I Feel That Ns Needs One Thing
CommunistWithAGun
Local Propaganda Guy Join Date: 2003-04-30 Member: 15953Members
Local Propaganda Guy Join Date: 2003-04-30 Member: 15953Members
Comments
Well, I commanded a game not too long ago where we basically had won, but then the aliens managed a comeback. So it's not always decided like that.
Besides, is there any way to directly address this?
I still don't see a turret cap for the marines. Back in 1.04 and earlier, if you whored it up in your base long enough you could build so many turrets that it was impossible for the aliens to penetrate. I ran into yet another game like that today and after a couple hours the marines had to F4 because the elevation and amount of firepower made everything a stalemate.
Umbra used to be a good counter to this, but I guess it got seriously nerfed, as far as I can tell. Web used to be a good counter to HA train too, but now that it's at third hive, web has lost all it's tactical importance, and has now become a mere novelty at hive 3. If a smart commander relocates into a hive and camps on a high platform with turrets, they can **** up an HA train on one or two towers, and there's not much the aliens can do about it, exept sneak a gorge in there to put up a hive and movement in, but even that's a lucky shot.
I haven't played 2.1 yet, but I hope it improves the mind-numbing lineraity that 2.01 suffers from. Every game has the same focus, marines try to **** on res towers for an HA train, and aliens try to wipe out the marines before they get an HA train. The HA train is the deciding point of the game, because a well coordinated HA train is absolutely unstoppable by anything. I have never seen one taken down, nor have I ever been taken down while participating in one, have you?
The difficulty in killing trains is the maplayout that resticts a combined attack with several onos most of the time.
The key is to find a good ambush place where you can bring your full force to bear. One onos stompspams, the rest attacks the train. Does work fine with several skulks or fades too though, all you need is a reliable stomper with adren.
The game is only decided in the first 5 minutes because you choose it to be.
I'd say the game is decided as soon as people choose a team... the better team (those that play well as a team and marines have a comm) will generally win.
Funny that.
The difficulty in killing trains is the maplayout that resticts a combined attack with several onos most of the time.
The key is to find a good ambush place where you can bring your full force to bear. One onos stompspams, the rest attacks the train. Does work fine with several skulks or fades too though, all you need is a reliable stomper with adren. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'd say a good portion of the game-deciding HA trains come long before anyone has onos... let alone several.
Tell that to the comms <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> They refuse to consider JPs most of the time.
I know you've got a point to prove but don't make it unbelievable now
Yep. tis the only reason I miss the ol' 1.0x's. Those games keep going back and forth for quite a while. Thats why NS was so time consuming, and thats why it was so addictive.
I managed to go onos at about the same time they got a HA train of like 5 people. now, most of my team was skulk, and like one fade. The heavies were at horseshoe, we had two hives, and I had regen and adren.
I went in there, stomp digested one, stomped them all, gored another, while they were continueslly being stomped they were also being hit by skulks and fades, the HA train was gone in a matter of seconds. It was just sweet.
Yes, if only people not give up too early, NS is best if you can make comeback and win against all odds :-) And yes it's possible. Yes better team usually wins game, but i'v seen far better team loosing game beacause of bad comming, wrong alien strategy or small detail like onos managing to rush base while everyone out :-)
So don't just give up!
If theres one thing you can count on, its people's selfishness.
Same for aliens, cept the drawback to them is that their expansion is a bit more linear (but in need of more space). Once the marines stop their expansion, the avarage alien team would just...fall apart.
Now more decision, that's the rub. I've seen / led / experienced more decisive counter-attacks and strategic fronts than I care to complain about stagnant players.
Stagnant or static players, make the game difficult and less dynamic.
The marines could be winning one minute, then a few of them have to leave the game to go to class or something. Now the Aliens have a multi-man advantage that they can capitolize on.
One of the most see-saw games I was ever on was on a pub. First marines were winning, we pushed them back into a hive, they broke out and took down one of our hives and locked it down. Somehow we recovered it. and Pushed them back again.
1 hour 30 minutes later, Aliens won after "certain defeat"
I love my pub.
I know my team can be totally owning it up at the beginning, then all of a sudden the team stops communicating and stops caring about following orders, and then the other team makes a comeback. The other team always thinks it was some marvelous show of skill on their part, when it was really just a lack of teamwork on our part.
If an HA train gets owned by stomp, or can't even jump/dodge it, then that's not a well coordinated HA train. That's a n00b HA train. Durhh. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
That statement alone is worth an entire locked flame filled thread. Stomp at the moment is the single most talentless skill to use, and basically with one mash of the button a single Oni can ensure a <i>travelling</i> (no, not static and waiting to rain HMG death on the Oni as it moves in) HA Train is utterly screwed. The Oni just has to be bright enough to do it in a corridor, and then has to keep them vaguely stationary until the rest of the alien team gets there for lunch.
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Right, as for the swing of games. I agree games are decided a little too early now, however there are comebacks. The problem is these comebacks <b>only come from the inadequacy of the winning team to keep pressure up,</b> not the ability of the losing team to fight harder. The only time you see a comeback is when the winners get complacent and start to basically p*ss about, rather than doing what they should be doing.
I have absolutely nil idea how that can be resolved, but that's how it seems to stand in 2.x
It's not even that hard to avoid stomp, because myself and everyone else I run into can do it just fine. If you can dodge a hopping skulk on celerity, you can definately dodge a stomping Onos. It's a very linear attack with deceptively bad range.
And even in the situation an Onos stomps a train, you better hope that Onos stuns every single person in that train, or that Onos is dying very fast. It only takes one or two HMGs to shred an Onos in seconds, even fully upgraded LMGs will rip into a Onos very hard.
Plus, it's not that hard to anticipate an ambush, don't run blindly through passageways and around corners, use LMG scouts, pay attention to MT, ping once in a while. Your chances of even attempting an ambush are limited, it's not a 3 mile hike to any one of your hives. Not to mention how unfriendly the map layouts are to a big bulky Onos.
But that's all just in my experience, add salt for best results. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Hah, sure it is. But it doesnt take much to counter it. Just last night i was playing on a 10vs10 server, ns_lost as map, we had 3rd hive coming at equillbrium, i was fading at the moment as the heavys started scrolling down to equilbrium, well. i managed to keep them at bay for awhile, but having not that much support at the time i died and they took the hive down. Anyhows, by that time we had 1 guy going Onos, and when i died i waited awhile for res and went also Onos. As i was almost finished evolving to Onos, the other onos died, :/ . Anyhows it took a long time but essentially got the train down, I'd more likely thank celerity for that, since if i'd probaly died if i'd taken the popular "Stomping Onos" upgrades..
But, yeah the games can be decided pretty early, but it doesnt happen everytime.
So we were 6 on the team, in the first few minutes we had 7 RT's (aliens didn't do any RTs it seemed)
Then the comm said "we just lost base. We lost" and recycled everything (I mean the RT's just as well) + f4ed.
So, no, the game isn't ALWAYS decided in the first few minutes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->So we were 6 on the team, in the first few minutes we had 7 RT's (aliens didn't do any RTs it seemed)
Then the comm said "we just lost base. We lost" and recycled everything (I mean the RT's just as well) + f4ed.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Haha, I've had commanders like that before. It's usually a couple guys not following orders, then our Commander gets so aggrivated he recycles everything as if we're never going to win. Joy.. <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif'><!--endemo-->
2 Solutions:
1. Find a different server (hard as hell to get an alien win on HAMPTONS).
2. Join a clan
Now that you know the solutions, stop complaining.