look better<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes because I need to lie about how many pubbers I can kill because I never ever am able to kill any <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->We are not talking about why the marines are winning, we are talking about how they are going to end it. Slightly different. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
See now that was a decent post
Now my point being If you keep playing and their half assing it 9 out of 10 times you can still win and you can always still have fun.
Loosing as aliens can feel miserable because marines can take their sweet time making the push for the last hive once they have locked down two other hives. Slowly electifying the whole dag nabbin map and choking the aliens to death by asphyxiation rather than by combat. Allow aliens cheaper units to compensate for that, so that the marines need to push hard to conquer all 3 hives or risk losing anyway. Even with lockdown.
well... we could always implement that at two hives cost of aliens instantly drops to 85% of normal cost... then to 75% at third hive... then they keep that even if they lose a hive... that might help ever so slightly for a comeback in the end... and the percents might not even have to be quite that low either... 90/80 might work too.
I actually see this as somewhat a decent idea as the kharaa need some sort of effective attack against electrified rt's other than regen onos... that takes a good while and that means the 'rines are basically getting unthreatened res sources for quite some time.
EDIT: Not that this would apply in any way towards 3.0 as alien play in CNS is completely nerfed and this solution isn't near radical enough to fix it.... taking oni down with lmgs on the norm... or one hmg even with umbra and gorge healing... all without actually getting TO the enemy to do any damage.
you know, aliens win about 56% of the time on like 2 maps, and like 66%on half of the maps, and 75% on the rest, i think that qualifies as the aliens winning most of the time the marines need more advantages over the aliens
Forgive me for starting out a bit off topic; but these posts about "well if you let the other team do THAT you deserve to loose." are getting tiresome (and are not really relavent to this topic, as has been stated). But it seems to me that there are so many preventative counters for everything, it's like two kid's argueing in this fasion; "I knew you were going to do that." "I knew that you knew" "I knew that you knew that I knew" etc, etc, etc... eventually one of them is going to hit the other, or one will run out of breath. IE, if there are so many preventative measures, the game should, in theory, remain in stalemate, until one person on some team does something so ingenious, or so stupid, that one team gains a foot hold, and it moves on from there. And being only human, mistakes are bound to happen, and one side starts dominating the other.
Back to the topic now, when marines are losing, It's a fortress, they make the aliens pay for every inch of territory they gain, the turtled end-game marines have hope.
But the aliens, in a similar situation can do no more than harrass the marines, giving them RFK to further fuel the aliens' destruction. their hope is usually gone before they lost a single hive
<!--QuoteBegin--Freak83+Jan 8 2004, 06:51 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Freak83 @ Jan 8 2004, 06:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I find that whenever I'm losing as an alien I just want to F4 and the only thing that stops me from doing so is my morals and how it would look bad on my clan. But seriously here, I just find that losing as aliens sucks, let's look at some of the ways you can lose.
<b><u>Siege Marines</b></u> Marines own all the res towers on the map and build a massive army of 20 sieges outside your base. They don't even have the skill to come in and shoot it down themselves. Losers.
<b><u>HA Train Rush</b></u> A big fat train of HA marines come tearing around the map to take you down. The only thing that can stop them is a huge army of Onos which at this point you usually don't have the res to get. There's no stopping them. Cheapness till end of game, losers.
<b><u>Knife/Welder Rush</b></u> Don't see this too often but it's just so the marines can show their unlimited power by taking everything including your OC chambers and hive down with their welders or knives. Humiliation to add to defeat, losers.
<b><u>Early game Shotty Rush</b></u> An annoying comm wants to end the game as soon as it started. Rush them with 1 hit kill shotties cause aliens don't even have time to get any chambers up to heal them. You die as soon as you spawn and you can't fight back. Losers.
<b><u>Late game LA Rush</b></u> Perhaps the only method where it's fair because aliens at least have a tiny chance. Marines swarm into the hive with nothing but LA + LMG and some upgrades. Still hate it but it's probably the best of the worst.
<b><u>Jetpack Rush</b></u> I hardly ever see this so I don't have much to say other than annoying marines flying away from you shooting the hive. Much more annoying in 1.04 but at lest jetpacks were fun to use back then.
Nooooooow.... when you're on the marine team and you're losing... now that's fun! I like seeing the aliens having all that power and that's the perfect time to try and knife and Onos without getting shouted at from your entire team. You know at that one point there is no chance of recovery and there's only hiding now. And aliens attack in fair ways too, just their abilities. No teleporting next to marine spawn and shooting it through walls.
Ok last thing I'd like to say, I know I probably sound mad because I just lost as aliens or something but I'm not. I just actually won as aliens a few times, I just wanted to say once and for all why losing as aliens sucks so much and wanted to know if others felt this way too. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> (i havent read previous posts)
yeah , these points you mentiond, ill tell you what its called
"Natural-Selection"
live with it dude (ok im gonna get flamed becuase this is my first post <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> joy)
Comments
All of the servers that I play on that hold some sort of statistics ALL show that marines win about 70% of the games played except for on one where it is about 55%. One of these servers has people that I consider VERY good. Now it just so happens that they tend to stack marines more often then not for some reason, but the point is: Marines win over Aliens more than vice versa.
By reading your post, I am assuming that you play as a marine most of the time for one reason or another. I won't speculate as to why, that's each players prerogative. Now it MAY be your experience that you lose as marines more often because of a few reasons:
1. Really BAD luck of getting a sucky team and/or sucky commander.
2. The servers you frequent have elite players always stacking aliens.
3. As a marine, you tend to cause a detriment to the team in some fashion, creating a weak link that gives the aliens a slight upper hand. Almost to the point of considering you as worthwile as an afk player. (Don't take this personally, this is my case when I play marines marines most of the time. Only on occasion do I throw down as a marine.)
4. The servers you frequent have a constant inflow of newbies, which more often than not join marines as they are easier to learn with.
Again don't take #3 personally, I'm only listing possibilities because to be honest your observations about marines losing all the time really threw me for a spin.
Yes because I need to lie about how many pubbers I can kill because I never ever am able to kill any <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->We are not talking about why the marines are winning, we are talking about how they are going to end it. Slightly different. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
See now that was a decent post
Now my point being If you keep playing and their half assing it 9 out of 10 times you can still win and you can always still have fun.
"You're cold, very cold.... Warmer.... Warmer.... Hot! You're on fire! LIQUID MAGMA!"
I actually see this as somewhat a decent idea as the kharaa need some sort of effective attack against electrified rt's other than regen onos... that takes a good while and that means the 'rines are basically getting unthreatened res sources for quite some time.
EDIT: Not that this would apply in any way towards 3.0 as alien play in CNS is completely nerfed and this solution isn't near radical enough to fix it.... taking oni down with lmgs on the norm... or one hmg even with umbra and gorge healing... all without actually getting TO the enemy to do any damage.
"I knew you were going to do that."
"I knew that you knew"
"I knew that you knew that I knew"
etc, etc, etc...
eventually one of them is going to hit the other, or one will run out of breath. IE, if there are so many preventative measures, the game should, in theory, remain in stalemate, until one person on some team does something so ingenious, or so stupid, that one team gains a foot hold, and it moves on from there. And being only human, mistakes are bound to happen, and one side starts dominating the other.
Back to the topic now, when marines are losing, It's a fortress, they make the aliens pay for every inch of territory they gain, the turtled end-game marines have hope.
But the aliens, in a similar situation can do no more than harrass the marines, giving them RFK to further fuel the aliens' destruction. their hope is usually gone before they lost a single hive
<b><u>Siege Marines</b></u>
Marines own all the res towers on the map and build a massive army of 20 sieges outside your base. They don't even have the skill to come in and shoot it down themselves. Losers.
<b><u>HA Train Rush</b></u>
A big fat train of HA marines come tearing around the map to take you down. The only thing that can stop them is a huge army of Onos which at this point you usually don't have the res to get. There's no stopping them. Cheapness till end of game, losers.
<b><u>Knife/Welder Rush</b></u>
Don't see this too often but it's just so the marines can show their unlimited power by taking everything including your OC chambers and hive down with their welders or knives. Humiliation to add to defeat, losers.
<b><u>Early game Shotty Rush</b></u>
An annoying comm wants to end the game as soon as it started. Rush them with 1 hit kill shotties cause aliens don't even have time to get any chambers up to heal them. You die as soon as you spawn and you can't fight back. Losers.
<b><u>Late game LA Rush</b></u>
Perhaps the only method where it's fair because aliens at least have a tiny chance. Marines swarm into the hive with nothing but LA + LMG and some upgrades. Still hate it but it's probably the best of the worst.
<b><u>Jetpack Rush</b></u>
I hardly ever see this so I don't have much to say other than annoying marines flying away from you shooting the hive. Much more annoying in 1.04 but at lest jetpacks were fun to use back then.
Nooooooow.... when you're on the marine team and you're losing... now that's fun! I like seeing the aliens having all that power and that's the perfect time to try and knife and Onos without getting shouted at from your entire team. You know at that one point there is no chance of recovery and there's only hiding now. And aliens attack in fair ways too, just their abilities. No teleporting next to marine spawn and shooting it through walls.
Ok last thing I'd like to say, I know I probably sound mad because I just lost as aliens or something but I'm not. I just actually won as aliens a few times, I just wanted to say once and for all why losing as aliens sucks so much and wanted to know if others felt this way too. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
(i havent read previous posts)
yeah , these points you mentiond, ill tell you what its called
"Natural-Selection"
live with it dude
(ok im gonna get flamed becuase this is my first post <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> joy)