What I want to know is how they get those metal things to come out of the guns SO fast that they can kill things. Just doesn't make any sense. Maybe if you threw a metal baseball really hard but those things in NS aren't even that big. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
IT"S A GAME GOD CAN COME DOWN AND KILL HIMSELF FOR ALL WE CARE CAPS LOCKS RULE YOU ..ya i'm bored
just a game and the creator had the imagination of an alien being "redeemed" while being shot at by 10 marines with HMGs...i would like to see some bullets/nades accidently joining the onos in the redeeming hehe
<!--QuoteBegin--tankefugl+Aug 11 2003, 02:16 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (tankefugl @ Aug 11 2003, 02:16 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Congrats with the Misconception of The Year Award!
<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> The title reads: Redemption And The Physics Of Natural Selection
Please note: Natural Selection is a game and not real life. Discussing the physics and innacuracies of a game proposed to be in the future is not only a waste of time, its a waste of that nerdly brain of yours that you should be devoting to your William Shatner shrine (which you STILL havent finished, tsk tsk).
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> A huge alien can't warp instantly to a location without the aid of technology.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm not sure about that. I'll ask the next huge alien I see:)
tankefuglOne Script To Rule Them All...Trondheim, NorwayJoin Date: 2002-11-14Member: 8641Members, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
<!--QuoteBegin--||SemperFi||+Aug 11 2003, 03:40 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (||SemperFi|| @ Aug 11 2003, 03:40 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--tankefugl+Aug 11 2003, 02:16 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (tankefugl @ Aug 11 2003, 02:16 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Congrats with the Misconception of The Year Award!
<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> The title reads: Redemption And The Physics Of Natural Selection
Please note: Natural Selection is a game and not real life. Discussing the physics and innacuracies of a game proposed to be in the future is not only a waste of time, its a waste of that nerdly brain of yours that you should be devoting to your William Shatner shrine (which you STILL havent finished, tsk tsk). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Er.
Who's William Shatner? And why do you think he deserves a shrine?
And I really do not grasp what is so offending with playing around with your imagination. Yes, we know it's a game. Yes, we know it's sci-fi. Yes, we know it's unrealistic and that you don't want to care.
But words such as 'why' and 'what if' are powerfull words. Try them out sometime. Tell me what you think.
EpidemicDark Force GorgeJoin Date: 2003-06-29Member: 17781Members
<!--QuoteBegin--Ross+Aug 10 2003, 11:57 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Ross @ Aug 10 2003, 11:57 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Monkeybonk+Aug 10 2003, 11:50 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Monkeybonk @ Aug 10 2003, 11:50 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> From the NS manual:
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Thesis: This, paired with the "blink" ability, may be the most scientifically troubling of alien evolutions. The two must be related, but it is unclear how – and any "experiment" that might "test" these abilities is, at this juncture, impractical. The best idea so far is that a new body is created back at the hive, and the alien's unique information (memories, etc.) is somehow transferred to it. This information is probably stored in some transmission-ready bacterial form, that is released when the creature sustains too much damage – much like a mushroom shooting off its spores when it is stepped on.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
ROFL I was 100% right! <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> I've never read that thing either! I WIN j00 LOOSE! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> I find it more likely that the alien's memories are transmitted through telepathy instead of bacteria; doesn't the hive mind and hive sight work through telepathy?
If that article is true, perhaps there should be more visual effects than just the alien dissapearing. I can believe that a mushroom shoots off spores when it is stepped on, but does the mushroom dissapear afterwards?
I would make a great TSA scientist <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> That is soo flawed, if the new body is created why has he substained dmg then? How can the hive create a new body in a second when it takes 10 minutes to spawn a skulk, AND dont even let me go onto the devour/redemption
Who's William Shatner? And why do you think he deserves a shrine?
And I really do not grasp what is so offending with playing around with your imagination. Yes, we know it's a game. Yes, we know it's sci-fi. Yes, we know it's unrealistic and that you don't want to care.
But words such as 'why' and 'what if' are powerfull words. Try them out sometime. Tell me what you think.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I concur! <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
As for that thing about falling 10 ft and you die, yet being fine slamming into a wall with jetpacks at 600MPH(yes I know that's from 1 million res nodes). See that is an exageration that is trying to prove a point(actually it' just a joke), but it's so exagerated that it no longer proves anything. In NS you are only lightly hurt from a 10 ft fall, and those jetpacks, while speedy, don't even go close to 100MPH.
The alien mind is of one, which accounts for the Hive Sight. Everywhere on each map, there are billions of alien particles floating around in the air, each and every one with their own ability to move independantly but all controlled by the one mind.
Your role within NS is to serve as the 'keepers' of lower conscious states (slightly below the alien mind itself), it is your job (duty if you will) to ensure the survival of the hive mind, for the greater good.
Each little bacteria is linked synaptically to every other bacteria in existence, directly, or indirectly.
When an alien choses the 'Redemption' evolution, lots of layers of 'explosive' or 'weak' bacteria become layered throughout the body. After sustaining x amount of damage, and almost destroying the entity, these cells decide to 'break up' and all the bacteria disperse and any bacteria nearby the hive, take on the role of these 'dispersed' bacteria to reform the exact state, including the separatory bacteria.
So really, when you use redemption, you die, but your conscious is transported to an exact clone of that species. Effectively respawning, but not quite.
Each active hive has enough bacteria surrounding it and being produced within it, to 'recreate' every member of the team. If a team of 12 were all Onos, then the hive/s would have sufficient bacteria to support each and every one of them.
They are all of one 'mind' but formed from many conscious, many trillions of bacteria sacrifice themselves in the course of battle, just so the conscious can overcome the evil and they can continue to spread and consume.
OK, I hope that sorts it out <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
InsaneAnomalyJoin Date: 2002-05-13Member: 605Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Subnautica Developer, Pistachionauts, Future Perfect Developer
edited August 2003
To all those of you whining about NS being only a game: this is a thread in a <i>forum about a game</i>; what were you expecting people to discuss? Cheese sandwiches? If it really troubles you that much, go away. Nothing is forcing you to take part in this discussion. If you just <i>have</i> to get on your high horses and say "omh thies si jsut a gaem!!! ur wasteing ur teim ha ha ha", just remember that you are telling this to the people that are fully aware that NS is a game and moreover don't care because they enjoy dicussing it.
At any rate what problem to you have with people using their brains to <i>rationally think about and discuss an argument</i>? Flexing the mental "muscles" is <i>not</i> a waste of time, no matter how trivial the subject matter may seem.
Sorry to go off on a tangent guys, but it really bothers me when people get whiney when other people actually chance to use their brains.
QuaunautThe longest seven days in history...Join Date: 2003-03-21Member: 14759Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
<!--QuoteBegin--BlaqWolf+Aug 10 2003, 09:42 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (BlaqWolf @ Aug 10 2003, 09:42 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> of course, the rest of the NS universe seems so very real...
it's something in the game just to be in the game. doesn't have to make sense. i know, it IS frustrating to get digested and then redeemed to another hive (where all hopes of survival is lost), but if you're looking for answers to your troubles, don't look to realistic physics. cuz they're not gonna help you in an UNrealistic game. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I wouldn't say its unrealistic. Its fully possible. In fact, I've heard of a lot wackier things our government is studying right now.
Like clone manipulation...like hitler was getting into...but thats beside the point.
The long and short of it is this; although we, the players, see the game as though the aliens are distinct beings, in terms of the game universe, they're not. There is only the hive, and the bacterium network. All aliens are one, all part of the same network. Hence why the aliens don't start appearing until the marines are there... at that point, the bacterium has no reason for them.
When redemption occurs, the data on the being is transmitted back through the bacterium, and the body is rebuilt at the central hive. When you bare in mind that 'thoughts' and 'memories' are, in fact, all part of the alien network anyway, it's really not that unlikely to have them transported back.
The other part to remember is that the body is NOT being rebuilt from the same matter... that matter dissolves and becomes part of the network, and matter at the hive site is used to rebuild it. Only the data has to travel... it's like the 'water in a u-bend' analogy mentioned earlier.
Or, of course, there is the second answer... it's just a game! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Anyway, heres the rough outlay of what I was going to say earlier.
Evolution on earth has been made of leaps and bounds as well as grinding progress.
The first leap was when multicellular life came into being 500 million years ago. Before then, only single celled bacteria existed. The next great leap was sexual reproduction. Young/Immature people may snicker but it's true. The existence of sex allowed infinitely more complex errors in genetic code and genetic intermixing then asexual reproduction could ever produce. Hence, life forms that use sexual reproduction are the most populous of multicellular life. The next leap from sexual reproduction was life on the land. Before life existed on the land, it was inconcievable that any life could exist on the barren rock beyond the sea. After life on the land began, the dinosaurs came. The dinosaurs lasted a very very long time in the general scheme of things and up until 65 million years ago they were the most successful form of life on the planet. After the dinosaurs extinction, a considerable vacuum existed in evolutionary terms. Mammals, the **** cousins of the dinosaurs, began to fill these roles. Some became herbivores, others carnivores, and others still became omnivores. Following the extinction of the dinosaurs, there was much "Experimentation" with nature and mammals. The mammals today are on the whole smaller then the mammals of millions of years ago. Then, the last great leap came; Intelligence (or as some like to put it, higher levels of stupidity). Before the emergence of intelligence, there was only instinct and the will to survive. With intelligence came abstract new things. These primitive apes learned that they were not invincible, that they could die. They learned the seasons and the stars, they imagined gods controlled the things that they could not understand and they imagined life after death.
A single bacterium cannot concieve of intelligence. A monkey cannot concieve of a corporation. A human cannot comprehend infinity (attempting to do so will result in insanity).
What is the next great leap for life? Who knows.
The fact of the matter is, we cannot concieve what large intelligences can do because we are not large intelligences. Think of it in terms of numbers.
If a bacterium is 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001, a human is 1, a neural network (such as the bacterium) would be 1000.
Imagine being a thousand times more intelligent (not smart, intelligent, there is a difference). You would damn well expect telepathy. Fact is no one knows exactly WHAT or HOW telepathy works. Therefore, telepathy has limitless potential and limitless capability. Therefore, teleporting one of your "arms" (fade) away from danger is not outside the combined consciousness capability of the bacterium.
If the above did not make sense, please consult your nearest headache pill.
What do you mean you would EXPECT telepathy? lol - IMO telepathy is nonesense. Some people really need to learn the difference between interpreting and sensing.
<!--QuoteBegin--+oo|+Aug 11 2003, 12:34 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (+oo| @ Aug 11 2003, 12:34 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> It just should'nt be for onos. Esp. while digesting! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeah and on that note, the physics behind digesting is flawed. The marine comes out without any digesting done to him, but who cares?!
Oh, and scent of fear. How exactly does that work?
A billion years ago multi cellular life would have been inconcievable for the individual bacteria living at the time.
500 million years later they pulled it off.
Telepathy is inconcievable to us because we are for the most part incapable of it.
You cannot prove that telepathy does not exist anymore then you can prove that alternate dimensions do not exist. There is no way to prove nor disprove their existence at the moment. Only time will tell the truth.
Are you serious? Just because one thing is possible does not make everything possible. I'm sure it was inconcievable to those bacteria that anything will ever exceed the speed of light too.
The universe is not built to satisfy human senses.
Therefore, the universe is also not built to satisfy human concepts of possibility or impossibility. It defies common sense that your mass approaches infinity when you approach the speed of light yet it does so we just accept it.
Time can only prove claims of impossibilty wrong. Think I'm wrong? Look at the earth centered universe. Belief is not fact.
about that clone explanation in the manual thingy. if a new clone body is made shouldn't you redeem with full health? i guess the body is incomplete depending on how much is redeemed. and the hive slowly completes the new body? gah i'm answering my self oh well. so you don't redeem instantly you have to wait to heal. but then again your talking about redeeming away i think :/
Besides the fact that your mass doesn't increase with speed (common myth), it only defies common sense because babies are not born with ultimate knowledge. We need to learn to understand, and commonly people do not learn this stuff. Hence it is not common sense.
And where did I say that I belive the universe was built for any reason? Let alone to 'satisfy humans'. Oh, I think something is impossible, therefore I must also think that the universe was built to satisfy my concepts? Hmmmmmm.
*cough*
I am not saying I belive; I am saying I have lack of belif. You're the one saying you belive. You're the one who expects telepathy.
<!--QuoteBegin--Kevor+Aug 11 2003, 07:56 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Kevor @ Aug 11 2003, 07:56 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> about that clone explanation in the manual thingy. ... but then again your talking about redeeming away i think :/ <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Maybe the hive clones the exact state of the alien when it redeemed?<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Also, I'm making an analogy. To you, Telepathy is utter garbage. Five centuries ago, the utter notion that the earth centered universe was wrong was utter garbarge. Human senses dictated that they be at the center of all things. Common sense has no grounding with how the universe works. What you think of telepathy doesnt mean it dosent exist since it cannot be proven to NOT exist. (so many negatives, headache ambulance on the way).
{Edit}
Also, you have an entitlement to a lack of belief, but to discredit something that may or may not exist without evidence constitutes a belief.
{Edit, since the above was typed before the link was included above}
Even so. Apparent mass still increases with increased velocity. If relativistic mass was not real, objects would be able to go beyond light. Although there is no "True" mass increase, there is a "temporary" mass increase brought about by an increase of velocity.
tankefuglOne Script To Rule Them All...Trondheim, NorwayJoin Date: 2002-11-14Member: 8641Members, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited August 2003
<!--QuoteBegin--nØthing+Aug 11 2003, 07:38 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (nØthing @ Aug 11 2003, 07:38 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> What do you mean you would EXPECT telepathy? lol - IMO telepathy is nonesense. Some people really need to learn the difference between interpreting and sensing. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Ahem. Let me enlighten you on the recent progress in the field of telepathy in modern history, also know as information technology and neurology.
(www.m-w.com) Main Entry: te·lep·a·thy Pronunciation: t&-'le-p&-thE Function: noun Date: 1882 : communication from one mind to another by extrasensory means
1) Wireless networking has had a tremendous progress lately. Computers are able to communicate without being physically connected.
2) There is ongoing research on human implants. Chips in your brain, you could say. Or just transistors underneeth your skin on your arm. Whatever suits you. Basically a computer in you.
3) Neurology has made it possible for computers to read brainwaves, and act according to certain patterns in these brainwaves. Simple "yes/no"-questions has been answered using this methid.
4) There has been scientific work on the field of stimulating your vision (via implants) and feeding input to your eyes.
Now, imagine that all these fields of science succeed. What do we got? Ah, well. A computer inside you, that you may controll by using your thoughts, and that feeds you data back. This computer is able to communicate with other computers. And we add the fift element:
5) IM. MSN, ICQ, IRC, whatever.
Voila! Telepathy for you.
Still "lol"?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><i>Sufficently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. </i> -- Arthur Clarke<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--{US-DF}Rico+Aug 11 2003, 12:43 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> ({US-DF}Rico @ Aug 11 2003, 12:43 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ok here's a good way to explain the NS universe:
Ever hear of Canadians? Ever see a REAL Canadian wandering around without their disguises on? Yes, i am implying that the Canadians ARE the aliens and in fact, i have proof, for behold, I know some canadians in real life!
I have recently come to understand this last week that Canadians have magical powers, some of which include the ability to place curses on people. Yes, thats right, before that i thought only gypsies and leprechauns were able to do this kind of thing but apparently i was wrong. Anyways, back to the topic at hand, yes, they are magical aliens, and one of their powers (besides placing curses on people) is magically teleporting back to their "hive" (aka Canadia) and then creating a new body out of snow.
Anyways, this is how i believe the NS universe works. Some people may try to brainwash you into "logical" explanations but i assure you, this goes FAR beyond logic.
PS: If some of you guys couldn't tell, this was just meant as a humorous post designed to lighten the mood of this thread, remember, it doesnt really have to make sense (even though it does based on the storyline) because it is just a game, if you really wanted someone to explain everything to you, you might as well go read a book or watch a movie, the game is fun, explaining respawn is not. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
As a side note, i apologize to anyone who might be offended by this thread. I do not dislike Canadians, in fact, i am friends with a lot of them and find them to be nice people, this is just my way of messing around with them. If you do feel offended somehow, feel free to make fun of me! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> (in a leprechauns voice) Ahhh, hes found out about us..... how could this have happened eh.
I blame Tarance and Philip from South Park, always giving away our secrets.
Now we must join with the other aliens on earth (the Scotish) and return to space before we are desroyed!
<!--QuoteBegin--Cronos+Aug 11 2003, 01:07 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cronos @ Aug 11 2003, 01:07 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Relativistic Mass is still mass. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> No, it is not. Otherwise they wouldn't call it 'Relativistic mass' at all, would they? They'd just call it mass.
And present day is nothing like it was five centuries ago. Five centuries ago, the notion of a God and centered univserse was accepted only because there was no way to disprove it.
Although we have no way to disprove many of the present day theories, we no longer just plainly BELIEVE them anymore. That is why they call them theories, instead of belifs.
Comments
-JohnnySmash
IT"S A GAME
GOD CAN COME DOWN AND KILL HIMSELF FOR ALL WE CARE
CAPS LOCKS RULE YOU
..ya i'm bored
just a game and the creator had the imagination of an alien being "redeemed" while being shot at by 10 marines with HMGs...i would like to see some bullets/nades accidently joining the onos in the redeeming hehe
<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The title reads:
Redemption And The Physics Of Natural Selection
Please note: Natural Selection is a game and not real life. Discussing the physics and innacuracies of a game proposed to be in the future is not only a waste of time, its a waste of that nerdly brain of yours that you should be devoting to your William Shatner shrine (which you STILL havent finished, tsk tsk).
I'm not sure about that. I'll ask the next huge alien I see:)
<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The title reads:
Redemption And The Physics Of Natural Selection
Please note: Natural Selection is a game and not real life. Discussing the physics and innacuracies of a game proposed to be in the future is not only a waste of time, its a waste of that nerdly brain of yours that you should be devoting to your William Shatner shrine (which you STILL havent finished, tsk tsk). <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Er.
Who's William Shatner? And why do you think he deserves a shrine?
And I really do not grasp what is so offending with playing around with your imagination. Yes, we know it's a game. Yes, we know it's sci-fi. Yes, we know it's unrealistic and that you don't want to care.
But words such as 'why' and 'what if' are powerfull words. Try them out sometime. Tell me what you think.
<!--QuoteBegin--Paranoia-2MB+--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Paranoia-2MB)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> fasdfasjflkasjf
IT"S A GAME
GOD CAN COME DOWN AND KILL HIMSELF FOR ALL WE CARE<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'd care.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Thesis: This, paired with the "blink" ability, may be the most scientifically troubling of alien evolutions. The two must be related, but it is unclear how – and any "experiment" that might "test" these abilities is, at this juncture, impractical. The best idea so far is that a new body is created back at the hive, and the alien's unique information (memories, etc.) is somehow transferred to it. This information is probably stored in some transmission-ready bacterial form, that is released when the creature sustains too much damage – much like a mushroom shooting off its spores when it is stepped on.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
ROFL I was 100% right! <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> I've never read that thing either! I WIN j00 LOOSE! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
I find it more likely that the alien's memories are transmitted through telepathy instead of bacteria; doesn't the hive mind and hive sight work through telepathy?
If that article is true, perhaps there should be more visual effects than just the alien dissapearing. I can believe that a mushroom shoots off spores when it is stepped on, but does the mushroom dissapear afterwards?
I would make a great TSA scientist <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is soo flawed, if the new body is created why has he substained dmg then? How can the hive create a new body in a second when it takes 10 minutes to spawn a skulk, AND dont even let me go onto the devour/redemption
Who's William Shatner? And why do you think he deserves a shrine?
And I really do not grasp what is so offending with playing around with your imagination. Yes, we know it's a game. Yes, we know it's sci-fi. Yes, we know it's unrealistic and that you don't want to care.
But words such as 'why' and 'what if' are powerfull words. Try them out sometime. Tell me what you think.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I concur! <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
As for that thing about falling 10 ft and you die, yet being fine slamming into a wall with jetpacks at 600MPH(yes I know that's from 1 million res nodes). See that is an exageration that is trying to prove a point(actually it' just a joke), but it's so exagerated that it no longer proves anything. In NS you are only lightly hurt from a 10 ft fall, and those jetpacks, while speedy, don't even go close to 100MPH.
The alien mind is of one, which accounts for the Hive Sight. Everywhere on each map, there are billions of alien particles floating around in the air, each and every one with their own ability to move independantly but all controlled by the one mind.
Your role within NS is to serve as the 'keepers' of lower conscious states (slightly below the alien mind itself), it is your job (duty if you will) to ensure the survival of the hive mind, for the greater good.
Each little bacteria is linked synaptically to every other bacteria in existence, directly, or indirectly.
When an alien choses the 'Redemption' evolution, lots of layers of 'explosive' or 'weak' bacteria become layered throughout the body. After sustaining x amount of damage, and almost destroying the entity, these cells decide to 'break up' and all the bacteria disperse and any bacteria nearby the hive, take on the role of these 'dispersed' bacteria to reform the exact state, including the separatory bacteria.
So really, when you use redemption, you die, but your conscious is transported to an exact clone of that species. Effectively respawning, but not quite.
Each active hive has enough bacteria surrounding it and being produced within it, to 'recreate' every member of the team. If a team of 12 were all Onos, then the hive/s would have sufficient bacteria to support each and every one of them.
They are all of one 'mind' but formed from many conscious, many trillions of bacteria sacrifice themselves in the course of battle, just so the conscious can overcome the evil and they can continue to spread and consume.
OK, I hope that sorts it out <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
At any rate what problem to you have with people using their brains to <i>rationally think about and discuss an argument</i>? Flexing the mental "muscles" is <i>not</i> a waste of time, no matter how trivial the subject matter may seem.
Sorry to go off on a tangent guys, but it really bothers me when people get whiney when other people actually chance to use their brains.
oy... <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif'><!--endemo-->
it's something in the game just to be in the game. doesn't have to make sense. i know, it IS frustrating to get digested and then redeemed to another hive (where all hopes of survival is lost), but if you're looking for answers to your troubles, don't look to realistic physics. cuz they're not gonna help you in an UNrealistic game. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wouldn't say its unrealistic. Its fully possible. In fact, I've heard of a lot wackier things our government is studying right now.
Like clone manipulation...like hitler was getting into...but thats beside the point.
When redemption occurs, the data on the being is transmitted back through the bacterium, and the body is rebuilt at the central hive. When you bare in mind that 'thoughts' and 'memories' are, in fact, all part of the alien network anyway, it's really not that unlikely to have them transported back.
The other part to remember is that the body is NOT being rebuilt from the same matter... that matter dissolves and becomes part of the network, and matter at the hive site is used to rebuild it. Only the data has to travel... it's like the 'water in a u-bend' analogy mentioned earlier.
Or, of course, there is the second answer... it's just a game! <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Anyway, heres the rough outlay of what I was going to say earlier.
Evolution on earth has been made of leaps and bounds as well as grinding progress.
The first leap was when multicellular life came into being 500 million years ago. Before then, only single celled bacteria existed. The next great leap was sexual reproduction. Young/Immature people may snicker but it's true. The existence of sex allowed infinitely more complex errors in genetic code and genetic intermixing then asexual reproduction could ever produce. Hence, life forms that use sexual reproduction are the most populous of multicellular life. The next leap from sexual reproduction was life on the land. Before life existed on the land, it was inconcievable that any life could exist on the barren rock beyond the sea. After life on the land began, the dinosaurs came. The dinosaurs lasted a very very long time in the general scheme of things and up until 65 million years ago they were the most successful form of life on the planet. After the dinosaurs extinction, a considerable vacuum existed in evolutionary terms. Mammals, the **** cousins of the dinosaurs, began to fill these roles. Some became herbivores, others carnivores, and others still became omnivores. Following the extinction of the dinosaurs, there was much "Experimentation" with nature and mammals. The mammals today are on the whole smaller then the mammals of millions of years ago. Then, the last great leap came; Intelligence (or as some like to put it, higher levels of stupidity). Before the emergence of intelligence, there was only instinct and the will to survive. With intelligence came abstract new things. These primitive apes learned that they were not invincible, that they could die. They learned the seasons and the stars, they imagined gods controlled the things that they could not understand and they imagined life after death.
A single bacterium cannot concieve of intelligence. A monkey cannot concieve of a corporation. A human cannot comprehend infinity (attempting to do so will result in insanity).
What is the next great leap for life? Who knows.
The fact of the matter is, we cannot concieve what large intelligences can do because we are not large intelligences. Think of it in terms of numbers.
If a bacterium is 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001, a human is 1, a neural network (such as the bacterium) would be 1000.
Imagine being a thousand times more intelligent (not smart, intelligent, there is a difference). You would damn well expect telepathy. Fact is no one knows exactly WHAT or HOW telepathy works. Therefore, telepathy has limitless potential and limitless capability. Therefore, teleporting one of your "arms" (fade) away from danger is not outside the combined consciousness capability of the bacterium.
If the above did not make sense, please consult your nearest headache pill.
Some people really need to learn the difference between interpreting and sensing.
Yeah and on that note, the physics behind digesting is flawed. The marine comes out without any digesting done to him, but who cares?!
Oh, and scent of fear. How exactly does that work?
500 million years later they pulled it off.
Telepathy is inconcievable to us because we are for the most part incapable of it.
You cannot prove that telepathy does not exist anymore then you can prove that alternate dimensions do not exist. There is no way to prove nor disprove their existence at the moment. Only time will tell the truth.
I'm sure it was inconcievable to those bacteria that anything will ever exceed the speed of light too.
Therefore, the universe is also not built to satisfy human concepts of possibility or impossibility. It defies common sense that your mass approaches infinity when you approach the speed of light yet it does so we just accept it.
Time can only prove claims of impossibilty wrong. Think I'm wrong? Look at the earth centered universe. Belief is not fact.
And where did I say that I belive the universe was built for any reason? Let alone to 'satisfy humans'. Oh, I think something is impossible, therefore I must also think that the universe was built to satisfy my concepts? Hmmmmmm.
*cough*
I am not saying I belive; I am saying I have lack of belif. You're the one saying you belive. You're the one who expects telepathy.
Maybe the hive clones the exact state of the alien when it redeemed?<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<a href='http://members.tripod.com/wmhxbigguy/Theory/mass.html' target='_blank'>http://members.tripod.com/wmhxbigguy/Theory/mass.html</a>
Mass does increase with increased velocity
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
According to theory of relativity, moving objects have increased mass
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Also, I'm making an analogy. To you, Telepathy is utter garbage. Five centuries ago, the utter notion that the earth centered universe was wrong was utter garbarge. Human senses dictated that they be at the center of all things. Common sense has no grounding with how the universe works. What you think of telepathy doesnt mean it dosent exist since it cannot be proven to NOT exist. (so many negatives, headache ambulance on the way).
{Edit}
Also, you have an entitlement to a lack of belief, but to discredit something that may or may not exist without evidence constitutes a belief.
<a href='http://www.phys.ncku.edu.tw/mirrors/physicsfaq/Relativity/SR/mass.html' target='_blank'>http://www.phys.ncku.edu.tw/mirrors/physic...ty/SR/mass.html</a>
{Edit, since the above was typed before the link was included above}
Even so. Apparent mass still increases with increased velocity. If relativistic mass was not real, objects would be able to go beyond light. Although there is no "True" mass increase, there is a "temporary" mass increase brought about by an increase of velocity.
Some people really need to learn the difference between interpreting and sensing. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ahem. Let me enlighten you on the recent progress in the field of telepathy in modern history, also know as information technology and neurology.
(www.m-w.com)
Main Entry: te·lep·a·thy
Pronunciation: t&-'le-p&-thE
Function: noun
Date: 1882
: communication from one mind to another by extrasensory means
1) Wireless networking has had a tremendous progress lately. Computers are able to communicate without being physically connected.
2) There is ongoing research on human implants. Chips in your brain, you could say. Or just transistors underneeth your skin on your arm. Whatever suits you. Basically a computer in you.
3) Neurology has made it possible for computers to read brainwaves, and act according to certain patterns in these brainwaves. Simple "yes/no"-questions has been answered using this methid.
4) There has been scientific work on the field of stimulating your vision (via implants) and feeding input to your eyes.
Now, imagine that all these fields of science succeed. What do we got? Ah, well. A computer inside you, that you may controll by using your thoughts, and that feeds you data back. This computer is able to communicate with other computers. And we add the fift element:
5) IM. MSN, ICQ, IRC, whatever.
Voila! Telepathy for you.
Still "lol"?
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><i>Sufficently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. </i>
-- Arthur Clarke<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Reading over this sort of reminds me why the discussion boards were locked, permanently.
I respect your view that telepathy cannot exist. All I'm trying to say is that an open mind is better then a closed one.
There is no direct evidence FOR the existence of telepathy, therefore it can be presumed Not to exist.
However, there is no direct evidence AGAINST the existence of telepathy, so it may well be presumed To exist.
Until solid hard evidence comes to light our arguments negate one another precisely.
Ever hear of Canadians? Ever see a REAL Canadian wandering around without their disguises on? Yes, i am implying that the Canadians ARE the aliens and in fact, i have proof, for behold, I know some canadians in real life!
I have recently come to understand this last week that Canadians have magical powers, some of which include the ability to place curses on people. Yes, thats right, before that i thought only gypsies and leprechauns were able to do this kind of thing but apparently i was wrong. Anyways, back to the topic at hand, yes, they are magical aliens, and one of their powers (besides placing curses on people) is magically teleporting back to their "hive" (aka Canadia) and then creating a new body out of snow.
Anyways, this is how i believe the NS universe works. Some people may try to brainwash you into "logical" explanations but i assure you, this goes FAR beyond logic.
PS: If some of you guys couldn't tell, this was just meant as a humorous post designed to lighten the mood of this thread, remember, it doesnt really have to make sense (even though it does based on the storyline) because it is just a game, if you really wanted someone to explain everything to you, you might as well go read a book or watch a movie, the game is fun, explaining respawn is not. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
As a side note, i apologize to anyone who might be offended by this thread. I do not dislike Canadians, in fact, i am friends with a lot of them and find them to be nice people, this is just my way of messing around with them. If you do feel offended somehow, feel free to make fun of me! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
(in a leprechauns voice)
Ahhh, hes found out about us..... how could this have happened eh.
I blame Tarance and Philip from South Park, always giving away our secrets.
Now we must join with the other aliens on earth (the Scotish) and return to space before we are desroyed!
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
No, it is not. Otherwise they wouldn't call it 'Relativistic mass' at all, would they? They'd just call it mass.
And present day is nothing like it was five centuries ago. Five centuries ago, the notion of a God and centered univserse was accepted only because there was no way to disprove it.
Although we have no way to disprove many of the present day theories, we no longer just plainly BELIEVE them anymore. That is why they call them theories, instead of belifs.