Ns On More Sane Platform?
Anlar
Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8519Members
Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8519Members
<div class="IPBDescription">No steam</div> Will there ever be Natural Selection on a <b>non-Steam</b> platform? Such as Unreal Tournament 2004's engine etc...
I am just asking because Steam is scanning the users' hard drives a bit too much (for mp3s, illegal software etc) for my taste, it is a slow and buggy software and furthermost it is useless. It does nothing important. (Unless if you call bugs and bloat features.) It also forces you to have an internet connection also for LANs which is at least for me completely unacceptable for special reasons. (They have promised the DL© features but I haven't noticed them so far.)
I have loved Natural Selection. I have played it for thousands of hours, mostly on the a few good clan servers. I am a very good player. Perhaps even one of the very best. The game format is one of the best ones ever made. Teamwork first person multiplayer shooter. The graphics have been great even with the old HL engine. The musics and sounds have been just plain incredible. The game has just rocked. The best game ever. <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
If not, it's a shame. I will play the non-steam versions as long as I can find any servers.. And quit when there aren't any. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo-->
I am just asking because Steam is scanning the users' hard drives a bit too much (for mp3s, illegal software etc) for my taste, it is a slow and buggy software and furthermost it is useless. It does nothing important. (Unless if you call bugs and bloat features.) It also forces you to have an internet connection also for LANs which is at least for me completely unacceptable for special reasons. (They have promised the DL© features but I haven't noticed them so far.)
I have loved Natural Selection. I have played it for thousands of hours, mostly on the a few good clan servers. I am a very good player. Perhaps even one of the very best. The game format is one of the best ones ever made. Teamwork first person multiplayer shooter. The graphics have been great even with the old HL engine. The musics and sounds have been just plain incredible. The game has just rocked. The best game ever. <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
If not, it's a shame. I will play the non-steam versions as long as I can find any servers.. And quit when there aren't any. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo-->
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
By the way, where did you learn that there was spywre on steam? I don't think that Valve is stupid enough to risk a huge class-action lawsuit from everyone who has ever has downloaded a steam client.
Anyways, that is not a big problem. The big problem is that Steam simply sucks.
OMG they scan your harddrive... do you have something to hide? no? Then stop crying.
Oh, and if you want to play HL or HL 2, even CS:CZ you will have to live with Steam, I never had ANY problem with steam, like the majority of peoples.
Install steam, live with it. End of the Story.
Install steam, live with it. End of the Story. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's nice, and probably true for you, but if you paid a visit to the SP forums, you would find that apparently there are more people that have had problems. And there are a great deal more problems with Steam than you give it credit for.
Just saying...
Anlar: NS is already on the Half Life engine, and to modify all the graphics, models, maps, and code for another platform would be a waste of time. For one, the code would need to be written from scratch, since they use completly different coding platforms, and another point is that bugs could be easily re-introduced during the conversion.
Steam does not "spy" on you. It simply checks for active known cheats. The only "spy"-like action that it did was unintentional, affected Windows 9x/ME, and delt with how those operating systems allocate an "empty" file (Actually, it's a FAT32 issue). See, Steam creates a virtual file system for it's data files. When Windows 9x is told to give steam 400MB, it allocates 400 random MB, but does not "0" them, meaning the data that was stored there previously (Deleted, that is), might be hidden inside the file
NTFS (Used by NT operatings systems, including XP and 2000) will clear out the data, so you get a genuine, "blank" file.
From Planet Halflife:
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"We were a bit perplexed when these reports first surfaced until we found out that people with NTFS didn't see the problem and people with FAT-32 did. In Windows, if you use NTFS for your file system, it zeros out the sectors before allocating them to a new file. So if you have something, like a Steam cache file, where a lot of space gets allocated but not used, and you look at it, then you'll see a bunch of zeros. The FAT-32 file system doesn't do that. If you allocate a large amount of space, don't fill it up, and then use a binary editor to look at the file, you'll see whatever was in those sectors before they were allocated to the new file (at least until they get written over). Whether the files are zero'd or not doesn't affect applications because you always assume there's junk there until you write over it. So this behavior isn't a function of Steam cache files, it's a function of the FAT-32 file system. Other applications that allocate large files and not fill them immediately will see the same behavior. It doesn't mean the application cares about the data, it just means it was something already on your hard drive. Just last night I noticed that Bram, the guy who created bittorrent for UNIX, had had the same issue raised on the UNIX file system (which makes sense)."
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The mp3s listed you find in steam related files are searched for by Steam, to be used in the built in mp3 player that isnt fully implemented yet <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
*Wonders why people Hate Steam, yet it is more Efficient, Better Pings, Better FPS, Easy In game Menus,Stable, Auto Updating*
Why didn't someone kill WON ages ago?
As is stated in the Unknown Worlds Entertainment announcement, future versions of Natural Selection may be developed on a different engine. However as it is currenty, and at least for 3.0, it is developed for Half Life, and Steam. I wouldn't expect a non-steam version of NS for a long time (at least a year)
*Wonders why people Hate Steam, yet it is more Efficient, Better Pings, Better FPS, Easy In game Menus,Stable, Auto Updating*
Why didn't someone kill WON ages ago? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
For some people(although not me, everything is the same except the stableness- and that only goes for SvenCoop3.0 and RC2 beta) the effect is the OPPOSITE. They get higher ping, slower everything, less FPS, more crashes.
Yes it is.
WON gave me better performance and much better pings, and I liked the feel of it better.
Don't be a fool. Steam blows in comparision to WON.
The ONLY thing I like about steam is that you can change servers mid-game with it, other than that it's a total pile and I feel sorry for myself of having to go with steam to continue to play my favorite games, but in the end it all fits with my masocist nature.
*Wonders why people Hate Steam, yet it is more Efficient, Better Pings, Better FPS, Easy In game Menus,Stable, Auto Updating*
Why didn't someone kill WON ages ago? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ok, I have no problem with steam, I like it.
Its just WON with a GUI, more user friendly, auto-update feature, integrated istant messaging service and lits ALL properly installed games and MODs.
Now the bad, the majority or people are getting at least 40 higher ping, my FPS are CONSIDRABLY lower on steam (100 FPS constant at 1600*1200) and now is <50FPS at 800*600.
Steam is stable when IT wants to be, I mean invalidsteamusertickit, that only means you gota log off and back on which depending on how steam is on your stystem can take a few minutes more that would be liked.
Steam also drains more CPU which is believed to be the cause of the lower FPS and higher pings.
They wont kill WON untill steam has next to no problems and until they need to (aka HL2 maby CS:CZ).
Right now its not a stage for enough of the players to use without problems.
If you dont beleive me just look at the steam tech support forum.
Oh and I watched one of my friends hack and cheat on Steam right in front of me, so dont think that the anti-cheat is fantastic, it only catches old well used ones.
I stopped playing ns around 1.3 and 1.4 untill I learned their was a steam version (when 2.0 came out, I didn't play it on WON at all) because WON blows so much. The only problem I have encountered with steam is that the disc during map change. This is because ns isn't made for steam yet, so it isn't steams fault, however I use to hit my retry key before map changes when I was on WON because it is quicker than waiting for the map change anyway. The list of features for steam >>>>>>> WON. If you don't like steam then that sucks for you, because that is the future, so go cry and stop complaining, because it is actually better (unless you have a pos computer or are just stupid I guess).
And WON feels more smooth when you play any higher fps have i never met on any steam server.
And it loves to stop working when it DLs patches uppdates.
So if HL2 is far from running smoth on your PC it's dirt, right?
Just because somethings not running properly on your system doesn't mean it's crap. I'm just experiencing this with Deus Ex 2. Ok it has high requirements. The graphic doesn't look that good for its high req. But if you tune your machine the games great and does make fun.
So if HL2 is far from running smoth on your PC it's dirt, right?
Just because somethings not running properly on your system doesn't mean it's crap. I'm just experiencing this with Deus Ex 2. Ok it has high requirements. The graphic doesn't look that good for its high req. But if you tune your machine the games great and does make fun. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Guess what? HL2 and DE2 have NOTHING to do with this. Steam itself is causing performance and startup problems. People who ran things fine under the traditional system are now losing 10s of FPS and gaining ping. Anyone who claims that the fault lies with gamers and not Valve is being honestly ignorant or purposefully dishonest. Keep your red herrings out of this thread.
WON became so good you can't let go of it, Steam will become so good you can't let go of it.
The network issues are second to gameplay ones. Steam utterly destroys the feeling of a Half-Life mod. Anything in Steam mods feels 'off' compared to what it would have felt in WON. Take CS 1.6 for example. Disregarding the extra weapons and features, you cannot deny that the game <i>feels</i> 'different'. Steam throws a monkey-wrench into a once balanced equation. I'd venture to be bold enough and say that if you can't tell the difference, you're a nub. Which, in essense, would not entirely be so far from reality. You see, top clans of Half-Life mods all prefer the old WON system (based on interviews and polls). While those in crappy clans or no clan at all prefer Steam. It really makes you wonder...
Furthermore, there there are additional problems. It is a proven fact that Admin Mod and it's plugins mess with hitboxes to a degree that promotes crappy playing. For example, it distorts CS hitboxes around the chest and head area. Now, if you have bad aim, this doesn't really hurt you much. In effect, it HELPS! Crappy players don't shoot dead on, they shoot a little here, or a little there, and miss their target. When the hitboxes are distorted off of the player model, crappy aim is promoted. Nubs simply have to do what they do best: Miss. The only difference is now the miss is counted as a hit. This further gimps gameplay to the point where good players are penalized for having good aim. In order to score successful hits with Admin Mod, good players have to purposely miss like a nubs. This is conceptually wrong and destroys the gameplay, turning it into a spamfest since hitbox distortion is not consistent. The next time you hit a nub DEAD ON only to have him shoot god knows where and kill you, check to see if Admin Mod is on that server. Chances are it is, and it's gimping your game. I only mention this fact because with Steam and Admin Mod, hitboxes are distorted even more! While this isn't a valid argument specifically against Steam itself, it certainly doesn't do much to help it's cause.
To the post right above me: Intel made for media? AMD made for games because of cache? Lets see some numbers. Your claims are unfounded. Back it up. For the record, Half-Life itself has been losing about 10fps efficiency per patch. Try playing the lastest WON on Half-Life's minimum specifications, then go back to a fresh install of Half-Life. It has nothing to do with how fast your computer/video card are. It has everything to do with the junk code they keep appending to each new version. Take a look at the progress of the Half-Life SDK. Youll notice a bunch more "HACK" methods in the recent ones. Steam is crappy, and claims of fps drops and ping inflation are real.
Steam does not scan your hard drive for mp3s and the such. It scans to enforce a higher degree of consistency between client/server. I.E. It knows if you use custom models. It needs to scan in order to propogate the success of VAC. Vac, which, does absolutely nothing. The fact that the dev team is relying on the removal of scripts and the implementation of VAC to remove cheaters is laughable to say the least.
Edit: Added a few things.
One change I would've made to Steam is make it work like Bit Torrent, updates and such could've been much faster, and lighten the load of content servers.